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Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

I think - someone who's done the maths will be along to prove me completely wrong - that whether enemies rush or not seems to be determined by your ranged strength compared to theirs. It's easiest to see if you're fighting bandits or goblins, once you kill a couple of their archers they'll start charging you and get wrecked

This is correct. The AI rates the strength of both sides ranged contingent and if they are stronger will sit back, if you are stronger it decides it'll lose if it just sits back so comes out and attacks.

And by stronger it seems to just be "I have more guys with ranged weapons" not a complex "he has 1 archer fully tricked out with 116 ranged attack that will murder 3 of my goblins"

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 07:09 on Oct 5, 2021

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Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

I've been playing around with some early game builds and I can't decide if I love or hate dagger spec.

The build is basically aimed at getting geared up asap. The idea is adrenaline, pathfinder, dagger spec, shield spec, recover (maybe crippling and executioner, maybe fast adaptation haven't tried those yet).

The idea is have 2 bros who identify a target with armor you want, drop on them, land 10 punctures real fast (2 then adren then 3 more) drop the target and recover.

It kinda works, both as a priority target removal early game, and gear farmer.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

One that I do like is the headchopper.

Flail duelist that uses flail spec and head hunter to proc a guaranteed head then quick hands an axe or something to make use of it.

Flail boys are good for the early farm and this helps them stay relevant for longer.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

rideANDxORdie posted:

If you're dead set on doing dagger specialists, I would say fast adaptation is a must. Crippling strikes is w/e, most of the time you will be doing enough damage to meet the injury threshold and there's also the fact that huge chunks of enemies are immune to injury or have big enough health pools to functionally be immune. Honestly, I don't think you need to specialize, I've always been able to shank the people I want early game by leaving them for last and surrounding with 5+ bros. Honestly recover is more important than any other perk for this since puncture is so fatigue-intensive. I've said it before, puncture is just too underwhelming as a main damage tool - it's attached to a weapon with low base damage, it doesn't benefit from double grip or duelist, it has a massive fatigue cost, and to top it all off, comes with an aiming malus. You can have two bros that puncture 3 times a turn (for about two turns until they are out of stam), or you can have 3 bros do 2 punctures - the results are super similar in the early game.

The qatal dagger from the Blazing Deserts DLC is a much better choice for a dagger specialist in the long run, you can pick the gladiator origin to get a bro who will be a natural w/ it or can score one from weaponsmiths in the Southern City-States for a pretty reasonable 1.2k-ish. I would recommend overwhelm and nimble/dodge on a high-initiative brother to take advantage of the three attacks a turn. Unlike the regular daggers, the qatal actually does benefit from double grip and/or duelist. They will typically get a regular dagger in their pocket as well for armor-stealing but honestly, the deathblow skill when used appropriately gets something like 90%+ armor penetration so you may not need to swap.

Oh I'm in agreement, it's not a good build really or for anything past maybe shaking a few mercs / nobles after you get 110 then it's basically useless.

I was mainly playing around with different ways to start the gear train with crap bros rather than an actual late game build.

Having played a few more hours, it's actually quite good at grabbing an extra set or two of armor from mercs/supply caravans in what is a fight dangerous enough I'd normally settle for 1 sure thing and hope to get lucky with a second set. It actually underperforms on raiders cause there are so many sets and chances. You just don't need anything it gives you, an adrenaline flail bro or double grip spear guy does it better.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Oct 7, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Yeah, I would have expanded out a while ago, you might struggle with the crisis but you can usually avoid most of it and then have a good 50 or so days to get ready for the next one.

The part of the game that sets difficulty and scaling see no differnece between a party of 1 and a party of 6. So unless you're playing some kind of self imposed challenge you might as well go to 6 fairly quickly.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Might be a rundundant tip but for necro savants nets are super helpful.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Peasants can get squires can't they? They can be real gods once you get cash rolling, very random though.

Theives are pro tier backgrounds whatever your origin, as are brawlers.

