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Condiv posted:assuming the next dem is macron-like (and why wouldn't I? democrat supreme obama endorsed macron) and wants to dismantle every social program he/she can the second they hit office, should i bother voting for this lesser evil? seems to me like lesser-evilism is just being a loving idiot and supporting evil So you don't like democracy?
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Jul 4, 2017 14:34
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| # ¿ May 22, 2024 18:08 |
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Condiv posted:They hardly fought for it cause they figured they'd get re-elected and then the republicans would just have to give them the SC seat. Just sad as hell. Canditades moving towards the center to maximize votes, incrementalism and an opposition trying to do things you don't want is what democracy looks like.
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Jul 4, 2017 15:40
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forkboy84 posted:What garbage. Just because it is doesn't mean it has to be. Yes it does. First I should have specified constitutional democracy. Your counterparts on the right just got their dream and elected a guy who wants to ban immigrants, build a wall and repeal obamacare. He's trying to do all three but is so far failing because of the constitutional checks in the system which are specifically designed to constrain change and we should all be counting our blessings that they're there. And they have to be for a real life system to function. Second the will of 300 million people doesn't change rapidly. Condiv posted:
When you think huge swaths of your fellow citizens are evil that's not really democratic. MikeCrotch posted:If moving to the centre and incrementalism are how you win votes, why is Donald Trump president? Trump is a threat to democracy and also isn't succeeding at the things voters want him to be doing (except the mental adolescents who voted entirely to stick it to the elites'). Hence why I'm against naive populism which the left seems to be looking at and saying "I want that too".
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Jul 4, 2017 16:18
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no that's what centrist ideology looks like and it's idiotic as hell
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Condiv posted:but the dems turn left faster if there are less centrists to fight against us tooth and nail. and waiting for centrists to wake the gently caress up isn't really an option anymore. besides, centrists have already shown they are willing to withhold support from candidates that aren't centrist approved enough. that's why they wasted millions on ossoff who showed a worse turnout than a guy who didn't actually exist, and let a bunch of other more promising races go completely unfunded and unsupported. if they can afford to lose races in order to keep us at bay, then they can afford to lose a few more races. That's politics and when you're on the extreme everyone fights you. That should be obvious.
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Jul 5, 2017 00:31
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Condiv posted:hmm, i don't think i'm extreme at all. just leftist. dunno why centrists think that's extreme, other than leftists don't like kings and nobles. More simply the confusion you have is solved by most people like you by returning to reality (vote d) or detaching completely from reality and becoming a Marxist.
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Jul 5, 2017 02:47
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So the dems have changed significantly since the last time you voted for them? It's like my trump guy at work who used to vote d but is convinced that Hilary is something new and special (she's not) and she's the reason he can't vote d anymore rather than the reality which is that he discovered facebook and followed click-bait off the ideological deep end.
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Jul 5, 2017 17:08
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Condiv posted:they've changed, but i've also become aware that the dems are only paying lipservice to the left at best and really don't want to move leftwards. So you're filled with dumb expectations because single payer was never close. You're like the guy who'se getting fed up with republicans and is vowing to vote libertarian next time because Trump didn't immediately and completely repeal Obamacare and build a wall (even though only an idiot expected those things to actually happen).
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Jul 5, 2017 20:01
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Condiv posted:i think at the point where we're literally voting for murderer politicians we can cut the lesser evil crap and choose not to indulge in that farce. The phrase murder is meaningless here - every choice that's ever existed in politics has had life and death consequences.
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Jul 6, 2017 00:56
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Condiv posted:it's doubtful i'm the reason why trump is president. also, i'm not helping republicans by not voting for democrats. the democrats don't own my vote, and if they want it they can run non-poo poo tier candidates. It depends on what we're talking about. Your angry misguided detachment from reality (democrats are murderers) is the exact thing that made it possible for the rural working class to delude themselves into championing a Manhattan real estate salesman because he tickled their ideological nerve centers the right way.
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Jul 6, 2017 01:51
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