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Shadowrun pretty much uses the cover system of XCom except the outside-combat part is a full on CRPG like Pillars of Eternity or Baldur's gate.
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Feb 17, 2017 17:55
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ohmygorgon posted:Fair enough, and don't get me wrong, even by the low standards set by Fire Emblem and video games in general, I think Fates has a poor story. I just think it's strange that all across the internet, people just hate this game's story so much, when the series already had the bar set pretty low. Not to mention, I think it's fair to criticize the game for its story when the story is pretty much what they marketed the game on. There was basically no marketing about the gameplay mechanics besides 'yeah sure it'll be like Awakening,' every bit of advertisement was about the story.
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Feb 17, 2017 17:59
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ohmygorgon posted:Fair enough, and don't get me wrong, even by the low standards set by Fire Emblem and video games in general, I think Fates has a poor story. I just think it's strange that all across the internet, people just hate this game's story so much, when the series already had the bar set pretty low. Even Awakening had an incredibly generic Fire Emblem story, the only element to make it particularly unique it from every other Fire Emblem is the time travel shenanigans, which was really more for having adult children to fight with you than it was a compelling plot point. At the very least, it is interesting to see Fates try to shake things up, even though it's a minor shake up at best. I feel like you're equating original with good here. Endorph posted:I liked Stella Glow more than 2/3rds of Fates. I'm guessing it being one game as opposed to 3 with a story for two at the most helps. And that's including padding as well.
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Feb 17, 2017 17:59
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Tae posted:Shadowrun pretty much uses the cover system of XCom except the outside-combat part is a full on CRPG like Pillars of Eternity or Baldur's gate. Yeah, Shadowrun and X-COM are the only satisfyingly non-anime (Awakening somehow endeared itself to me) turn-based squad tactics games on PC I've seen in the past decade or so.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:03
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RareAcumen posted:The problem is finding good ones. Because if people can do whatever you can end up with Stella Glow and I can't think of any other ones from the 2010's. Endorph posted:I liked Stella Glow more than 2/3rds of Fates.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:16
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RareAcumen posted:Well, you can't make the game too similar because you risk everyone accusing you of ripping off another one. But the turn-based SRPG games aren't really that rare. They're usually more like FFTactics though. The problem is finding good ones. Because if people can do whatever you can end up with Stella Glow and I can't think of any other ones from the 2010's. Look, I know Days of Ruin was a change-up but it's still a good game even if it didn't have Lash or Sonja also please don't tell me if it came out before 2010 i don't want to think about how long it's been since the last Advance wars
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Feb 17, 2017 18:22
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It was decent? Writing-wise, some of the characters were fun and it had A decent twist. Gameplay wise it was basically exactly like Luminous Arc, but it had a wider variety of characters and decent balance so you actually had some choice in who to use instead of never using the canadian warlus because he has a 10% hit rate and 2 move.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:23
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Endorph posted:FE5 and FE9 have pretty good stories for what they are. They interact with the mechanics of the game, have a proper tone that isn't contradicted by gameplay, some interesting plot and characterization beats, and are exactly as long as they need to be. 5's antagonists are weak, but there's an actual reason for that. And FE4 has a really ambitious, very interesting story, even if its execution is middling due to the limitations of the time. I don't think it's really fair to act like every FE game has a bad story. Fire Emblem has done interesting things with the genre and the medium. That is definitely true. I guess I would say I find Fire Emblem's narrative strengths to be in world building and characters, which, for example, FE9 does an excellent job of, while the actual plot is generally simple. I do not think that is in any way a bad thing, in fact, I think it is unnecessary for a game, particularly a game set like Fire Emblem, to have some deep, amazing plot. You also make an excellent point concerning the marketing. I never even considered that, because I always avoid preview stuff for games, but yeah, it would make sense if IS was selling this game as some sort of excellent story that people would be upset when that does not happen. RareAcumen posted:I feel like you're equating original with good here. Not per se. I'm more just playing Devil's Advocate for all the complaints I've seen directed at the story. Like I said, I do not think Fates' story is particularly good, but I am surprised, and perhaps a bit saddened, by the fact that everyone seems to only want to talk about the story. But, like Endorph said, I guess that does make sense if IS wanted to market the game as a great story, which Fates obviously isn't. That does remind me, I think IS even worked with a professional author to work on the story, which would certianly raise the expectations of the story for the game, although I am not positive if that actually happened or not. ohmygorgon fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Feb 17, 2017 |
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Feb 17, 2017 18:32
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The iwata asks fate interview was two developers and the hired writer.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:46
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mandatory lesbian posted:Look, I know Days of Ruin was a change-up but it's still a good game even if it didn't have Lash or Sonja I never played any of the Advance Wars games, actually. Never looked like my cup of tea. I'm just using it as an example because I can think of menu-JRPGs but turn based stuff like this just makes me draw a big blank for whatever reason.
