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is motorcycling awesome
yes
hell yes
hell loving yes
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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Is Twist of the Wrist any good? The book or the DVD?

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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Thanks for the reading list. It's still winter here, so books are the main way I'm going to get any semblance of skill improvement.

I'm kinda bored of all the moto-vloggers and skill videos on YouTube, which I find do an ok job of showing, but not explaining what's actually going on.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

MomJeans420 posted:

Twist of the Wrist II is also available on youtube. It doesn't look dated at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhOomvv6oNI

Ah. Thanks for the link. Dude has some real David Carradine vibes. Those demos they do on the motorcycle with two sets of handlebars was pretty interesting.

Russian Bear posted:


This channel is kinda interesting for a little while and his videos that commentate about handling emergency situations (like your buddy crashing) are also pretty cool

https://www.youtube.com/user/Stubbs928

Yep. I've been using his low-speed maneuvering drill tutorials.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

Carth Dookie posted:

First time I got on a road bicycle was surreal since I hadn't ridden a bicycle for years, but had ridden a motorbike continuously for about 10 and my ride was the 1250 bandit at the time. The lightness and speed of the handlebars was quite unnerving for about 20 minutes. The weird part was when I next rode my bandit a few weeks later it felt like an unstable boat for a while until I mentally partitioned the difference between a bicycle and a motorcycle. It's like my subconscious chucked a wobbly because it only had space for controls of one two wheeled vehicle and I kept loving with it.

I was a daily bike commuter pre-pandemic and regularly put 1000+ miles a year on a bicycle. When I recently started riding a motorcycle, I found that counter-steering and cornering came pretty naturally to me, but managing the weight of the motorcycle is still pretty challenging. It definitely feels a bit floaty and boat-like at low speeds. Feeling the whole motorcycle rock forward under braking loads was unnerving at first. Also breaking bicycle habits on a motorcycle is annoying, like walking your bike forward at a stop.

quote:

Sounds like it's almost an "uncanny valley" of control affinity for two-wheelers. Close, but different enough to make a rider uneasy.

Definitely felt that way for me. I fully intend to keep cycling and motorcycling all summer. Hope the uneasiness goes away.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Just checking that a research octane number of 91 is equal to 87 (R+M)/2 rating (US regular)?

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I've been trying to build up confidence in taking my bike out on the highway. I don't mind that my 250cc honda tops out at 78mph but I'm still unnerved by how much I get blown around, especially with an upright riding position. I got anxious on the highway after an hour on a recent trip and took city roads the rest of the way. Any tips for feeling more planted and secure?


Also my pillion came off while I was riding the other day. Fortunately I was able to pin it in place with my rear end before it fell off and was able to lock it properly after I pulled over.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

builds character posted:

I have a not super helpful tip which is ride some dirt. Maybe something like cornerspin depending on where you are. It will help you learn that the bike moving under you is OK. The bike really wants to stay up and as a general rule you’re the one that will make bad things happen with overreaction. Otherwise, as folks have said, just accept that there’s some wind and relax and ride through it. My guess is it’s the anticipation of getting blown around that’s causing issues.

You've inspired me. I found a dirt bike class not too far from me and I'm going to see if I can book a lesson next month.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

Midjack posted:

Their June dates actually work out slightly better for me so I'm going to accept their reschedule this time but if they try to push into July or later then I'm done with them and will go elsewhere. Apex Cycle in the DC metro area if you're curious, and I'm only going through them because the local community college discontinued their MSF program last summer.

Sorry to hear they're jerking you around. I took the class with them last October and it went smoothly. It was a bit far from me but they were the only ones offering classes during the panini.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Finally managed to schedule some time with a mechanic and get frame sliders installed (no cut). They're surprisingly unobtrusive.
One one hand I'm thinking it's kinda moot putting them on a bike that was dropped by the PO, but on the other, seems like a good way to prevent any more damage.

