Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005






Ghosthotel posted:

It's pretty much a stand alone film except for some small stuff.

Very minor spoilers:

The movie starts off with Diana receiving the original copy of the WW1 photo as a gift from Bruce Wayne and that's pretty much as connected as it gets to the other movies.

Really, it takes place a hundred years ago, how connected could it be? Would Steve Trevor's biplane have a Wayne Industries engine?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Grendels Dad
Mar 5, 2011

Popular culture has passed you by.

McSpanky posted:

Really, it takes place a hundred years ago, how connected could it be? Would Steve Trevor's biplane have a Wayne Industries engine?

Cyborg's grandfather as steampunk man.

Avalerion
Oct 19, 2012

So it's basically closer to the marvel movies?

Happy Noodle Boy
Jul 3, 2002


Time traveling Barry Allen loving the timeline some more.

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


Doflamingo posted:

Lay it on us brother! I wanna hear about the very bad joke and the very bad final boss.

Sure.

Bad Joke Spoiler:



There's a bar scene that introduces the other characters you see in the photo from BvS and at some point Diana punches a guy across the bar which causes one of the side guys to go "I am both horrified and aroused." By itself it's just a really tired joke I've seen in a bunch of other stuff but the way it cuts to the character as he says it seemed really off which made me feel like it had been added in during reshoots.



Final Boss Spoiler (seriously don't click if you don't want the whole ending spoiled.) :



Ares shows up in the last 20 minutes and he creates his comic armor from melted scraps of tanks and guns and whatnot that fly onto his body and it's pretty cool for all of 20 seconds before he basically becomes Doctor Doom from the recent Fantastic Four reboot and his power is just to use telekinesis and throw stuff at Diana a whole lot. Even Diana mostly resorts to throwing stuff back at him so it turns into snowball fight but with crates full of grenades which is really funny thinking about it now.



I had fun watching it but it definitely feels way more like a Marvel movie than the previous entries in the DCEU.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster
Saw it. Spoiler-free random thoughts.

- Better than BvS and Suicide Squad; worse than MoS.

- There are quips ahoy. Some are pretty funny, but some of them are weird Austin Powers jokes "Wow, strong lady make me horny!"

- Chris Pine and the German general are surprisingly good. Gal is pretty meh. Robin Wright is amazing. Everyone else is pretty forgettable.

- There are a couple of really good action scenes, but unfortunately the really good ones repeat themselves over and over. (Deflect bullets with shield, run, throw something, run, deflect bullets, run)

- They literally do a "welp, we've got 15 minutes left. Drop in the CGI final boss from a video game."

- WWI is apparently a terrible war that killed about 20 people.

- Some really well shot scenes.

- Definitely "feels like a Marvel movie" compared to the other DCCU films, but not as well done as the top-tier Marvel stuff.

- Agree with what someone else said; very strong Thor 1 "fish out of water" vibes for the first act.

- The CGI for Wonder Woman jumping or moving long distances vertically never looks good. I don't know why. It really stuck out to me. It looks like a "Who Framed Roger Rabbit" cartoon pasted into real life.

Overall, probably a 6.5 or 7 out of 10.

Was decent fun. I'd recommend seeing it in theaters, but if you originally weren't really excited it is probably fine to wait for streaming/DVD.

Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 14:27 on May 25, 2017

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

- WWI is apparently a terrible war that killed about 20 people.

Well, at least it killed more people than the Alien Invasion of New York, the attempt to turn a European city into an ELT, and a terrorist suicide bombing in a crowded market place, combined.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Gyges posted:

Well, at least it killed more people than the Alien Invasion of New York, the attempt to turn a European city into an ELT, and a terrorist suicide bombing in a crowded market place, combined.

WWI was a real event. It has a Wikipedia page and everything.

It's just kind of funny because Chris Pine spends the first half of the movie going "You don't know what the real world is like! This is the war to end all wars! The slaughter out there..."

*Every German and British soldier in No-Man's-Land gets shot in the leg/shoulder and crawls back to the trenches*

That's a weirdly defensive post about a movie I'm assuming you haven't seen, my dude.

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

That's disappointing to read. I'm not expecting piles of corpses and blown apart bodies but, you know, you're setting the movie during WW1 and we know Diane walks away from mankind at the end for a century, so why sanitize the war so? Why change the setting if you're not going to bother using it? Maybe it isn't as bad as I'm imagining it, though. I'll just see how it is in practice when I see the film.

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

WWI was a real event. It has a Wikipedia page and everything.

