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Epsilon Moonshade
Nov 22, 2016

Not an excellent host.

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

Every character is the best character. :colbert:

I'll grudgingly accept this with one exception - there's a particular character later in the game with little motive other than being a massive jerkass.

In a game full of trope-y (and honestly, awesome) characters, that's one they could've skipped or at least fleshed out some motivations for.

Although I guess that you could make the argument that having a character that's a lightning rod for hate makes for a good character if they're used sparingly.

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Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



Epsilon Moonshade posted:

I'll grudgingly accept this with one exception - there's a particular character later in the game with little motive other than being a massive jerkass.
I recall a few characters who seemed to be little more than massive jerkasses. There was a literal Team Unforgivably Evil at one point. Maybe I missed some conversations that redeemed some of them, though.

Epsilon Moonshade posted:

In a game full of trope-y (and honestly, awesome) characters, that's one they could've skipped or at least fleshed out some motivations for.

Although I guess that you could make the argument that having a character that's a lightning rod for hate makes for a good character if they're used sparingly.
There are certainly characters that you love to hate. And in a game where most of the antagonists have viable and believable motivations, it's fine to have a few complete dickheads. There are real people who are complete dickheads for no discernible reason. My problems with the writing in this game do not lie in the characters themselves.

Epsilon Moonshade
Nov 22, 2016

Not an excellent host.

Commander Keene posted:

I recall a few characters who seemed to be little more than massive jerkasses. There was a literal Team Unforgivably Evil at one point. Maybe I missed some conversations that redeemed some of them, though.

The one I'm thinking of is a member of that team, but we're probably straying a bit too close to character spoilers at this point so I'm going to stop. I'll be sure to bring it back up if I remember it later on.

Greyarc
Dec 29, 2016

Entry 7: Shopping, Chatting, Building, Stabbing



Tiz shakes his head.

...I take it from your grim countenance our fears were confirmed.



Well spoken, lad. I shall support the effort however I can. Take this. It will serve as a token of your new office as chairman of the restoration effort.



Tiz bows.

It's an honor. Your Highness... Isn't there any way to drive the Eternian military from the borders of your kingdom?



Bah. They've been a curse upon us all of late. And never more than this last week. They're in a lather over this search for the wind vestal.



They've berthed their ships at the lake southwest of us with cannons trained on the city.



It galls me, but there's little I can do.

......



I am Agnès Oblige, the Vestal of Wind.

You!

I shall resolve the matter. I give you my word, I will cause you no further grief.



You need worry on the matter no further, Your Highness. Farewell.



Agnès walks off.





The Sky Knights have occupied the lake. Their boldness is an affront, but they hold my people hostage.

Seems like a pretty one-sided fight. Still, Agnès's decision to stop the Sky Knights is concerning. Let's have a chat.



......

Don't tell me you're thinking of storming the Eternian camp at the southwest lake alone...

Don't be ridiculous. I'm well aware that I am no match for an airship.

Good. It sounds like they have this city in their crosshairs, besides.

As long as these people are held hostage, I have no choice.

They didn't seem the types to talk this out...

......

Wait... You wouldn't. You can't!

......

The party steps out of the castle.



Get captured! Then they'll take you aboard their airship. That's your ticket across the sea!



You can't really mean to-- Agnès, they'll kill you!

I'll not ask you again. Leave us. You are too eager to meddle in the affairs of others. Farewell.



......?



It seems you've need of a guide. At least let me show you the way there.



I think it's a grand idea! It could take weeks with Agnès's sense of direction.

Airy! ...Very well. Then I ask you to serve as our guide. Only as a guide, and only as far as the lake. Is that clear?



Tiz is abnormally enthused about heading into a camp full of enemy soldiers.

Before heading to the lake, there's side stuff to do. I'm going to talk pure gameplay for a while, so those uninterested should skip ahead to the screenshot of Airy talking.



As mentioned earlier, tapping the button on the left of the lower screen opens a small menu. Starting from the top:
  • The save option allows saving on the world map.
  • The second option is for tutorial quests, which teach basic elements of the game to new players with the bait of small rewards. Interestingly, their completion was carried over for New Game+ even with all carry-over options turned off.
  • The third option is for updating online data.
  • The fourth was just added after the last scene with the king: the rebuilding Norende minigame.


Each of the little icons is either a blockade (the exclamation points) or a shop. In order to finish rebuilding the town, all blockades must be cleared and all shops must be fully upgraded. These two activities are both done by assigning workers to the appropriate icon. The number of workers available are shown in the lower left corner.



