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What is the best flav... you all know what this question is:
This poll is closed.
Labour 907 49.92%
Theresa May Team (Conservative) 48 2.64%
Liberal Democrats 31 1.71%
UKIP 13 0.72%
Plaid Cymru 25 1.38%
Green 22 1.21%
Scottish Socialist Party 12 0.66%
Scottish Conservative Party 1 0.06%
Scottish National Party 59 3.25%
Some Kind of Irish Unionist 4 0.22%
Alliance / Irish Nonsectarian 3 0.17%
Some Kind of Irish Nationalist 36 1.98%
Misc. Far Left Trots 35 1.93%
Misc. Far Right Fash 8 0.44%
Monster Raving Loony 49 2.70%
Space Navies Party 39 2.15%
Independent / Single Issue 2 0.11%
Can't Vote 188 10.35%
Won't Vote 8 0.44%
Spoiled Ballot 15 0.83%
Pissflaps 312 17.17%
Total: 1817 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Locked thread
Stabbatical
Sep 15, 2011


That's really interesting. The long and short of it is that we just don't know anymore because it's all gone weird and all of this run-up with the polling and predictions is a bit of a dog and pony show, just like in the US election then?

That's actually pretty exciting and terrifying.

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hakimashou
Jul 15, 2002
Upset Trowel
I'm glad this thread has the name it does, there's no other way it could be.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Middlesbrough South is even more awkward because we've got a new MP standing, the UKIP vote is enough to completely destabilize the constituency, and the Labour vote has been dropping steadily and would be on course to fall below the tories this election.

I have no loving idea how it's going to go here.

ISeeCuckedPeople
Feb 7, 2017

by Smythe

TheRat posted:

This sounds very american
(and very illegal)

My positions are calculated with the recognition that as an American big business rules supreme and will respond to any threat with anything and everything including literal assassination.

That's why when you develop policy you have to analyze response and counter strategy from every single possible attacking point and come up with policy that is bullet proof in that regard.

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

OwlFancier posted:

Not ideally no, but I'll take sappy hippies over people who are liable to gently caress us over out of malice.

Alas most human activity is emotional, not cognitive, so any political party advocating for saving the planet is going to attract a lot of people who want to do that by singing at it and holding hands.

What you'd want is the technocratic party, which sadly would also attract a bunch of silicon valley techbros, because you can even approach science in a cargo cult fashion.

I mean I'm a bloody commie mostly out of a mix of spite and idealism so I don't feel qualified to complain about the greens.

The issue is the environment is a fundamentally scientific issue. The sterling example being nuclear power and research thereof; the greens are staunchly opposed to it, because it sounds a bit labcoaty.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Historically over here that's why you bring capital to heel as sharply as possible.

spectralent posted:

The issue is the environment is a fundamentally scientific issue. The sterling example being nuclear power and research thereof; the greens are staunchly opposed to it, because it sounds a bit labcoaty.

I concur, but still, practically as long as you're having public participation in politics your chocies are between nuclear bad because scary, nuclear good because cool, environment bad because money, environment good because trees.

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo
I took that quiz and got 33.3% Labour, 33.3% Green, and 33.3% Lib Dem. Not quite what I was expecting (would have assumed more Labour, less Lib Dem), but in some cases where things were really similar I kind of half-assed my answers and picked whichever. I'm glad I was able to avoid the Tories and UKIP at least.

Also, been talking to a UK friend about politics lately; turns out I know more about politics there than he does (he wasn't aware that the Tories were the Conservatives and thought they were two separate parties). Have been working on convincing him that Corbyn's not as bad as the media paints him and that he should vote Labour or at least definitely not Tory out of those two and the Lib Dems, which are the three he's been considering because, well, he doesn't/didn't know much about politics.

Intrinsic Field Marshal
Sep 6, 2014

by SA Support Robot
>not voting Pissflaps

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

The airlines would all convene together to do massive price hikes and blame the party who removed the subsidies and they would lose the next election based off that attack.

I think most people wouldn't care, especially if this came out alongside better rail.

ISeeCuckedPeople
Feb 7, 2017

by Smythe

forkboy84 posted:

Think you're over-estimating how important flying is in peoples lives. Reminder that Britain is actually not a big island.

I guess so. In the US everyone I know flies. And as a immigrant flying is a important part of my life. I do it at least 4 times a year. I'd do it more if it cost as much as it did in Europe. Probably once a month.

spectralent posted:

I think most people wouldn't care, especially if this came out alongside better rail.

Maybe things are different in England. In the US they would call the president a Gay Marxist Unamerican Thug and hang effigies of him in front of the white house while the law got sued to the supreme court. Some angry rednecks would probably shoot up an airport. Or bomb it.

Stabbatical
Sep 15, 2011

Roland Jones posted:

Also, been talking to a UK friend about politics lately; turns out I know more about politics there than he does (he wasn't aware that the Tories were the Conservatives and thought they were two separate parties). Have been working on convincing him that Corbyn's not as bad as the media paints him and that he should vote Labour or at least definitely not Tory out of those two and the Lib Dems, which are the three he's been considering because, well, he doesn't/didn't know much about politics.

