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Is Communism good? This poll is closed. |
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| Yes |
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375 | 66.25% |
| No |
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191 | 33.75% |
| Total: | 523 votes | ||
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dk2m posted:Assuming you're talking about the US - what capitalist class? What does that even mean in this day and age? It's not 1905 anymore, there are no evil guys twirling mustaches behind their huge oak desk. The people that run businesses respond to external pressures - communists don't. You can protest and peacefully change society in ours, you cannot in a communist system. There will be winners and losers like in every system, but the moral case in a communist society is built around the idea that anyone that doesn't fall in line is a traitor to revolutionary ideals. Even neo-communists STILL disdain socialists - if they can't even get along with fellow leftists, what hope is there for anyone else? The like ten CEOs who own a huge portion of global capital cannot, in fact, be swayed or affected in any meaningful way by peaceful protest, and we are completely beholden to them in terms of the global power structure. They're also the ones responsible for climate change killing us all in 10-15 years. So yeah, hope that helps.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:22
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Communism killed 20 million people but capitalism killing 7 billion will be fine because,
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Mar 3, 2017 18:22
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asdf32 posted:Democracy was most certainly an ideological threat to the monarchy. not nearly as much as bourg nationalists like napoleon
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Mar 6, 2017 16:11
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falcon2424 posted:No, it's really not. I'm pretty sure the labor theory of value has held up even into the model of 21st-century global capitalism. Also if you think Marxism made Russian and Chinese societies worse based off of the famines they caused, then fine. But you should actually travel to those countries and ask people who lived through those times whether they think their lives improved compared to those of people in neighboring countries. I think you'd be surprised.
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Mar 27, 2017 17:32
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That's true but you're pulling my leg if you think even complete state control over media can hypnotize people into thinking their lives are better off now than they used to be. There are plenty of people kicking around who suffered but didn't die during the Great Leap Forward and are still alive to this day. Anyway ask Russians how they feel about "shock therapy" and American "democracy-building" efforts.
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Mar 27, 2017 18:59
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steinrokkan posted:How about asking former Soviet satellites about no longer being sucked dry by the Soviet imperial parasite? I'm sure that despite getting to no longer have the Russians boss them around, most of the former Soviet satellite states still weren't happy with American business parasites sucking out what was left of their economies.
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Mar 27, 2017 19:17
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steinrokkan posted:Lol, sure thing, buddy, I'm mad I never had the opportunity to wait in line for the last roll of toilet paper or bribe a bunch of guys just to get a plumber scheduled to fix the sink. Or that I will never get to see the majestic sights of tree-melting acid rains from all the progressive Communist industry. I'm not saying they liked Soviet-style collapse better. Unfortunately, that collapse was shortly followed by another catastrophe when we finished the job of picking the bones clean.
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Mar 27, 2017 19:26
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hakimashou posted:Denying, minimizing, or attempting to rationalize or justify the horrors of communism is denying, minimizing, or attempting to rationalize or justify the horrors of the holocaust, and for equally despicable motives. Nah that's actually the far right line on things.
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Mar 27, 2017 23:36
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:the world owes central planning a debt as well for ridding the world of the awfulness that was USSR in the long term, central planning increased life expectancy, literacy, access to health care, and production in russia and china lol basically Cerebral Bore posted:You mean the central planning that took the USSR from a burned-down peasant country to the world's second industrial superpower in ~30 years and this with the most destructive war in modern history throwing a spanner in the works?
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Mar 29, 2017 20:51
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:it also fractures your country into tiny pieces or forces you to switch to a free market model in the long term so that's good the chinese government still owns pretty much all the land and their mixed economy is way more mixed than most other nations even now. also quasi central control over that economy means they're better equipped than the US to handle, say, a climate catastrophe that would require the government to be able to enact economic change instead of having the corporations pay you off to legislate how they want you to...