The village starts with a small area -- two blockades and two shops -- accessible. Other regions and the shops within can only be accessed after clearing the blockades between the starting area and them. So, why rebuild Norende?



The shops deal in real merchandise. Upgrade a shop, and you get access to new goods sold by the Adventurer.

Any upgraded shops will also routinely give gifts of relevant wares: upgrading the item shop could eventually have you drowning in basic curing items without buying a single one, for example. The trick? The village works in real time. As shown, the first armor shop upgrade takes 30 minutes. Many of the blockades take days. Also, the game must be currently running (sleep mode is encouraged) to count the passage of time.

I'll offer updates on my Norende rebuilding every once in while, but that's about the gist of it. The top shop rewards are fantastic, so if anything it ends up feeling like cheating for throwing so much free junk at the player. You can get more workers using Street Pass, and more workers reduces the amount of time projects take, but I'm not sure I'll bother.

Now, then...



What? Surely it's not so--

How many times did you get lost in that ravine? There was only one path! Then it took you two hours to find me at the top, despite perfect visibility.

Er, the canyon path was... very twisty. I'm certain it's a maze even to the locals...

Ha ha ha... Not really.

......

But at least this way I have an excuse to tag along and... Er, nevermind...

Stay close. The lake we make for is said to be unreachable by any but the most knowledgeable.

R-right! Of course.

Mmm-hmm. I'll bet.

So, um... What do you plan to do once we get there, Agnès?

......

That is no concern of yours, Tiz.

I've no choice...

Not as long as they have the people of Caldisla in their sights.

It will be fine. Enemy or no, they are men, not monsters.

......

A naive vestal and the bloodthirsty shepherd who has a crush on her.



Tiz has made a name for himself in the city.



This is the girl with the obsession over mystery opening cutscene man Ringabel. That said, she's not wrong.



...But talking to the man himself reveals he's busy with more important issues.



I buy one of almost everything in the armory, just missing the rod (basic magic attacker weapon) and bronze helm (useful but oh well). Shopping spree follows:















Now to go test it all out.




Autobattle can be turned on/off during battle using the Y button. It doesn't just make your characters attack, it will try to repeat whatever you did during your last manual turn (characters still can't act if they start their turn below 0 BP). Handy.

With encounter rate set to max and autobattle set to 4x attack for both characters, grinding is a breeze.



The last random encounter in the Caldisla region, currently. Like the zombie, only appears at night.




The goal was to level to 4 and have Tiz reach Freelancer level 2. This gains him the ability Treat, which restores 20% of an ally's HP and can be used while silenced.



Meanwhile, in Norende, upgrading the item shop to start netting free merchandise. Next:



It's time to gracefully surrender.

--

Event Viewer
Main Scenario:
Entering the Palace
Airy's Grand Plan

Party Chat:
Agnès's Intentions
Tiz the Navigator


quote:



pg.2: In recent years, the Eternian Sky Knights have raided Caldisla and taken hostages. Now, with Norende swallowed by the Great Chasm, he feels more helpless than ever. He promised to do all he could to help rebuild the village, and put Tiz, its sole survivor, in charge of the reconstruction.

quote:



quote:


Greyarc fucked around with this message at 07:37 on Feb 24, 2017

Blademaster_Aio
Jan 22, 2017

Agnes is me at the start of every video game, lost and naive with no sense of direction.

I actually like to believe Tiz is helping Agnes just so he can forget about the pain. Like he has to be useful to someone, for some sense of purpose since he lost everything.

Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



At this point, I think it is actually like he says; he wants to help and protect the one person who has the power to Fix Everything.

Pittsburgh Lambic
Feb 16, 2011

Blademaster_Aio posted:

I actually like to believe Tiz is helping Agnes just so he can forget about the pain. Like he has to be useful to someone, for some sense of purpose since he lost everything.

I always viewed Tiz as being like a puppy. He follows you everywhere regardless of whether you want him to, and regardless of how much you try to get him to bother someone else. He just won't let go :smith:

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Huh. Is this actually a Final Fantasy game with a single hub town? That's actually a neat approach if so.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

Although next time, you would be wise to heed the ancient Japanese proverb... phone first!
Greyarc, will you be doing, like, Job analysis or something along those lines later on?

MightyPretenders
Feb 21, 2014

Glazius posted:

Huh. Is this actually a Final Fantasy game with a single hub town? That's actually a neat approach if so.

We haven't gotten to the first boss yet. It's too soon to say whether or not Tiz and Agnes will stay near Caldisla or not.

Epsilon Moonshade
Nov 22, 2016

Not an excellent host.

Blademaster_Aio posted:

Agnes is me at the start of every video game, lost and naive with no sense of direction.

