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Gharbad the Weak posted:But there is an idea that the gross poo poo will be stripped out, right? you wouldn't know it from listening to his actual plays but yes
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May 6, 2020 22:28
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One day, one day, there's supposed to be some kind of SRD.
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May 6, 2020 22:45
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I hope he tones down the magic somewhat. Martial characters get completely left in the dust in SOTDL and when we played 2 campaigns with my group, everyone eventually branched into magic careers because not doing so makes your character essentially worthless outside of combat.
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May 6, 2020 23:09
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I'm a sucker for obscene grimdarkness so I'm curious how easy it will be to refit SOTDL material to Mad Wizard. Apparently the MW mechanics are the ones Rob is most proud of, so it'd be a shame to leave behind all the stuff I like in SOTDL.
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May 7, 2020 00:52
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Greatly looking forward to this. I love a lot of the lethality and class branching but all the constant gross poo poo ruined any chance I had of ever successfully pitching the game to any of my friends I enjoy playing with.
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May 7, 2020 18:53
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Yeah, the people I know look at the corruption system a bit side-eyed, then I have to figure out how to say "there's a lot of stuff that's gross we don't have to use" and that's the final nail.
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May 7, 2020 18:59
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Midgetskydiver posted:I hope he tones down the magic somewhat. Martial characters get completely left in the dust in SOTDL and when we played 2 campaigns with my group, everyone eventually branched into magic careers because not doing so makes your character essentially worthless outside of combat. There's a lot of other stuff that I could fix myself - I think the rapidity of advancement is a well-intentioned bad idea, for example - but magic in particular was pretty egregious.
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May 7, 2020 18:59
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Having never gotten to play it, what's up with magic? Is it standard "wizards just make things happen, martials have to jump through hoops" and "spellcasters have more narrative power", and/or something else?
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May 7, 2020 19:10
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Gharbad the Weak posted:Having never gotten to play it, what's up with magic? Is it standard "wizards just make things happen, martials have to jump through hoops" and "spellcasters have more narrative power", and/or something else? For example, one 1st-level spell in the Order Domain (Consistency) lets you name a number between 1 and 6, and then any time a d6 is rolled in a 5-yard-radius sphere, you can decide to replace it with that number. For a system like SotDL this is shockingly powerful, and there's no saving throws. It's a one-step spell to completely neutralize an enemy - you can name "1" and that's all their Boons and Damage dice for a while. And all your own party's Banes, don't forget that.
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May 7, 2020 19:16
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Wow. That's a spicy move.
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May 7, 2020 19:26
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Gharbad the Weak posted:Wow. That's a spicy move. And your enemy's Banes! But not your enemy's Boons or your own party's Banes, because you get to pick when it applies! I was really in love with SotDL for the first few sessions and had generally good feelings about it at the time, but I think it needs a complete re-do which is why I'm interested in this Mad Wizard thing.
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May 7, 2020 19:58
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Yeeeahh, there's a reason Serf has outright banned the Order Tradition in his games, it was just too broken to fix.
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May 7, 2020 20:02
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We also had to ban a number of Magic schools and character combos. The spellguard class combined with time magic was really stupid - not only can you freeze enemies in a time bubble for CC, you can crank your action economy up and end up talking like 5 actions in a turn. Since magic isn't really tied to being a weakling nerd like in other systems, you could easily create a hulking two handed hammer wielding chronomancer and while it was fun to play, I eventually retired the character voluntarily when I felt like I was cheating all the time.
