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Doktor Avalanche
Dec 30, 2008

this might be a good thing in the end, let the roaches come into the light and stomp em out

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Homeless Friend
Jul 16, 2007

Cuttlefush posted:

DSA bay of pigs

khazar sansculotte
May 14, 2004

Is there a medium post or some poo poo somewhere summarizing all of this yet. I need to share it with people who don't consume Twitter or forums

rudecyrus
Nov 6, 2009

fuck you trolls

quote:

Because we were hosted by the Communist Party, the vast majority of our itinerary involved us meeting state or party officials and representatives from the party’s mass organizations. These meetings mostly consisted of us receiving lectures followed by a Q&A period, instead of any even exchange of ideas, tactics, and advice. On several occasions comrades asked our Cuban counterparts for advice on our own organizing, and consistently we were met with non-answers.
"cuban officials tried to educate us, but we didn't want to listen"

quote:

At no point in our itinerary did we meet with independent, critical, or alternative leftist voices, and criticisms of the country’s bureaucratic political structures were almost entirely absent. For this reason, I sought out and organized three meetings with critical leftists entirely separate from the official itinerary. While I give credit to the delegation organizers for never impeding my efforts and encouraging all of us to ask challenging questions, there was no intentional effort to introduce the critical perspective.
"I couldn't find anyone unhappy with the government, so I sought out people who agreed with me"

quote:

Our first visit of the third day was to the National Assembly for People’s Power, or the Cuban parliament. We heard a presentation from Homero Acosta Álvarez, Secretary of the National Assembly, for an explanation on how the Cuban government functions. He explained that in their system, there are elections for municipal, provincial, and national assemblies. Multiple candidates may compete for the same seat in local elections, while there is only one candidate per seat for national elections and voting is done by approval. The National Candidacy Commission approves candidates for each race, and parties are technically prohibited from campaigning.

This, he argued, was proof that the country has democratic processes for working people to engage with. In reality, though, the complete ban on the existence of other left-wing parties and strict restrictions on independent organizing means that the Communist Party bureaucracy dominates political life with very little check on their power.

quote:

By contrast, the planned economy in Cuba allows services like healthcare, housing, and education to be provided for free (or in the case of state housing, with rents capped at 10% of family income) to the whole population, and the government will actively solicit input from ordinary people when considering big reforms like the 2019 constitution or subsequent Family Code.

Still, none of this alters the fact that Cuban political life is controlled by the impenetrable Communist Party bureaucracy and not by the working people themselves. Mass consultations take place and go away when the bureaucracy wishes for them to, and proposals are accepted or rejected on the same basis. Meanwhile, the creeping introduction of private business and austerity measures takes place completely outside of workers’ control.
Every time I read criticism of a socialist country (Cuba/China/etc.) by these types, they always admit the system is far better than what we have, BUT it's still bad because there aren't enough political parties, or the legislature doesn't spend hours and hours debating tiny details, or the government cracks down on (anti-government) protests. gently caress these dipshits

rudecyrus
Nov 6, 2009

fuck you trolls
yes, the government gives the people everything they need, but don't you see the secret oppression that's really happening???

rudecyrus has issued a correction as of 01:39 on Apr 20, 2024

Ferrinus
Jun 19, 2003

i'm finding this quite easy, i guess in part because i'm a fast type but also because i have a coherent mental model of the world
friends of mine were on the delegation and they basically described it to me as life-changing. like yeah the blockade means a lot of missing amenities but (to paraphrase them) it felt like being in a real society for the first time ever. among other things, my friend reports that he saw more cops in the two or three hours he was at newark's airport than he did the entire time he was in cuba

Cuttlefush
Jan 15, 2014

Gleichheit soll gedeihen

Ferrinus posted:

friends of mine were on the delegation and they basically described it to me as life-changing. like yeah the blockade means a lot of missing amenities but (to paraphrase them) it felt like being in a real society for the first time ever. among other things, my friend reports that he saw more cops in the two or three hours he was at newark's airport than he did the entire time he was in cuba

i hope you had a nice trip ferrinus

khazar sansculotte
May 14, 2004

Democratic Socialists of America

*puts on They Live glasses*

Ferrinus
Jun 19, 2003

i'm finding this quite easy, i guess in part because i'm a fast type but also because i have a coherent mental model of the world

Cuttlefush posted:

i hope you had a nice trip ferrinus

no, i really am relating my friend's words, i didn't have the time to go. i might try when these become a regular occurrence but i can think of a lot of comrades who should get a seat before i do

Cuttlefush
Jan 15, 2014

Gleichheit soll gedeihen

Ferrinus posted:

no, i really am relating my friend's words, i didn't have the time to go. i might try when these become a regular occurrence but i can think of a lot of comrades who should get a seat before i do

:nsa:

Pepe Silvia Browne
Jan 1, 2007

Ferrinus posted:

no, i really am relating my friend's words, i didn't have the time to go. i might try when these become a regular occurrence but i can think of a lot of comrades who should get a seat before i do

i mean it is good to know that some of the people who went got something out of it tbh

Ferrinus
Jun 19, 2003

i'm finding this quite easy, i guess in part because i'm a fast type but also because i have a coherent mental model of the world

Pepe Silvia Browne posted:

i mean it is good to know that some of the people who went got something out of it tbh

the vast majority did! the important takeaway from all this is that people like the writer of the r&r article are actually a minority in the org even though their views are probably more palatable to the us's general population, which came as a very pleasant surprise to me over the last howevermany years

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

Son of Sorrow
Aug 8, 2023

comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

lumpentroll
Mar 4, 2020

The hotter, the wetter, the better

comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

Ohtori Akio
Jul 15, 2022

comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

Weka
May 5, 2019

That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.
Cuba lets it's citizens collect a NED paycheck to make yankee propaganda but it's unfree?!

Doktor Avalanche
Dec 30, 2008

can't wait for the dsa gusanos to claim they have havana syndrome

Lpzie
Nov 20, 2006

Cuba is for clowns

Ace of Baes
Jul 7, 1977

comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

tristeham
Jul 31, 2022


comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

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DaysBefore
Jan 24, 2019


comedyblissoption posted:

personally meeting president xi followed by falun gong

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