The mechanic pointed out my front turn signal stalk is loose and my right handlebar has a subtle bend to it, so I ordered those parts. Nice thing about this honda is that most of the OEM parts are on ebay at reasonable prices. Except mufflers, which are super pricey new and all the used ones look beaten to hell. I just want a less obnoxiously loud muffler.

The mechanic also told be that 250cc bikes like this have a habit of burning oil at freeway speeds and he advised me against doing more than 45 minutes at a time above 65mph.

Also I now have 700 miles under my belt :toot:

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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
In a first for me, someone started reversing toward me at a traffic light. And the car had no reverse lights or brake lights, so I was pretty rattled to see a car all of a sudden backing into me. Fortunately I left plenty of space between myself and the car in front and could easily swerve. The driver was trying to get into a different lane to make a turn, but he waved at me, so I guess that means I have to forgive him.

Also, is it appropriate to give the motorcycle wave/salute to cops on motorcycles? I passed a line of them today and couldn't make up my mind.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I am a shade of mocha with extra cream and have a non-European name.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I've been using trail braking a lot more and it's made me more confident in corners. So much so that it makes me thing the way cornering is taught is bad?

Slow look lean roll is fine, but the whole thing about finding a line, outside inside outside, apexing etc. doesn't seem helpful, especially if you don't already know the corner. I've already had a couple close calls with debris and potholes in turns, so I'm keen to keep my brakes loaded. In longer turns, I just keep a steady lane position through the turn instead of trying to find the apex. I'm sure it's less efficient, but I think it gives me a larger margin for correction and reaction in city riding.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I recently crossed the mille miglia mark and decided this was a good time to check the old expense spreadsheet. It looks like I've spent about $6730 on motorcycling so far. That includes the bike itself, a full year of insurance, the $300 MSF course I took last year, apparel, parts, and service. It also includes gas, but it's just an estimate based on my average mpg and average gas prices (I haven't bothered to track gas closely, but I have a detailed breakdown of the specific items I bought, service records, etc. if anyone is interested).

On balance, I think this was a good decision, and I wish I started sooner. I found learning and applying skills to be rewarding. I look forward to riding my motorcycle, even on grocery runs, in a way I never really looked forward to driving (I still get joy out of riding a bicycle, but that's a separate kind of thrill). I've been taking longer trips, but I'm starting to run into fatigue as a limiting factor, both physical and mental. Riding on the highway still makes me nervous because of how much I've been blown around, but I power through it now.

I've had a couple close calls with cars, a couple times with someone in an oncoming lane drifting over the center line and a couple of times with people pulling into the street from blind driveways. As for my own mistakes, I did run wide on a turn early on and have been far more conservative about speed ever since. The closest I've come to dropping the bike happened when I put my foot down on wet leaves or slippery asphalt at a stop. I still forget to cancel my turn signals and occasionally sound the horn when trying.

I've also been rigorous about ATGATT, with the exception being that I'll wear my normal street jeans or pants when running errands around town. Otherwise, it's always jacket, helmet, gloves, boots, ear plugs. Not gonna lie, it's been tempting to forgo the jacket as it gets hot and I see a lot of other riders around here squidding in t-shirts.

Skill development: I go to a parking lot about once a week and practice emergency braking. I've been using trail braking in turns more and that's helped boost my confidence. I still run a bit wide doing tight figure 8s in four parking spaces. I need more practice doing swerves at speed. I also still need to get better at finessing the throttle and the clutch. My bike seems to have a choppy throttle and lurches a lot even if I roll off the throttle gently, mainly in first and second gear.

In terms of the bike itself, a 2013 Honda CBR250, I've been pretty happy with it. I don't feel like it needs more power but it does feel a bit floaty on the highway, as though it's gliding, and the wind certainly doesn't help. The bike doesn't have ABS and I have locked the back wheel a couple times, but the bike is forgiving. My interest in other bikes stems solely from curiosity about what else is out there. I'm not looking to buy a different bike for a while, but I'm thinking about something with larger displacement and ABS.