Wildmen can also roll up as gods but are fairly random, I think they are roughly the same as manhunters.

The South also has a bunch of good ones too, nomads are a bit like squires.

Beggars and gamblers are also scratch off tickets, unlikely to find a winner but can be really good, and are super cheap.

Fishermen, grave diggers, farmhands etc are your usual early game hand holders till you find something good.

Criples are good filler, they cost next to nothing and if you don't give them any gear of value they do work. Adrenaline, 9 lives, fast adaptation and just use them for surround bonuses, to soak up hits, net dispencing devices and run around as distractions if they last long enough. They are trash but so cheap you don't care very early, sacrificing them for virtually anything of value is a good trade.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Oct 10, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Count Uvula posted:

These ones aren't recruitable by the peasant militia.

Can you tell I don't play it very often?

Wow that's a weird list. Gamblers?

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

I always end up with a bro like that, give them 9 lives, throw them into the meat grinder and watch them come grinning out the other side missing an ear.

And to add a bit of content my fodder build.

9 lives or colossus if they happen to have a lot of HP
Gifted or rotation
Dodge or Shield mastery

They are usually dead by this point but you can also add underdog, lone wolf, nimble.

For offensive bros that won't amount to anything long term but have some MATK.

Adrenaline, fast adaptation, gifted, dodge, rotation works well.

A bunch of stuff you'd never take on a real bro but works really well at turning trash into something that can do some early work.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Oct 14, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Yeah the South is harder on early companies than the main body of the map. Even nomads are harder than their brigand counterparts.

And absolutely. The early game (lasting until between 7 days if your on it, good and lucky, to like 20) is all about getting your basics in place, gear, gold, and some bros good enough for the mid game.

Mid-game (I classify it as up to about day 150 which is where even with really good tactical play your mid game bros will start to die due to the games scaling) is all about getting better gear (Your first famed, t3 weapons, good if not the best armor), filling out your roster with mid game bros, searching for and finding the odd end game quality bro and leveling up for the crisis.

Late game is finding the rest of your god roster, replacing the last of your mid game guys and getting top of the line armor etc and then smashing out the hardest locations.

I find your mid game guys tend to be nimble, this works because the requirements are lower (can get to around 90-100 hp with colossus, about 100-105 stam, low 80s matk and low 20s mdef, mid 40s resolve is basically a perfect mid game nimble bro) and they come online with raider gear and the nimble feat. I build all of them with colossus, gifted and dodge as their first 3 feats.

Battleforged edge them out in the late game but require both a really good bro, more mdef and matk (for the end game) and the sheer cost in equipment so tend to underperform until you can full fit them out.

Weapon wise, top end weapons make a huge difference. I find maces and axes the best. Pair a guy with axe spec, quick hands and a longaxe works well and I combine a mace with polearm spec and a billhook (pathfinder helps here too).

Fight reaver barbarians for skull maces earlish, or buy a two handed winged if you see one under 2.5k. Long axes are on raiders alot. Billhook on mercs and noble armies, use raider pikes before that.

Axes the best drop from chosen but that's a hard fight, use what you find before.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Oct 14, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

By far the best best backline in my opinion is 4x throwers using heavy javs with quick hands and a two handed axe in the back pocket.

Their primary job is the high dps from throwing stuff (pathfinder is also good to rotate them where they are needed quickly) the axe is so you don't have to baby sit them, if something breaks through the lines who cares, quick hand out an axe and murder it.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Dodge is really good on anyone not wearing super heavy armor.

Don't spam out the crazy aoes, use fatigue efficient weapons and enjoy lots of extra mdef, the one stat where each point is exponentially better than the last.

Also yes, it goes down over the fight, but even at it's worst it's still around 5 mdef. And the earliest part of the fight, when the lines clash is by far the most dangerous, which is exactly when you really need that extra mdef.

Dodge is basically mandatory on any nimble bro I run, which is most because nimble is loving great.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Also mid game guy.

