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Tom Perez B/K/M? This poll is closed. |
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| B |
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77 | 25.50% |
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160 | 52.98% |
| M |
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65 | 21.52% |
| Total: | 229 votes | ||
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mcmagic posted:I don't think policy has anything to do with why the Dems are in the situation they are in right now. I have no idea how you changed from a Cassandra pre-election to an idiot post-election, but it's been a hell of a thing to witness.  That dog would be listened to by the donor class.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:41
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evilweasel posted:see, this is a stupid post You think that the Republican party (which completely controls the state governments of 60% of the US population) is a minority party. Who gives a poo poo what you think is stupid?
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Apr 12, 2017 19:42
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Condiv posted:they wanted him to win so bad, they sent a grand total of $0 in aid. already responded to this too
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Apr 12, 2017 19:43
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BardoTheConsumer posted:Yeah just go hard left and see if you win any elections I guess. It's worth a try. Centrists are supposed to be all about making a deal through compromise. If you start out the gate as a Centrist and you push for a compromise solution that ultimately works for both sides, then the Republicans can't support it because it would be a win for Democrats and a Republican can never let a Democrat get a win or they could be devoured by their own. If you start out the gate as a Leftist and craft Centrist legislation, then it's a loss for the Leftist Democrat and the Republican can support it. If you desire Centrist policy you should support Leftists.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:43
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evilweasel posted:i already answered this question, gave you a very easy to understand answer, that you quoted and typed a response to yeah, you said some bs about they only wanted to run one test run and they weren't sure thompson could win, but oh they sure wish he could, and that they just happened to choose GA, with the candidate they were familiar with as the testing grounds to throw 8.3 million dollars at. that doesn't explain a lot though, cause 8.3m is a lot and thompson wanted a fraction of that and was told no by perez.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:43
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BardoTheConsumer posted:Or we could be some sort of coalition? I mean I know idiological purity is important in this radicalized age and all but eating each other probably isn't the answer. The problem is, a lot of third way Dems have made the pretty deliberate choice to ignore a major, vital part of that coalition, ie: the working class. I agree that all cylinders need to be firing for the Dems to win national elections, but you have to understand, it's not the Sanders wing of the party that's shutting other wings out, or refusing to let them hold the reins for a little bit.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:45
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BardoTheConsumer posted:Or we could be some sort of coalition? I mean I know idiological purity is important in this radicalized age and all but eating each other probably isn't the answer. Like, don't confuse talking about "centrists" in D&D with talking about people who just have moderate political views. We're referring specifically to the people who run the DNC (and their idiotic defenders here) who have basically no ideology to speak of, aside from power for its own sake. Establishment Democrats aren't in politics to make the world a better place, or for that matter really do much of anything when in office other than the bare minimum their constituency demands (assuming they can't weasel out of it somehow). They're mostly in politics because it's a good racket and because it feeds their ego. If forced to choose between sharing what power they have in the DNC, with people who want to do poo poo (which always carries some risk), and just remaining a minority party forever, they'll choose the latter. They have chosen the latter. These are the shitheads we're talking about - not people who aren't ideologically leftist enough. I know that gets lost in the rhetoric sometimes but that's what it is. I mean I can only speak for myself but I'm pretty sure I'm not alone on this.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:45
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Kilroy posted:what specific campaign promises are you hypothetically accusing me of wanting him to abandon? single payer? $15 min wage? Kilroy posted:I suppose I should also point out that if Thompson does an AMA where he talks about single payer and 15 that's a lot more believable than Hillary finally doing that after figuring out the winds are blowing at gale force in that direction within her party and the Sanders wing basically forcing her to. Then mostly ignoring those issues in the general. I should point it out, even though I know you've got a ready-made excuse prepared and you don't give a poo poo.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:45
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Condiv posted:yeah, you said some bs about they only wanted to run one test run and they weren't sure thompson could win, but oh they sure wish he could, and that they just happened to choose GA, with the candidate they were familiar with as the testing grounds to throw 8.3 million dollars at. that doesn't explain a lot though, cause 8.3m is a lot and thompson wanted a fraction of that and was told no by perez. How much of that 8.3 is from the DNC and how much is from individual donors?
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Apr 12, 2017 19:45
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So Condiv have you switched from Bizket to Linken Park? Lemme know when you're done with playing Crawlin' on loop and move onto Good Charlotte. Haven't heard that poo poo in years.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:46
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SSNeoman posted:So Condiv have you switched from Bizket to Linken Park? Lemme know when you're done with playing Crawlin' on loop and move onto Good Charlotte. Haven't heard that poo poo in years. Is this the centrist pushback? Against people saying mean things
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Apr 12, 2017 19:46
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Submarine Sandpaper posted:You make distinction between Thompson and Hillary where there's none wrt policy even going as far down as promoting bipartisanship. Well, but Thompson doesn't have a 30-year record of supporting austerity or free trade, though. Baggage counts for a lot in politics.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:46
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Condiv posted:yeah, you said some bs about they only wanted to run one test run and they weren't sure thompson could win, but oh they sure wish he could, and that they just happened to choose GA, with the candidate they were familiar with as the testing grounds to throw 8.3 million dollars at. that doesn't explain a lot though, cause 8.3m is a lot and thompson wanted a fraction of that and was told no by perez. yeah none of this is true, you are an idiot go quote my post and try to respond to it, not your diseased memory of what it said
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Apr 12, 2017 19:47
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Boy, I sure wish I hadn't been such an rear end in a top hat to third-party voters, because now I'm too busy getting hosed up the rear end by Trump to do lovely Let's Plays anymore!