It's just kind of funny because Chris Pine spends the first half of the movie going "You don't know what the real world is like! This is the war to end all wars! The slaughter out there..."

*Every German and British soldier in No-Man's-Land gets shot in the leg/shoulder and crawls back to the trenches*

That's a weirdly defensive post about a movie I'm assuming you haven't seen, my dude.

Oh, not defending it at all. Just making a joke about the stupid low death counts in these Comic Book movies about wars and conflict and stuff.

You'd think they could at least work in the cliche scene where they have people pouring over a newly posted long list of newly confirmed dead for their friends and loved ones.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Gyges posted:

Oh, not defending it at all. Just making a joke about the stupid low death counts in these Comic Book movies about wars and conflict and stuff.

You'd think they could at least work in the cliche scene where they have people pouring over a newly posted long list of newly confirmed dead for their friends and loved ones.

Ah, sorry. I thought it was another "lol cars" joke.

They do have people getting hit with gas, but it is very silly. I don't know how to properly describe it, but they get hit with this new poison gas and they do a "TV fall" where the millisecond the gas comes near them a group of 10 people all instantly ragdoll and fall down on top of each other.

The most "brutal" stuff from the war is all guys getting punched or having stuff thrown at them by Wonder Woman. A lot of her battle scenes have really good weight to them.

Also, a disappointing lack of lasso and invisible planes.

Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 20:08 on May 25, 2017

MisterBibs
Jul 17, 2010

dolla dolla
bill y'all
Fun Shoe

Jimbot posted:

That's disappointing to read. I'm not expecting piles of corpses and blown apart bodies but, you know, you're setting the movie during WW1 and we know Diane walks away from mankind at the end for a century, so why sanitize the war so?

It's a PG-13 film. You have to sanitize it.

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


Jimbot posted:

That's disappointing to read. I'm not expecting piles of corpses and blown apart bodies but, you know, you're setting the movie during WW1 and we know Diane walks away from mankind at the end for a century, so why sanitize the war so? Why change the setting if you're not going to bother using it? Maybe it isn't as bad as I'm imagining it, though. I'll just see how it is in practice when I see the film.


Yeah so major spoiler about the "walking away from humanity bit", and just the entire ending in general. This is probably my biggest disappointment with the movie.

The movie seems to be building up to a point where Diana realizes that everyone involved in the war is doing bad poo poo and Ares tries to convince her that even though he's the god of war he only ever gave men the inspiration for cruelty and never forced them to engage with it.

This is thrown out the window when Steve Trevor heroically sacrifices himself and Diana realizes that actually mankind is good and evil can be defeated with the power of love. That's explicitly said by Diana like twice during the ending btw I'm not saying it as a joke. So after defeating Ares the war just sorta magically ends and it's completely unclear as to what exactly made her step away from mankind except maybe being heart broken over Steve's death.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Ghosthotel posted:

Yeah so major spoiler about the "walking away from humanity bit", and just the entire ending in general. This is probably my biggest disappointment with the movie.

The movie seems to be building up to a point where Diana realizes that everyone involved in the war is doing bad poo poo and Ares tries to convince her that even though he's the god of war he only ever gave men the inspiration for cruelty and never forced them to engage with it.

This is thrown out the window when Steve Trevor heroically sacrifices himself and Diana realizes that actually mankind is good and evil can be defeated with the power of love. That's explicitly said by Diana like twice during the ending btw I'm not saying it as a joke. So after defeating Ares the war just sorta magically ends and it's completely unclear as to what exactly made her step away from mankind except maybe being heart broken over Steve's death.



I didn't want to mention it because it could possibly be considered a spoiler, but "the power of love was the greatest power of all" was really silly. I didn't even notice she said it twice, though.

I think we are meant to believe that Ares is sort of telling the truth and that there are lots of bad people out there, but there really isn't any reason why she had to "walk away" except that it already happened in BvS.

Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 20:21 on May 25, 2017

BrianWilly
Apr 24, 2007

There is no homosexual terrorist Johnny Silverhand
Heh, folks getting put off 'cuz WW isn't grim or dark enough for them and directly undermines BvS; is it my birthday already? (Well, actually, yes it was, last Monday)

This movie sounds perfect. :toot:

Guy A. Person
May 23, 2003

Can't remember but, is it said directly in BvS (or I guess here) that WW "walked away from humanity" immediately after WW1? Maybe she stuck around to try to help rebuild then when it was obvious that even without Ares the world still birthed fascism and even more war so she left around/before WW2*?