Agnes' lack of directional sense is the best thing ever. :allears:


Blademaster_Aio posted:

I actually like to believe Tiz is helping Agnes just so he can forget about the pain. Like he has to be useful to someone, for some sense of purpose since he lost everything.

He's got survivor's guilt and doesn't really give a drat about what happens to himself, and he really has nothing better to do. All he knew before was herding sheep (and maybe kicking the rear end of the occasional wolf or something since he appears to know how to fight,) so it's not like he's got a lot of job prospects otherwise. :v:

Greyarc
Dec 29, 2016

Junpei posted:

Greyarc, will you be doing, like, Job analysis or something along those lines later on?

I'll be posting summaries for each of the jobs, starting once we get our fourth party member.

Also, next update won't be until after the weekend.

Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



Epsilon Moonshade posted:

Agnes' lack of directional sense is the best thing ever. :allears:
She's like Ryoga. I bet she could go the wrong way in a three-legged race.

Epsilon Moonshade posted:

He's got survivor's guilt and doesn't really give a drat about what happens to himself, and he really has nothing better to do. All he knew before was herding sheep (and maybe kicking the rear end of the occasional wolf or something since he appears to know how to fight,) so it's not like he's got a lot of job prospects otherwise. :v:
Eh, he's the same level as Agnes, who has explicitly not had any combat training in her life, and while his stats are slightly more weighted towards the physical then hers, IIRC, there isn't much difference. RPGs are full of farmboys with no prior combat experience picking up swords and proceeding to devastate the local wildlife and whatever country opposes them. It's like fighting is ingrained into their DNA. It must be tough being a monster in a medieval fantasy world; you always have to worry about whether the farmboy you're about to eat is going to horribly murder you.

Dartonus
Apr 1, 2011

It only gets worse from here on in...

Commander Keene posted:

It must be tough being a monster in a medieval fantasy world; you always have to worry about whether the farmboy you're about to eat is going to horribly murder you.

The trick is to figure out if anyone else looks exactly like your intended victim before you actually attack them.

Paperio
Mar 1, 2012

Greyarc posted:

With encounter rate set to max and autobattle set to 4x attack for both characters, grinding is a breeze.

This. The way this game treats random battles is one of its best features. Along with this and other menu tools that haven't been mentioned, you can completely adjust the game's pacing and difficulty to whatever you feel like, from grinding several battles in minutes to completely turning off random encounters the entire game.

Greyarc
Dec 29, 2016

Entry 8: Surrender at the Southwest Lake



Time to head to the lake and meet these Eternian Sky Knights face-to-face. Hopefully now they're open to peaceful talks.

Fun fact: the background for the following cutscene has the appropriate lighting changes depending on whether you go to the lake at day or night.



Hm, seems we've been saved the effort. Have a look below.

Hm? Ahh, the vestal's come to us!





Ugh, let's be done with her and back to the villa already. I'm liable to go on a killing spree if I don't get a proper shower soon.

Watch the ship, boys!

Aye, sir!







This blue light--what's happening?

A part of the asterisks' power, boy! You've nowhere to run. Not till I'm finished with you!



What!? I live for fighting, woman! Let me have this! My heart's fuse is lit! You can't unlight my heart fuse!

Ugh, must you always shout? Daft or loud, man. Pick one!



...I understand that. I've no intention of resisting.



Whaaat!? No soul-searing combat? No white-knuckled fisticuffs? No smashing!?



Now, come along, vestal. I'll see you're well taken care of.



Well, that was a surprisingly reasonable yet bittersweet parting.






You. Sky Knights. Will you promise me she won't be mistreated?

I've said it once. I plan to take care of her myself. I'll see the beatings aren't fatal.

Beatings! Finally! Ha haa, count me in!

What!?

She's dragged us all across this backwater for weeks. Surely I'm entitled to vent my frustrations?

Hm hmm, but fear not. I'll see she's brought back from the brink each time. Though I fear my magic won't keep the girl's mind intact.



Are you listening to this, Agnès? I told you before...



You're my hope. I'll not hand you over to these monsters!

Ahh, youth. So passionate. So sincere. So thoroughly stupid.



Barras! Show these starry-eyed brats what they're up against!







Time for the first boss battle of the game. Holly is a standard Final Fantasy white mage who heals and casts buffs on her party. Barras, likewise, is a standard Final Fantasy monk who... punches things.



Holly spends her first two turns bonking people on the head with her stave...



Before getting serious and using Protect on herself and Barras, raising their physical defense to 125% for a few turns.



She also casts Aero, a damage spell.




