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ComposerGuy
Jul 28, 2007

Conspicuous Absinthe

Kelp Plankton posted:

As someone who played a good chunk of the Beta, though? Playing as a camp counselor is still a lot of fun. Very tense in a way other multiplayer horror games don't really nail. It feels like you're being hunted, you've got to make a lot of interesting decisions about what you're doing and where you're going and if you want to try and help the other players or hinder them, switching between the two options at any given moment based on what's going on. Cars to escape in only have so many seats available, the police barrier exit leaves you vulnerable to Jason attacks but he can only go after one of you at a time, etc.

Yeah, honestly I prefer counselor because of this right here.

Moment-to-moment decision making makes the whole experience really fun and the design choices about how you can win as a counselor are very smartly done in my opinion. You have three ways out as a counselor in a match:

1. Repair one of two cars. The total number of car seats is 6 between the two vehicles and in a full game there are 7 counselors, so right off you're in competition with each other to not get musical-chaired. I also don't think I saw any matches where both cars ended up being repaired. You're going to be doing well just to get one up and running.
2. Call the cops and escape. Any Jason worth their salt is going to be checking the phone box religiously, so to have any shot you not only need to repair and call while Jason is either distracted or in-between visits to the phone, but you've probably got to do it early enough that a car hasn't already escaped, because that seriously narrows your victory conditions and Jason will know it.
3. Wait out the 20 minute timer. If you're in this position, you're probably either the only one left, or one of very few. Since counselor fear level is a battle of attrition the whole match that you will likely slowly be on the losing end of, you're going to be hard-pressed to make it to the end against a good Jason.

Strategy changes almost on a dime depending on the situation, who you are playing with, and especially who you are playing against (which may or may not include other counselors).

By contrast, Jason has fewer choices to make moment-to-moment, especially in the early game before he unlocks shift and rage. There's some things in the early game that you basically *have* to do to ensure no one escapes early:

- Gotta check the phone
- Make sure the cars aren't being repaired
- Cut power/radio so Jarvis can't be called and counselor fear increases

Jason's decision making becomes more interesting mid-to-late match because if you haven't killed anyone by then, the chances of you getting everyone drop like a stone, so it becomes more about how to maximize your kill rate and deciding just who to chase.

ComposerGuy fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Apr 25, 2017

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Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
you would think that everyone would want to play the killer exclusively, but in DbD that turned out not to be true. this remained the case even though the killer was hosting (and always had the best connectivity experience) and was trivially easy to win, and therefore get more blood points (xp) to level up anything you wanted. it was much easier to get a game going by simply going killer because so many people were bopping around as survivor.

Inside Out Mom
Jan 9, 2004

Franklin B. Znorps
Dignity, Class, Internet
Man, this game seems like it might be pretty cool. I feel like I'm in the prefer to be councilor crowd here. Without ever playing a game like this, I feel like I would just get clowned as Jason anyway. I saw some gameplay on twitch during the beta and it definitely caught my attention. It not only seems to have better gameplay elements but also look way better than Dead By Daylight. Even if I'm not great at it, it would seem to be a really fun spectator game for sites like twitch and all. Hopefully the post launch opinions are as good as the anticipation in this thread.

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


I think both sides look fun in their own way, but most people are probably going to want to be the big scary guy with power over others. Being a counselor will probably be more interesting, and I have little doubt I'll be bad at both.

ComposerGuy
Jul 28, 2007

Conspicuous Absinthe

Inside Out Mom posted:

Even if I'm not great at it, it would seem to be a really fun spectator game for sites like twitch and all. Hopefully the post launch opinions are as good as the anticipation in this thread.

I have no doubt it's going to get serious run on twitch.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!

ComposerGuy posted:

I have no doubt it's going to get serious run on twitch.
yeah, DbD was humongous on twitch and this game looks better put together overall

FunkMonkey posted:

I think both sides look fun in their own way, but most people are probably going to want to be the big scary guy with power over others.
again, per DbD's overall distribution, this turns out to not be the case. when games were difficult to get, they were always more difficult to get for the survivors.

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Say, do you know how to do the walk?

Coolguye posted:

you would think that everyone would want to play the killer exclusively, but in DbD that turned out not to be true. this remained the case even though the killer was hosting (and always had the best connectivity experience) and was trivially easy to win, and therefore get more blood points (xp) to level up anything you wanted. it was much easier to get a game going by simply going killer because so many people were bopping around as survivor.