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Feb 17, 2017 18:49
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Tae posted:The iwata asks fate interview was two developers and the hired writer. I thought that was the case. I can see a bigger expectation for story with a hired writer. ohmygorgon fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Feb 17, 2017 |
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Feb 17, 2017 19:01
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It really strikes me how little I care about the characters in Fates as compared to Awakening. There's nothing I can objectively point to as to why Sully, Stahl, Cordelia, or Gregor is better than anyone from Fates, but I just can't care as much about the characters here. Maybe it's because Corrin is so goddamn stupid compared to Robin. Robin's kinda bland, but he at least reacts to things like he's got a brain in his head. Corrin...does not. I'll say more once a few of the stranger aspects of worldbuilding are revealed here, but I feel like there's a potentially *really interesting* setting based on this whole "astral plane" business that, obviously, is never followed up on, explained, or delved into in the slightest. *sigh* At least the gameplay is fun.
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Feb 17, 2017 19:42
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Personally, the bulk of the cast of Fates is more boring because their one-notes don't even synergize well together. At least in Awakening a good 70% of the supports still feel kinda organic. The most 'dull' character is maybe Laurent, and at least he's optional. Meanwhile, there are maybe about 10-15 interesting characters in Fates, which is a problem when it has maybe the largest or second largest cast in the series.
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Feb 17, 2017 20:03
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If you didn't like Elise, you are scum.
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Feb 17, 2017 20:10
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Seeing this LP has made me suddenly realize that I'd like a Fire Emblem or FE-esque game that's entirely steeped in the feudal Japanese fantasy setting, rather than using it as a weird East Vs. West thing. It probably wouldn't functionally change a lot, but I'd like to see how it could differ compared to the traditional western fantasy stylings. I'd want it to be more than just a reskin/slight tweaking of classes, like what I've observed so far from Fates, but I know I'm just fantasizing here. I will say, though, that some of the weird stat-mod stuff that's going on with skills and weapons are kinda turning me away, but I will admit that it can add to gameplay and strategy depending on implementation. And I'm hoping Dragon Veins could end up more interesting than just "here's a weird gameplay gimmick on some maps only the Lord/select other characters can interact with!", but I'm also not expecting too much. And on yet another note, holy crap Corrin is dumb and gullible. So far he seems to have believed every single thing anyone has ever told him, regardless of how farfetched it seems. The whole "everybody is claiming they're mah family" thing feels painfully contrived, as well. On the one hand it sorta makes me glad I ended up skipping Fates, on the other hand I'd like to try out some of the mechanical changes for myself and see them in action. Eh, maybe I'll remember to look into it when I have the funds.
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Feb 17, 2017 20:17
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ohmygorgon posted:That does remind me, I think IS even worked with a professional author to work on the story, which would certianly raise the expectations of the story for the game, although I am not positive if that actually happened or not.
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Feb 17, 2017 22:18
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mandatory lesbian posted:also please don't tell me if it came out before 2010 i don't want to think about how long it's been since the last Advance wars It's been a little longer than 2010... 2005 ohmygorgon posted:I thought that was the case. I can see a bigger expectation for story with a hired writer. I believe what happened was they hired a writer who gave them the idea for just two paths, and then Nintendo decided to add a third path. Conquest got hit hardest by that but we'll get to that in due time.
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Feb 17, 2017 22:21
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I, for one, would pay to see a Fire Emblem game written by Kiyoshi Shigematsu
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Feb 17, 2017 22:22
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Let Araki write FE. I want Jojo in my SRPGs.
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Feb 17, 2017 22:46
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Taro Yoko should have written Conquest. He would have fixed alot of issues with it. I'm only half joking with that.
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Feb 17, 2017 22:52
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Emperordaein posted:Taro Yoko should have written Conquest. He would have fixed alot of issues with it. I'm only half joking with that. I imagine a Taro Yoko penned Fire Emblem would be like Genealogy but even more wacked out and I would give my left tit to see such a thing become reality.
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Feb 17, 2017 23:13
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Tendronai posted:It's been a little longer than 2010... 2005 i checked and you're WRONG it came out in 2008  still too long
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Feb 17, 2017 23:18
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RandomNinja posted:The combat is these games were certainly interesting to me. Awakening was my first real FE game, so having more of what was essentially the same was a good thing. As for the story, thankfully you can just skip all of it with the start button. Oh my god go and play Fire Emblem 7 stat
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Feb 17, 2017 23:21
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Camel Pimp posted:I imagine a Taro Yoko penned Fire Emblem would be like Genealogy but even more wacked out and I would give my left tit to see such a thing become reality. -1460860764.jpg)
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Feb 18, 2017 00:04
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Cythereal posted:Yeah, but I was meaning less anime and more for PCs. Because PC Gamers can just play 4X games, and I sure as hell spent a lot more time playing stuff like Master of Magic than Shining Force or other TBS stuff as a kid.