For this bike, I'm thinking about getting saddle bags or a top case so I don't always have to wear my backpack and so I can take longer trips.

Thank you to the fine folks here (and other online and IRL bike people) for coaching me through this. Sorry for the long post, but I figured it would be better to contain it to one post.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Tire pressure is fine, but the suspension is already on 2nd lowest/softest setting out of 5 notches. I'll try turning it up a notch. (I weigh about 150 lbs). Maybe the front shocks are the issue.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Just heard from my sibling that my lil nephew blabbed to my parents that I have a motorcycle. Now I have to have the fourth most-awkward conversation with my parents in the near future. The MSF course did not prepare me for this.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Is it a trick of the lighting or is there a hefty dent in that gas tank?

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
No gopro, but here is what I recorded from my phone in a ram mount

https://i.imgur.com/rAhuCHc.mp4

And here is me doing figure 8s

https://i.imgur.com/Lh0qo1g.mp4

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

Toe Rag posted:

Man that is shockingly bad quality.


Yep. The low res is because I downscaled it quite a bit to keep the upload small, but the jello effect is because cell phone cameras use a rolling shutter. You're also seeing the phone's image stabilization struggling to keep up. My understanding is the vibrations from the bike overtax it and can kill your phone camera (I only recorded a couple minutes). I still use my phone on the bike to navigate occasionally, but don't ever turn on the camera.

The bike itself is a one-cylinder, so there's that aspect too. If I uploaded a version with sound, you'd hear the rpm changing in sync with the video.

Anyway, a GoPro or something like it is on my wishlist. Still trying to see what the optimal setup is for a just-in-case dashcam.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I got to spend the weekend with a guzzi V7, marking the third bike I've ever ridden.

Coming from a 250 Honda, I definitely felt the the extra 100 lbs. It was way harder to maneuver at slow speeds. I dropped it once when I was pulling out of a driveway and was cut off by someone who ran a red. I stopped while leaned over and my leg wasn't ready to catch the weight. Fortunately it had crash bars on it, but it did leave a scratch in the crash bar. The V7 has a low seat height but was harder to flatfoot than my 250 because it was so wide. I feel so embarrassed I let it happen. Riding a different bike was definitely humbling.

Driving, though, it felt amazing. A heavy bike like that feels so planted and secure, and while it shakes at idle, it's amazingly smooth underway. I didn't feel any anxiety on the highway the way I do on my own bike. The power felt reassuring and it didn't seem like it would push me to do dangerous things. It was neat feel the bike pull to the right when revving at idle, and I could feel the heat coming off the cylinders.

The only other mishap was that I put a rain cover on it and when I came back in the morning, some of the plastic melted onto the pipe. The owner told me something similar happened to him and it can come off with oven cleaner.

My own bike afterward felt tiny, buzzy, and cramped afterward in comparison.

The next bikes I'd want to try are a bonneville and maybe a larger displacement sportbike. Not sure I want to buy a new bike just yet though, especially since the insurance rates for first year drivers on anything larger than 400cc is astronomical here. I'm also not committed to a riding style just yet and am still trying to schedule a dirt bike class.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Professor, I promise to learn the difference between power and torque before the the exam. :science:

And yes, I did notice that when I first started riding, I kept stalling the 250 because I didn't rev it high enough to get moving. Whereas the v7 would get rolling at just a hair above idle.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Recently took a dirt riding class, per a suggestion from this thread. Just some thoughts:

We were on Honda CRF230s. It's taller than my CBR and I had to be on my toes, but I felt pretty comfortable on it (I'm 5' 7"/170cm). I think it's because it's such a narrow bike. The bike that I struggled the most to balance was a cruiser I think because it was so wide, even though the seat height was so low. So I think width is more important than height as far as my handling abilities.

The suspension on the bike felt nice. I expected the ride to be more jarring through the course, but it felt quite smooth, even when sitting. I also thought it was pretty responsive, though I don't have much to compare it to.

