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John Henry Miller posted:Hillary continues to attack Bernie Sanders in her book. The democrat party is no place for workers. Trump is the future. hmm yes the guy who's most memorable line is "you're fired!!" is the man to protect workers' rights 
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Sep 11, 2017 11:15
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botany posted:but we already had a USpol thread Odd, it seems kids can be tried as adults in new hampshire, and they've done so in other attempted murder cases. Wonder why they're trying to rehabilitate these particular murderous kids?
Condiv fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Sep 11, 2017 |
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Sep 11, 2017 17:31
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actually, you'll find it was lenders who triggered the crash cause they're loving idiots who were more concerned with short term profit than not driving the economy into the ground
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Sep 11, 2017 18:34
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Paracaidas posted:Clearly, economic anxiety is considered as a mitigating factor in the legal system as well. gently caress off with this
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Sep 11, 2017 18:43
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Trabisnikof posted:Economic hardship isn't the same thing as economic anxiety, turns out a good chunk of the people that report themselves most anxious about the economy are people who have above average wealth for their area and fear losing it and being like those around them. forgive me if i can't tell the difference anymore after dems spent 2016 pretending raising the minimum wage, single payer healthcare, and free college were appeals to racism
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Sep 11, 2017 18:53
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Trabisnikof posted:makes sense you wouldn't understand what economic hardship is yeah, making ~$20k a year sure has spoiled me
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Sep 11, 2017 18:58
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Paracaidas posted:
quote:“Not everything is about an economic theory, right?” Clinton said, kicking off a long, interactive riff with the crowd at a union hall this afternoon. add on all the racist, sexist bernie bro bullshit too. dunno why you're pretending that stuff didn't happen, cause it did
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Sep 11, 2017 19:11
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Rappaport posted:There is already a thread devoted entirely to Dem issues, friends. it wouldn't leak over if people weren't trying to punch left while we were discussing a multiracial kid getting lynched Condiv fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Sep 11, 2017 |
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Sep 11, 2017 19:16
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Paracaidas posted:Your initial reaction makes far more sense now. For the record: I was not punching left. i don't agree with all of this, but i don't want to continue this derail any further thanks for not punching left, though i'd prefer if you just call these shithead kids what they are, racist murderers
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Sep 11, 2017 20:31
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Jaxyon posted:That's sorta accurate...more accurate would be that the financial industry caused it and house flippers were a symptom. yeah, i mean you can claim house flippers were the majority of bad loans, but the financial industry knew they were making bad loans and didn't care cause it got them bonuses
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Sep 11, 2017 20:44
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Majorian posted:The people you're describing here are a marginal percentage of left-Dems, Sanders supporters, DSA members, etc, though. The vast majority of these groups (and certainly their leaders) fully acknowledge that issues of racial inequality need to be addressed with extra emphasis, and that economic justice will lead to an end to racism. i think you mean will not maj
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Sep 11, 2017 20:48
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Even the most financially-illiterate person should probably have known that something was up when they were denied by every bank for any traditional mortgage, but offered a $425,000 mortgage with 3% down on a $30,000 a year salary. or maybe they thought they caught a lucky break? don't blame the conned for being the prey of con-artists
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Sep 11, 2017 21:05
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Yes, that's why people were willingly doing it. actually, the people making $30k a year were. if you were at that income level, and some banker dangled the impossible dream of homeownership in front of you, it'd be hard to avoid not jumping at that "opportunity"
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Sep 11, 2017 21:10
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Push El Burrito posted:A tree falling over is nature. if the hurricane is shot enough do you think it could be arrested?
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Sep 11, 2017 21:42
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skeleton warrior posted:oh, hey, another thread full of Majoran and Condiv telling us why Bernie Was Right And Would Have Won actually i haven't mentioned bernie at all till this post at least
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Sep 11, 2017 22:29
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skeleton warrior posted:Good point, all of your posts have been "Hillary was wrong and you should have voted for someone else but not Donald Trump or Gary Johnson or Jill Stein but I don't know who that other person would be I guess you should figure it out yourself" sorry, none of that either you're actually the one bringing that poo poo in here congratulations?
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Sep 11, 2017 22:33
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Taerkar posted:Locking Bernie up wouldn't solve anything. It's mostly those using him as a club to attack That Witch Hillary, Destroyer of Leftist Hope. she's done enough to attack herself recently imo
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Sep 11, 2017 22:37
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when will paul ryan tweet his favorite hentai to the world?
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Sep 12, 2017 13:20
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so hillary clinton published a book discussing what happened in 2016 here's a short review of it quote:How do you lose the presidency to a man like Donald Trump? He was the most unpopular presidential candidate of all time, compounding blunder with blunder and heaping gaffe upon gaffe. Keeping him from the Oval Office should have been the single-minded mission of the Democratic party. And it should have been easy for them.