You're at the point I start hitting the north hard for barbarian weapons, reavers have the best throwing weapons and arguably the best none famed maces in the game.

I'd also keep a look out for small mercenary companies and if they are aligned with a small house you don't mind pissing off ganking them for gear, same for supply caravans for noble stuff, though if you want to be cautious wait till you have guys at 7 for that.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Count Uvula posted:

You should try rotation on your tanks :v: It costs a lot of stamina and a perk slot, which could both be going towards killing things more/better. You can also use a tank with rotation to deal with one of the AI's main strategies of trying to deal with your 2-hander bros: if the enemy parks a dude 2 tiles away so he's out of range of a 2-hander (usually to throw javelins or some poo poo at you), you just move your tank in front of your 2-hander and rotate him forward so he's only 1 tile away and can move+attack.

I'm a big fan of reach weapon in the pocket and quick hands on my two handers for this reason.

Ai lands 2 tiles away.
Quick hands out long axe and swing
1 step back
Your move AI

It's also very handy for noble armies and legion style undead, even if their shield wall ties up your guys you can still hit their actual damage coming out the backline and hit it hard.

Similarly, it let's you concentrate the damage of 4 front liners (and whatever backline) on a priority target in a straight line on straight line clash situation.

The tactical flexibility is so good, try it and never look back.

This flexibility is also why I'm way less of a fan of rotation than I used to be.

My own candidates for rotation are:
Tanks, since the only real worthwhile use for it is to save a bro who can't take another hit and tanks are the guys built to take hits. If I need to rotate the fight is likely hard and on a knife edge so the bro coming in likely needs to take a beating and come out the other side.

The downside to rotate on tanks is often it's better to give them lone wolf and use them to tie up as many enemies as they can a little away from the lines for a while, which makes it hard for them to rotate someone. As an aside tanks are also great to chase down archers since you don't need to kill them quick just stand next to them so they stop firing.

Hybrid backliners/banner If it's a backline. I don't do this but can see it working as an extra bit of safety, more like an emergency rotate, they can pull out a two hander and take maybe 1 or 2 hits in an emergency where a front liner got focused. Not the same level of safety as a tank and will need their own rescue shortly most of the time. This could work because backliners are usually free to move around at will and can actually get there, especially if you take pathfinder too.

Though it does compete with bags and belts which gives them extra stam (throwers always stam out in longer fights) some more ammo and they can slot a smoke pot for the same effect in an emergency.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Oct 19, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Yeah if I wanted rotate I'd probably drop lone wolf on my tanks.

It's not an always thing, it's another line of defense and when your tanks are already pushing mdef super high the boost is actually really good. Going from 10 to 15 mdef is good but not super noticable. 30 to 35 is huge and 45 to 50 or higher is real numbers that make real differences.

Again it's not force it, it's more license to be a bit more free because if he does get separated, my tank just gets a huge boost right when it matters most.

Also 9 lives is pretty underrated. It's a great perk on early fodder bros who you get with poor HP, colossus isn't going to help on some 40hp trash, but 9 lives is a guaranteed extra hit from any weapon in the game.

I could also see a case for it in late game, though I don't use it myself, where it's value comes from knowing your guy on 45hp can take at least 1 more hit guaranteed from that chosen with an axe. Nothing else gives you that. Without 9 lives, you have to sit there and decide if you want to take the gamble, he might take a hit and come out fine, he might not. 9 lives, until it triggers you know for sure. Which has value.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Wafflecopper posted:

I usually graduate them to swords at around 55-60 and other weapons at 65-70

This, below 60 you want spears, below 70 but above 60 is sword range and then over 70 you want to be using a real weapon that can hurt someome through armor (axe, mace, hammer)

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

One additional drawback to flails is how much stam they use. Not at my pc but it's roughly 15 for a normal swing (30 for two) or 25 for the headshot (50 for two).