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Feb 18, 2017 00:19
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Evil Fluffy posted:Because PC Gamers can just play 4X games, and I sure as hell spent a lot more time playing stuff like Master of Magic than Shining Force or other TBS stuff as a kid. Like I said, I don't like overly anime games - Awakening was the only Fire Emblem game I enjoyed - and turn-based squad tactics can be pretty fun. Awakening, X-COM, and Shadowrun are all great games, and scratch a different itch for me than Civilization. Still, will be reading this LP with interest. I think I heard some noise about it when it was released, that it's the first game in the series to acknowledge that gay people exist?
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Feb 18, 2017 00:23
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Cythereal posted:Like I said, I don't like overly anime games - Awakening was the only Fire Emblem game I enjoyed - and turn-based squad tactics can be pretty fun. Awakening, X-COM, and Shadowrun are all great games, and scratch a different itch for me than Civilization. Not quite. There have been a lot of relationships in the series that have implied in that direction, ranging from Lyn and Florina and Raven and Lucius getting paired endings through Heather being an explicit lesbian and Ike and Soren maybe having something going on in Tellius, right through Awakening confirming that Kjelle is bi as all get-out with DLC dialog amounting to "Severa, my deepest innermost desire is to bang the holy hell out of you." What sets Fates apart is that it's the first game that has explicit gay marriage. Each route has one bisexual character who can marry a Corrin of the same gender. Oddly, there's another bisexual character who can't marry anyone of the same gender, despite a pretty explicit preference. But yeah. There was a lot of noise about it, in all directions.
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Feb 18, 2017 00:51
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mandatory lesbian posted:i checked and you're WRONG I forgot Days of Ruin was a thing 
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Feb 18, 2017 01:00
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Part 1  That's a fancy chair you got there   I am, yes. I still have many questions, but at least now I have a few answers. Thank you for giving me the space I needed to think. Of course, I'm glad to hear you're feeling better. If you wouldn't mind, I have a small favor to ask. Why would I do that? Well...this throne is infused with the power of the First Dragons. It is said that those who sit on it regain their true form and mind. I thought if you sat on the throne, then perhaps- Sit on the drat chair, you have nothing to hide and you literally trusted everything else immediately No! It has nothing to do with trust. I just wonder if the Nohrians have been sealing away your early memories...If so, maybe this special throne could help bring those lost pieces back. Those sweet memories of me and your siblings.... I see. I'm sorry, Corrin. I don't mean to push you toward something you don't want. Thank you, Yukimura. Corrin, you probably don't remember him, but this is Yukimura. He's one of our strategists and brightest leaders. We would be lost without him! You are too kind, milady. Though in truth, I still have much to learn. That said, I am here to help in any way I can, Lord Corrin.*The siblings arrive*   There have been rumors circulating about spies from Nohr infiltrating the castle. I would like to quash those rumors once and for all. Yukimura, is everything ready? Yes, milady. People are beginning to gather at the plaza. Excellent. Thank you. Corrin, I've arranged for Takumi, Hinoka, and Sakura to give you a tour. I thought you might want to get to know the are a little bit before this event. I need to speak with Yukimura first, but I'll meet you at the plaza soon. We'd be happy to show him around. Thank you, Mother.  Not at all. It would be my pleasure. Thank you, Azura. Of course, Corrin.  I can't wait to show you around! I think you'll l-love it here. Thank you, Sakura. A guided tour sounds like a great idea. *Everyone but Ryoma and Yukimura leaves*   Yes, I can't imagine the position he's in. It's a lot to process. That said, I think his return is a message from the gods. A good message, I hope. Why do you say that? I don't know. After that invasion up north, I just feel uneasy. We should remain on high alert, if you ask me.*Time passes*    They're delicious and nutritious! I guarantee you'll love 'em. Well...sure! Why not? Mmm...I've never tasted spices like these before. This is amazing! Ha ha! Told ya! Here, take an extra one on the house. Share it with your lady friend! Well, thank you very much! Here you go, Azura. Thank you, Corrin. Mmm, you're right. This is delicious.  It's quite a contrast from the fortress I grew up in. I'm glad you like it. Like I said, I've always been happy here. BROTHERRRRRRRR Pardon me? I don't trust you. Shouldn't you be heading back to Nohr soon? Takumi... Hey, who said you could me by name? You haven't earned that privilege either.Uh, I understand being suspicious of Corrin because he randomly came out nowhere, but hasn't Azura been there for at least like a few years....? That doesn't even make sense. Excuse me? Azura has been in Hoshido for as long as I've been gone. Shouldn't that be enough to consider her part of the family? Oh god, even Corrin sees it  I apologize for Takumi's rudeness. He's a bit of a hothead. Anyway, how'd you like to try a sweet rice dumpling? It's a Hoshidan specialty! I'd love to. Thanks, Sakura! You're welcome! You know, I'm very close with a girl in Nohr who's around your age."She's technically an adult, like you are!"  uh........... No! Actually, she's my- All right, everyone. The ceremony is starting. Let's head to the plaza!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpgBFiGFE_o  The people gathered at the plaza  Mama Miko gives an assuring smile  The suicidal sword suddenly has an eye why the gently caress do you still have that sword  Suddenly, the force!   This can't be goo-  WELP  And now the sword shatters into pieces!  Jesus christ, how much does dad want Corrin dead?!?!  Well poo poo This is either the most foolproof double-downed plan to kill one man, or the most convoluted attempt to murder a single person in Hoshido But wait, if the latter is the goal then why would they even bot-   I'm fine... I'm so glad....  Mother...Mother!   Show yourself!  He's going nova!   