The course emphasized leveraging your bodyweight to maneuver and counterbalance. We did a lot of standing almost upright on the pegs, which was a fairly new riding posture for me. It also got pretty tiring. I struggled a bit with positioning my feet on the pegs during sharp turns, which I think led me to run wide a few times.

We rode a bit in sand, gravel, and slippery grass. We also rode through the woods a bit and practiced going over logs and obstacles. Breaking traction is no longer terrifying, but I don't think I'm skilled enough to use techniques like sliding the rear to my advantage.

I think the key thing I came away with was becoming more comfortable allowing the bike to maneuver itself beneath me as the terrain changes (which I recall was the main reason I was advised to try dirt riding). But beyond that, I'm not sure what else is transferrable to street riding, though I haven't had a chance to ride my own bike since the class. Fun experience overall.

T Zero fucked around with this message at 03:38 on Sep 11, 2021

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Perhaps a dumb question, but how do I learn how to ride with a passenger?

A coworker asked for a ride home the other day and I refused saying that I need to practice first. But then she (correctly) asked how do I practice without riding with someone.

Yes, I understand that the passenger should be as geared up and protected as the driver.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Sort of the opposite inquiry: If I intend to ride all winter (at least an hour a week, once a week) anything I should be doing to ensure reliable starting? Bike is fuel-injected, stored in an unheated, covered car port and temps here drop below freezing, though I will likely avoid riding on such cold days.

Also I keep my tires inflated to near the max rec on the sidewall (29psi). Is it worth reducing pressure a bit to improve traction on cold days?

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
CBR250

This is from the manual, and identical to the chart on the swingarm

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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
My mistake - I said "sidewall" when I meant "sidearm/swingarm". Sorry for the confusion.

The tires are Michelin pilot street radials, rated max 38 PSI front, 41 psi rear. Front tire is new this year, rear tire is 1.5 years old, with plenty of tread left.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Got a pleasant surprise from my insurance company for my bike anniversary.



Also a sentence I never thought I would say

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Basically everything except collision, which would almost double my premium. I didn't think it was worth spending close to 1/3rd of my bike's value on insurance alone.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I actually called the insurance company to verify that I didn't lose any coverage and figure out why they dropped my rate. They told me there is a 10% renewal discount and that I had a surcharge on my account because of something in my driving record, but they couldn't tell me what. They dropped the extra charge after a year. I assumed it was a new rider markup, but they said that wasn't it.

I've never owned a vehicle before this bike and the only moving violation I've had was a speeding ticket in a rental car a decade ago. No idea what points I have on my record. I did switch my state registration when I got my moto license though.

:iiam:

My recollection is that my insurance rate does include an MSF discount and a discount for having a wheel lock.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Vehicle ownership per capita:

Switzerland: 524 per 1,000 residents
UK: 491
US: 800

https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-962-january-30-2017-vehicles-capita-other-regionscountries-compared-united-states

The average car in the UK drives about 6,800 miles per year. In the US, it's more than 14,000.

https://www.nimblefins.co.uk/cheap-car-insurance/average-car-mileage-uk

The US has more drivers and those drivers drive more. Those drivers are also worse at driving and the US has worse infrastructure. That leads to more insurance payouts. More frequent payouts divided among more drivers means the coverage per driver is lower.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

Howdges posted:

That clutch slippage became a major factor for the figure 8. I repeatedly made a fool of myself, cutting wide, putting a foot down, opening the throttle way too much. I kind of sort of got it eventually, but it doesn't feel smooth and I think I'm going to fall over the whole time. Fortunately for the test you only have to make a u-turn. I passed so now it's time to pay way too much for a bike and continue my training in a parking lot. Gonna check out that short motorcycle chick too, thank you.