So give them to guys with lots of stam to spare and probably take a moment to think about their usage. They stam out fast, even early game.

If you're making a guy for quick hands though, keeping something else back pocket again really helps. It also keeps them relevant for longer with the flail as they can bring out a mace or something should you face a group where the fail looks dodgy.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Reduces stats. Makes a god teir enemy much safer to deal with.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

I do find that really good banners are so hard to find, doubly so if you want a front line banner.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Tin Tim posted:

I think I've never played with a banner in the front because why?

Depending on the bro I sometimes build my banner to be tanky and give them rotation for emergency swaps but it's not a core strategy for me. I usually roll on every beast slayer I come across for my banner because their base morale is 43-50 with Matt between 52-62 and their events are cool and good too. Pretty rare to find though

I like then front because a guy with a hammer or whatever is generally impactful but not usually critical. Backline however is the highest single target dps in the game so compromising there Always seems bad to me. Though I often have to cause finding a good front banner is hard.

Also a front banner should have some good defense and can also have utility as a bit of an offtank/saviour.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Genghis Cohen posted:

I'm the opposite - I find that an ideal backline guy is relatively easy to find and synergises very well with a Bannerman. You need MAttack and Fatigue for a swordlancer, that's it. Add Resolve and he's a bannerman, you only need Rally+Fortified Mind, which supports you taking Fearsome anyway. If you are super focussed on the banner you can take Quick Hands, but it's hardly necessary as I only ever take a banner in undead fights, and then I just replace the swordlance/billhook before combat. I think backline polearm guys are one of the only builds that have the perks spare to make a bannerman. Frontline bros need the perks, what would they give up for Rally+Fortified mind?

Ahh, I don't really do polearms past the early game. My backline is generally 4 thrower hybrids (the hybrid part is a two handed weapon so they don't need to be baby sat).

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Veryslightlymad posted:

I'm not convinced most other weapons are better, though. Of the other polearms, the Billhook is clearly better on damage, and the Swordlance is able to sometimes hit more than one enemy, but other than that... Eh. The banner does shockingly good work. It's also 100% to armor. Like, the difference between it and something else is so marginal, I don't see a point in taking it off. You're almost never going to need to, since you're doing competent damage reliably to whatever you want.

Someone said whip, and that makes sense to me. Another thought I just had is bags and belts and then making the banner a source of nets, bandages, fire pots, whatever.

I find the most important stats on weapons as you get further into the game becomes the combination of base damage and damage through armor. Although a couple of hammers to smash armor is also nice.

This is why like the barb skull mace and the chosen axe, slightly lower base damage but higher penetration results in quicker kills overall.

In a reach weapon world billhooks I find preferable, longaxes are good too, I don't remember their stats but if I'm taking axe mastery on my 2 handed axe bros a longaxe goes in the back pocket.

And if you want backline damage, seriously heavy jav plus duelist plus throwing mastery puts out the hurt.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Oct 26, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

dogstile posted:

Doing marginally less damage but across three targets is way greater than just hitting one guy 10% harder.

Not when that guy is a chosen about to Murk someone and that 10% difference means he survives and your guy dies.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Genghis Cohen posted:

Huh? By the nature of 2-tile reach weapons, a swordlance in the centre of your second line will almost always be within reach of 3 enemies.

The banner is fine as a weapon. But a Billhook is definitively better unless your men start breaking, or maybe you're facing magic that targets Resolve.

Throwers are terrific damage output (I run hybrid archer/throwers and hybrid duellist/throwers) but I still find a place for pole-arms: they're not effected by darkness, they can use Swordlances combined with Fearsome to break morale, and critically, it is much easier to find acceptable recruits than to find good ranged candidates.

If you hire 5 hunters you'll nearly always find 3 or 4 good thrower/2h axe hybrids. You want your throwers throwing from 2 tiles away ideally (a few longer range shots as lines collide are just a bonus) treat them like a polearm but one that does a truckload more damage. You're absolutely fine with like 80 ratk and 70-75 matk.

