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TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Entropic posted:

You're nuts. The White Monument is crazy good in sealed.

Black Monument was a loving house in 2HG

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TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Count Bleck posted:

This is what Prerelease is all about.

That and 2-0'ing people that deserve to lose every game of Magic they play because they're overall terrible sports about it.

qft


Also lol at the lack of changes to Standard.



BJPaskoff posted:

We want to see what happens, we don't have enough data yet.

I figured "massive drops in attendance for standard events" would have been enough data by this point but here we are

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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YggdrasilTM posted:

The 90% of the Legacy and Modern players "free word of mouth advertisement" is "Standard sucks and it's a money pit, do not play it".

agree with this in both ways

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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mcmagic posted:

It's for political poo poo in D&D. I pissed off a lot of people during the election.

and also not during the election

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Sickening posted:

The black 2 mana curse enchantment.

haha, I didn't think about that. That's pretty hilarious

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:

Top should always be banned for reasons beyond power level.

This. There are few cards less fun to play against


vvv this guy gets it

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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the only people who are upset about top's banning are the assholes that made playing against it a chore

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Errant Gin Monks posted:

I went to a new shop the other day and they don't even try standard anymore. All modern and draft.

Same with the FLGS near me. They didn't fire off a single standard event last week

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Siivola posted:

The content's okay, but... I dunno, the style is super amateurish compared to anyone else in the story team. I wish I knew how to explain this better, but this reads like a fanfic more than any other Magic story I've read.

Yeah, this was my read on it as well.

"It's OK content delivered in the most amateurish way possible," Nissa screamed. She had long since given up on non-screaming forms of communication.


mandatory lesbian posted:

20 years from now, if MTG is still around, i will still be reminding people that jace wanted to gently caress a cosmic horror

lmao if you don't want to do this

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Deified Data posted:

Wanted to touch base and thank you for the useful resources - I read the article, watched the video, lost my first game, and I'm still interested so there's that.

I have a limited base of how the game is played to build off now, so I'm curious about (casual) deck building - good strategies for beginners to pursue, most efficient products to look for, etc. Whether you have the time to reply or not, thanks for the time regardless.

Some advice for beginners when it comes to building casual decks and building a collection:

- Beginners always overvalue life gain. Gaining life is usually not that important in most games, so don't waste your time with cards where all they do is gain life

- When you're building a deck, have a plan for how it can win. Test it by "goldfishing," or just playing against an invisible opponent. Unless you are purposely buiding a slower deck, most of the decks you build should be able to win the game by turns 5/6 without any interference from the opponent

- Stick to 60 cards. There is almost no good reason to have more than that in your deck. You want to minimize variance in games, and one way to do that is by playing the minimum deck size. A general rule of thumb is to run 23-24 lands in most decks.

- Think about efficiency in terms of in-game interactions. You generally want to see/draw/use more of your deck in a game than an opponent does of his/her deck. So where possible, you want to avoid situations where an opponent can kill/remove 2+ of your cards with only a single one of their cards, and look for opportunities to do the same. The reason most creature enchantments/auras are bad is because they create easy 2-for-1 situations for your opponent.

- The deckbuilder's toolkit is an OK place to start to get some staples and lands, but generally you want to buy singles rather than sealed product. That said, your friends/people at your store should be more than willing to give you their bulk commons/uncommons, unless they're shitlords. Otherwise, once you know what you want to build, buy the singles you need.

e: There are generally two types of cards--cards that help you get to a winning situation, and cards that maintain a winning situation (e.g. they help you "win more"). Generally, you want to prioritize the first type of card for your deck. It can be tough to make this distinction, but generally as you evaluate cards for your deck, ask yourself "will this help me turn a losing situation into a winning one, or is it something I want to have when I'm already winning?"

If I think of anything else, I'll let you know.

TheChirurgeon fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Apr 26, 2017

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Taco Defender

80s James Hetfield posted:

Haha, this was my first pitfall of the game.

"Who cares about drawing a card when Angel's Grace gives me 7 life!!!!"

It's crazy how universal it is--players think "if I have a bazillion life, I can't lose!" and so load up on cards that gain them life, then are shocked when they just lose anyways. I think that part of it is also because they don't think about whether cards affect "the board" yet, so they don't realize that the life gain doesn't help them win or turn a losing situation around, it just delays the loss.

