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kustomkarkommando posted:
I was thinking people seem to be really hyped up over Clive Lewis even though he's fairly inexperienced and an unknown quantity, then I remembered Owen Smith was a thing I don't know if Lewis even wants the job though. He was pretty negative about handling two frontbench portfolios and how he didn't have the experience to manage them both properly. He might not feel ready for such a big jump (if he even has the backing)
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Feb 10, 2017 13:08
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nopantsjack posted:Its also just the papers don't report the on going Tory project to quietly kill the NHS, most of them for obvious reasons but then you've even got the guardian who run stories like Jeremy hunt criticizing the NHS without the headline or much of the story addressing the fact that he has been bullish about loving the NHS in full sight of everybody for years now. Jeremy Hunt comes across as one of the most evil fuckers in the cabinet. At least with IDS you can make the argument that he actually believed his poo poo and his actions came from delusion and sheer irresponsibility. Hunt gives the impression he knows exactly what he's doing and has no qualms about it, every statement he makes is a coldly calculated distortion meant to manipulate the media coverage, and it's working really well. Even with the growing concern there's barely any direct criticism of him and his department, or even the government in general Can't wait for him to be PM!
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Feb 10, 2017 14:58
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Pesky Splinter posted:Hunt is like a loving cockroach, and probably one of the most frustrating politicians because no colossal gently caress up ever seems to get him removed from office. That disgusting smirk as he redirects the blame onto the NHS itself, rather than his continuing ideological desire to carve it up for privatisation is infuriating. And yeah, the apparent active maliciousness is the worst part. He's like a Terminator, nothing seems to stop him. He can hide behind plants and run out of hospitals and give terrible interviews, and he's right there on the front bench next time you see him, not giving a gently caress. Mass protests and strikes where he smoothly deflects the blame and that's the end of it. He's doing the job the party wants him to do, and he's doing it very effectively. He honestly seems like one of the more dangerous tories, he obviously impressed a few people with his Culture Secretary dealings
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Feb 10, 2017 19:30
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He pretty much gave that impression before the vote anyway, it seemed more about having a strong official stance than actually forcing every MP to vote for it
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Feb 11, 2017 22:01
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Is Trump going to meet some veterans and do this to them?
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Feb 12, 2017 10:41
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Guavanaut posted:Was there any time when there were four TV channels but no affordable home computers with the beep boop video games? ZX81 and the BBC's big 'get your kids a computer' was before Channel 4. The 90s had Saturday morning TV shows where you'd call in and play bad games by telling them to go LEFT and RIGHT instead of riding your bike to the woods without doing any vandalisms Also Patrick Moore's Bogus Journey
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Feb 12, 2017 23:25
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forkboy84 posted:It's actually easy to figure out. He wasn't. SSJ or whatever Goku Wilders, who was cool in LF so I don't know what he's up to these days
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Feb 13, 2017 21:40
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Tesseraction posted:For the record, SSJ2 Goku Wilders was quoting Marx and Engels and attributing them to Strasser to see how many of you would notice. It's a fantastic troll when you're up on the game. Was anyone even arguing with the content? It was more the STRASSERITE STRASSERITE gimmick posting that was weird. Maybe I'm not up on the latest political meme culture 
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Feb 13, 2017 22:56
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Tesseraction posted:If anything he was mocking the thread's inward thinking as tacitly national-socialist without admitting that it only cares about socialism in one country. In particular he opened with "glad to find a thread of fellow Strasserites" or something to the effect when he first started poasting in here. Guess I didn't connect it with the thread conversation or anything, I thought he was popping up with edgy non-sequiturs. I probably wasn't paying attention though don't mind me kingturnip posted:My go-to these days is: what would the sentence have been if the accused was Muslim? You can kinda test this theory live
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Feb 14, 2017 01:56
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Don't forget these are actually parliamentary by-elections, not just some local councils - they're definitely a better predictor, but still pretty limited since we live in interesting times. Especially in Stoke where the UKIP King is launching his crusade after Labour's unpopular parachute decided he was bored with being their MPOberleutnant posted:There's a really good Private Eye special report on the history of the revolving door between the Government and Civil Service, and the private sector here. There's a better scan here, looks good in a bad way baka kaba fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Feb 15, 2017 |
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Feb 15, 2017 00:38
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Pochoclo posted:Never in my entire life has anyone ever given me one good loving reason why you should love your country. Loving your flag is such a ridiculous loving concept that I'm not even going to engage it - the fact that human beings are capable of such a sentiment is a terrible thing all in itself. But seriously, love your country? Basically it's loving a government, because people come and go - humans are migratory in nature, history is full of invasions and counter-invasions. Countries amount to nothing but government apparatus, and seriously, you love that poo poo? Are you loving stupid? It's an in-group/out-group thing