E: Everyone says the rebel is microscopic too so that's probably my best bet

In terms of balance, I've found that seat width is more important than seat height. I had more trouble maneuvering a low, wide cruiser on foot than a tall, narrow dirt bike. Waddling a large bike out of a parking spot can be tricky.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Nitrile gloves work on capacitive screens, so maybe snip the finger off one and put it on your riding glove?

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

SEKCobra posted:

Are you sure? I use nitrile gloves professionally and I have to really push down to get capacitive screens to work with them.

Works for me.

This is me wearing a nitrile glove over a knit glove using a phone that has a tempered glass screen protector on it. In cold weather, I wear my riding gloves over this.

https://imgur.com/b1Rm2dj

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Since I'm just over one year into riding and it's coming up on tax time, I decided to look at my bike expenses and figured it might be of interest to other folks. Values here are in dollars. Total spend is $7490, excluding fuel (my back of the envelope fuel cost estimate is about $140 (~3000 mi @ 65 mpg and $3/gallon)).

"Hardware" includes the bike itself and things attached to the bike. "Administration" is legal paperwork and insurance.

It's more than I thought I would spend (was initially expecting $6000 for everything), but overall a worthwhile endeavor. Of course, a lot of this is one-time startup costs, so the overall spend per mile will decline over time.

Edit: Bike is a 2013 Honda CBR250R purchased from a dealer with 4100 miles, ~$3000 total out the door. It was clearly dropped on its right side by the PO, so I replaced a few parts and had the fairings repaired.

Edit 2: One thing I'm wondering is whether it's worth restoring the exhaust to stock. It currently has a Delkevic exhaust that is annoyingly loud, but I've gotten used to it. I just saw a good stock can pop up on ebay, but it's $165. The stock can is heavier though (15lbs, vs 5 lbs for the Delkevic).

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T Zero fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Feb 14, 2022

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Sure. Here is the service record. The color coded rows distinguish two separate trips to the mechanic.

It was mainly fixing PO damage but also replaced an aging front tire. Since it was dropped on the right side, there was damage to all the sticky-outy bits, though mostly cosmetic. The only remaining damage is a scrape on the outer fairing and a small crack near one of the mounts. Mechanic said it would be cheaper to replace the whole right fairing than to try to fix the damage. I'm keeping an eye on ebay, but all the replacement panels are even more dinged up than mine. And since it's just cosmetic, I'm not worried. I may replace it if I come around to selling it, but even then I'm not sure it would help it fetch a higher price.

As you can see, a lot of the cost is in having a pro do the work. It's my first bike, so I really didn't want to mess around with anything that could compromise it (also I started accumulating tools later in the year). I think it was worth it for the piece of mind.

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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Dunno if I've graduated out of the newbie thread, but I recently went to California to see family and rented a couple bikes.

I got my first taste of lane splitting and filtering. It felt surprisingly natural and safe. Only on a couple stretches did I have to bob the handlebars to avoid mirrors. Wish I could do that back east.

The bikes I rented -

CBR500: It felt like much more sturdy and well-built version of my CBR250. Much less buzzing and shaking. Also the pipes were much quieter and I was amazed how much a quiet bike made longer rides less tiring. I was also surprised that the riding position was so upright, almost identical to the 250. I had to scooch back in the seat and deliberately crouch when crossing bridges. The power delivery was smooth and consistent, never felt like it would launch out from under me. It's basically how I imagined a motorcycle throttle would work. It made me much more confident on the highway. The throttle on my 250 feels more like a suggestion to the engine. On the other hand, engine braking on the 500 seemed to be a lot weaker.

Annoyingly the horn is above the turn signal on this bike but it's below on my 250. Ended up beeping a lot of folks.

Zero SR: I rode a newer Zero on a demo day, so I wasn't too surprised by this one. I did have a bit of range anxiety and had to plan my riding a bit more carefully. I kept reflexively grabbing for a clutch that wasn't there. It was also a bit tricky to modulate the power with just the throttle (had to put my foot down a few times making low speed turns). The lower center of gravity seemed to make it more stable in the wind. I felt like I was blown around much less on the highway. Also, having that little cubby in lieu of a gas tank was super useful.