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May 7, 2020 20:07
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Midgetskydiver posted:We also had to ban a number of Magic schools and character combos. The spellguard class combined with time magic was really stupid - not only can you freeze enemies in a time bubble for CC, you can crank your action economy up and end up talking like 5 actions in a turn. Since magic isn't really tied to being a weakling nerd like in other systems, you could easily create a hulking two handed hammer wielding chronomancer and while it was fun to play, I eventually retired the character voluntarily when I felt like I was cheating all the time. Like, I am fairly sure some folks specifically called out the Order domain as a problem. While I am on a tear, I do want to quickly call out the 'advance every session' thing. Before I start - I understand that this is the easiest thing in the world to change on my own. But I gave it a go, and ... it's bad. You get new stuff to play with every level - that part is good! - but you never get a chance to learn your character's capabilities with advancement this rapid. You might get a new trick or a new bonus or a new power, but it's really easy to lose track of all the stuff you get. Even something as small as figuring out how many Boons any given warrior-type would get in certain circumstances turned into an exercise of spreadsheets and conditional if/then statements. And page flipping ... lots and lots of page-flipping. e: On the upside, at least we found out we were doing the Object Teleport spell wrong. The spell description didn't say anything about unattended objects being immune to getting teleported, so our party's wizard was just basically disarming all enemy casters' implements right off the bat. There's rules about it, but they aren't anywhere in the spell description. dwarf74 fucked around with this message at 20:55 on May 7, 2020 |
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May 7, 2020 20:50
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dwarf74 posted:I am fairly sure there are some playtesters here on the forum who have more or less said that Rob takes an extremely ... uh ... casual approach to game-balance and sometimes completely ignores playtest input. the game's expectation is that you will finish an entire adventure in a single session and then there is significant time off between adventures for characters to go and get training, learn spells, pick up paths etc. but none of that is strictly codified and therefore doesn't happen. also finishing an entire adventure in a session is hard, especially if you're like me and just improvising most of it this reminds me that i made a bunch of bugfixes for sotdl that i should get around to finishing
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May 7, 2020 21:02
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I honestly feel like SOTDL would be better balanced by just removing the ability to make a pure martial character. Even hybrids are insanely far above pure martials in terms of combat competence, but the balance is so loving wacky it basically doesn't matter what the party is doing so long as everyone is some sort of mage. The campaign I played in had a guy who basically just picked up Primal magic and became a nearly unhittable hulking damage demigod, a guy who went all in on healing to the point that HP damage was barely a threat to us, someone who went Chronomancy/Technomancy to have a giant mech that goes really fast and myself as a control type character with psychic/enchantment magic who basically existed to completely shut down without fail any enemy that wasn't immune to compels. Four completely different concepts, all hilariously overpowered in their own way. It's a stupid way to balance things but it sorta worked out?
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May 7, 2020 21:36
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I mean 3 of the 4 base paths are spellcasters and Spellguard exists, so it wouldn't take much maybe just make Power advancement purely level based rather than being tied to specific paths? it would have some knock-on effects but I think those are mostly fine (smooths out spell-Rogue's mid-level options, makes Mystic much better, etc.), and it would make some of the martial paths more appealing for a lot of characters (and the "good" magic paths for martial classes less narrow), since it basically just puts spell/tradition picks on a level with other class features/stat boosts/etc. I'm also having a hard time thinking of anything it would break too badly, since the currently-worthwhile classes that lack power boosts at level 9 (like Soul Thief) can generally be worked around via a second Expert class anyway, and probably just makes things like Savant and Jack-of-All-Trades appealing e: that's absolutely a hack though if I was designing a SotDL 2e though it is something I would seriously consider, since it seems like a really obvious stat to key aspects of ostensibly "non-magical" abilities off (of course it can also be essentially removed/abstracted to level, but I think there are advantages to having a universal stat called "Power," both in terms of being more-or-less unassailable if grognardy fucks want to complain about fighters having abilities and because its a lot easier to write intuitive/readable mechanics around "Power" than an "effective level" formula LGD fucked around with this message at 23:42 on May 7, 2020 |
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May 7, 2020 23:32
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Out of curiosity since I brought it up over in the 5E thread. I think I wasn't really correct about there being a lack of magic items in SotDL, but looking over the book it does seem pretty clear it isn't designed with them necessarily in mind. I'd need to look over an adventure or two, to see if there are any enchanted objects awarded anywhere. Probably the main thing would be that, the magical items aren't as concrete as in D&D? The items with stats and such and various abilities listed are actually the relics, which I may have been getting mixed up with the other options. What about you guys? Do you give out enchanted items often?
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May 8, 2020 08:01
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Oh yeah, multiple per adventure, but I also used fully random generation for it so it usually ends up weird (and occasionally useless) so it rarely impacts the game/power levels much.