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Sep 13, 2017 08:15
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:When I was a lot younger my sister and I were on our way to school in a half hour commute or so, and it was the first time I had listened to any Kanye when that opening drum line from black skinhead came out. When I made the lovely remark of "Why can't he make his point without yelling" she gave me the most direct and razor sharp answer I had ever heard on this subject that cut through a lot of my unnoticed white privilege: "Because no one was listening when he said it quietly." the thing that gets me the most about blm is that they are doing exactly what we've said good protests should do for a long time. civil disobedience, no violence, etc. but people hate blm with a passion for protesting the way we say is the proper way to protest. hell, even when it's not mass protest, just one football player kneeling during the pledge they get unbelievably angry it just goes to show that people really really don't care about civil rights and don't want to have to think about it
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Sep 13, 2017 08:55
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Trabisnikof posted:She's not wrong that protecting ACA should be the current legislative priority on healthcare and she's not wrong that single payer shouldn't be a litmus test. it should actually dems need to start actually pushing left and get us away from fascism, instead of cowering cause the repubs might call them socialist (which they do anyway)
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Sep 13, 2017 09:58
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other things that should be litmus tests: supporting ending civil forfeiture legalizing marijuana holding cops accountable for murdering innocent people pushing hard on improving civil rights and fighting back on voter suppression and gerrymandering Condiv fucked around with this message at 10:02 on Sep 13, 2017 |
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Sep 13, 2017 10:00
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Star Man posted:I think I've heard that BLM is decentralized to prevent any named leaders from being targeted and hurt or kiloed. yeah i've heard it too, and it makes sense considering what police did to people like fred hampton
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Sep 13, 2017 11:09
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OtherworldlyInvader posted:I don't feel threatened walking past a statue of Jefferson, I do feel threatened (for good reason) walking past a confederate memorial. This is why confederate statues should be torn down. Almost without exception every historical figure was racist. What is is important is what causes people today hold them up to rally around. The Confederacy existed to perpetuate slavery and white supremacy, and the mass produced confederate statues of today exist to keep that legacy alive. I don't see Jefferson used in the same way. Heritage not hate? It's not a particularly convincing argument when "the south will rise again"ers argue it, but maybe you'll have better luck
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Sep 13, 2017 12:20
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botany posted:missteps? sure. hosed up on the level of literally owning slaves? i really don't think so. MLK cheated on his wife. that's not exactly a nice thing to do but doesn't even loving register on the nathan bedford forrest scale. what hosed up thing did harriet tubman ever do? i feel like saying "all influential people have dirty spots on their CV" trivializes how uniquely hosed-up slavery is. well, and raping slaves. and then enslaving your rape babies and selling them i guess it's supposed to be excusable cause that's how things were back then? but then you have to ask yourself why a monument to lee, who was just doing things the way they were done "back then", is bad but a monument to jefferson is good? maybe they were both bad and we should have monuments to neither?
Condiv fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Sep 13, 2017 |
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Sep 13, 2017 14:46
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Taerkar posted:Single-Payer is also not the end-all, be-all of health care. Only a few countries (2?) actually have it while most of the others with UHC have other means of achieving it. i mean i'm fine with that. france has single payer for 70% of expenses and 30% covered by private insurance that's like 200 euro a year. and medicine and doctors that cost as much without insurance as a typical american pays in copays. moving to something like that would be a massive improvement over what we've got now. unfortunately, we've got 3 directions in this country right now: single payer, status quo with obamacare and shoveling more money into the insurance companies, or total deregulation. and only the first option is a sane path
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Sep 13, 2017 15:23
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botany posted:i am genuinely skeptical that single payer is politically feasible in a system where the health insurance companies have that much political pull. i think it's still fine to push for it openly and as hard as possible, but the more likely outcome is that you'll end up with a public option as a compromise. which, hey, is still great! if we had a public option i think the aca would be doing a lot better. without it, the insurance companies have no incentive to be honest, and companies really don't care about collusion laws anymore nowadays so free market competition doesn't really exist there public option would've given us a good benchmark, and not including it was extremely idiotic and doomed the aca to its current state
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Sep 13, 2017 15:30
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Xae posted:Because the tax would be much higher than 2-5%. fica could be less if it wasn't capped at $127,500
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Sep 13, 2017 15:33
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RuanGacho posted:Equifax and how that plays out could set a strong precedent for companies that don't act in the public interest, so while it may not seem connected at all, raise help with your representatives and senators and Make.Them. Pay. would be awesome to see equifax get the corporate guillotine
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Sep 13, 2017 15:41
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botany posted:it was included though? the house version that pelosi drummed through had a public option. it lost it in the senate. i meant not including it in the final legislation
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Sep 13, 2017 16:03
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Taerkar posted:Honestly I get the impression that from what the 'Single Payer, nothing less' crowd says that they wouldn't consider the hybrid systems acceptable. dems were asking for it though since they supported lieberman over his dem opponent despite him abandoning the party. they were perfectly fine with him going independent after he lost the democratic primary: quote:right after Lieberman lost the primary, he was welcomed with a standing ovation back to the Senate club by his Democratic colleagues. Subsequently, Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid indicated that Lieberman's seniority would be preserved if he won reelection, despite the fact that he officially abandoned the party.