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Feb 18, 2017 01:05
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Well that was dumb and a bit contrived.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:07
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What the gently caress is even going on at this point?
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Feb 18, 2017 01:16
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I have a feeling that Corrin turning into a dragon was part of the plan. The enemy's weapon loadout implies as much. Corrin turning into a dragon has potential as a story element. But it's not the sort of thing that should be done unless it's a huge part of the plot.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:19
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Head Hit Keyboard posted:What the gently caress is even going on at this point? Well, if I had to put it in words I'd say that Hoshido is starting too...
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Feb 18, 2017 01:49
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Garron said over the sword-phone "No Corrin, you are the demons" And then he was a dragon.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:57
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I never played the game and when it came out I heard all about the three different routes you could take through the game. Up to this point if you hadn't told me the BIG CHOICE hadn't been made yet I would have assumed it was by now. Maybe I don't even remember if you already have. But holy poo poo what is even going on. Everyone's just tugging on this poor guy's arms and legs and nobody is really talking sense yet. YOU'RE MY SON NO, YOU'RE MY SON  BROTHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Feb 18, 2017 02:32
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chiasaur11 posted:Not quite. There have been a lot of relationships in the series that have implied in that direction, ranging from Lyn and Florina and Raven and Lucius getting paired endings through Heather being an explicit lesbian and Ike and Soren maybe having something going on in Tellius, right through Awakening confirming that Kjelle is bi as all get-out with DLC dialog amounting to "Severa, my deepest innermost desire is to bang the holy hell out of you." Huh. Interesting. I'd assumed the series took the usual Japanese stance of "And then they grew out of being queer when they became adults, the end."
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Feb 18, 2017 02:47
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Hey Hoshido. Sane people have a thing called a weapons check. It's good to make sure people from outside didn't bring in anything dangeous. Like say, a Soul Edge looking demon sword. Does your pacifism barrier not make you be able to weapons check. Did you not pay attention to Soul Edge. Whyyyyyyyy. So Mikoto's death was the moment the story truly took a turn downhill for me, just for how manipulative it seemed (OH NO SUPER PERFECT MOM I JUST MET DIED OH NOOOOO), and how it finally stuffed Nohr's appeal into the grave morality wise. I'll get into it later, but like alot of things, I think the story would have turned out better had Mikoto survived, albiet losing her ability to maintain the barrier.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:53
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In terms of plot hits, Birthright is a fairly generic FE story, with all that implies. There also are at least some not entirely goody goody things going on there (ninjas kidnapping a Nohrian princess in retribution isn't exactly on the up and up, no matter how much she doesn't mind years later), though admittedly it hasn't come up much. Conquest on the other hand... well Nohr is fairly obviously set up as the evil kingdom, but it's not like there aren't plenty of decent people living there. I mean, we've already seen the 4 royal siblings there, and they seem mostly okay, and I don't think it's terribly a spoiler to say most of the recruits on that path are generally decent people as well. There were plenty of interesting places they could have taken that story, but the one they chose for Conquest, oh God the story route they took for Conquest.
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Feb 18, 2017 04:13
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Christ this game's story is giving me a headache. 
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Feb 18, 2017 04:33
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you guys haven't seen anything yet! That said, I do like the map for this particular chapter, it's an interesting puzzle
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Feb 18, 2017 04:44
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