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May 8, 2020 08:29
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Midgetskydiver posted:We also had to ban a number of Magic schools and character combos. The spellguard class combined with time magic was really stupid - not only can you freeze enemies in a time bubble for CC, you can crank your action economy up and end up talking like 5 actions in a turn. Since magic isn't really tied to being a weakling nerd like in other systems, you could easily create a hulking two handed hammer wielding chronomancer and while it was fun to play, I eventually retired the character voluntarily when I felt like I was cheating all the time. I've laid out Spellguard / Time magic builds that get upwards of 40 actions per turn, and there have been supplements that added even more slightly different, stacking action economy spells and talents since then. And frankly even when you're not theorycrafting abominations like that, there's just no way for pure martials to keep up with hybrids. Martial characters typically have to wait till their loving Master path to do anything remotely interesting, if not by level 9-10 (e.g. when a campaign is already almost over, if you make it there at all). Meanwhile hybrids can get significant control or utility effects by like level 5 and compensate for slightly lower base damage with buffs and utility. Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 08:58 on May 8, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 08:52
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:40 actions per turn I enjoyed SDL for what it was but I hope the author takes game testing a little more seriously this time around. Any system will have issues but it's pretty obvious SDL wasn't playtested at all, or the author just doesn't care about any semblance of character parity. There's a healthy balance between "obsess about parity so much that it overtakes the system" and "just don't care about parity at all". I think Warhammer 4e does a good job of this.
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May 8, 2020 15:48
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Obviously there's the option for a GM to just go, "No, you can't do that." but it's definitely better to not have that situation in the first place.
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May 9, 2020 11:10
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Arthil posted:Obviously there's the option for a GM to just go, "No, you can't do that." but it's definitely better to not have that situation in the first place. Crucially, the problem with this approach is it's a very soft limit. You can't be good at charop in a system where the ceiling is "your GM gets cold feet" instead of something quantifiable. I like SotDL well enough, and I would never play the dedicated action economy monster in a real game, but the experience of trying to draw the line is, itself, anti-fun. It's like, can I play a core book only Time magic hybrid? Can I make him a Clockwork? Is it okay if I splash Arcane magic to get extra casts of my action economy buffs per day? And so on.
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May 10, 2020 00:44
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also, for the record, the action economy monster wouldn't be fun at all; the build is tight enough that pretty much every build decision is locked in by necessity, and you'd be going through the same script every fight with very little variation. my serious characters in SotDL are usually more defender / controller types who are good at hitting things but also have a lot of CC spells, which actually results in interesting turn-to-turn decisions in combat
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May 10, 2020 00:53
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I'm thinking about writing up a little reskin of SotDL along the lines of those older mixed live-action/animated movies, like Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Ralph Bakshi's Cool World. Everything to do with corruption/demons turns into cartoons, and corruption here means moving closer to becoming a cartoon character. Marks of darkness are just absolutely perfect for this, I think. Consider: Your eyes pop out of their sockets when you are surprised Your legs wobble when you are nervous Music follows you around, changing according to your mood and intentions I personally love the aesthetic of those films, but would anyone else be interested in seeing this take?
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Jul 3, 2020 18:12
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That's a super cool and creative idea for a twist on corruption and I love it
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Jul 3, 2020 19:54
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I tend to run SotDL as slapstick horror-comedy since I'm not really into the grimdark aesthetic on its own merits. Last campaign I ran my players fought a giant rolling ball of skeleton cooks that flew in the direction you hit them, where proper management of terrain let you yeet them into a giant oven. e: which is to say yes, absolutely do it Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Jul 4, 2020 |
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Jul 3, 2020 20:23
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Strange Charm posted:I'm thinking about writing up a little reskin of SotDL along the lines of those older mixed live-action/animated movies, like Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Ralph Bakshi's Cool World. Everything to do with corruption/demons turns into cartoons, and corruption here means moving closer to becoming a cartoon character. Marks of darkness are just absolutely perfect for this, I think. Consider:
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Jul 3, 2020 21:49
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As I said once earlier I put SotDL rules into Dark Sun with some minor additions, which was fantastic. Nobody plays a pure martial character in Dark Sun, everyone is some psychic weirdo or elemental worshipping nutcase or a bugman or whatever so it works out great. The pure martial archetype doesn't really exist in that setting so nobody feels like they are missing out on anything.
