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I remember when the movie came out I was still just barely clinging to my Simpsons obsession, and sitting through it was one of the most awkward moments I've ever had in a theater. The audience was laughing, but you could just feel that everyone was forcing laughter because they felt like they should be laughing. I've watched it only one time since then, it doesn't hold up, it's exactly as bad as any other random zombie Simpsons episode where they're just trying SO hard to cram jokes into every single line and moment but most of them are falling flat. This thread seems to pop up every few months in GBS and it's always interesting to see everyone's different interpretations of when and why it stopped being good, though a lot of them are incorrect talking points that always pop up on the internet and won't die, like: "It went to poo poo when the writers left for Futurama." - False, it was already declining by this point, it just so happened that Futurama premiered only shortly after the classic era of The Simpsons ended. See also "when it decided to start mimicking Family Guy" (which it never really did) "After Conan left the show." - Conan only wrote a few episodes and left before the decline. Yes the show was written as a committee but Conan was *edit - whoops* - just never really that major of a player in the show's success. "Armin Tanzarian episode" - whether you like or hate the episode, it just happened to fall right at the beginning of season 9. There's a drastic difference between season 8 and season 9 due to Mike Scully taking over as showrunner and feeling that the show should be edgier and that the rules the show had established for itself should be challenged. Also it's true that anyone who thinks the love of the old episodes is just out of nostalgia owes it to themselves to head over to SimpsonsWorld.com and just choose literally any episode from seasons 3-7. They're legit good and they hold up very well. Season 2 is also actually very good and has this kind of darker, depressing tone about it, but it isn't as funny as 3-7. Season 1 is laughably archaic, but amazing to see how drastically the show improved in just one year. Season 8 is mostly still great but you start to see tropes of the later seasons creeping in. SweetMercifulCrap! fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Feb 7, 2017 |
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Feb 7, 2017 20:20
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Cough Drop The Beat posted:The Principal and The Pauper isn't even that bad by terrible episode standards. Yeah, it's a garbage concept for an episode and insults the viewer's intelligence, but pick out any random episode from, let's say, 2007 to the present, and Armin Tanzarian is a brilliant idea in contrast. At least there is a concept behind that episode vs. some run-of-the-mill zombie afterthought that came years later. This, and also I think the backlash it received only proves the point they were trying to make in the first place. It's honestly possibly the most interesting episode of The Simpsons in that regard. I think it "works" if you view it as a thought experiment and not entirely canonical. Earlier in the thread it was mentioned that the episode should have conveyed that to to the audience. A last minute reveal that this was Skinner writing a fictionalized autobiography of himself, or something of that nature could have fixed that, but also would dilute the concept.
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Feb 7, 2017 21:13
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Episodes where the plot centers heavily around a new one-off character like that were rare in the good seasons but they went on to use it so often that it's basically a lazy sitcom writing trope now.
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Feb 8, 2017 08:34
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The NYC episode aired right before The Principal and the Pauper and is essentially the final episode of the golden era.
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Feb 8, 2017 16:31
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Drink-Mix Man posted:Worst jokes in modern Simpsons for my money, though, are just their lame attempts at character humor that basically boil down to "[character] has X one-dimensional trait." Crazy Cat lady throws cats! The bullies are bullies, and refer to themselves as such! Groundskeeper Willie is poor, get it? That and their need to insert the supporting characters into any scene. It's like, let's say the family goes to the mall, they draw character names out of a hat of what supporting characters they can cut to at the mall for unrelated filler jokes. Also over-explaining jokes. The way they constantly do it makes it absolutely baffling that these are supposedly professional comedy writers.
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Feb 8, 2017 17:12
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JediTalentAgent posted:Does the over-explaining jokes thing maybe tie in a bit to the show having a more global audience today vs. 20-25 years ago? They have limits to how much can be changed in a script for each market, so better make sure everyone knows exactly WHY this is funny in case you're not from a culture that gets it. I mean it's possible, but hasn't the show pretty much been global since the mid 90s? Often it's not even explaining something that requires it though. I'll make up a scenario: Lisa: "dad, you shouldn't leave this manhole cover open, it isn't safe!" Homer: "oh it's fine Lisa etc" Classic episode: they walk away and someone falls in behind them and they don't see it or it ends up helping someone somehow Modern episode: *man falls in seconds later* Homer: "OH MY GOD IT TURNS OUT I WAS WRONG AND IT WAS IN FACT A BAD IDEA!"