If it makes you feel better, Richard Garfield made the same mistake when he made the white boon in Alpha gain 3 life for 1 mana, and thought that'd be on par with drawing 3 cards, doing 3 damage, or getting 3 mana.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Elyv posted:

+1/+1(or +1/+0) counters weren't white in alpha, they were actually in like every other color. Tokens also existed but were only created by The Hive(check out that text box, by the way) which I'm told was considered one of the best cards in the game back then because it gets you a creature every turn dude, that's so good!! I think white only really started to claim that space with Kjeldoran Outpost in Alliances. They had token-making in Fallen Empires but really so did everyone else.

Alpha had really powerful color hate so I guess something like "destroy 3 red or black permanents" wouldn't be out of the question :v:

Couldn't be +1/+1 counters anyways or it'd outclass Giant Growth, since presumably they're all instants (or Interrupts, in Counterspell's case but the point is they aren't sorceries).

Maybe returning 3 creatures from graveyard to hand could have worked, but Raise Dead and Regrowth already occupied that space.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Actually now that I think about it, a 3-point Harm's Way would have been fine. Not overpowered, but fine (although probably a little too close to lightning bolt, but we're working with limited technology here)

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Taco Defender

80s James Hetfield posted:

Haha, these are actual MTGO people



I've been in MTGO games where playing an plasm capture resulted in me being called an rear end in a top hat and followed by a concession

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Taco Defender

Star Man posted:

People to this day think the Pokémon TCG was meant to be Magic-lite because they think that the card game was created by Wizards because of maybe two or three similar gameplay elements or rules. I remember magazines comparing Professor Oak to Wheel of Fortune in 1999.

to be fair, Professor Oak was a house, and even better than WoF



KenBearlLOLOL posted:

I keep running into this kind of stuff in MTGO commander, my favorite was the guy who scooped to me playing a non buyback Forbid as the last card out of my hand with no damage sources on the board.

This is one of the reasons I stopped playing MTGO outside of drafts. It's like every casual game is populated by EDH players


Pontius Pilate posted:

Mana drain outside of vintage is pretty rude.

can't tell if serious but god forbid I run mystic snake or plasm capture in my joke-rear end blue-green ramp deck

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/addendum-april-24-2017-banned-and-restricted-announcement-2017-04-26

e:f,b

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Sampatrick posted:

They banned Jace because Jace was the best card in that standard. Caw-Go was arguably the best deck even before Stoneforge was around. The other top tier decks were things like URx Twin featuring Jace the Mind Sculptor, RUG Control featuring Jace the Mind Sculptor, UW Control featuring Jace the Mind Sculptor, UB Control featuring Jace the Mind Sculptor, and then RDW and Valakut. Jace was more prevalent in that format than SFM.

Also, you're insane if you think Snapcaster is better than Jace or SFM.

I kind of stopped playing in tournaments for a while when Theros block was released so I can't speak to that, but I did play standard during RTR/INN and Snapcaster wasn't degenerate or anything. Hell, I recall Thragtusk-laden aggro decks being the bulk of the format at the time

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Sampatrick posted:

Well, it was a lot of Midrange Thragtusk decks but yeah, Swagdaddy was the most played card in the format. It was very diverse even accounting for that, however. Pretty much every archetype was viable in that standard.

I didn't say it was bad--I very much enjoyed my Ghost Dad deck. I was just pointing out that Snapcaster wasn't a degenerate or format-defining card in standard at the time, so complaining about it being on the level of JTMS or Cawblade is, to me, crazypants

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Marketing New Brain posted:

It absolutely was in the deck that played 4, the UW Flash deck, and it was insanely dominant and the best deck in the format by a ridiculous margin.

Hmmm nope

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck_search_result.asp?Location=2013+Magic+World+Championship+-+Standard

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Marketing New Brain posted:

I was talking about a completely different standard than this, you know, the one that had Mana Leak, 1 and 0 mana cantrips where Snappy was insane like he is in older formats. They rotated out Mana Leak and pretty much all of the good cheap spells specifically because of how good Snapcaster was, and it was STILL great. But yeah this clearly is not the format or deck I was talking about.

You're basically talking about a two-month time frame right between like May 2012 and July 2012, when Delver pushed ahead of Pod and right before M13 rotated Mana Leak out of Standard. Forgive me if I don't see your point about Snapcaster's dominance

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Sampatrick posted:

Delver was pretty much always the best deck in that format. Also, Mana Leak didn't rotate until RTR.

my bad. 3 months, I guess?

