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PostNouveau posted:Still can't believe there are people who don't believe in electoralism or whatever you call actually getting behind policies and candidates. CNN and MSNBC are debating the merits of democratic socialism, and they would have just continued to ignore it forever without actual wins. fbi plant 1: electing people who agree with 90% of our views is stupid. we should do something else instead fbi plant 2: he's right fbi plant 3: mans got a point
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Jun 28, 2018 22:24
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if you cant boot poo poo stirrers like him out of your organization how tf can you get anything done
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Jul 19, 2018 02:52
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Coolness Averted posted:Pretty sure a procedure for booting someone for nebulous 'being a bad person and disingenuous' would just be another tool the exact people you want out would abuse. seems bad that you can never kick out some rich kid clearly acting in bad faith that doesnt give a poo poo about helping people
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Jul 19, 2018 03:00
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I wish Sanders had used his popularity to build some kind of grassroots movement (organize communities, help unionize, provide legal and financial assistance to stuff) because having just a few socialists around make them easy to be picked off. The right seems way better organized
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Jan 29, 2019 15:42
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PostNouveau posted:Also dubious claims to the idpol group he was claiming to represent IIRC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAfIoFZs5bw
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Jan 3, 2021 06:52
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my eyes glaze over at house procedural bullshit, political capital isn't real and i cannot believe there isn't a mechanism for the most left leaning members of congress to make a stink about universal healthcare. that said i dont see what yelling at the dsa means they're not responsible for electoral representatives do or don't
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Jan 12, 2021 20:25
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if they cant get a bill on the floor thanks to nancy pelosi it should still behoove them to try anyway and make as big a ruckus about it as they can, go to the press, cry foul etc
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Jan 12, 2021 20:31
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apropos to nothing posted:idgaf about jimmy dore, i barely know who he is and have never listened to him or his show. sounds like hes an rear end in a top hat, and he prolly is. gently caress him. if hes casting the dsa as an enemy then that sounds bad and i dont agree. but i do agree that AOC and other socialists should be putting forward things like m4a when they can, even if it appears theres no chance they will pass now, whoever says it. you win people to socialism by demonstrating to them what you stand for and that youre willing to fight for it. yep
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Jan 12, 2021 21:53
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this bureacratic 3d chess over paygo or whatever makes no sense to me. the right will find some excuse to kill m4a regardless, might as well keep screaming about it from the rooftops instead of ekeing out useless concessions. useless towards any achievable goals i mean, clearly they're useful for the personal career advancement of the electoral reps who play along
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Jan 14, 2021 21:23
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apropos to nothing posted:it’s a question of whether you believe change happens through formal political leadership like congress or through the power of mass social movements. for socialists its the second one. so if that’s the case positions in government are to be used to build mass movements above anything else. if you want to build and grow the DSA I can’t think of very many better ways than to make the case for Medicare for all and, if and when democrats vote against it, AOC can go out and say “we need Medicare for all and the democrats and republicans have both revealed that they’re unwilling to do this despite its popularity and a global health pandemic. if we want to win this we need to get organized and so if you want to win Medicare for all please join the DSA and help us build a real movement for Medicare for all. “imagine AOC actually tying the fight for m4a to joining the DSA and getting organized, it would be very powerful imo. is that being critical of her? yeah it is we should be critical of our leaders cause we should be trying to chart the best course forward. doesn’t mean I’m calling her a counter revolutionary sellout or that she’s cancelled or whatever the gently caress but imo that’s 100% what she should be doing. aoc/sanders/the squad's unwillingness to build or direct people towards a mass movement is such an incredibly wasted oppurtunity given their current public profile and makes me wonder about them
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Jan 16, 2021 13:26
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FrancisFukyomama posted:drat, the DSA delegation got to personally meet with Maduro https://twitter.com/NicolasMaduro/status/1411121788701052933 lol https://twitter.com/jergong/status/1413302463642308611
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Jul 9, 2021 17:45
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they seem to be walking back one of the good things they did https://twitter.com/socialistcall/status/1423031445971509251
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Aug 5, 2021 01:45
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nice
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Aug 6, 2021 04:36