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Apr 12, 2017 19:47
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Kilroy posted:The left has been trying that for about thirty years or more. Turns out that an alliance with nihilists isn't worth much. And... do these people actually exist or is that how it looks to you? Real question I'm curious..
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Apr 12, 2017 19:48
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steinrokkan posted:Is this the centrist pushback? I'm actually left as gently caress I just don't tilt at windmills.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:48
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When I used to read evilweasel's D&D posts back in the day I would think "I wish he would just talk like a human being instead of a robotic lawyer" and I guess a monkey's paw somewhere closed because his normal personality is a thousand times worse.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:49
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mcmagic posted:How much of that 8.3 is from the DNC and how much is from individual donors? not sure, but it's not like they didn't offer him support in other areas as well: quote:In addition to being well-funded, Ossoff is also heavily staffed. The DCCC sent eight staffers to Georgia in March to help his election efforts, bringing his total to 70 paid staffers and 2,000 volunteers. The DNC's bylaws mandate that the organization stay neutral during the primary, but the committee is prepared to deploy staffers and high-profile surrogates to the district for Ossoff if he finds himself in a head-to-head runoff. i wish thompson could've had just one of those staffers. oh well, the guy who hobnobbed in d.c. is the only one worth attention from the DNC
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Apr 12, 2017 19:49
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evilweasel posted:yeah none of this is true, you are an idiot nah, you're obviously more interested in calling people idiots than making arguments. that's been about 90% of your responses to me, so forgive me if i don't waste the effort sifting through that to find the few specks of actual content in your posts
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Apr 12, 2017 19:50
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Kilroy posted:The left has been trying that for about thirty years or more. Turns out that an alliance with nihilists isn't worth much. see this is what i don't get sure, assume the dnc has no ideology other than power for power's sake how on earth does that lead you to "the dnc doesn't want to win an election that would get them closer to power"
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Apr 12, 2017 19:51
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Kilroy posted:Actually I think both Clinton and Thompson should have been more vocal about the parts of their platform that draw from progressive causes, and I don't think Thompson is super progressive just that he's not a conservative Democrat either. So it's just you here contradicting yourself. As usual. So you think Thompson ran a standard democratic campaign but that he totally would have won if he'd just been more progressive in his R+30 district? You're delusional. quote:I suppose I should also point out that if Thompson does an AMA where he talks about single payer and 15 that's a lot more believable than Hillary finally doing that after figuring out the winds are blowing at gale force in that direction within her party and the Sanders wing basically forcing her to. Then mostly ignoring those issues in the general. I should point it out, even though I know you've got a ready-made excuse prepared and you don't give a poo poo. The Sanders wing forced Thompson to state he supported 15 and single payer to get their money, and once he got it he ignored those issues in his campaign.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:51
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Submarine Sandpaper posted:You make distinction between Thompson and Hillary where there's none wrt policy even going as far down as promoting bipartisanship. You also consistently argue that Hillary would not enact or support leftist policy. So, if your Bernie bro won the election, was supported by the national democratic [ideals] and affirmed bernie's policies, he would be going against his constituents. And note that Hillary does have a serious credibility problem. That's factored into the comparison as well. You can find evidence of her supporting and opposing almost anything, at some point in her career. For what it's worth I think she would have supported leftist causes as President to the extent that her triangulation calculator told her to, but no more. And I even supported her on that basis.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:51
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SSNeoman posted:I'm actually left as gently caress I just don't tilt at windmills. actually you do your conduct wrt third party voters is proof enough of that
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Apr 12, 2017 19:52
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Berne Bro not being word filtered to big gay cum daddies is problematic.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:52
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Condiv posted:nah, you're obviously more interested in calling people idiots than making arguments. that's been about 90% of your responses to me, so forgive me if i don't waste the effort sifting through that to find the few specks of actual content in your posts i gave comprehensive answers to your arguments that treated you like an adult, you ignored them and have now chosen to pretend they don't exist, so i'm just going to call you a moron rather than repeat putting in effort to explain why you're wrong again when all you can muster are to repeat the same stupid things i already debunked, but with less detail
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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SSNeoman posted:I'm actually left as gently caress I just don't tilt at windmills. IMHO in face of the utter collapse of pragmatism and its failure to achieve anything whatsoever, tilting at windmills is bound to have a better track record.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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Nonsense posted:Berne Bro not being word filtered to big gay cum daddies is problematic. same but "centrists" -> "untermenschen"
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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JeffersonClay posted:So you think Thompson ran a standard democratic campaign but that he totally would have won if he'd just been more progressive in his R+30 district? You're delusional. You're making the incredibly unwise assumption that economic populism has nothing to offer in an R+30 district - particularly when most Dems haven't tried that strategy in quite a while anyway. quote:
How did they "force" him to do that?