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Jul 9, 2020 20:15
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kind of old news at this point, but there was a news post last week outlining some details of Weird Wizard's character creation that do make it look like what it's being advertised as - a more serious adjustment than merely toning down the making GBS threads dicknipple demons, but still recognizably the same system the key mechanical points- *4 attribute system remains in place *attribute distribution no longer governed by ancestry, instead you select (or roll) among 4 arrays (example given is 12/11/10/9) *there is now a "damage dice" stat (starting at d6) that apparently does what it says on the tin and is what you use for damaging targets in combat *Ancestry still exists and appears to do many of the same non-primary-attribute things it did before (starting HP, size, a couple traits) *you then select a "Background", which gives you starting skills (not professions, though they lack any numeric component at this juncture) and equipment *also an "Identity" which just sounds like the usual assortment of random tables imo these mostly seem like good changes, though as always the devil is in the details - if you're going to have attributes decoupling them from ancestry is very obviously an excellent move, I can see a variety of interesting ways for things to interact with the damage dice stat, moving to skills doesn't necessarily seem bad if they function similarly
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Aug 24, 2020 21:35
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Only takes a little digging to see that "skills" still involves Professions as you know them from SotDL. Those are now Lore Skills (maybe change them to knowledge skills tbh?). There's also skills for using certain types of weapons, armor and languages.
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Aug 25, 2020 06:11
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I tend to run SotDL as slapstick horror-comedy since I'm not really into the grimdark aesthetic on its own merits. Last campaign I ran my players fought a giant rolling ball of skeleton cooks that flew in the direction you hit them, where proper management of terrain let you yeet them into a giant oven. Hell yes. My games all quickly devolve into Sam Raimi / Peter Jackson splatter comedy and not the edgelord embarrassment it tries to be.
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Aug 25, 2020 12:52
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Shadow of the Demon Lord has a Chinese translation. Looks to be a very recent release.
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Jul 22, 2021 17:33
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Is there a nordic / viking kitbash for SOTDL that isn't A Glorious Death? I want to do a norse sagas game in the ruleset, but AGD is just offensively bad.
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Jul 27, 2021 16:28
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Tias posted:Is there a nordic / viking kitbash for SOTDL that isn't A Glorious Death? I want to do a norse sagas game in the ruleset, but AGD is just offensively bad. Nothing official I don't think, but I remember a pretty decent homebrew/campaign setting called Lifdrasil - An Edda of Ashes floating around back in the G+ days. Probably worth a look if you can find it.
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Jul 27, 2021 22:57
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been running a campaign of this for a few sessions. i gotta say, i think this is my favorite fantasy RPG system by far. so simple and clean!
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Aug 6, 2021 00:56
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hi hello greetings i am new to shadow of the demon lord and am just starting to learn the system as a player. i am looking for some build advice. i'm gonna try to make vegeta as a character and if (when) they die im gonna try to make kenshiro the main dude from fist of the north star. there are a lot (a lot) of resources to dig through, so if anyone has recommendations for particular things to pick up or books to look at i would greatly appreciate it because i dont even know where to start
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Nov 19, 2021 17:46
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what is a 'vegeta'?
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Nov 19, 2021 20:19
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The best punching build for that is probably Monk/Mystic/Martial Artist. Monk is in Bred For Battle, Mystic and Martial Artist are in Demon Lord's Companion.
Piell fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Nov 19, 2021 |
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Nov 19, 2021 20:30
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Conspiratiorist posted:what is a 'vegeta'? punch man with energy blasts and ki powers, a reskin of a "goku," i honestly figured vegeta was self explanatory. Piell posted:The best punching build for that is probably Monk/Mystic/Martial Artist. Monk is in Bred For Battle, Mystic and Martial Artist are in Demon Lord's Companion. thanks i appreciate it!
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Nov 19, 2021 21:02
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