Fearsome wise, I actually like most of my team with it rather than a few high res guys trying to be fearsome deliverers. My baseline res target for everyone is mid 40s (and like 60s for tanks) so not super high but the sheer quantity of checks really does make a noticeable difference.

I used to love swordlances too, but found I'm much happier being able to kill one or two guys right now than have 3 guys at half hp. Although it is fun to behead 3 raiders at once.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Oct 26, 2021

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Donkringel posted:

I found an interesting Reddit thread with some slightly obscure tips

My two favorite ones are
1) Net Alps. Breaking nets are melee based and Alps have no melee
2) if you dagger and enemy and the ground is covered in corpses for ages you won't get the armor drop since the body can't be spawned.


Side question for folks, when choosing a Noble house to piss off an farm, which one to choose? Top, mid or low?

If you have noble war as your first crisis it doesn't really matter since they reset anyway.

In other situations I try and find the most useless to me house. Usually smaller and long term not useful. I don't care about trade good but I do care about giving up things like the only hunters cabin on the map or the only weaponsmith etc. I also try not to anger someone that gives me good wilds access - that is great sell/resupply cities on the edge of the wilds.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

One thing that I think should be clear in this discussion is that while you get less actual defense out of every point you put in MDEF over 50, it's still the single most important stat in the game.

MDEF is also the stat where every point in it is more valuable than the previous one, so getting lower returns for points after 50 is kinda irrelevant, you absolutely still want to be taking those points.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Categorise your first few sets of recruits.


Trash but might hit something
Trash exists to absorb damage and save better bros
Future potential

Trash but might hit things.

Think about fast adaptation so they hit more, think about nine lives (survive a guaranteed death), gifted is always good as hard stats make a big difference, dodge, collosus (If they already have good hp).

Play a little careful with these guys, the second they get dodge at level 3 you let them double grip or use a two hand. You don't want them to die but you don't mind

Trash saviour

Think about nine lives, dodge, rotation, colossus, rotation, shield spec

They exist to survive as long as possible and to jump in front of another, better, bro and take a mace to the face for them. Them actually reaching death costs you gold, equipment and xp so just focus on stuff that keeps them alive, give them a shield, spear and a net

Good bros

Do your actual build, save student to level 5, early game you can probably afford to carry (and will likely find some gear for) 1 battleforged guy if you find a really really good bro otherwise the rest are nimble (nimble is excellent up to like day 150 and then starts to fall off a little). Think about keeping a rotation bro you dont mind sacrificing next to them in the line or using them in the backline for a while to keep them safer.

People seriously sleep on dodge, it's a fantastic perk.

People also sleep on nine lives - which is great on early trash and again very late game (although it's late game use can be replaced by save scumming).

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Honestly i have no idea. Caravan missions are still bad. The only time I do them is if it's literally the next town I was going to anyway or if it's really close, the arriving town has a weaponsmith and I'm flush with cash.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Small tip on spiders, unequip your shields and have everyone just two hand whatever weapons you have

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

KPC_Mammon posted:

Throwers do the best damage in the game, why would you want to hybrid them?

What is the purpose of a thrower, what function do they need to fill?

1) Do insane damage
Feats requried: Duelist, Throwing Mastery, Killing Frenzy, Beserk, Quick hands (to reload)
Stats Required: 80, ideally 85 Ranged Attack by level 11, Stam 100ish+

2) Be in the right place to do damage
Optional feats: Pathfinder
Optional playstyle: Think about positioning

3) Don't die
Feats requried: Collossus, Nimble
Stats Required: HP 65ish before colossus, Resolve 40+

4) Don't become a lame duck when something gets through your lines
Feats required: Quick hands
Stats required 75+ Melee attack, 10+ melee defense

Equipment Required:
Throwing weapons, two handed axe or mace

Free Feat choices (pick 3):
Gifted (usually required for stats), fearsome (but I'm a fearsome on nearly everyone kind of guy), bags and belts, pathfinder.