Barras, meanwhile, uses Invigorate to raise his physical damage, then attack several times in a row. Nothing a potion can't fix.



Holly goes down first.



Barras finishes himself off with an explosion that damages everyone on the battlefield.



The reward is more than enough to level both party members, as well as have Agnès hit Freelancer level 2.



Barras and Holly drop appropriate Final Fantasy items.





Ever wondered what ethers were made out of? Yum yum.



But that's not all...





We also unlock our second and third jobs. Summaries for each job will be coming once we get our fourth party member. For now, the main thing to know is that switching to these jobs lets us use/learn the abilities Barras and Holly showed off plus more, and change base stats to make us better at punching or spell-casting, respectively.



It certainly is lucky Eternia sent a pair whose bark outmatched their bite.

Tiz...



I swore I would involve no others on my journey. The task I face is mine as vestal, and mine alone...



I had thought I'd steeled myself to face any peril. To withstand any pain... But had I faced those two alone, I'd have faltered. My journey would have ended in a cell, or worse.

I am grateful to you, Tiz. And grateful for you.





Hmph, I did that a while back, silly.



Tiz... I thank you.

That just leaves the problem of how we're crossing the sea. We need to get you to Ancheim, don't we?

I've another plan! This one's better still! If riding their ship as a captive's out, why not as a captain?

You want us to steal an airship!?



We've no way of knowing where it went.

Let's head back to the city for now. We can ask around there.

The airship should still be above the lake unless someone besides Barras knows how to pilot it and drove it away during the battle. The game never explains, though there are some guesses one can make. In any case, the airship isn't here now, so back to Caldisla.


Next: How to use jobs, a book, a fire, and the third member of the party.

--

Event Viewer
Main Scenario:
The Monk and the White Mage
My Ray of Hope
We Go Together


quote:



pg.2: A 24-year-old man of unknown origin. His name is Barras Lehr, and he carries the monk asterisk. A typical brawler, he is rude and violent. He hates it when people call him "bear wrestler."
--------------------------------
Likes: Fighting, drinking, meat
Dislikes: Strategy, thinking, cowardice

quote:



pg.2: A 26-year-old woman from Eternia. Her name is Holly Whyte. She is keeper of the white mage asterisk. Though a healer of great skill, she is sadistic to the core. Hedonistic and capricious, she has a wanton personality.
--------------------------------
Likes: Glamor, tough guys, wine
Dislikes: Pessimists, brats, innocence

quote:


Greyarc fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Feb 24, 2017

Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



Note that, IIRC, the explosion that finished Barras off is the result of Invigorate failing. Yes, Invigorate can fail, but it's obviously not a wasted turn when it does.

And note how Barras "perished", but Holly "was defeated". Meh, probably just sexism with no relevance to the game's plot.

I think the plan is to hijack an airship and pilot, because Barras was the only member of that airship's crew who could actually pilot the one he and Holly were on, and he's dead as a doornail. I don't think airship piloting is standard education for either shepherds or vestals, even wind vestals. Let's hope there's somebody at the command building who can pilot an airship.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!
They're both dead.

I always wanted to get more information about the asterisk barrier, but this is the only time I recall it being mentioned.

Also, someone should share the boss theme. I would, but my phone is a jerk.

Dartonus
Apr 1, 2011

It only gets worse from here on in...

Commander Keene posted:

Note that, IIRC, the explosion that finished Barras off is the result of Invigorate failing. Yes, Invigorate can fail, but it's obviously not a wasted turn when it does.

Actually, iirc, Barras's version is the only one with the AoE effect, the player-usable one only damages the user on failure. Additionally, I believe Barras's Invigorate only fails when he's low on health, but is guaranteed to fail when that is the case.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!
Well he did say he approves of death by frontal assault.

And yes, only Barras can explode like that.

Pureauthor
Jul 8, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT KISSING A GHOST
I like how you just straight up kill the poo poo out of the 2 villains when you meet them.

Pittsburgh Lambic
Feb 16, 2011

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

Also, someone should share the boss theme. I would, but my phone is a jerk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUNw6ka7oTE

Music to burn down all of Eternia to. :rock:

Blademaster_Aio
Jan 22, 2017

Anges should be our monk.

Because the peace loving vestal should be the one to punch things to death via frontal assault!

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Agreed.

MightyPretenders
Feb 21, 2014

Speedrunners just make everyone monks with white magic at about this point, until something more synergistic becomes available. It's good, consistent DPR.

As you might expect, Tiz's natural stats lean towards the Monk's specialty, while Agnes' point her towards White Mage.