:psyduck:

BillBear
Mar 13, 2013

Ask me about running my country straight into the ground every time I play EU4 multiplayer.
Honestly the hung parliament option just flat out seems like the best option.

May will get destroyed by her own party and replaced with Boris Johnson or some insane hard right nutjob within the party, who completely fucks everything up.

Brexit completely blows up in the Tories face and they alone have to deal with the mess they have made.

Tories won't be able to do gently caress all and all Labour have to do is exist to get a huge win in 2022. Oh and we'll likely keep Corbs as opposition leader.

Angepain
Jul 13, 2012

what keeps happening to my clothes

OwlFancier posted:

Middlesbrough South is even more awkward because we've got a new MP standing, the UKIP vote is enough to completely destabilize the constituency, and the Labour vote has been dropping steadily and would be on course to fall below the tories this election.

I have no loving idea how it's going to go here.

Also you appear to have been put in the same constituency as part of Ohio which is going to shake things up a lot. I knew gerrymandering was bad over there but I didn't know they could just up and give half a city back to the British.

Namtab
Feb 22, 2010

Roland Jones posted:

(he wasn't aware that the Tories were the Conservatives and thought they were two separate parties).

Your mate doesn't seem too bright imo

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

Namtab posted:

Your mate doesn't seem too bright imo

Pretty scary how many people I have to explain fundamental aspects of the UK democratic process to on a regular basis, tbh, so this doesn't surprise me.

Today I met a man who hadn't heard of the Labour Party and didn't know the groups of politicians were called "parties". This man had registered to vote.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

spectralent posted:

Pretty scary how many people I have to explain fundamental aspects of the UK democratic process to on a regular basis, tbh, so this doesn't surprise me.

Today I met a man who hadn't heard of the Labour Party and didn't know the groups of politicians were called "parties". This man had registered to vote.



I'm doing this in real life.

TheRat
Aug 30, 2006

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo
He's fairly young, was a student until recently, and isn't dumb, just... Not at all engaged previously. I'm trying to help there, at least.

Regarde Aduck
Oct 19, 2012

Grimey Drawer

Paperhouse posted:

Yeah but... do they want the Tories to win

I mean I guess everyone know they will so

The SNP benefit from the Tories so yes.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

spectralent posted:

Today I met a man who hadn't heard of the Labour Party and didn't know the groups of politicians were called "parties". This man had registered to vote.
It might actually be a better thing under the current system if people just voted for the best constituency representative instead of going by party name. Although I'm not too sure how someone who hasn't heard of major national parties would glean that information.

ISeeCuckedPeople
Feb 7, 2017

by Smythe
So based on the Yougov projections the Tories will not take a majority correct?

In that case is it hung? Or what percentage do you need to hold to hold power?

Can parties make coalitions? Would the rest of the left be willing to form a coalition with Labour or is their only hope come from winning a majority outright?

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops
I think the thing I have to explain most frequently is that you can't vote for party leaders, and that council seats and parliamentary seats are different. This is very specifically people who think they're actually voting for Teresa May/Caroline Lucas/Jeremy Corbyn, not people who don't want to endorse their party. I had one woman say something like "If the Tory here is so bad why doesn't May just sack him?".

Guavanaut posted:

It might actually be a better thing under the current system if people just voted for the best constituency representative instead of going by party name. Although I'm not too sure how someone who hasn't heard of major national parties would glean that information.

My mind truly boggled since he had heard of the conservatives (from members of his family in the medical profession :getin:). I managed to get a "won't vote tory" out of him but he seemed kind of confused by the entire political process.

The best bit was "I thought I just ticked a box". Yes, for a political party you nimrod!

spectralent fucked around with this message at 01:53 on Jun 1, 2017

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

So based on the Yougov projections the Tories will not take a majority correct?

In that case is it hung? Or what percentage do you need to hold to hold power?

Can parties make coalitions? Would the rest of the left be willing to form a coalition with Labour or is their only hope come from winning a majority outright?

Maybe, yes, 50, yes, probably willing.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

So based on the Yougov projections the Tories will not take a majority correct?

In that case is it hung? Or what percentage do you need to hold to hold power?

Can parties make coalitions? Would the rest of the left be willing to form a coalition with Labour or is their only hope come from winning a majority outright?

Yes parties can make coalitions, we had one until 2015.

There isn't really much of a left other than Labour but if the conservatives cannot secure a majority they will be in deep poo poo. Minority governments are a thing but we haven't had one for a long time and they tend not to work out well.

The comedy option is that remainaholic Tim Farron goes into coalition with the tories and does a brexit. I think the lib dem base might actually catch fire.

The government is formed by parliament holding a vote to establish one, it can do this without a majority as long as everyone consents to it. Otherwise we reroll the election until a government happens.

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

OwlFancier posted:

The comedy option is that remainaholic Tim Farron goes into coalition with the tories and does a brexit. I think the lib dem base might actually catch fire.

The Lib Dems would be finished if he did this. It's all they have left.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

spectralent posted:

The Lib Dems would be finished if he did this. It's all they have left.