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Feb 15, 2017 23:18
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The  is now a bomb
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Feb 17, 2017 07:41
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Pissflaps posted:I'm talking about the death of labour in Scotland. Pissflaps posted:The days of Ed Miliband now seem like a golden age compared to Labour in 2017. 🤔
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Feb 20, 2017 23:28
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Pissflaps posted:There's no incongruity: Corbyn is overseeing the same happening to labour in the uk as a whole. Labour was already in trouble by the time it lost the GE and all of Scotland. That's why Miliband quit and that's the situation Corbyn inherited. It's really easy to pretend everything was just great until lousy Corbyn messed everything up It's also easy to ignore that Labour's polling was actually trending upwards for once until something happened in June last year, something about a referendum... and his own party launching a protracted public coup intended to dominate the news cycle with bad PR. Purely a coincidence that this is when Labour's polling tanked though
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Feb 21, 2017 00:52
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serious gaylord posted:Not quite. Labour have consistently polled around 30-35% for general election preference since mid 2015. The narrowing of the gap in the run up the referendum shows a drop in the tories and a big swing to UKIP while labours numbers remained fairly steady. Then Brexit happened, UKIP no longer had a purpose and they all flocked back to the conservatives. I'm not talking about the Tories, I'm talking about Labour's raw numbers. I can pop out some graphs when I'm at a computer but e.g. 
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Feb 21, 2017 01:50
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Pissflaps posted:Here's that 'upward trend' Haha yeah keep moving those goalposts pissflaps
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Feb 21, 2017 01:51
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^^^I know it's early but come on. Close your left eye or something dratendlessmonotony posted:As a democrat he had the options of calling for a second referendum because the situation has changed... and also asking his MPs to vote according to their constituents' wishes and not whip. If this isn't lead-up to him resigning and making way for a better leader, he's deluded, and this is as someone who quite likes socialism and jam alike. He can call for a second referendum later, when the situation actually has changed. Like what exactly do you think has happened yet? Absolutely nothing. Everything about brexit is completely nebulous and promises everything to everyone. There's nothing to fight, no specifics to build a case against. We already had the general 'things will be bad' argument and how well did that go? The only thing that's changed since the referendum is that a larger majority now support going ahead with some form of brexit - not exactly fertile ground for a second referendum to save us all. Until the terrible, terrible details of what's actually in store begin to emerge from these negotiations, there's not really much anyone can do baka kaba fucked around with this message at 08:18 on Feb 21, 2017 |
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Feb 21, 2017 08:15
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You literally want Labour to lose the next election so you can rub Corbyn's nose in it like a naughty puppy
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Feb 21, 2017 08:59
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Prince John posted:Our primary school merrily used the racist version in the 80s, but I was completely oblivious to the racism part. I think I was in my twenties before I happened to hear it again and thought "hang on a minute...". Honestly until the whole Clarkson thing I'd never heard anyone say anything past "eeny meeny miny mo" and then pick whatever they were pointing at
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Feb 22, 2017 00:25
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forkboy84 posted:And that was just the first example that really stood out of the CIA's incompetence. There's been loads so far. So bad it's kind of inspirational in a way. They always come across like kids playing a game, except they have the resources of the world's largest superpower to make their stupid ideas actually happen. People die and lives are ruined and societies fall into chaos because some clown has really great ideas about how to totally pwn the enemy. They're a good example of failing upward
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Feb 22, 2017 19:49
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LemonDrizzle posted:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/22/labour-drawing-plansto-work-theresa-may-brexit/ What's surprising about this? Labour wants to be involved in influencing the negotiations, they have to be seen to be acting in good faith, so obviously that's the kind of internal discussion that's going on
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Feb 22, 2017 21:06
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Hmm it's almost like this whole thing is about positioning and being able to make arguments rather than control a majority government
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Feb 22, 2017 21:13
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Guavanaut posted:That's barely a step up from reporting on what Local Lad Jack has to say in the popular Brexit Magazine. How has this not been scanned and posted all over the internet yet? I guess it's a local magazine for local people but someone needs to risk it
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Feb 22, 2017 22:55
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forkboy84 posted:Two things in The Guardian I've liked in one day. Impressive going. 