But straight up, go back and look at tournament results. Delver was nowhere near as dominant as you are making it out to be.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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mcmagic posted:

Jace is too good on an empty board and too miserable to play against.

mostly because of that fateseal ability. I'm glad they realized how unfun that mechanic was, particularly on a permanent.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Rinkles posted:

Not that poo poo again. The eldrazi don't need to pervade every aspect of the lore. I never loved them but I appreciated they were very different from what they did before. Now I'm sick and tired of them. Emra'--gently caress OFF.

gently caress em'rakul?

I mean, who wouldn't, amirite? :haw:

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Veyrall posted:

Please leave your fetishes out of this.

I'm thinking, mechanically, exactly what the missing gods may have been. I'm thinking, a 5 color one, one that can change its color identity, and a colorless one, but I don't think they can even do a colorless one since colorless cards have certain predefined spaces and limitations and flavor...

Or hey, maybe I'm overthinking the cycle and it's just not even gonna be a thing outside of the lore.

One of the missing gods was obviously purple

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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TheKingofSprings posted:

It's almost like variance control shouldn't be in one colour's wheelhouse or something

it's not--mana smoothing is in green

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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little munchkin posted:

both scg events and gps avoid major us cities for what i assume are financial reasons

renting space in Chicago is insanely expensive. On par with NYC and SF, and it makes no sense

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Man Homelands was so loving garbage that it almost killed Magic entirely

Even the flavor was wildly uneven and at best just OK

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Elyv posted:

good cards in fallen empires:
black pump knight
white pump knight
hymn to tourach
high tide(like 5 years later)

that said, I think Fallen Empires' and IA/AL flavor texts are both extremely underrated because they do a good job at portraying a world. I liked the Sorine Relicbane/Arcum Dagsson interaction, for instance

cards that are good cards but not necessarily very strong that were in FE (and certainly not strong by today's standards):
- Mindstab Thrull
- Aeolipile
- Goblin Grenade
- Brassclaw Orcs
- Breeding Pit
- Icatian Javlineers
- Derelor
- Goblin Warrens
- Vodalian Mage

Basically, I think the set was pretty underrated. But it was also massively overprinted and over-ordered and still underpowered/underwhelming compared to Legends and the Dark (neither of which has aged all that well, but were *SO COOL* at the time it didn't matter), and so its reputation at the time was well-deserved.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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suicidesteve posted:

What happens if I sneak a Cheatyface into play? Is that a deck error or a GRV?

your dick doubles in size

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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80s James Hetfield posted:

GP buttcrack guy was right.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Rap Record Hoarder posted:

I'd almost rather they not even attempt a BR walker, it'd just be a shittier version of Tibalt.

BR Sarkhan got some play in Jund back in the day

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Seem like good changes to me. I probably want core sets to be more interesting than they will actually be, but it seems like the best way to help fix issues with Standard when reprints in the new "blocks" aren't workable. Also like fewer limitations on set mechanics carrying over.

I like invocations OK but agree that their current pace/strategy wasn't sustainable.

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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mandatory lesbian posted:

it's not even like ghostfire is a good card or anything it just would have been a cool card to print

Hell they could have printed it in Dragons of Tarkir as a precursor to BFZ and it would have fit the setting

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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dragon enthusiast posted:

Should have used the planeswalkers decks as the place to print generic staples into standard

Yeah, but having a core set again lets them print Dominiaria poo poo and stuff like Sengir Vampire

Also whatever Duals they want around for the next year

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Star Man posted:

When people clamor for quotes from literature on cards, I always wonder if those same people actually read that stuff in their spare time.

"having read or seen a Shakespearean play" seems like a pretty common thing, even if Richard III isn't one of the more commonly-assigned/read/performed plays


vvvv same

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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mcmagic posted:

That just magic... Cards have different selling points and play differently in different metas.

Whoa buddy cool it with these blistering hot takes

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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more

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TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Gustav posted:

Alright, I'll be the first to admit it. I did not know "abrade" was a word.

Same, I thought it was a foreign language promo til I saw it was in English

TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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Mezzanon posted:

Crucible man, crucible man
doing the things a crucible can
what's he swing for?
It's not important
crucible man

:golfclap:

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TheChirurgeon
Aug 7, 2002

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80s James Hetfield posted:

Give us a 1/1 with Afflict 10

seems like you'd just make a creature unblockable at that point

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