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AnimeIsTrash posted:type of guy obsessed with trots in 2021 https://twitter.com/breadrosesDSA/status/1423454976135860226 Yet the implications of these commitments are more controversial than they might seem at first glance. With respect to Commitment 1, unless greater clarity is provided about its purpose and goals, this commitment could just as easily lead to constructive efforts aimed at defending the integrity of democratic electoral processes so important to guarantee the political voice of working and poor people throughout Latin America, or to disturbing, anti-democratic efforts aimed at legitimating rigged or highly suspect electoral processes by authoritarian governments in the region. In other words, the São Paulo Forum is perceived by many of its most important members as being so closely associated with authoritarian governments in Venezuela, Nicaragua, and Cuba that it was necessary to create a parallel organization excluding those governments While once a dynamic space facilitating a shared vision of left-wing politics in Latin America, since the death of Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez in 2013, the organization has experienced deep divisions over its relationship with the government of Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro. Key leaders of important Forum membership organizations — such as former Uruguayan President Jorge Mujíca — have publicly expressed condemnation of the Maduro government’s abuses of political and civil rights, while other members, including Maduro himself, have sought to ensure the Forum not only stays silent on the political and civil rights abuses of member organizations, but actively defends those organizations, such as the Maduro government in Venezuela and the government of Daniel Ortega in Nicaragua. In practice, joining the São Paulo Forum will accomplish little beyond signaling DSA’s ideological alignment with authoritarian governments in Latin America (Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua). By formally joining the Forum, we effectively commit DSA to defending our sister organizations (such as the United Socialist Party of Venezuela, the Nicaraguan FSLN, and the Cuban Communist Party), which will make internal political debate around our internationalism work in Latin America even more difficult. There is no clear strategic reason for joining the Forum unless you believe that any critique of authoritarian governments that self-identify as leftist is tantamount to supporting US imperialism or a betrayal of solidarity with our comrades in the Global South.
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Aug 9, 2021 04:13
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gently caress these assholes lol
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Aug 9, 2021 04:13
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i do wonder if they have the ability to expel someone like that if she was part of the organization and not just making poo poo up
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Dec 9, 2021 16:28
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looking at the history of postwar left wing organization in the usa and deciding the solution is more splitting
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Dec 13, 2021 19:59
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didnt a bunch of SAlt recently join DSA with the explict idea of "hey these guys are gaining numbers and momentum, we should try to get on board and help with that even and change things a bit even if the alignment isn't 100%". i dont like SAlt because whenever they talk about foreign policy its indistinguishable from pro imperialist state department propaganda poo poo, but that seems like a better line than continual splitting into ever tinier orgs
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Dec 13, 2021 20:05
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in retrospect its a shame that in the wake of 2016 when there was a whole bunch of people looking to be channeled somewhere useful, all those online personalities or whoever decided to push people towards an organization with the structures of the DSA instead of something better. real missed shot there but you work with what you got
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Dec 13, 2021 20:10
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In Training posted:will Lehman is running on a platform of "abolish the UAW" he is a complete loon some plague rats posted:so. he's still a fat dork mewling on twitter about how someone was rude to him so he called the cops on them these SEP guys seem like incredibly obvious wreckers trying to derail any activists trying to do any tiny iota of anything good. what would you do in this case tough guy
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Aug 30, 2022 08:36
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mawarannahr posted:socialist alternative makes you pay money to support anticommunist British guys in Hong Kong Lol
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Jan 16, 2024 15:47
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Mr. Lobe posted:You have a pretty distorted notion of what hyping is. I did not mention what org I was tabling with at the Olympia action until asked, and in that quote you cited I literally described us as small potatoes. Because we are. We are like 12 people. why does your 12 person communist organization need to take a stand against cuba
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Jan 17, 2024 14:48
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fermun posted:any member can get an article published in even if the article directly opposes official org positions. lmao
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Jan 20, 2024 01:13
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https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3957814&userid=177018&perpage=40&pagenumber=3#post536736256quote:But we are the global generation raised after the end of the Cold War, after the process that Odd Arne Westad called “Americanization”—what so many others called “globalization.” in conclusion mila kunis posted:in retrospect its a shame that in the wake of 2016 when there was a whole bunch of people looking to be channeled somewhere useful, all those online personalities or whoever decided to push people towards an organization with the structures of the DSA instead of something better. real missed shot there but you work with what you got mila kunis has issued a correction as of 02:13 on Jan 20, 2024 |