YggiDee
Sep 12, 2007

WASP CREW
I always make Agnes the Monk here, for probably about the same reason I usually make Lenna a Dragoon in FFV

gently caress you game, you don't get to tell me which character is slightly more suited to a class

theshim
May 1, 2012

You think you can defeat ME, Ephraimcopter?!?

You couldn't even beat Assassincopter!!!
Same. Plus, Agnes has better outfits overall, but especially in the physical classes :black101:

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
I am 100% behind Agnes beating everything to death with as close to her bare hands as possible. For like the entire game.

It's an interesting way of grabbing jobs, beating people up for them. But "asterisk" doesn't sound like anything all that... powerful or notable.

Blademaster_Aio
Jan 22, 2017

The asterisk gets an explanation in game from how it got its name and where it was made.

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




Good to know the average peasant protag wastes the first miniboss he sees

stone cold

Aquasnake
Jan 30, 2013

"I... I did well, didn't I?"
I never caught on that the different characters had different stat leanings, so I built literally everyone wrong in my playthrough, but I had Agnes primarily as the monk the whole game, which made a particular skit with a bow later on pretty hilarious.

Araxxor
Oct 20, 2012

My disdain for you all knows no bounds.
The stat differences are completely negligible unless you are trying to optimize to a ridiculous degree. The stat changes the Jobs provide usually make up for it.

Also, first time I played this, I thought those two were gonna be recurring minibosses. So I was pretty surprised when it turned out that you actually killled them.

Blademaster_Aio
Jan 22, 2017

Dr. Fetus posted:

The stat differences are completely negligible unless you are trying to optimize to a ridiculous degree. The stat changes the Jobs provide usually make up for it.

Also, first time I played this, I thought those two were gonna be recurring minibosses. So I was pretty surprised when it turned out that you actually killled them.

I was shocked that the farm boy and the vestal actually 'killed' to begin with. Or you can just interpret it as 'fought hard in self defence and then managed to hit some vital spot' that killed them.

Tiz and Agnes sure don't act like they, you know, killed someone, even in self defence.

Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



Aquasnake posted:

I never caught on that the different characters had different stat leanings, so I built literally everyone wrong in my playthrough, but I had Agnes primarily as the monk the whole game, which made a particular skit with a bow later on pretty hilarious.
There is no "wrong". The stat differences are literally negligible. I checked my save file, and the difference between the fastest character and the slowest, both in Freelancer jobs at level 99, is 3 Agility (71-74). I think you need to be the fastest by at least 20 Agility in order to be guaranteed the first turn in a battle. At max level, the fastest character isn't even guaranteed to go before the slowest, let alone get first turn. The other stats are spread similarly. When we say a character is "slanted towards" or "favors" certain jobs, that means Tiz is literally like 2 points stronger than Agnes, and she has maybe 3 more points in Intelligence and/or Wisdom.

Araxxor
Oct 20, 2012

My disdain for you all knows no bounds.
With regards to speed, needing 21 more agility to outspeed something is false. In order to be guaranteed to outspend something, the character's agility needs to be greater than 1.25 times the agility stat of whatever they're trying to outspeed.

Annoyingly enough, they raised the speed randomization to up to 1.4 times in Bravely Second. :argh:

Cador_2004
Oct 13, 2012
To be fair a few points in a given stat matter a lot more early on like at this point in the LP.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

Blademaster_Aio posted:

I was shocked that the farm boy and the vestal actually 'killed' to begin with.

Agnes' thirst for blood is beyond all comprehension.

Commander Keene
Dec 21, 2016

Faster than the others



Dr. Fetus posted:

With regards to speed, needing 21 more agility to outspeed something is false. In order to be guaranteed to outspend something, the character's agility needs to be greater than 1.25 times the agility stat of whatever they're trying to outspeed.
Doesn't change my point. +3 Agility isn't even remotely close to 125% of 74.

Dr. Fetus posted:

Annoyingly enough, they raised the speed randomization to up to 1.4 times in Bravely Second. :argh:
That's annoying. I haven't gotten to the point in Bravely Second where I'm actively trying to manipulate Agility, though, so I hadn't noticed personally. I can accept a little randomness in turn order, or if turn order is completely random, but a large "swing" in turn order really makes it seem like they're only pretending to allow you to affect your turn order.

Kemix
Dec 1, 2013

Because change
Agnes for Monk, Tiz for White Mage. Because god drat it, Agnes has GOT to have some aggression to let out after that. She needs to start punching poo poo until it's a red paste.

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Xander77
Apr 6, 2009

Fuck it then. For another pit sandwich and some 'tater salad, I'll post a few more.



I assumed those two were going to be comic relief villains for the rest of the game. Interesting change.

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