DbD had issues for both sides and I think a large part of that was the map design. The map design was pretty awful.

Combine that with survive with friends for a game that wasn't really designed for it as well as the survivor "meta" that was with the game for most of it's release, and it just looks sloppy in hindsight.

Thankfully, the map doesn't suck in Friday the 13th.

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


blackguy32 posted:

DbD had issues for both sides and I think a large part of that was the map design. The map design was pretty awful.

Combine that with survive with friends for a game that wasn't really designed for it as well as the survivor "meta" that was with the game for most of it's release, and it just looks sloppy in hindsight.

Thankfully, the map doesn't suck in Friday the 13th.

I imagine this game's longevity will be very dependent on new maps down the line.

I remember a DbD stream AllShamNoWow did that was just him and his friends giggling like idiots as they frantically avoided the killer. Really made the survivor side entertaining.

ComposerGuy
Jul 28, 2007

Conspicuous Absinthe

FunkMonkey posted:

I imagine this game's longevity will be very dependent on new maps down the line.

Agree 100 percent.

It's shipping with 3, which I think is a solid number considering the obvious care that went into map design. I'm hoping we end up with a cruise ship style map a la Part 8 down the line. Maybe instead of cars you have to activate life boats?

I'd also like Part 5's halfway-home ranch thing and the crystal Lake town itself, which shows up a few times in the series.

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

Captain Beans posted:

What kind of unlocks do you use xp for? All I've seen so far is clothes.

Jason killmoves and perks for counselors. (Slower stamina drain, chance to not be caught in Sense, etc) Also different Jasons and Counselors unlock as your level goes up.

Stunt_enby
Feb 6, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Jason killmoves and perks for counselors. (Slower stamina drain, chance to not be caught in Sense, etc) Also different Jasons and Counselors unlock as your level goes up.
Well, I WAS looking forward to this game...

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


Stuntman posted:

Well, I WAS looking forward to this game...

That's a little hyperbolic, but I wasn't aware of the trait gains - they'll have to manage that very carefully, if DbD was any lesson.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
Not sure what you mean by the DbD survivor meta. The game blatantly favors the killer outside of some busted as hell perk combos that are mostly fixed promptly. At its core whenever a chase starts the survivor is toast unless the killer screws up. They actually released data on a couple of their streams showing that the killer was earning about as much as all survivors combined for almost half of all games played despite the fact that there's, you know, 4 survivors.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
Also, for what it's worth, here are all of the perks. They look uniformly uninspiring outside of Restful and Marathon: http://fridaythe13th.gamepedia.com/Perks#/search

Low Profile apparently only works while crouching which means it's functionally useless after you're spotted

Coolguye fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Apr 26, 2017

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

ComposerGuy posted:

I have no doubt it's going to get serious run on twitch.

I was watching a streamer that got control of Tommy Jarvis. He was with a group of like 4 survivors when suddenly Jason warps into the middle and puts him in a stranglehold. The survivors manage to break his grip, but Tommy dropped his gun and can't find it. Jason starts killing everyone and in a panic, Tommy just runs off into the forest and abandons them all to die screaming :byodood: "TOMMY JARVIS LIVES ANOTHER DAY!!!!" :byodood:

So I dunno if I'm gonna buy this game but its definitely gonna be hilarious to watch people suck at it.

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


Coolguye posted:

Also, for what it's worth, here are all of the perks. They look uniformly uninspiring outside of Restful and Marathon: http://fridaythe13th.gamepedia.com/Perks#/search

Low Profile apparently only works while crouching which means it's functionally useless after you're spotted

That doesn't look so bad, thanks for sharing.

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

Stuntman posted:

Well, I WAS looking forward to this game...

They also changed it since beta, there seems to be negative stats on them now.

McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005






Does Tommy Jarvis come with all stats maxed as well as the shotgun, or is he just an armed respawn for the next/last person who died?

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

McSpanky posted:

Does Tommy Jarvis come with all stats maxed as well as the shotgun, or is he just an armed respawn for the next/last person who died?

Stats are all high, not sure if maxed, but he's excellent at all.