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Feb 8, 2017 18:53
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Mad Doctor Cthulhu posted:That's also when any criticism of the show was foisted off onto Comic Book Guy, which was a pretty classless way to handle it. Now I'm starting to remember why that mentality drove me away from the show: "gently caress you for liking our show, you're supposed to give us a break because it's free." Yeah, if you're too touchy to deal with criticism and have to resort to mocking your fanbase, take a hike. Yep, and I mean I can understand the frustration back then when it was legit good, which it still was at the time, and it was only extreme fringe nerds criticizing the show. But they held on to that, from what I can tell, to this day. "Oh, the show is different than it used to be but it's still as good as ever. You don't like it? Well you're just a Comic Book Guy then!"
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Feb 8, 2017 20:47
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^pretty much. Supposedly they don't even do it in person half the time and over the phone instead. Think about that. They raised a fuss over the pay cut when they literally just phone it in for like an hour or two a week.
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Feb 9, 2017 19:11
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Son of Rodney posted:Can anybody actually point me toward an actual good episode from the last ten years? I've only seen a handful of them but Bart's New Friend from 2015 (season 26) and The Book Job from 2011 (season 23) come to mind. Of course, you can't watch them ever expecting them to resemble the classic era at all, but about twice a season they manage to pull off an episode that works and isn't total trash.
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Feb 10, 2017 02:42
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PostNouveau posted:Nah it was good. Oh yeah, "Halloween of Horror" (their first non-Treehouse of Horror Halloween episode) was very good and far better than any of the THOH episodes since like, season 10?
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Feb 10, 2017 12:52
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Speaking of killing off characters, anyone remember a few years ago when they made a huge publicity stunt that "a citizen of Springfield is going to die!!" As the season premiere? Then it turned out it was Krusty's dad, who has been in no more than 3 episodes, and only prominently featured in one.
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Feb 10, 2017 15:44
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Maya Fey posted:Are there any episodes from the past ~10 years worth watching? Even the worst Futurama or South Park seasons have a couple There are, people have given some answers on the last few pages. There's usually a small number of decent episodes per season. Usually they're just very bland and forgettable rather than offensively bad.
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Feb 11, 2017 03:19
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Scudworth posted:Basically same poo poo with the box fort, cut it in half. Kids talk to Flanders, bart says "hmmmm", next shot they're both on top of the castle and the delivery army appears. There's some good jokes in the setup to them building a fort, like the bait and switch where Bart gives the name of the company which is pretty "classic Simpsons." But then yeah, the battle scene goes on forever, isn't funny,and is way too over the top and cartoonish. You can just picture what the writer's room was like for these episodes. Formerly they would pitch joke ideas, and only note them if they made them laugh in that moment, and then later still only use them if they still seemed funny after numerous read throughs. In contrast I highly doubt anyone laughed at the entire battle scene concept and it was as dull as any business meeting anywhere. "We need to pad the episode, come up with lots of shipping-related visual puns for the "battle."
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Feb 12, 2017 19:07
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Lowtax posted:There are horrible parallels between The Simpsons and shmorky. They both, at one point in time, had a TON of talent and potential, but then one day they suddenly lost it all and became some vile, revolting affront to all mankind. Then they pooped and peed in their diapers. Well not that part, but you know. also the voice acting on both became really forced and grating
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Feb 13, 2017 04:52
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Thin Privilege posted:
They didn't reanimate them but they edited each episode by zooming in and occasionally stretching so they have a 16:9 aspect ratio. They also seem to have applied a noise filter and everything looks like those pixel smoothing filters on old emulators. It looks terrible. South Park on the other hand still had all the files for every episode season 2 or 3 onward and were able to reformat every episode into 16:9 and look true HD without compromising framing for the most part.
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Feb 13, 2017 22:48
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Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:I will still argue up and down with people about their rosy memories of the first bunch of seasons. There were plenty of: This is pretty true, but those three complaints would only be scratching the surface of why post-classic seasons are bad. The amount of "wacky filler" and cartoony moments is probably the most glossed over aspect of the classic seasons. The show was never grounded in reality, but giving those wacky moments actual good comedic timing, knowing when the joke has gone on long enoguh, and not over-explaining the jokes makes a massive difference.