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Sep 13, 2017 17:12
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Party Plane Jones posted:Every thread is primary chat once again, jesus christ. thank axeil for that gift axeil posted:Nah mostly in how she (rightfully) really loving hates Bernie and points out all the little insidious things he did that undermined her. To make an analogy he was basically a little kid holding his hand in front of your face saying "I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!" and people fell for that excuse/explanation. And also how she points out sexism was a major contributing factor to why she lost even though no one admits it. i don't see how anyone "rightfully" hates bernie sanders. he's done p good keeping voters engaged past the election
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Sep 13, 2017 17:14
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Condiv posted:dems were asking for it though since they supported lieberman over his dem opponent despite him abandoning the party. they were perfectly fine with him going independent after he lost the democratic primary: here's a slate article backing this up further: quote:With just a few days to go until the midterm elections, Sen. Joseph Lieberman of Connecticut has a 14-point lead over Democratic challenger Ned Lamont. Lieberman started his campaign as a Democrat but switched his affiliation to Independent after he lost the party primary in August. What will happen if he gets re-elected to the Senate? the dems patted lieberman on the back after he abandoned the party cause he lost the dem primary, then he stabbed them in the back in return
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Sep 13, 2017 17:21
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axeil posted:He is a cuckoo in the nest of the Democratic Party, replacing all the eggs with his own poo poo-filled ones. Elizabeth Warren and Kamala Harris are party leaders. Bernie Sanders is a crotchety old man who is encouraging party in-fighting because he's not a Democrat by his own admission both of which support bernie's medicare for all plan unlike hillary clinton, who is going around throwing tantrums about how obama and bernie didn't do enough for her campaign  (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Sep 13, 2017 17:23
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Harrow posted:Wait, what did she say about Obama? Obama, the guy who ran around campaigning for her? Did she say something lovely about him not taking public sides in the primary until it was basically over or what? she said that his actions during his presidency made her gaffe wrt coal miners blow up worse than it ever would of if he had governed better. quote:She made a connection between Mr. Obama and what she called her biggest gaffe of the campaign: telling voters in Ohio, “We’re going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business.” Mrs. Clinton insisted that the line was taken out of context, but said Mr. Obama had fed the narrative of Democratic hostility toward coal miners by announcing a plan that set state-by-state targets for carbon emissions reductions, and a framework for meeting them, at the White House, next to the head of the Environmental Protection Agency. also, she complained he put her in a straight-jacket by asking her to not go full out negative against bernie in the primaries
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Sep 13, 2017 17:30
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Taerkar posted:It was pretty obvious that Lieberman would get a pretty huge chunk of the Republican voters voting for him in the general election as well as those democrats that voted for him in the primary. Smoozing him so he didn't run immediately into the open arms of the Republican party was pretty sound political strategy. imo, people like lieberman who will jump into the arms of republicans on a whim shouldn't be in the dem party at all it's too bad nancy pelosi refuses to make healthcare a litmus test issue so we can filter out future liebermans that will try to sabotage future healthcare bills
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Sep 13, 2017 17:33
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Taerkar posted:No he shouldn't, but that traitorous fucker was #60 and he abused the gently caress out of it. one problem is that apparently lieberman used the perks the dems handed to him (during the general election no less) to sell himself to voters. he was campaigning on the fact that he would have more seniority than lamont if he got into office, that he would keep all his influence and would be better able to represent connecticut and bring it more perks and benefits because of it. that very well could've tilted the election away from lamont. as i said, the dems brought lieberman's healthcare treachery upon themselves when they rewarded the first instance of it (and clapped for the slimeball when he came back as an independent)
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Sep 13, 2017 17:42
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axeil posted:
When she sent out her daughter to lie and say bernie was going to rip away everyone's healthcare, and she said single payer would never ever happen, and when she said ppaca was fine and just needed a few tweaks but listed nothing that was truly helpful, she poisoned that well on her own. Bernie didn't make her change-allergic by proposing singlepayer.
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Sep 13, 2017 17:56
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Spun Dog posted:Like her or don't like her, it's possible to hate something after being over-exposed to it. Well, you can thank axeil for that gift 
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Sep 13, 2017 17:59
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Gort posted:Christ, take it to the bad thread I don't think axeil is interested in that
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Sep 13, 2017 18:00
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