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum

ComposerGuy posted:

Agree 100 percent.

It's shipping with 3, which I think is a solid number considering the obvious care that went into map design. I'm hoping we end up with a cruise ship style map a la Part 8 down the line. Maybe instead of cars you have to activate life boats?

I'd also like Part 5's halfway-home ranch thing and the crystal Lake town itself, which shows up a few times in the series.

I'm sort of wondering if eventually down the line it'd be okay to include other classic slashers like Freddy, Leatherface or Micheal Myers with respective maps based on their films. I know, this is a dangerous road to tred, but just something later in the game to spice up the killer selection between good maps and councilors. However, even if this is possible, Myers probably is off the table because he's already in another game.

Wanderer
Nov 5, 2006

our every move is the new tradition
As long as you tailored the game mechanics to new slashers, I'd be down. Treating them as interchangeable with Jason would be a disappointment.

My first thought is that Leatherface would be easy to hear coming from miles off because he's got a six-foot-long running chainsaw, but if you're in some kind of meat-packing plant, that'd cover the sound of the revving.

You could also do Ghostface from the Scream movies, where he's only about as durable as a "counselor" but he can plant traps and maybe there's two of him.

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum
And while I'm being crazy, I'm also wondering if you could have a two killer face off with 8 survivors. The killers can't really work together as only one can win among them, murdering the councilors empowers the killer that actually offs them and it becomes a hunt to be the stronger slasher while the survivors try to make it out and use the rivalry to their advantage. If the slashers try to work together and try to make it an even split of say 4 for Jason and 4 for Freddy, it allows people to spawn back as Tommy Jarvis or other strong survivors.

Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames
And you don't know who's a survivor and who's the Scream guys because they can disguise themselves. :getin:

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


Crabtree posted:

And while I'm being crazy, I'm also wondering if you could have a two killer face off with 8 survivors. The killers can't really work together as only one can win among them, murdering the councilors empowers the killer that actually offs them and it becomes a hunt to be the stronger slasher while the survivors try to make it out and use the rivalry to their advantage. If the slashers try to work together and try to make it an even split of say 4 for Jason and 4 for Freddy, it allows people to spawn back as Tommy Jarvis or other strong survivors.

This would actually be brilliant and even if it was Jason clones competing I'd love to see it in-game. Whoever kills more is the winner of match and the killer flagging behind gets buffs.

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum

FunkMonkey posted:

This would actually be brilliant and even if it was Jason clones competing I'd love to see it in-game. Whoever kills more is the winner of match and the killer flagging behind gets buffs.

Nah, whoever ends up stronger kills the other killer in a really spectacular kill scene. That's your reward for being the winner and better hunter.

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


Crabtree posted:

Nah, whoever ends up stronger kills the other killer in a really spectacular kill scene. That's your reward for being the winner and better hunter.

A narrative thing is fine as a spectacular victory scene but if you have the winning player get the buffs and perks it just makes it harder and harder for the losing killer to make a comeback and that's no fun.

I think we may have just miscommunicated and we agree. Anyway, let's hope such a mode comes to exist at all.

Buck Wildman fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Apr 26, 2017

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum

FunkMonkey posted:

A narrative thing is fine as a spectacular victory scene but if you have the winning player get the buffs and perks it just makes it harder and harder for the losing killer to make a comeback and that's no fun.

You're right, which is why I"ll also allow killers to interrupt kills and for there to be enough survivors to maybe stave off one killer if they either work together or complete enough tasks. Weaker killer can still catch up in a certain time frame, but the more these killers let the survivors either call the cops, ready an escape or complete other objectives, the more they can respawn as stronger survivors, including one that could even give a buffed killer a run for his money, Ash Williams.

Although, there's likely holes in this, I just want to make sure there's a way for the survivors to win, keep it fun for whoever is either killer and provide a satisfying victory for the winner(s).

Crabtree fucked around with this message at 03:03 on Apr 26, 2017

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor


So long as the match end animation is the victor having the loser in an armlock giving them a noogie while standing on a mountain of dead teenagers, I'll be happy.

Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames
JASON WINS...FRIENDSHIP.