* christ this is potentially confusing haha

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Guy A. Person posted:

Can't remember but, is it said directly in BvS (or I guess here) that WW "walked away from humanity" immediately after WW1? Maybe she stuck around to try to help rebuild then when it was obvious that even without Ares the world still birthed fascism and even more war so she left around/before WW2*?

* christ this is potentially confusing haha

It's made very clear that she walks away at the end of Wonder Woman. Long before WWII.

I think in BvS they just say "the war" caused her to do it, but even there it is almost explicitly meant to be WWI.

Grendels Dad
Mar 5, 2011

Popular culture has passed you by.

Guy A. Person posted:

Can't remember but, is it said directly in BvS (or I guess here) that WW "walked away from humanity" immediately after WW1? Maybe she stuck around to try to help rebuild then when it was obvious that even without Ares the world still birthed fascism and even more war so she left around/before WW2*?

* christ this is potentially confusing haha

So she'd see the Nazis surface and walk away before punching any of them in the face? that would be very weak.

Guy A. Person
May 23, 2003

Grendels Dad posted:

So she'd see the Nazis surface and walk away before punching any of them in the face? that would be very weak.

Ah yeah that's true, it's just dumb that she just randomly leaves after seeing heroism in war then.

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


It's never directly said but I felt like a lot of people figured WWI was the catalyst for that based off the photograph and like that's a pretty good guess to make since we know how bad it was.

The setting is completely wasted imo. I know they had a pg-13 rating to work with but there had to be more creative ways of showing how gruesome the whole thing was then just showing some wounded soldiers in one scene.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Guy A. Person posted:

Ah yeah that's true, it's just dumb that she just randomly leaves after seeing heroism in war then.

I mean... the heroism results in her boyfriend dying and he only had to be heroic because men were evil (or kind of evil or maybe neutral and influenced by Ares), so it's not like it was a great experience.

Still doesn't really make sense to give up on humanity because of that, though.

Avalerion
Oct 19, 2012

BrianWilly posted:

Heh, folks getting put off 'cuz WW isn't grim or dark enough for them and directly undermines BvS; is it my birthday already? (Well, actually, yes it was, last Monday)

This movie sounds perfect. :toot:

Yea, this actually makes me want to see it. :D

I'm genuinely hoping it does well and they'll go full marvel with the rest.

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


My problems with it really doesn't have anything to do with a lighter tone it's just some really muddy characterization with Diana and an ending that's just really bad.

I'll admit I have my biases as I love MoS and BvS but my girlfriend who hated both those movies was just as lukewarm as I was on this one and hated the ending as well. It just falls completely flat.

Ghosthotel fucked around with this message at 21:25 on May 25, 2017

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

Ghosthotel posted:

My problems with it really don't have anything to do with a lighter tone it's just some really muddy characterization with Diana and an ending that's just really bad.

I'll admit I have my biases as I love MoS and BvS but my girlfriend who hated both those movies was just as lukewarm as I was on this one and hated the ending as well. It just falls completely flat.

I do find it kind of ironic that they decide to lighten the tone of these things during some of the darkest chapters in modern history. But people love their wars and conflict, so showing them in any kind of challenging of negative way is a big no-no. Would it be reductive to say Wonder Woman walks away from mankind because her boyfriend died? Or is it presented better than that? I can see what they were going for from reading the spoilers, since Superman did a similar thing and perhaps Wonder Woman comes back into the fold at the end of BvS because she's tired of good men sacrificing themselves, or something like that..

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


The movie does a really bad job at giving another reason if there is one.



The movie literally ends with Diana looking fondly upon the photograph and sending Bruce an email saying "thanks for bringing him back to me." That and her big love conquers all speech makes it seem like she was just really sad about Steve for like 100 years.

Ghosthotel fucked around with this message at 23:39 on May 25, 2017

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Jimbot posted:

I do find it kind of ironic that they decide to lighten the tone of these things during some of the darkest chapters in modern history. But people love their wars and conflict, so showing them in any kind of challenging of negative way is a big no-no. Would it be reductive to say Wonder Woman walks away from mankind because her boyfriend died? Or is it presented better than that? I can see what they were going for from reading the spoilers, since Superman did a similar thing and perhaps Wonder Woman comes back into the fold at the end of BvS because she's tired of good men sacrificing themselves, or something like that..

I think the message they were going for is:

- Ares started WWI, but bad people exist.
- Diana had no exposure to pure evil before she left the islands.
- She thought Chris Pine was the greatest and representative of all humanity.
- Chris Pine dies because of the badness of evil people (and maybe Ares)
- Her boyfriend died and she has seen evil, so now she is disillusioned with the world and decides not to fight.