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Feb 14, 2017 22:01
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Yeah, often in the classic episodes a celebrity will show up and deliver a line or two, but they usually at least came up with an appropriate reason for them to be there and the episode isn't centered around them. Adam West was there at a car show with the original Batmobile. Or Leonard Nimoy in Mage vs. the Monorail - it's a little forced but it also makes sense that they would try to get some celebrities to attend the event for publicity. There aren't any Family Guy-esque cutaways in that they never cut to a non-canonical scene where the characters are inserted into a random pop culture reference, but there are cutaways.
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Feb 16, 2017 00:22
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Another thing regarding the old animation is in addition to breaking the character models for expressions, they would use cinematic angles as well as shots you could only do with animation. Today it's not only sterile with robotic characters, the camera angles are always boring and uninspired.Riptor posted:and also all the completely unnecessary and distracting gags walking into frame during the homer live thing. just reeks of a lack of confidence It was probably because without them the only thing moving would be Homer's mouth.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:00
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I think I've listened to most of the commentaries for the classic seasons, and some of them are great and fun, and you really get a sense of how much they cared about the show back then. I can't imagine they would have anything interesting to say about any modern episode.get that OUT of my face posted:"the principal and the pauper" gets all the ire among fans because it was the first episode of season 9 that felt off. the Lord of the Flies episode was worse, and if any number of those not-as-good episodes were in the place of that one, it would be the one fans point to as the downfall It was actually only the second episode of season 9, the first being the New York City episode, and both were actually holdovers from season 8. It's just a weird episode itself and everything immediately following it was different in tone and style.
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Feb 21, 2017 19:15
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Groovelord Neato posted:why do they have two living rooms. it's common for houses to have two living room areas.
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Feb 23, 2017 18:51
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Scudworth posted:Here's a YouTube playlist of 15 guest couch gags -- https://goo.gl/N5I0M0 This is the most recent one, from last Sunday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXzLju-4Su8 A lot of work went into this for it to be so horribly unfunny. Like, take that, 1998-era South Park! Take THAT.... California Raisins?? I actually think most of these are decent though.
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Feb 24, 2017 22:23
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When they made this segment they either thought they were being the edgiest motherfuckers on the planet or it was entirely cold and calculated over a dull meeting. Probably the latter. There's no way it was anything else.
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Feb 25, 2017 22:59
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There are several excellent episodes in the post-cancellation Futurama though. "The Late Phillip J Fry" is easily a top 10 episode for example.
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Feb 26, 2017 07:27
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I would agree that the original run of Futurama is perfect in that there aren't really any bad episodes, but also I think everyone remembers the trippy sci-fi adventure episodes and less of the sitcom-y ones which make up a good chunk of it and don't hold up quite as well. They sort of feel like filler in retrospect. In the commentaries they mention that Fox wanted there to be a balance between familiarity and crazy sci-fi for a more general audience. And that's why Rick and Morty is great (so far), it's the best elements of Futurama, amped up, minus the filler.
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Feb 28, 2017 19:32
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I loving love that episode and i don't care who knows it. It's weird. At the time it originally aired, it was kind of shocking, but with the context of how much more weird and bland the show would get, it's not that bad. It's weird, at least kind of funny, and most importantly memorable, which is more than can be said for almost all later episodes. Son of Rodney posted:One thing this thread has taught me is that I'm propably the only person who enjoyed the Futurama movies. All of them. Repeatedly. I've seen them all once, and remember almost nothing from them. To me they're a chore to watch as a movie since they don't have any proper flow to the plot from being intended to be split up into four episodes each. But then they also suck as individual episodes. I think they're far worse than the proper Comedy Central seasons that came after.
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Mar 1, 2017 00:33
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Wizard Master posted:How do you guys feel about Bojack Horseman It's fantastic. It's like Mad Men meets Arrested Development and some Zootopi thrown in. But a message to anyone looking to check it out, it doesn't really get good until after the first 6 episodes.
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Mar 5, 2017 05:05
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They could have kept using him as a criminal but the Simpsons should have stopped being his enemy. He is the villain in the ride though and it's actually halfway decent.
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Mar 6, 2017 23:04
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PostNouveau posted:Tonight's episode was about how every kid gets a trophy these days because everyone who writes this show is 60. let me guess.. is there a joke about receiving a trophy for receiving a trophy?
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Mar 20, 2017 20:05
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The explaining the jokes thing has been par for the course ever since Al Jean became showrunner in like, 2001? I want to say it started out as over explaining the joke being the joke (which still sucks), but somehow evolved into the norm for their joke writing.