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Jan 20, 2024 02:08
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i only know a few dsa people from irl and online and they've been nice hardworking people with solid opinions. i can imagine the reason they don't mass decamp to a better organization is that splitting isn't going to bring socialism to the USA, there's no "one weird trick" to digging out a victory unless the situation is right and castigating activists for losing out to overwhelming state power in (mostly) prosperous and well fed nations (till now) isnt useful. in that context, its better to be where most people are at instead of splitting into tiny sects and all you can do is express regret is that people weren't funneled into something with a better structure when a lot of people were looking for something in the wake of trump 2016 and the realization of what the democratic party is. giving people like promise li a voice is barely forgiveable though
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Jan 20, 2024 06:19
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SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:Lmao the Cubans treated a bunch of unruly children as equals and the kids couldn't even show up to the meeting Imagine being literally invited to a socialist state and having the audacity to feel the head of that state is beneath you, as a tiny loving group with like 0.0002% support in your home country. loving Americans man
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Apr 18, 2024 16:59
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Cassian of Imola posted:hey quick question op what was the USSR's policy on the Nazis before deciding that defeating them was the best strategy, and what made them change their minds Cassian of Imola posted:trot criticism usually focuses on real or perceived antidemocratic practices or tendencies in communist parties or governments. sincere or not, it happens to make their rhetoric line up with right-wing, capitalist criticisms of existing communist power structures. 'trots' are therefore viewed with some justification by all sides as subversive and, as in Cuba, sometimes get support and funding from capitalist foreign powers you know, thats a great point
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Apr 24, 2024 18:45
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Cassian of Imola posted:co-opting and undermining the Republican forces in the Spanish Civil War lol Cassian of Imola posted:his stated beliefs and aims re: communism in one country so true bestie, "socialism in one country" meant "socialism in one country for ever and ever, no other countries get to have it. if they try it we'll spend resources to take it away from them". thats exactly what happened postwar
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Apr 24, 2024 23:29
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Cassian of Imola posted:I'm sorry, am I misremembering. did they win that one after the NKVD installed an unpopular, paranoid puppet at gunpoint then disappeared along with their guns and most of the Spanish treasury The USSR did more than any other country to fight the fascists in Spain and you are a dishonest anticommunist that flips from "it's bad when the USSR exports socialism" to "it's bad when the USSR doesn't export revolution" at a moments notice based on rhetorical convenience to bash them. I prefer the honest ones that just admit they think communisn is bad because they're less annoying
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Apr 24, 2024 23:50
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Ferrinus posted:the cpc allied with the kmt on two separate occasions, the second time after a disastrous betrayal, and the result was that they liberated china from the foreign invaders and domestic capitalists both. this probably explains why mao praised stalin for his contributions to socialism and the cpc upholds stalin to this day That's so weird. According to this one moron American leftist Stalin betrayed them so why aren't they mad about it to this day? You'd think they'd be especially frank about him after the sino Soviet split
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Apr 24, 2024 23:52
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Ferrinus posted:the funny thing is that not only CAN you have it both ways w/r/t mr. ioseb "socialism in one country" jugashvili but you CAN ONLY have it both those ways, because it is only by defending and supporting various socialist revolutions as they happen across the globe do you make concrete steps towards global socialism. trotskyist internationalism amounts in practice to socialism in no country, because, mysteriously, the non-european people who keep having a go never quite do it right and thus never quite merit our support or emulation ever wonder why an exhausted by civil war and famine nascent USSR focused on internally building socialism over trying to spread it everywhere after being stopped in poland? some reasons i can think of are: - stalin got fat and lazy after eating all the grain in ukraine - stalin saw this hitler guy in germany and was like, drat fascism is really cool. thats the ideology for me - they figured they weren't ready for it and trying to do so would trigger some kind of 'world war' where millions of their citizens would die and they thought that might be bad. it's probably one of the first two, but what do you think?
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Apr 25, 2024 00:06
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the USSR was a continental sized state, it was not "one guy with a moustache". its leadership represented victorious elements/factions within the revolutionary society and was reflective of it, good and bad. thinking the USSR was great while abhorring what it actually did is a fundamentally stupid position - like I said, legit anticommunism is far more coherent than these idiots.
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Apr 25, 2024 00:23
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