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Bip Roberts posted:Voting to end democracy is cool. All he had to do was call his opponents islamophobes.
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Apr 16, 2017 23:15
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Bip Roberts posted:Voting to end democracy is cool. Yeah everyone seems to be doing it these days I can't wait for the 23rd
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Apr 17, 2017 00:09
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkLLlsUhM1M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MgBM1NZ9Lg
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Apr 17, 2017 00:10
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Bip Roberts posted:Voting to end democracy is cool. The middle east has a cool history of that
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Apr 17, 2017 00:43
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America's role in overthrowing two governments on their southern border—along with funding various paramilitary groups in the vacuum left afterwards—probably made it easier for Erdogan to consolidate dictatorial control over the government by using extreme nationalist and religious propaganda.
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Apr 17, 2017 01:18
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Alienwarehouse posted:America's role in overthrowing two governments on their southern border—along with funding various paramilitary groups in the vacuum left afterwards—probably made it easier for Erdogan to consolidate dictatorial control over the government by using extreme nationalist and religious propaganda. Turkish leadership has repeatedly made it clear that they want Assad ousted. I think they'd be happier had the US actually overthrown him.
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Apr 17, 2017 01:22
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Bear Retrieval Unit posted:It's like every nation around the world suddenly got an urge to own itself. ya its called globalism   and they'll be dragged kicking and screaming towards itthe trick is to drag the tantrum baby towards it quickly, and not let it go into a nuclear meltdown which everyone is too busy hem hawing over~
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Apr 17, 2017 01:22
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Bear Retrieval Unit posted:It's like every nation around the world suddenly got an urge to own itself. well that is the basic idea of nationalism so
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Apr 17, 2017 01:35
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Lastgirl posted:ya its called globalism Come again?
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Apr 17, 2017 01:38
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The margin was only like 2% right? Apparently there was a lot of intimidation from yes, and yes were the only guys with billiards and such. So erdogan got his result, but the country is still divided
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Apr 17, 2017 01:44
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Peel posted:well that is the basic idea of nationalism so I don't think anyone on the left is really opposed to their country being economically self-sufficient instead of leaving it at the mercy of few unaccountable international bodies. Economic globalism (one world market) with no protections for workers or unions (protectionism) leaves everybody who's not wealthy worse off. It's no coincidence that Trump adopted the anti-free trade rhetoric, because he knew it sounded very appealing to the down-trodden working man (unfortunately they got played by a conman). Protectionism and economic nationalism is not the same thing as ethnic and religious nationalism. Unfortunately, we have a massive, corporate neoliberal lobby that deliberately conflates the two in order to crush any opposition to their laissez-faire economic agenda as bigoted. It's going to be interesting to watch Erdogan in the coming years after this, though. He now has much more leeway in forging new alliances around the world.
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Apr 17, 2017 01:48
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Ohlol he could only intimidate enough people to get a two percent victory. Man do MHP and those Nationalist Maoists have his balls in a nutsack now.
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Apr 17, 2017 01:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76hlxowjkr0
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Apr 17, 2017 02:10
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Alienwarehouse posted:America's role in overthrowing two governments on their southern border—along with funding various paramilitary groups in the vacuum left afterwards—probably made it easier for Erdogan to consolidate dictatorial control over the government by using extreme nationalist and religious propaganda. This has nothing to do with America and everything to do with turkey. loving Americans want to make everything about themselves I swear
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Apr 17, 2017 02:22
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNa7aELDcw8
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Apr 17, 2017 02:44
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The woman in the video thumbnail is bangin'. 
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Apr 17, 2017 03:08
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Alienwarehouse posted:The woman in the video thumbnail is bangin'. Nice dude
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Apr 17, 2017 04:57
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Heh. The Turks realized that democracy is really dumb and voted to end democracy. This is actually woke guys
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Apr 17, 2017 05:08
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They merely chose to have less democracy, since they had too much
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Apr 17, 2017 06:03
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Ammanas posted:They merely chose to have less democracy, since they had too much Do we have democracy bombs ready to go? Like that 21k lbs one we just dropped in Afghanistan?
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Apr 17, 2017 06:38
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Ammanas posted:This has nothing to do with America and everything to do with turkey. loving Americans want to make everything about themselves I swear I do blame Europe and America a bit for their support of erdo as a figurehead for moderate Islam. He wouldn't have gotten this far without their tacit support , which lasted until gezi more or less. It can be argued that tge emergence of erdo can be attributed to the 1980 coup, which some claim was supported by the USA as a gladio thingy.