How to use: Throw weapons, don't worry when something sneaks through your line, pull out axe and murder then return to throwing poo poo.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Noble fights were literally made for front line builds that take quick hands and have the reach version of their two hander spec.

That is your 2handed axe guys have a long axe, your 2handed mace guys have a polemace and so on.

Oh no the noble shield wall is blocking me. Best pull out this big rear end weapon and chunk their backline anyway.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

People are way too down on dodge here.

It's a big chunk of mdef, yeah it drops off but ask yourself when do you really need that mdef? It's at the start, when it gives it you.

Similarly, even when your fat out you still get a reasonable amount of mdef, the single most valuable stat in bb and one that scales hard.

Also as soon as you get colossus, dodge and 100ish armor youre good to two hand.

Also for nimble, on a guy you want to take forward and not some mid game filler - aim for 100hp, it makes such a huge difference.

Finally, a bunch of nothing but nimble guys can do basically the entire game outside maybe a couple of the end game fights. They are quick and cheap to put together and really effective.

Unless you get a combo of perfect bro and great armor, just nimble up the whole team until after the first crisis at the earliest.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Emandesunu posted:

Also when you go nimble apparently you're supposed to stack up hp not fatigue?

Oops. I thought I needed more fatigue to keep my dodge high

View dodge as a lot of extra mdef when the lines clash and those few really important first turns and a smaller but still welcome amount for the clean up. That alone justifies picking it.

Don't build for it though it does it's important job just by existing.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

No but there are breakpoints.

Do you die in 2 chosen hits or 3?

How many injuries do you pickup from that unhold fight?

Etc.

That make a big difference, either to your runs success or to how frustrated you get reloading.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Star posted:

Is it ever worth it to level initiative?

Memes

A fencer might, and might do well. But in optimal terms id rather tmhave a good 2 hander

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Two hander with 2 reach in the pocket and quickhands should be a basic standard weapon loadout for everyone. It's real strong.

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Thought I'd post a different kind of guide. Something to provide more of a "what should I be doing" higher level guide to the game that offers a sensible and easy route to getting to end game content for people that haven't done it before or who get a little lost along the way.

It's not the most optimal, but it is flexible and consistently achievable and offers clear things to work towards in an order that should lead to overall success, if sometimes a little slower or less efficiently than some of the hyper optimised stuff people do.

Recommended start - Northern Raiders
Recommended 1st crisis - Nobel War
Difficulty - easy economy, hardest combat or if you are really new, middle combat.

Why?
Northern Raiders have a very front loaded semi difficult part (escape the north) and then have it pretty easy. You can restart if you screw up too bad in the first 4 days or so. Also the big downside of Nobel houses that hate you will be removed after the Nobel War crisis.

Nobel War will fix your biggest raiders downside, right around when you want to start hitting barbarians, also it will give you loads of gold and is fairly easy.

Economy difficulty is really your choice, but higher really just leads to more grinding and long term is irrelevant.

Combat, harder difficulties primarily give you better scaling. Which sounds bad but gives you earlier access to stuff, better loot and more chances at famed items. This is a snowball game, early power snowballs build on themselves.

The goals

You're building entirely for your first crisis, a team that can comfortably take on large noble armies and win and loot them. This will leave you with huge stockpiles of gold and an experienced team for the post crisis game when you have a bunch of freedom to do what you want, rebuild towards end game camps, find absolute beastly bros, get the best of the best gear etc. Etc.

Team roster
Your team can really be anything you want, I'll throw out a rough suggestion that works but you're very free to experiment of go with someome else's loadout. But I'd strongly recommended all, or at least most, of your guys go nimble for the first crisis, which I'll discuss more later.

I'd suggest you:
Do a 7 front line 5 backline loadout.
4 ranged guys, throwers primarily, archer throwers are fine. 1 banner type guy.
Front line 2 or 3 tanks at the ends and in the middle. The rest two handers.