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Mar 21, 2017 16:55
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Earwicker posted:lol its well past that point. it has not been edgy or experimental in over a decade, and even when it was good it was never really "experimental" even if some of the social commentary was I guess sort of edgy for the 90s? Nah it really was pretty edgy stuff when it was new, it just doesn't seem that way now out of context. It killed the wholesome, generic, copy-pasted, uninspired family sitcom that dominated TV in the 70's and 80's.
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Apr 3, 2017 18:44
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Android Blues posted:Yeah, there's tonnes of stuff that on rewatching you realise it's the writers drawing on the resources of their own childhoods in the 50s - 70s more than anything, even the non-flashback stuff. Like, one of the most consistent sources of gags in early seasons is 50s/60s-style educational filmstrips that Bart and Lisa are forced to watch in school, which would not be happening in 1990. Fwiw, I was in elementary school in the early 90's and we definitely did watch film strips, along with the CRT TV and VCR on a wheeled cart. In the commentaries for the old episodes, they mention how everything was supposed to be slightly behind the times, basically how life would be like for small town America in the late 80's/early 90's.
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Apr 4, 2017 16:22
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I didn't like the new Rick and Morty episode until the end in which it clicked as to what the purpose was - the whole thing was basically to shut up all the crazy, overly in-depth fan theories as well as worries that the show was going to become heavily serialized. I almost wonder if that was their original idea and then they saw all the annoying fan reactions and came to their senses, realizing that the show works as mostly self-contained adventures.
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Apr 6, 2017 20:48
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I still hope it was an April Fool's joke and RIck is still in brain-prison. The real resolution will happen next episode. I do think that's possible too because of how perfectly it went for Rick. But whatever happens I hope it's not a season long arc.
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Apr 6, 2017 20:56
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I think the Frank Grimes episode carries a lot more weight as an adult because no matter what level of success you have achieved, there will always Homers doing better than you. It is one of the earliest instances of jerkass homer but at least it was to make a point.
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Apr 23, 2017 09:24
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I didn't know they did an actual Trump episode (and I really don't think I want to know what happened in it). I was just citing President Lisa saying "We've inherited quite a budget deficit from President Trump." There is no actual Trump episode. They made this (terrible) clip after he announced he was running: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oz7_JP7ROvA Somehow the wires got crossed with this and that joke from the 2000 episode Bart to the Future and now much of the internet thinks they not only predicted his presidency, but were able to animate his campaign press announcement shot for shot in the year 2000.
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Apr 25, 2017 07:12
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMEAjTYwEew
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Apr 25, 2017 19:29
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An Ounce of Gold posted:JK, it was the Skinner episode where we find out that he isn't actually the real Skinner. I don't know if it was the lowest point, but it was one of the worst written episodes. I listened to Mike Reiss speak at a university and I remember him saying, "the problem with today's Simpsons is that at one time Homer was as dumb as you remember your dad being when you were a kid, but now he's as dumb as your shoe." You've seen every episode and you still think this is the worst one? Most fans consider it a point of reference for where the show started to suck, but so, so, so many worse episodes have aired since then.
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Apr 29, 2017 18:30
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FWIW, South Park kind of stopped being a preachy mouthpiece for Matt & Trey a few years ago. They still do topical humor but it's less about taking a stance on a polarizing topic and more about just having some fun with current events. It's definitely better than it was 6+ years ago when it was at it's peak of insufferable preachiness, but I think many people tuned out at that point and will not notice. The most recent season they attempted to do an entire 10-episode story arc, but it fell apart due in part to the fact that they still tried to write it the way they always have, each episode produced entirely in the week before it airs. They admitted this was a failure though. The previous season (from 2015) had a nice balance of continuity and self-contained plot elements though and it was refreshing. So, say what you will about South Park, they addressed their biggest problem of being a soapbox and also have taken some big risks to rejuvenate the show. SweetMercifulCrap! fucked around with this message at 20:48 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 20:46
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A couple of South Park episodes from the last ~5 years that are worth checking out if you abandoned the show a while ago: I Should Have Never Gone Ziplining A Nightmare on Facetime Faith Hilling Handicar Grounded Vindaloop You're Not Yelping Tweek x Craig
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May 22, 2017 21:43
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Neukoln19 posted:wow that tik tok video was really really hard to watch Yeah but even those first few seasons we originally thought sucked are still better than what it's been for the last 15 or so years.
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May 25, 2017 04:59
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