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Apr 17, 2017 12:12
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rudatron posted:So erdogan got his result, but the country is still divided
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Apr 17, 2017 22:53
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get that OUT of my face posted:considering that democracy is officially dead in turkey, it's a moot point The Turkish Republic never really functioned as such. Ataturk's legacy isn't creating a republic, it was managing to avoid colonial rule. Now they have Islamist Putin.
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Apr 17, 2017 23:16
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Agag posted:The Turkish Republic never really functioned as such. Ataturk's legacy isn't creating a republic, it was managing to avoid colonial rule. Erdogan is the Turkish Trump, didn't you read the manual? He's terrible at everything except destroying his country 
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Apr 17, 2017 23:17
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Brother Friendship posted:Erdogan is the Turkish Trump, didn't you read the manual? He's terrible at everything except destroying his country I'll meet you halfway on this. Erdogan has Trumplike tendencies and basically sucks, but Trump will leave office in 4 or 8 years, or sooner if he gets really bored. Erdogan (like Putin) isn't going anywhere without major bloodshed.
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Apr 17, 2017 23:28
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So this referendum pretty much confirms that Erdogan's rhetoric about joining the EU was all bullshit, right?
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Apr 17, 2017 23:54
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Alienwarehouse posted:So this referendum pretty much confirms that Erdogan's rhetoric about joining the EU was all bullshit, right? He did want to join the EU until they made it clear that they'd never accept Turkey.
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Apr 18, 2017 00:15
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Agag posted:The Turkish Republic never really functioned as such. Ataturk's legacy isn't creating a republic, it was managing to avoid colonial rule. they are for some justice and development
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Apr 18, 2017 00:15
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Alienwarehouse posted:So this referendum pretty much confirms that Erdogan's rhetoric about joining the EU was all bullshit, right? I saw a tweet about Turkey having a referendum on their EU application, which seems like the international relations version of "you can't fire me, I quit"
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Apr 18, 2017 01:39
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Alienwarehouse posted:So this referendum pretty much confirms that Erdogan's rhetoric about joining the EU was all bullshit, right? For sure. But to be fair, the EU was bullshitting that they'd ever let Turkey join. I guess part of the appeal of authoritarians is that they cut through the (neo)liberal bullshit. get that OUT of my face posted:i've heard the term "illiberal democracy" thrown around regarding Turkey, but now it looks like it's not gonna even be all that democratic. so yeah, it'll be Russia with a "moderate islamist" bent Its such a great name for a party that wants to jail or disappear all opposition, and "develop" economically along Russian lines and socially along Saudi lines.
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Apr 18, 2017 02:01
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how hard of a shift has turkey gone in terms of "morality?" it gets lost in the shuffle about erdogan's overall dictatorial tendencies, but i know he said the national drink of turkey was ayran instead of beer or whatever liquor ataturk liked, and kissing in public is a crime of some level
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Apr 18, 2017 02:27
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We should have shot down his plane during that coup if we didn't want this to happen. There's no point in hand-wringing about it now.
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Apr 18, 2017 03:21
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hakimashou posted:We should have shot down his plane during that coup if we didn't want this to happen. Western powers backing a Sunni authoritarian?!
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Apr 18, 2017 03:24
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:He did want to join the EU until they made it clear that they'd never accept Turkey. Erdogan would never have accepted having the ECtHR stymieing him, so EU membership was never in the cards for an AK-ruled Turkey. The biggest pro-Turkey voice in the EU was actually Britain, with France against, but Turkish membership was dead long before Brexit.
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Apr 18, 2017 03:28
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hakimashou posted:We should have shot down his plane during that coup if we didn't want this to happen. Glenn Greenwald got super huffy about the idea of Western media figures supporting the coup, so I guess the Universal Law of Greenwald Irony obligated Erdogan to declare himself eternal sultan. Funny enough Turkey has extended it's 'state of emergency' following the vote, an emergency dire enough to suspend the normal processes of government but not bad enough to postpone a constitutional referendum. It's the same state of emergency he used to stack the Electoral Council in his favour.
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Apr 18, 2017 03:34
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does anyone have a rec for a good history of modern turkey
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Apr 18, 2017 03:55
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https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/apr/17/donald-trump-erdogan-turkey-referendum-congratulations
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Apr 18, 2017 04:00
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hakimashou posted:We should have shot down his plane during that coup if we didn't want this to happen. I waited the whole night for that to happen 
cancelope has issued a correction as of 05:22 on Apr 18, 2017 |
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Apr 18, 2017 05:16
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Apr 18, 2017 06:24
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Turks in Europe are statistically more likely to be poorly educated and highly religious, and also highly nationalist (last 2 are in reaction to their environment kinda). Turks in those other places tend to be wealthier, better educated, probably not living in those places for life, and they have a clearer picture of religious/nationalist authoritarianism from where they stand.
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Apr 18, 2017 06:41
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