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zoux posted:Like I said I haven't read it, but I'd be reaaaaaal surprised if Marvel, a company that has shown a commitment to expanding minority, women and other marginalized voices in recent years, would, with zero editorial oversight, allow one of its premiere IPs to be turned into a fascist forever. Is this the same Marvel that had to hastily retract a statement made by one of their higher-ups that sales were in a slump because people were tired of female characters and diversity?
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May 12, 2017 02:59
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From what I recall, and this was years ago, the artist that was tapped to work on OSC's proposed Superman story actually stepped down and said that after all the backlash they didn't feel they could in good conscience go ahead with the project after which DC put it "on hiatus" which is corporate-ese for "we're canceling this but don't want to come right out and admit that we blinked first." zoux posted:Right, but OSC is never going to feel you not buying that book. If you can't get past OSC being a homophobic piece of poo poo to the point that it impacts your enjoyment of the book, by all means don't buy or read his poo poo. But your individual purchasing habits are in no way going to impact the lives of the creators, the only person you are affecting is yourself. So, self-denying in order to punish a person for having bad politics or morals isn't actually doing anything. I prefer to not directly patronize artists who spend their free time campaigning to deny gay people basic civil rights, thanks.
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May 16, 2017 22:58
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zoux posted:Well, educate me my friend. Why would anybody want to have a discussion with you when you've pre-emptively declared that anyone on the other side of the argument is just in it for the virtue signaling?
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May 18, 2017 20:20
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Edge & Christian posted:The overall message is basically "yes, Captain America is a fascist in bed with Nazis whose collective endgame is a genocidal attack on freedom with the intent of setting up a Fourth Reich but... but... but... he's not a NAZI. Cap would never be a Nazi! He's not even really a full fascist. He's not that bad. You can work with Nazis and Fascists and still be a fundamentally decent guy who made some tough, potentially bad decisions" which is not "LOL Marvel loves Nazis and Captain America is a Nazi forever" but is still fundamentally lovely and gross. Lonos Oboe posted:Thanks Edge & Christian for the lowdown on Cap. I was kinda hopeful it would be like Superior Spider-Man which was much better than I expected it to be. I read up on the reactions to certain things like Hydra/Nazi Cap lifting Mjolnir aka: "2017's must have prison tat" and folks being asked to wear Hydra gear in comic shops. Part of me wants to say they are over reacting. But considering the current political climate and especially the writer's history. I think it's understandable why some people are concerned. This pretty much sums it up, to which I would add that people don't think that Marvel's new mandate is to make Captain America a Nazi forever and those whose argument is "well well, looks like Cap isn't going to stay a Nazi forever, whodathunk?" are either missing the point or simply being obtuse in their rush to deliver the hottest takes. People think that it's dumb and tasteless for Marvel to decide in this the year of our lord 2017, when white supremacists and "racial realists" are feeling way more comfortable proudly coming out, to write a comic book where Marvel's iconic Nazi-punching superhero, the creation of a couple of Jewish boys from New York City back during WWII, gets turned into a secret Nazi for the equivalent of "big event" clickbait. Nick Spencer's and Marvel's constant attempts to justify everything by repeatedly insisting that "Hydra totally aren't Nazis guys, this isn't a story about Nazis, stop making it about Nazis" is honestly kind of cowardly and pathetic. Nobody actually buys that line especially when the Marvel movies, television show, and even other actual Marvel comics are like "oh yeah, Hydra are Nazis, gently caress those guys." They want the controversy they're courting to rake in all that sweet big event moolah but then they whine when people call it out for what it very obviously is. I was actually going to try and expand on my thoughts a bit more once I got home from work but I guess someone already sort of did it for me which I appreciate because I'm extremely lazy. Now all that said, this is the thread about writers whose politics leak into their comics work, so: quote:“I’m the most hated man in America today,” Spencer told the Daily Beast a year ago. Some of the criticism directed at him has been vicious: variously charged as a fascist, white supremacist and even a Nazi, all of which are completely baseless. On the one hand, I agree that Nick Spencer (probably) isn't a fascist, white supremacist, or Nazi. On the other hand, a look at some of the highlights of Nick Spencer's failed political career does in fact help paint the picture of the sort of person happy to go to bat for a ~visionary story~ about what if Captain America...was a Nazi??? in 2017 in between admonishing people on Twitter for taking joy in watching Richard Spencer get punched in the face. I am completely willing to believe that Nick Spencer isn't a literal Nazi irl but I'm also willing to believe that Nick Spencer is a lovely, clueless person comfortably insulated from the wider repercussions of the dumb poo poo he does by the warm embrace of his own rear end in a top hat, and the story he's writing doesn't even sound that fuckin good anyway so all of this is for nothing but another big dumb event destined to be swept under the rug except for the occasional quip in a Deadpool comic and a splash page of Nazi Cap hefting Mjolnir that's destined to wind up on a bootleg t-shirt sold alongside "heritage not hate" memorabilia.
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May 20, 2017 06:19
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