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Feb 23, 2017 14:04
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Guavanaut posted:Thought this was one of those political compasses for a second. But it is  Laradus posted:On the "what is a True English" topic there was an interesting YouGov survey last month about that when they had a spate of nationality-related polling; This is just begging for a comparison test where they have to actually apply this to some real people
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Feb 23, 2017 19:51
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Don't fall for pissflaps's's transparent expectation raising pls
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Feb 23, 2017 22:41
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Niric posted:Pissflaps' posting style often irritate me as much as the next person (apart from the puns, the puns are always solid), but sometimes it doesn't really matter if he's being disengenuous or not if it contains or leads to a vaguely interesting point. And the point that the opposition would be expected to retain a seat in a byelection, but that there's a very good chance they won't, at least according to the betting markets, is interesting (if depressing). Yeah but if he genuinely believes the 'Jeremy is electoral poison driving away all the voters oh god the polls' schtick then it wouldn't be even slightly surprising if there's an upset or close result at either election. There's all kinds of stuff going on (Brexit especially, needing an election because Labour's Tristram Hunt got bored with Stoke, the UKIP push, expected low turnout etc) that means it's not exactly the average election situation. If anything these are a test of how the mood and loyalties are shifting, because we're living in times of massive political and national upheaval But pissflaps is more about going 'hey guys I think Labour will win these easily holy poo poo if that doesn't happen!!' so he can act incredulous about it tomorrow for a laugh
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Feb 23, 2017 23:53
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Pissflaps posted:"Figgy poppleton rice" can shove her clean eating chicken burger up her arse. That's one of the benefits of clean eating
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Feb 23, 2017 23:55
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Nobody's saying Corbyn is blameless in what happened, but when a seat has had a steadily decreasing Labour majority for two decades (including during Cameron's government) it's stupid to try and pin it all on the guy who became leader a year and a half ago
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Feb 25, 2017 09:21
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She doesn't mean anything specific, it's just handwavey 'Labour bad' and dogwhistling. People are meant to fill in the blanks themselves But if you want some ideas, some popular tropes are 'Labour destroyed the economy' and 'Labour let in all the immigrants'
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Feb 25, 2017 10:19
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^^^ it means a symbolic hero who's expected to ride in and save the dayPissflaps posted:Let's get 'british public' on the list swap the column titles around and... it's u Why the hell is 'boogie' on there anyway? Or is that the bit where Paul Merton goes 
baka kaba fucked around with this message at 11:08 on Feb 25, 2017 |
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Feb 25, 2017 11:06
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Taear posted:Blame it on the boogie. You know, like the song. Yeah but you're meant to blame it on the boogie, so the joke works better without it?
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Feb 25, 2017 11:18
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Paxman posted:She sees the idea that Labour were actually poo poo when they were last in government nationally as a weapon she can use to convince people they would also be poo poo if they won the mayoral elections in May. This is one of the reasons it's important to challenge the idea that the last Labour government was bad. As well as being untrue, it helps the Tories. At all costs? Because the people who want to replace Corbyn are extremely comfortable with the idea of embracing those 'Labour did all the bad things' ideas, using an admission of guilt and a move towards Tory policies as a mark of 'being a serious and credible party'. The Labour 'moderates' etc want to cut borrowing and enact cuts, they want 'controls on immigration', all because the public accepts the narrative that Labour got those issues wrong and caused all the problems. By supporting them, you're supporting an acceptance of those ideas, and also a push rightwards to actively 'fix our mistakes' Because that's the issue here. Copeland has been losing Labour support for decades - why is that? Jeremy Corbyn didn't turn it around, but he sure didn't cause a sudden change by badmouthing New Labour or anything. People have been losing confidence in the party for a long time, because of local conditions and because of the party's public image, during and after the Blair government. Trying to pretend that they actually had things great won't win people over. Trying to pretend that everything was actually fine and that Jeremy Corbyn lost a cast-iron sure thing and needs to go won't help Labour's public standing What you need is party unity, on-message and making a case that a) the Tories are poo poo and b) voting Labour in the future will be good for you. And both of those things mean acknowledging the issues that have led to the current situation (not pretending they don't exist and that people won't notice what you're doing) and moving forward from there
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Feb 25, 2017 11:38