Both bikes had ABS, but I didn't really notice it coming into play.

I could see myself owning and being happy with either bike. What other bikes should I try? I have my eye on a z900rs and a svartpilen near me.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
I don't have any particular goals in mind. I'm just trying to sample what's out there and see what bikes provide a unique riding experience. I don't intend to buy a new bike anytime soon, especially with inventories, supply chains, gas prices and markups being what they are. My current bike fulfills most of my utilitarian needs, but I'm kinda bored with it as a joyrider.

Haven't thought about an SV650, but I don't see anyone offering one on Riders Share or Twisted Road near me. I'll look into a Harley or another big cruiser or bagger, but I'm a bit intimidated by heavy bikes and I'd have to maneuver it in a tiny parking lot where I live. My parking spot faces down hill, so I'd have to be able to reverse the bike out uphill.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you

unimportantguy posted:

What motorcycle dudes on YouTube are worth watching? I like Jerry Palladino, FortNine, and DanDantheFireMan. Is there anyone else I should have on my watch list?

I've found tutorials on this tiny channel by a Russian instructor to be helpful: https://www.youtube.com/c/MotoControlEn/videos
Although the guy recently fled Russia for reasons and the channel's future is up in the air

Marlon only has a handful of videos and hasn't posted in a year, but I like his sense of humor: https://www.youtube.com/user/StrangelyBrownNo1/videos

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Had a close call today.

I was making a downhill right-hand turn, admittedly going a bit fast (30 in a 25) and riding in the far left lane position. The roads here had been dry for a few days and it had just started raining. It was a shallow turn so as I was approaching, I saw that traffic was backed up at the light around the corner. I began braking, but not soon enough, and braked a more aggressively as I started making the turn. The corner was a bit dusty and now damp, so the rear tire slid out sideways. I thought I was going to low-side, but I managed to correct and keep the bike upright. As I straightened up, I jumped the very low curb into the grass median and then got back into the road. As far as I remember, I didn't lock up either wheel.

Looking back, I should have slowed down and took a less wide line through the turn to give my self enough margin to correct. I think I was also indecisive - I should have committed to stopping and adjusting before the turn rather than trying to adjust speed and direction while leaned over.

And of course, this all happened about 30 seconds after I had just pulled out of my apartment building. I'm guessing my tires were a bit cold too, though I don't think that was a huge factor here.

T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Re: ear plugs - I've got Ear Peace christmas tree-shaped plugs and I've got a bunch on lazer lites in various pockets, but I think my left ear canal has gotten larger. Ear plugs don't seal as well on that side now and I'm wondering whether the ear plugs themselves changed the shape of the canal.

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T Zero
Sep 26, 2005
When the enemy is in range, so are you
Went to an open "cone camp" today and it was lot of fun. It's a group of riders who do competition riding on cruisers who meet up on weekends to practice riding. I was told this was one of their smaller sessions because of the holiday weekend. I was on the tiniest bike there but the turns and maneuvers were still really tough. I struggled with a couple of the very tight circles they laid out. I still have a lot of room for improvement on finessing the clutch, but I think my throttle is also pretty snatchy at low revs.

It was interesting because the competitive folks were absolutely shameless about scraping floorboards and tipping their bikes over. The rider who walked me through the course first asked me what kind of protection I had on my bike. "We drop bikes here all the time." One of the more advanced riders did the course without using his brakes at all (he rode through it with a cone balanced over his foot to prove it).

The only issue though is that the riders were all doing their own thing -- I didn't receive much in the way of coaching, although I'm guessing the Harley and Indian riders didn't have much insight into a low cc sportbike. They did warn me to take breaks to let my clutch cool off after such aggressive use, though I dunno how applicable that is to me.

I still need to take a proper intermediate/advanced riding class, but I definitely want to try it again.

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