I still think the lib dems actually are powered by phylacteries and cannot die a true death but it would be hilarious.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
The Lib Dems are finished now

OwlFancier posted:

Green party, one would assume? They're basically luddites.

In the actual meaning of the word, rather than the pejorative one!

ISeeCuckedPeople
Feb 7, 2017

by Smythe

OwlFancier posted:

Yes parties can make coalitions, we had one until 2015.

There isn't really much of a left other than Labour but if the conservatives cannot secure a majority they will be in deep poo poo. Minority governments are a thing but we haven't had one for a long time and they tend not to work out well.

The comedy option is that remainaholic Tim Farron goes into coalition with the tories and does a brexit. I think the lib dem base might actually catch fire.

What about the SNP? Plaid Cymru? Green Party? I though they were considered left?

And the Lib-Dems? More likely to stand with the Tories than Labour?

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

MrL_JaKiri posted:

In the actual meaning of the word, rather than the pejorative one!

I know it's great! I was inordinately pleased by that.

spectralent
Oct 1, 2014

Me and the boys poppin' down to the shops

MrL_JaKiri posted:

In the actual meaning of the word, rather than the pejorative one!

That picture of the girl who shrugs and says "why not both?" in spanish is here.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

What about the SNP? Plaid Cymru? Green Party? I though they were considered left?

SNP aren't really left, the others are but have low single digits MPs between them.

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

And the Lib-Dems? More likely to stand with the Tories than Labour?

This was the case less than two years ago.

I don't want to be rude but you have a lot of holes in your knowledge.

Vitamin P
Nov 19, 2013

Truth is game rigging is more difficult than it looks pls stay ded

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

So based on the Yougov projections the Tories will not take a majority correct?

Yeah but it's probably nonsense.

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

In that case is it hung? Or what percentage do you need to hold to hold power?

You need 326 of the 650 MPs to be with you. If no single party has that many it's a hung parliament, meaning either another election is held or two or more parties form a coalition, combining their MPs to have 326 or higher. There's not really a lot of rules for how a coalition government works.

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

Can parties make coalitions? Would the rest of the left be willing to form a coalition with Labour or is their only hope come from winning a majority outright?

Yes in theory.

In some ways the best possible outcome would be for the Lib Dems to prop up another party in exchange for a referendum on the final terms of brexit, as that's the only way it's even remotely feasible we get one, even if that's the most wishful of wishful thinking.

MrFlibble
Nov 28, 2007

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Fallen Rib

spectralent posted:

The Lib Dems would be finished if he did this. It's all they have left.

Anyone stupid enough to still vote for the lib dems (in any area that isn't a conservative / lib dem seat solely to keep a conservative out) is still going to vote lib dem if the lib dems take a hot steaming poo poo directly into their mouths every day until the next election.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

What about the SNP? Plaid Cymru? Green Party? I though they were considered left?

And the Lib-Dems? More likely to stand with the Tories than Labour?

SNP have an image of being "progressive" but they are not particularly left, PC and the greens account for, what, three MPs? The lib dems were in government with the tories from 2010 to 2015...

I thought you said you followed UK politics.

E: PC have 3 seats, so four between the two parties.

hakimashou
Jul 15, 2002
Upset Trowel
What actually does happen if there's no majority or coalition to be made after the election, if they can't pass a budget or whatever?

Namtab
Feb 22, 2010

spectralent posted:

The Lib Dems would be finished if he did this. It's all they have left.

I remember tintower posting something along the lines of "the membership won't let him do a coalition if it means brexit" as tho the lib dems have principles beyond getting in power

kustomkarkommando
Oct 22, 2012

ISeeCuckedPeople posted:

So based on the Yougov projections the Tories will not take a majority correct?

In that case is it hung? Or what percentage do you need to hold to hold power?

Can parties make coalitions? Would the rest of the left be willing to form a coalition with Labour or is their only hope come from winning a majority outright?

Parties can make coalitions but its more likely you'd have piecemeal agreements to secure confidence support, that is minor parties agreeing to vote with the government on confidence motions and budgets to facilitate a minority government but voting as they desire on other bills

If no one can hammer out a working majority for a budget vote you can't get a minority government. Labour would need to gain 22 seats as it stands if they wrangle all labour sympathetic parties to back them, and that's assuming no minority party losses

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

hakimashou posted:

What actually does happen if there's no majority or coalition to be made after the election, if they can't pass a budget or whatever?

Then you have no government and the election happens again until you do.

That is where "confidence and supply" comes from. Confidence establishes the government, supply means you vote for the budget.

kustomkarkommando
Oct 22, 2012

The Tories could survive as a minority by wrangling support if they fall roughly 14 seats shy

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ISeeCuckedPeople
Feb 7, 2017

by Smythe

OwlFancier posted:

SNP have an image of being "progressive" but they are not particularly left, PC and the greens account for, what, three MPs? The lib dems were in government with the tories from 2010 to 2015...

I thought you said you followed UK politics.

E: PC have 3 seats, so four between the two parties.

I do somewhat.

How is being Progressive not being leftist? In the us the only leftists we have are progressives.

And I assume that the SNP are to the left of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown who built the modern Labour party right?

So how would one even claim Labour itself is leftist by these standards?

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