US Education 2017: Countdown to DeVos Destroying Public Education

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I believe the state of US education is...
	Doing very well...
	Could be better...
	Horrendously hosed...
	I have no idea because I only watch Fox News...

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Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

Brainiac Five posted:

It's pretty funny but also pretty revealing that my parents are regularly stunned by how much academic work is required for my youngest sister's Culinary Arts classes.

There's "cooking schools" like Le Cole or Courdon Bleu, but then there are the culinary programs of accredited colleges and universities. It's something you have to explain to people before they understand how rigorous it is. I mean seriously, go take a professional cooking 1 class, the most basic class in a program and tell me you aren't exhausted after every class. I mean, this is off topic, but it's not a horribly bigoted derail like most of the thread so whatever. I just get really pissed when people think I go jackass around in a kitchen all day and that "American Regional Cuisine," a 400 level class, is somehow easy or something they could do. I mean gently caress, we had a food science class that the head of the chemistry department complained about because it was more advanced than their organic chemistry class.

Babylon Astronaut fucked around with this message at 05:12 on Feb 10, 2017

# ¿ Feb 10, 2017 05:07

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 17:12

Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

litany of gulps posted:

Anyone that knows what it actually entails respects the program. Why do you think a class like this gets dismissed by the ignorant? What are they really saying? This isn't at all off-topic.

A: Schools like Courdon Bleu have horrible standards. They are actually closing all their US schools because the teachers became so lax that a cert from their school is considered worse than no experience.
B: Overcompensation. For example, the board of regents is always on our rear end to make it "more educational" so now every single class involves math and writing papers because that's what they think academics looks like.
C: Most people only have to cook to impress their friends and family, and not a culinary teacher. Their work will never be timed or graded.
D: Grandma can make her thanksgiving gravy fine without knowing that she's polymerizing starches and denaturing protein. Learning why things work the way they do is much harder than simply knowing how to do it.
E: TV only shows the cooking part of being a chef, so people don't really think about the chemistry, physics, history, visual arts, accounting, and business management the job actually requires. Not to mention some people use "chef" to mean "a good cook." Look at what the ACF requires to become a master chef: it's loving impossible and almost no one gets there. Taking the test requires two recommendation letters from other master chefs. There are 67 in the world. The test itself costs 3,800 dollars, is 8 days long, and is judged partially by historical accuracy. This is extremely difficult. You need to be taking continuing education classes and re-certify every 5 years. Compare that to "win a reality TV contest."
F: STEM or it doesn't count.

In short: the dunning-kruger effect strikes again!

# ¿ Feb 10, 2017 06:13

Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

Owlofcreamcheese posted:

If you are talking some added electives in shop or electronics or whatever, rad. Do that for sure.

The place my stomach gets real sour is when a group of kids is being failed by their awful underfunded and poorly staffed school and people come up with the idea of "these kids aren't being provided what they need to reach the standards of basic education? I know! lets remove standards of education and I don't know, some guy can maybe come in and teach them plumming or something"

I get what you're saying. It's like the old Newt Gingrich plan of letting the kids be the janitors. No, an underfunded school shouldn't give up on teaching and instead train kids to sweep floors. But everyone is talking about postsecondary, so I don't think it fits.

# ¿ Feb 10, 2017 21:28

Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

Uranium Phoenix posted:

Yeah, I had some kids out because of that. A lot of students and parents are pretty terrified of the new administration. They're worried they or their family members might be deported, and that's true even for those who are here legally.

See, I don't think that's irrational. Even if you are here legally, are they going to cattle car you to a camp to determine your immigration status? How do they clear their name, when they just saw people with legal visas denied at the border? How long will it take? Will their job, home, and belongings be there when they get back, or should they just go to Mexico to avoid being detained in prisons that were shuttered for being dysfunctional? Do you risk your family to stay and keep your job? None of these problems are solved by being here legally.

Owlofcreamcheese posted:

Like if someone wanted to draw up a plan where a kid got a normal education and then IN ADDITION to that also got some practical job training then maybe that would be cool. But it really sucks how many people, even fairly liberal people on D&D feel like the solution to the problem with universal education is to make it less universal.

I think a mandatory class on how to clean things and basic home maintenance would be great. Also, personal finance. I also think they should learn things for the sake of learning, like arts and the humanities. Really, your reading, writing, arithmetic does not need to be immediately applicable to anything to be a great help in life. You're learning empathy, critical thinking, and logical reasoning by studying these subjects.

Babylon Astronaut fucked around with this message at 23:02 on Feb 18, 2017

# ¿ Feb 18, 2017 22:58

Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

You just answered your own question. Your goal wouldn't be to make a boring horrible class.

# ¿ Feb 19, 2017 01:30

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 17:12

Babylon Astronaut: Apr 19, 2012

Sure. I mean the bar is "more interesting to kids than algebra."

# ¿ Feb 19, 2017 04:17

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > US Education 2017: Countdown to DeVos Destroying Public Education