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precision posted:It was strongly implied that Mexico was far worse off radiation and environment wise, and therefore really desperate (not one baby in SIX YEARS). Meanwhile Gilead are having enough babies to casually trot out the 20 they've had just in the past year alone. Compound that with the fact that we can assume every place in the world with morality and working internet will have nothing to do with Gilead and I think it's obvious we're supposed to assume Mexico is turbofucked and Gilead is merely hosed once a month. I think the implication is that the developing world got hit much worse by whatever is causing the infertility epidemic, and while other places like Canada and Europe may be better off than Gilead, the latter is the only (former) developed country willing to consider trading its fertile women. Though the more this show emphasizes the infertility crisis aspect of the setting, the more jarring I find it that the flashbacks show a pre-Gilead world that's pretty much indistinguishable from our own apart from the hospital scenes in episode 2. It seems like a big failure of imagination to present something like this as causing no major social changes except the one specific change of inspiring a bunch of religious nutcases to overthrow the US government. INH5 fucked around with this message at 04:46 on May 18, 2017 |
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May 18, 2017 04:42
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In some of the flashback scenes there are little pieces that hint to what is going on. The most jarring for me was the empty carnival grounds (though it was hard to see because nearly all the shots were closeups).
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May 18, 2017 04:53
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I think general denial and the likelihood that gradually dropping infertility would be a sort of snowballing existential crisis, as opposed to an immediate threat to extant human life a plague or impending meteor, would cause a delayed response like what we've seen. It would take time for people to really come to grips with the full impact of the situation, and then when they finally did things would rapidly and dramatically break, which they have.
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May 18, 2017 05:25
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Theocratic states practicing mass rape and chattel slavery are not rational actors and their rationale for their abuse isn't solely based on pragmatic considerations like actually reliably producing live babies. That poo poo's jsut an excuse. Many countries in the global south already have terrifying rates of infant mortality, a global infertility pandemic would drop live births even further than in the developed world, so yeah Mexico wants to make babies. Gilead's willing to trade away its one useful resource because whatever propaganda bullshit they spout about their agricultural miracle, their economy's likely on the skids due to keeping half their labour pool in domestic servitude and alienating all potential trade partners by being cargo cult christian ISIS. EDIT: JUICY HAMBUGAR posted:In some of the flashback scenes there are little pieces that hint to what is going on. The most jarring for me was the empty carnival grounds (though it was hard to see because nearly all the shots were closeups). I wish they'd pull the camera back a bit more and let the story tell itself environmentally for that proper Children of Men vibe, but maybe they can't because they need all the juicy closeup shots of people's faces while they're experiencing soul-crushing grief and hardship. EDIT II: The crane execution was brutally anxiety provoking and horrific, all the scenes like that where they do the Cuaron-style diegetic camera are dynamite. TomViolence fucked around with this message at 07:24 on May 18, 2017 |
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May 18, 2017 06:38
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The way they've changed Mrs. Waterford's backstory makes me even more suspicious she's going to end up helping June. Did Janine ever get her tray of desserts? 
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May 18, 2017 22:26
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I liked the Aunt's scene in this episode. As cruel and terrible as she is, she really does believe in and take pride in the system and is pretty upset that the disfigured handmaids are forced to sit out and not be honored at the dinner (an entire tray of dessert!) None of the characters are just cartoonishly evil for the sake of evil and it makes the story a lot more terrifying as a result.
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May 18, 2017 23:19
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tweet my meat posted:I liked the Aunt's scene in this episode. As cruel and terrible as she is, she really does believe in and take pride in the system and is pretty upset that the disfigured handmaids are forced to sit out and not be honored at the dinner (an entire tray of dessert!) None of the characters are just cartoonishly evil for the sake of evil and it makes the story a lot more terrifying as a result. Absolutely, a clear-eyed true believer who has your best intentions at heart while maiming/raping/killing you is way loving scarier than a stock cackling madman.
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May 18, 2017 23:37
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The pacing of the show is kinda starting to bore me at this point. We get it, it's an oppressive dystopia where nothing much happens. I'm just not sure the show has enough story to tell, given that 15-20 minutes each week is padding.
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May 19, 2017 22:28
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Elizabeth Moss loving blows me away as an actress. Her line delivery and facial expressions are so layered and the execution is perfect. The scene in the bath, her line delivery for "awesoooome.." slayed me. And when she's in the Commander's room and you see a whole conversation she's having in her head by her facial expressions as she reaches the decision to try to seduce him... 