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Mar 29, 2017 20:58
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:very reminiscent of hitler seizing jewish funds by the way hey as a jew go gently caress yourself for trying to compare an innocent ethnic group to some landlords who would kill their own livestock before they allowed it to be taken away lol
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Mar 29, 2017 21:12
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If you're not willing to expropriate you gotta get out of the Marxist kitchen.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:16
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steinrokkan posted:If those Jews are not going to let loose of their hoarded private property for the benefit of the people, there needs to be some solution to the problem. you have a tenuous grasp of history
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Mar 29, 2017 21:18
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TomViolence posted:The bolsheviks were a bunch of backstabbing, paranoid, powerhungry assholes in the years immediately after the civil war and no-one should earnestly attempt to rehabilitate that poo poo because it does the case for communism more harm than good. yeah i should clarify that when stalin deported all those ethnic minorities and basically chewed up and spat out the peasantry for daring to resist him...that was not good taking boug farms and land though...that's very good.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:25
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:it's unfortunate that the two sets "ethnic minorities" and "bougie farmers" and "peasants" happened to overlap so much huh yea that's why i tried to clarify. stalin killed a ton of people he didn't have to because he was paranoid as gently caress and also wanted to consolidate all political power around himself. same with mao. it doesn't matter anyway because the petty bourg is shrinking pretty quickly these days. but the idea of taking their stuff was never a bad idea, stalin was just a murderous dickhead.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:28
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:people now arguing itt that corporations are exactly the same as a soviet centrally planned economy lol What do you think "collectivism" means and what do you think a corporation is, lol.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:45
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:my line of descent means jack poo poo but me having grown up in russia and having gone through it's systems may have something to do with you хуйло поганое How old are you? Are you confusing communist Russia with the Russia we pillaged the economy of?
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Mar 29, 2017 21:47
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hakimashou posted:They cribbed that from genocidal communism too Hello to anyone reading the thread who wasn't sure that half of "anti communists" really just have far right sympathies.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:48
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White Rock posted:Question, what is the general take on say the french and american revolution, or smilar revolutions? Where they "worth it" it terms of body count? Why? Is the outcome all that matters? The Reign of Terror proves that the Assembly can never work and we should stick with the best system we have as proven by history, monarchy.
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Mar 30, 2017 13:11
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SyHopeful posted:The 1960s post-colonial Africa where former colonial powers attempted to destabilize all of the nascent nations to maintain control of the resources that attracted colonizers in the first place? Where Western powers propped up or installed corrupt politicians or autocrats like Mobutu, Bokassa, or Bongo? Where Lumumba was assassinated for friendly overtures to the Soviets even though even the CIA officer tasked with killing him said he was no communist? Where the Belgians supported Katangan secession so they could keep their hands on the resources there, or the Brits supporting Biafra for their oil? Where apartheid South Africa occupied Namibia and invaded Angola to fight efforts to build socialism? How about the myriad scandals of France's ELF? Of course not. We can't be anti-communist without ignoring the hundreds of millions of people killed by capitalist, imperialist exploitation.
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Mar 31, 2017 16:14
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There is enough food, water, and housing for everyone in the world, actually. Capitalism manufactures scarcity by design where there really is none.
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Mar 31, 2017 20:42
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asdf32 posted:Socialism is hardly more irrelevant than when talking about global poverty. If first world leftists got their nationalist revolutions the rest of the world would be hosed and expected to say thank you for the end of "exploitation". It's really sad how little you know about pretty much anything.
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Mar 31, 2017 20:55
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Actually I think you'll find that most people are on board with abolishing jobs that only serve to make money off of other people while providing no value yourself.
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Mar 31, 2017 21:03
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Capitalism has killed more people than both those ideologies combined though. Also nazis were capitalists and were enabled into power by center-right liberals.
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Apr 1, 2017 00:40
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tekz posted:That is honestly surprising to me. How open/free was the voting in that referendum? More open than the 1996 elections when we intervened to fix the election and stop the populace from reelecting the communists. Of course the revisionists in this thread who want to pretend communism is some insane genocide philosophy would paper over this fact.
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Apr 2, 2017 04:34
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