It pretty much is "because her boyfriend died." But I think they were trying to use him as a metaphor for "goodness" being killed in WWI.

Honestly, it seemed like they were just trying to find a way to make sure it jived with the end of BvS and wrap everything up so they can time-skip back to the present.

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

Guy A. Person posted:

Can't remember but, is it said directly in BvS (or I guess here) that WW "walked away from humanity" immediately after WW1? Maybe she stuck around to try to help rebuild then when it was obvious that even without Ares the world still birthed fascism and even more war so she left around/before WW2*?

* christ this is potentially confusing haha

Maybe at the end she got around to asking someone how the whole war started, and then said gently caress this once she learned WWI's insane bureaucratic boogie to war.

Please tell me that the movie at least touches on some of the insane Trench Warfare innovations, like spy trees.

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


It doesn't.

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

Sounds like they should have probably had the big bad die but instead of the war ending, people just fought on anyway. That would have let them have their boyfriend dead I'm sad and "gently caress mankind, my man died for this?" stuff too. From what you guys said it sounds pretty problematic, especially since this is, you know, the first huge female lead superhero film and Wonder Woman is a feminist icon yet it sounds like they made it all about Steve Trevor. All that said, I honestly don't know much about Wonder Woman, I don't know how she'd react except from the Justice League cartoon and in that when she thought Superman died she was straight-up about to murder the culprit until Flash stopped her. So maybe it's appropriate to her characterization in the film. It's why I liked Batman V Superman a lot because of the gravity of it all and how these conflicts aren't sanitized to the point where nothing is lost or nothing is gained. Wasn't afraid to make the losses tragic but the gains good and meaningful.

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

Since it sold out in a hour, looks like Draft House is doing the Women-only showing of Wonder Woman in Downtown Brooklyn. Proceeds are being donated to Planned Parenthood, which is really nice.

This was posted 9 hours ago so it's probably sold out but this topic isn't getting much attention and the last string of conversation was ending spoilers, so I figured I'd try to get things going with this bit of really cool news.

teagone
Jun 10, 2003

That was pretty intense, huh?

Can't help but laugh at guys who are legit upset about the women-only WW screenings. Idiots. Someone also compared it to the Holocaust unironically on twitter. Cross-posting that tweet from BSS movie thread.

zoux posted:

https://twitter.com/Starius/status/868000722364878848

It's actually two screenings so it's twice as bad as the Holocaust.
:lol:

teagone fucked around with this message at 00:13 on May 27, 2017

Ghosthotel
Dec 27, 2008


Imagine interacting with that guy in real life.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Ghosthotel posted:

Imagine interacting with that guy in real life.

You know that nobody actually does.

Neo Rasa
Mar 8, 2007
Everyone should play DUKE games.

:dukedog:
LMAO I clicked on that link and that it turned out I already had that person blocked.

Martman
Nov 20, 2006

Ghosthotel posted:

Imagine interacting with that guy in real life.
Oh yeah? Well imagine interacting with Hitler!!

Checkmate.

Bacon Terrorist
May 7, 2010

to ride eternal, shiny and chrome

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2022
The WW1 stuff makes the Blackadder WW1 series look grim in comparison, obviously things have to be toned down for the kids because that's the way superhero movies work but still disappointing. Also possibly tied into the whole tank promo art gaffe? As far as I'm aware the only tanks in WW1 were tractors with ad hoc armour plating.

evilmiera
Dec 14, 2009

Status: Ravenously Rambunctious

Bacon Terrorist posted:

The WW1 stuff makes the Blackadder WW1 series look grim in comparison, obviously things have to be toned down for the kids because that's the way superhero movies work but still disappointing. Also possibly tied into the whole tank promo art gaffe? As far as I'm aware the only tanks in WW1 were tractors with ad hoc armour plating.

The Blackadder finale was plenty grim, despite only featuring a few explosions and a field of flowers. Very appropriate. Not seeing the movie for the war though . I am going to avoid it for just being mediocre.

Tenzarin
Jul 24, 2007
.
Taco Defender
I love blackadder. Glad to know to skip this now.

Dark_Tzitzimine
Oct 9, 2012

by R. Guyovich
Making of Featurette

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikMGXsbZn9Q

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Lurdiak
Feb 26, 2006

I believe in a universe that doesn't care, and people that do.


It's beginning to sound more and more like this whole "this is the good DC movie" thing is just a lie perpetuated by Wonder Woman fans.

  • Locked thread