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May 19, 2017 22:34
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pigdog posted:The pacing of the show is kinda starting to bore me at this point. We get it, it's an oppressive dystopia where nothing much happens. I'm just not sure the show has enough story to tell, given that 15-20 minutes each week is padding. You use your phone/tablet while watching, don't you. The acting and cinematography in this show rank up there with the best. If you're not watching carefully, you're seriously missing out.
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May 19, 2017 22:56
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I don't think there has been even one single minute of padding so far. This show is phenomenal. 
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May 20, 2017 00:50
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Not another kissing part!
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May 20, 2017 01:02
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This show is really veering off into soft porn territory sometimes.
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May 20, 2017 01:14
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The bits where the sex is sexy are the bits where I tune out. Maybe it's meant to be for contrast or something but it bugs the gently caress out of me in the context of the show, like it's reaching for some sort of 50 shades style appeal.
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May 20, 2017 02:50
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What the gently caress, did you both not understand why June would want to have sex ,enjoyable, rock your world sex. What the gently caress is wrong with both of you.
Hollismason fucked around with this message at 02:56 on May 20, 2017 |
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May 20, 2017 02:54
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It's just jarring to me, I didn't say it didn't fit and yes, it is entirely on me. EDIT: Like, sure I can see having good, non-exploitative sex as being a way to escape or resist or whatever, but in the context of a show as disturbing as this the horrible abuse that bookends it renders even the non-exploitative sex disturbing in its presentation. TomViolence fucked around with this message at 03:04 on May 20, 2017 |
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May 20, 2017 03:01
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Hollismason posted:What the gently caress, did you both not understand why June would want to have sex ,enjoyable, rock your world sex. What the gently caress is wrong with both of you. Yeah this show is one of the very few where every single sex scene is necessary and in service to the plot.
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May 20, 2017 03:12
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It's more the way it's presented than the content of it. It's got a real skinemax vibe and feels weird tonally compared to the rest of the show.
veni veni veni fucked around with this message at 03:21 on May 20, 2017 |
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May 20, 2017 03:18
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Get Help
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May 20, 2017 03:25
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Hollismason posted:Get Help A better idea: Chill out. Different viewers will inevitably have a different reaction to th content of the show and how it's presented. If the skinemax-lite presentation of the sex scenes doesn't feel tonally jarring to you big whoop, it doesn't mean that people who do find it dissonant are mentally unhealthy. In fact, the disjunct might even be intentional on the part of the showrunners, to create that sense of dissonance. Actually discussing it like an adult instead of being weirdly defensive is probably a better tack to take.
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May 20, 2017 03:28
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Hollismason posted:Get Help You are weird. E: If it works for you, fantastic. I don't know why you are throwing around a bunch of lame rear end insults because someone views something different than you. And I don't appreciate you assigning intent to my post that I didn't have. veni veni veni fucked around with this message at 03:36 on May 20, 2017 |
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May 20, 2017 03:30
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veni veni veni posted:It's more the way it's presented than the content of it. It's got a real skinemax vibe and feels weird tonally compared to the rest of the show. The show is communicating their kind of sex as a primal, healthy, innately good thing in contrast with the soulless mechanical implantation process sanctioned by the state. I think it's supposed to feel that way, it's the only time these people can act like themselves instead of cogs in the rape factory.
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May 20, 2017 03:40
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I know that. I still think the way it is filmed is a bit tacky.
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May 20, 2017 03:44
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I thought it was done really loving sexy
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May 20, 2017 03:52
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The sex scene with Nick I found really emotionally titillating, in a good way. It takes acting chops to sell emotional transitions during simulated sex. Again, give Moss even more awards, please.
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May 20, 2017 05:00
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Die Sexmonster! posted:You use your phone/tablet while watching, don't you. Actually fast-forwarding at 2X speed about half the time. The acting is good, I like Elizabeth Moss a lot, the theme of the show is fascinating, but they just. don't. have. enough. story. and therefore they pad the thing out.
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May 20, 2017 06:02
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I thought Nick was supposed to be an ugly creep due to them casting an ugly creeping looking guy. But apparently he's giving June multiples and poo poo. Maybe that's the point, that even a spindly goon creep like him becomes a stud in a world where every other man is a rapist
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May 20, 2017 09:47
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Dunno, he doesn't look ugly to me, at all. Not to mention that his appearance likely plays a very secondary part in the whole attraction, if I had to wager it's more about the fact that he is secretly powerful, has been sympathetic and gentle towards June and is generally very much into her. Not to mention the whole forbidden love aspect and the fact that they share a few secrets that could get both of them killed. But that's just me I guess.