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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evilweasel posted:see this is what i don't get The DNC has been completely had circles run around them by republicans in the last 10 years. That is the scandal, one of incompetence.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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I am just loving amazed that people are taking a 20 point swing from 2016 in under 6 months and somehow painting it as DEMOCRATS BAD. This is spectacular news and points to a good chance of winning GA-6, MT-AL and SC-19 plus the state-level races in NJ and VA in the fall. There was almost no chance of winning a district that in a neutral environment is R-30 barring the Trump piss tape leaking. Why does everyone seem to be pissed instead of elated? How the gently caress is that the conclusion you take? If the GOP were suddenly competitive in deep blue districts in cities they'd be dancing from the rooftops. Why the gently caress can't our side ever enjoy anything? axeil fucked around with this message at 19:56 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 19:54
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Maarek posted:When I used to read evilweasel's D&D posts back in the day I would think "I wish he would just talk like a human being instead of a robotic lawyer" and I guess a monkey's paw somewhere closed because his normal personality is a thousand times worse. His posts are fine, he's just telling people not to clutch pearls and eat each other. Condiv posted:not sure, but it's not like they didn't offer him support in other areas as well: like look at this poo poo. Oh if only he had one staffer, a penny for the poor please surely we could take redneck kansas if we do thaaaaaaat
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Apr 12, 2017 19:53
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Majorian posted:Well, but Thompson doesn't have a 30-year record of supporting austerity or free trade, though. Baggage counts for a lot in politics. He campaigned on making trade agreements that made it easier for Kansans to export agricultural products. That's code for free trade agreements.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:55
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axeil posted:I am just loving amazed that people are taking a 20 point swing from 2016 and somehow painting it as DEMOCRATS BAD. I'll guess CENTRISTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's basically like the left's version of GLOBALISTS!!! VVV case in point
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Apr 12, 2017 19:55
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Kilroy posted:The left has been trying that for about thirty years or more. Turns out that an alliance with nihilists isn't worth much. Fwiw, I think your assessment is essentially correct.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:55
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Majorian posted:You're making the incredibly unwise assumption that economic populism has nothing to offer in an R+30 district - particularly when most Dems haven't tried that strategy in quite a while anyway. Even Trumpists are now plurality pro single payer and other things, but we will still assume that you must triangulate the poo poo out of everything because that has been proven to work
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Apr 12, 2017 19:55
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axeil posted:I am just loving amazed that people are taking a 20 point swing from 2016 and somehow painting it as DEMOCRATS BAD. I don't know, personally. While it may not be replicable in all districts or states, I think it's a big sign that the Dems should run hard on economic populism, because even a little of it can go a long way. steinrokkan posted:Even Trumpists are now plurality pro single payer and other things, but we will still assume that you must triangulate the poo poo out of everything because that has been proven to work Yeah, well, the problem there is the "proven to work part," I'm afraid...
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Apr 12, 2017 19:55
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Kilroy posted:He's not a "Bernie Bro" you horse's rear end and how would he be going against his constituents who voted for him despite his coming out in support of $15 and single payer? Did they vote for him without knowing about his support for those things? Did they vote for him thinking he didn't really support them? lol did anyone think hillary was gonna be tough on the hated banks after her secret speeches to goldman sucks?
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Apr 12, 2017 19:57
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Majorian posted:I don't know, personally. While it may not be replicable in all districts or states, I think it's a big sign that the Dems should run hard on economic populism, because even a little of it can go a long way. Whoah easy there bud that's a dangerously good post for this poo poo thread! We're still not up to Evanescence on our teenager pandora trip for you to start doing that! Typo posted:lol did anyone think hillary was gonna be tough on the hated banks after her secret speeches to goldman sucks? Putin bots aren't even trying anymore
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Apr 12, 2017 19:57
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axeil posted:I am just loving amazed that people are taking a 20 point swing from 2016 in under 6 months and somehow painting it as DEMOCRATS BAD. This is spectacular news and points to a good chance of winning GA-6, MT-AL and SC-19 plus the state-level races in NJ and VA in the fall. There was almost no chance of winning a district that in a neutral environment is R-30 barring the Trump piss tape leaking. Why does everyone seem to be pissed instead of elated? Because selection of representatives is a zero sum game, and failing to anticipate a possible victory and deploy resources to swing it from zero to all is in fact extremely infuriating.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:57
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Majorian posted:I don't know, personally. While it may not be replicable in all districts or states, I think it's a big sign that the Dems should run hard on economic populism, because even a little of it can go a long way. 
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Apr 12, 2017 19:58
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