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big scary monsters posted:I know what the cliché normally means, but this use doesn't really make much sense. Presumably Corbyn is the one currently riding the charger, except that in this context he's being talked about as a failure, not a hero. And why "physically" change, especially in reference to a metaphorical rider? And then, what is physically changing the rider on a white charger a shortcut to? And then later we're not talking about riders any more but heads, which we're going to chop off and replace with new heads. Are the heads still on a white charger? What? The point is the idea of this magical hero who can save the day is stupid. Sticking a new guy on the horse and going 'now we have the hero we need!' won't change anything, because there are deep underlying issues that can't simply be fixed overnight by one person Yeah the head-replacing thing is awkward but who cares, it's pretty clear what the meaning is I think? At least he sounds like he's making an argument on the spot instead of reading some carefully prepared remarks
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Feb 25, 2017 11:48
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learnincurve posted:They don't need to talk about the war when the Tory Press can bang on about how Blair deceived parliament and his own cabinet, implying that if the Tory party had all the facts and knew that the chemical weapons report was made up then they would never have voted for it. I don't think people are voting on whether they hate or love the Iraq war, more like "how have things been going, right here, up until now". And "here's what I think is to blame - which party do I think is going to do something about it?" The trouble is Labour heartlands have been suffering from lack of investment and economic problems for a long time, and two of the biggest narratives the Tories bang on are "Labour crashed the economy and wasted money so now we have to make cuts, but we're the serious party who'll make things right" and "there are too many immigrants and that's why there are no local jobs and why public services are stretched" So you have areas in real need of change, who are being offered a lot of easy pandering answers by the Tories (and UKIP) and reasons not to trust Labour. And a big part of that problem is people believing those narratives and not realising where the blame really lies. And this is absolutely a problem with Corbyn's Labour, that that message just isn't getting out there, but it's in no way limited to his tenure - he didn't get us where we are today. And like I said before, Labour in the past has been happy to perpetuate those lies, believing that if they confess to all the bad things they can me-too on the Tory policies and people will suddenly be happy to vote for them. That kind of thing is a massive gamble and it sure didn't pay off in 2015 big scary monsters posted:Metaphor should illuminate an argument through insightful comparison or clarify a point by analogy. To clumsily misuse a cliché does neither, it obscures and confuses the issue instead. You see it all the time in political speech, politicians relying on bad metaphor to try and bypass actually making an argument rather than just using plain language to set out clear points. I dunno, like I said it seemed clear to me and the analogy felt like it was meant to be awkward, in the sense of 'this is the simplistic fantasy cliche people's attitudes seem to mirror and it just doesn't work like that in reality', but whatever
baka kaba fucked around with this message at 12:15 on Feb 25, 2017 |
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Feb 25, 2017 12:09
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learnincurve posted:Thinking about it, now not only Thatcher is dead, but a lot of the ex-miners and so on who will never vote Tory because they can't just loving let it go are also dead, there are no longer any Labour safe seats at all. I didn't quote it because it was ages back and I was catching up, but someone was talking about how it's bad to base the idea of a 'safe seat' on the size of a party's majority, because then it could move between 'safe' and 'unsafe' and that would 'make no sense' I honestly don't get that line of thinking - a seat should be 'safe' if it comfortably goes for a single party each time. If that becomes threatened, like when the majority drops to dangerous levels, then it doesn't make sense to call it safe anymore. Who cares if it technically hasn't changed sides for decades, it's not like chances of losing it decrease the longer you hold it or anything, either it's currently at risk or it isn't
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Feb 25, 2017 12:26
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Kurtofan posted:how comes theyve got so many ukip voters in wales then They assume you're saying it to the imaginary immigrants and it ends up encouraging them
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Feb 25, 2017 14:52
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croc suit posted:white people not wanting to become a minority in their own country is a bad thing   spectralent posted:Also it's real freaky how many people in healthcare there are in this thread.
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Feb 25, 2017 18:15
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Darth Walrus posted:Remind me, where was that chart of party support over time that showed the Dems mirroring Labour and UKIP mirroring the Tories? There was a way more useful chart that actually showed flows to and from parties so you could see exactly how voters were moving. I don't know the name for that kind of diagram though so I can't find it, anyone got any idea? It was like solid blocks that peeled apart like cheesestrings curving into the next set of blocks for the following election
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Feb 25, 2017 18:22
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Gonzo McFee posted:Never understood the fascination with David Miliband. A guy more gormless than Ed Miliband who's already been found out for endorsing and trying to cover up extraordinary rendition and torture. Pretending he holds some secret key to electoral victory is just weird and feels like a leftover from Tony Blair. "Hello, The News? It's me, David Miliband. I have a hot take I think should be your headline story" and so...
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Feb 25, 2017 19:06
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