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May 20, 2017 09:55
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Nick is definitely a very good looking person
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May 20, 2017 10:37
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precision posted:Nick is definitely a very good looking person Huh. Well at the time we were watching I checked this with my partner (who is a heterosexual woman to my knowledge) and she agreed he was repulsive, but no accounting for taste I guess
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May 20, 2017 10:57
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Hollismason posted:What the gently caress, did you both not understand why June would want to have sex ,enjoyable, rock your world sex. What the gently caress is wrong with both of you. I understand the writers include the scenes for contrast and other thematic reasons, but usually someone who is subjected to regular and systematic rapes won't have "get a great sex life" at the top of their list of priorities. It's understandable why people may find that characterization unrealistic, insensitive, or perceive it as just there for titillation.
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May 20, 2017 12:29
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It's not like Elizabeth Moss is super attractive in a conventional sense and yet everyone is super into her, I'd say this is all probably intentional. In fact the show goes the extra distance to show that attractive Joseph Fiennes is not attracted to the super attractive Yvonne Strahovski and that in turn June is disgusted with Fiennes.
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May 20, 2017 12:30
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whalesteak posted:I understand the writers include the scenes for contrast and other thematic reasons, but usually someone who is subjected to regular and systematic rapes won't have "get a great sex life" at the top of their list of priorities. It's understandable why people may find that characterization unrealistic, insensitive, or perceive it as just there for titillation. Her life is torture but it's a daily torture she's been enduring for years, I think it changes things a bit, I mean even people in the Nazi deathcamps had sex after a while. Another aspect is that by banging Nick she's scorning Fred and taking whatever revenge she can against him, even if he'll never know.
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May 20, 2017 12:32
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Her life is torture but it's a daily torture she's been enduring for years, I think it changes things a bit, I mean even people in the Nazi deathcamps had sex after a while. The only distinction I would make is that being generally tortured isn't the same as being raped repeatedly; but your point is definitely valid. I would say it's a testimony to the show's quality that it can be viewed in different ways depending on each person's personal experiences and sensibility. Mostly I was just pointing out that the weirdly hostile reaction to people criticizing the sex scenes seemed unwarranted.
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May 20, 2017 12:48
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I dunno if suffering constant trauma and abuse particularly ignites a person's sex drive, I expect it does the opposite. Particularly since, while the day to day abuse June suffers might have become banal through its sheer repetitive drudgery, things just lately have escalated to become even more stressful.
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May 20, 2017 13:03
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I don't think it ignites anything but I think it's not enough to completely switch it off for the majority of people. After a while even the worst experiences can become an unpleasant mundanity. June specifically brings up the (incorrect) "frog in boiling water" analogy, when things become gradually worse over a long period of time you just eventually get used to it. And really, I think the whole thing here is that she's reclaiming her agency, and that's probably the main take from that scene (and from the scenes where she becomes more proactive about manipulating Fred).
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May 20, 2017 13:09
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Die Sexmonster! posted:You use your phone/tablet while watching, don't you. I agree about (most of) the acting, but the cinematography? Um, no. I mean goddamn, how much slow motion can one series possibly have? Guess we'll find out! Some people people in this thread seem to be reflexively praising everything about this show and get strangely mad at even a little criticism.
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May 20, 2017 13:15
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FourLeaf posted:I agree about (most of) the acting, but the cinematography? Um, no. I mean goddamn, how much slow motion can one series possibly have? Guess we'll find out! There are some very beautiful shots (like the aerial view of the handmaids in red flowing towards the execution ground, implying both a God's-eye view of events and alluding to menstrual blood/fertility; and the wide shot of the living room with June and the commanders wife at either end, beautifully composed). The slo-mo can be a bit eh, but yeah overall it's good
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May 20, 2017 13:44
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The slowmo bits with the downbeat pop song cover pre-year-zero fell exceptionally flat, especially when contrasted against some of the stronger, better-composed scenes. Also it's a shame the soundtrack seems to have got a bit more generic and orchestral when in the first few episodes there was a brilliantly disquieting ambient synth drone horror movie score they seem to have altogether discarded. A bit weird and uneven like that, but maybe I'm misreading things and there's authorial intent behind it. The quality of the show is still pretty stellar overall.
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May 20, 2017 15:14
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Every shot in this show is like a painting. The symmetry, the placement of the characters, the lighting... I don't understand how someone could watch this on 2x speed instead of taking all that in. It's part of the experience.
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May 20, 2017 15:27
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