I like to pick up throwers who can get an ok matk and give them a two hander in their back pocket with quick hands to deal with guys that slip into the back line.

The tanks are shielded up and have giant hp pools, lots of mdef, and use a spear.

The front liners generally use maces, axes with 1 or 2 hammers. And use quick hands to have the 2 tile ranged version as well. They generally don't focus on the aoe attacks and just hit for damage most of the time.

There's lots of room here to experiment and try other builds out, I've left it intentionally vague but just given a rough system that will work.

The dudes:
Don't need to be that good. This guide will work with a team of fairly ok dudes and doesn't need superstars. It will deal with The first crisis and get you rich and for someone who hasn't done the long game before, that's a good point to start finding, equipping and power leveling your superstar hedge knights of whatever.

Caveats, mdef is the single most important stat in the game, it's value grows exponentially. Going from 4 to 5 mdef is meh, going from 40 to 41 is a big deal.

Hp is underrated, you're going nimble across the team, try and crank it high, 100hp will make a big difference.

Why nimble?
Battleforged dudes, or at least a mix, perform better on a long timeline. Sure. But a BF dude needs a large investment in gear, better stats than a nimble dude to be as effective or better and you likely won't even notice the difference until way past the first crisis. Nimble bros are easier to find, are at nearly full power as soon as they get the nimble perk and are cheap to gear.

Basical plan
Same as it ever was:
Run South, gank some easy caravans on the way if you can but it isn't required.
Then in the south play a normal game, get dudes up to 6, kill bandits, once the dudes get their basics in place (colossus, gifted, dodge would be my basics for the front line) switch them to two handers if you can and get another dude or two.

Focus on bandits and raiders, though you can experiment with other stuff, nomads are ok when you have dodge. And do this on repeat. Hit any easy looking camps when you find them. Once half your bros have nimble you can start to do some wild expeditions looking for camps.

Avoid hexes, difficult wild animals, giests before you have whips and a good banner, necrosavants.

Your goal by day 80 or so if to have all your team of 12, maybe some reserves, and have them at least at level 8.

Then the Nobel War starts and you should throw yourself into it, your team should take on a big Nobel army fairly easily and the loot will be exceptional. From that point you are rich, have a decent base team and can do what you want for your end game goals.

What do I buy/sell? Also why maces, hammers and axes?

Save any good famed armors you find for later battleforged bros. Sell anything else that isn't also good for nimble.
Save any good famed weapons, either use them or if real good aim to build a bro for them.

Sell everything else.

Buy any early winged maces you see.

I like maces and axes because you can take a quick trip north through the wilds around day 60 to 70 and kill a bunch of barbarians and get a lot of their versions which are real nice and a quick and cheap way to get high end weaponry.

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 10:43 on Apr 18, 2022

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

One thing I always wondered.

If you kill a zombie and it gets necro raised and then you kill it again is that 1 chunk of xp or two?

Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Anyone else still playing?

I decided to start a new run and I'm hooked all over again.

Turned off the rather cheaty try out mod and decided to just play with trash bros. Turns out stats don't really matter and the early power perks more than make up for it.

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Cast_No_Shadow
Jun 8, 2010

The Republic of Luna Equestria is a huge, socially progressive nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 714m are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich.

Runs going well, day 60 and out busting camps, trash bros thinned themselves out, old bros are about 8 or 9 and farming for good bros is slowly underway.

My famed item luck has been terrible though. A two handed axe that rolled to be almost identical to a great axe, which is ok. 4 famed shields. And some medium armour, which I'm not sure if it's good for a nimble forged guy or not. Mid 200s for mid 20s fat off the top of my head. What's the breakpoints people look for on armour for nimble forged?

Edit - looking up what the internet says the armour is in no way good enough for nimble forged so more trash pieces

Cast_No_Shadow fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Dec 31, 2023

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