ComposerGuy
Jul 28, 2007

Conspicuous Absinthe

Crabtree posted:

I'm sort of wondering if eventually down the line it'd be okay to include other classic slashers like Freddy, Leatherface or Micheal Myers with respective maps based on their films. I know, this is a dangerous road to tred, but just something later in the game to spice up the killer selection between good maps and councilors. However, even if this is possible, Myers probably is off the table because he's already in another game.

The rights issues would be a clusterfuck. Hell, the F13 film rights are a clusterfuck literally right now. I can't imagine Gun Media are eager to jump down that rabbit hole.

Drunken Baker
Feb 3, 2015

VODKA STYLE DRINK
When calling the cops they also send out a paramedic hearse. Next person to die respawns as Roy from V and can try and rack up some kills of his own before the real Jason guts him.

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

Drunken Baker posted:

When calling the cops they also send out a paramedic hearse. Next person to die respawns as Roy from V and can try and rack up some kills of his own before the real Jason guts him.

You can just do this anyway.

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum
Oh yeah, and is it possible to put the Crispin Glover dance as a taunt or something? Because if not, you're not getting the whole franchise experience.

Drunken Baker
Feb 3, 2015

VODKA STYLE DRINK
No crispin Glover dance? :murder:

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

Someone did the math once based on the chronology of the Jason movies, character's ages, alleged time passed, etc, and determined that this scene takes place sometime in the 2000's within the Jason universe.

:dance:

Buck Wildman
Mar 30, 2010

I am Metango, Galactic Governor



Holy poo poo, HOLY poo poo I completely forgot about this.

Developers, I know you're reading this. You NEED to have this dance and the accompanying song play whenever a counselor reaches the police safe zone.

Tinfoil Papercut
Jul 27, 2016

by Athanatos

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Well kids, looks like we know the strengths and weaknesses of all the Jasons now! .....You're still going to play Vanessa, aren't you? *shakes head judgingly*

Jason II
    Strengths
  • Can Run
  • Traps (Starts with more)
  • Morph

    Weaknesses
  • Shift
  • Defense
  • Water Speed

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

A devious prick with the laziest headgear I've ever seen on a psychotic murderer. He's everywhere at once and good at flushing out those sneaky types.

Jason III
    Strengths
  • Can Run
  • Weapon Strength
  • Grip Strength

    Weaknesses
  • Stun Resistance
  • Sense
  • Stalk

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

He's like a train: huge, powerful, unstoppable. But you can hear him coming a mile away and should be all set if you can stay out of his way.

Jason VI
    Strengths
  • Throwing Knives (starts with some, other have to find)
  • Sense
  • Shift

    Weaknesses
  • Defense
  • Can't Run
  • Morph

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Like that ex girlfriend who just won't leave you alone.

Jason VII
    Strengths
  • Sense
  • Water Speed
  • Grip Strength

    Weaknesses
  • Can't Run
  • Traps
  • Shift

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Don't let him near you - and for the love of god: Stay. Out. Of. The. Water.

Jason VIII
    Strengths
  • Water Speed
  • Destruction
  • Stalk

    Weaknesses
  • Can't Run
  • Grip Strength
  • Sense

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Wow, he really trashed this place. Don't worry I'm 100% sure he's moved on to the oth.....*blood gurgling sounds*

Jason IX
    Strengths
  • Shift
  • Stun Resistance
  • Stalk

    Weaknesses
  • Can't Run
  • Less Hit Points
  • Traps

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

SURPRISE! You're dead.

Savini Jason
    Strengths
  • Shift
  • Weapon Strength
  • Destruction

    Weaknesses
  • Water Speed
  • Can't Run
  • Grip Strength

Tinfoil Papercut posted:

Savini, a haiku by Tinfoil:

One by one the cabins fall
All will turn to ash
He comes now, embrace your end

Tinfoil Papercut fucked around with this message at 12:32 on Apr 27, 2017

Alexander DeLarge
Dec 20, 2013
I'm really glad I got the Savini Jason now. drat.

Drunken Baker
Feb 3, 2015

VODKA STYLE DRINK
When can i pre-order for the X-Box and do I get the Savini skin?

I REALLY hope we get a Jason X skin at some point. Not even Uber-Jason, just the pig-mask Jason. I love that mask.

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Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
i somehow think that the 'less hit points' and 'less defense' weaknesses are going to turn out being entirely toothless on jason since who the gently caress wants to step to that with anything less than a shotgun to begin with

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