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sexpig by night posted:I mean, that was exactly what Depp's strategy was. He never made any attempt to prove she lied about saying she was the victim of domestic abuse, he just made sure the jury knew she was also a weird hollywood piece of poo poo and relied on the jury going 'well I assume she lied there too then', that and almost certainly had a massive media time posting epic memes about his lawyer crushing that stupid bitch who looked to the side once or whatever those buckets of weird freaks on youtube kept talking about. Absolutely. I’m not trying to defend the decision and say it’s cool and good haha gently caress that stupid idiot female, I’m saying it’s not really as simple as “wow what a stupid jury” when the case is about very specific incidents in specific circumstances and not just a straight up A/B test of which side is actually the hero and which is the villain of the piece.
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Jun 2, 2022 12:00
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does the depp-heard thing have its own thread somewhere. i don't think there's a way to "lightly touch on it" without a whole thread blowing up
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Jun 2, 2022 12:12
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Probably gbs but I’d rather it be there than here at this point
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Jun 2, 2022 12:17
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https://twitter.com/deadline/status/1532266039203008512?s=21
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Jun 2, 2022 12:22
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Alan Smithee posted:Probably gbs but I’d rather it be there than here at this point Yeah it's pretty gross. That Trump guy is there.
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Jun 2, 2022 12:30
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At the end of the day if you're celebrating this poo poo then you're celebrating this: https://twitter.com/TaylorLorenz/status/1532125987051163648?t=IQLzSCUK1Pm7ttPu-7pdEA&s=19 Even in this thread, which I assumed was more level headed than this, there's the same old misinformation being confidently spouted. What a surprise to see the same old people behind it all. https://twitter.com/dogunderwater/status/1532093405672656909?t=13McbVrEgmJVZbUFvMt7RA&s=19 Then of course there's stuff like this. https://twitter.com/Ego_death18/status/1529892773159219208?t=2TwSWyP9MWG63p_iuCLMpg&s=19 https://twitter.com/SababaUSA/status/1532085891866533894?t=WNDDxkUNCxlQD61_A_L2tw&s=19 DrVenkman fucked around with this message at 12:55 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 12:52
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No one with any sense is celebrating the fact that Amber Heard did damage to women who have been victims of abuse.
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Jun 2, 2022 16:59
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It was always the endgame of this, take the most ridiculous, toxic victim and put them up as the typical example of most accusers. That "hundreds" of victims withdrawing statements, what is going on there? Legal advice? Panic? The entire Depp trial hinged on a specific set of words Heard used in a WaPo op-ed, not the act of accusing your abuser. I really doubt that even a fraction of 1% of similar cases would play out the same way. If anything, the biggest problem for this trial was the introduction of "mutual abuse" on a grand stage, that now forever tarnishes someone who fights back as being as equally guilty as their abuser.
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Jun 2, 2022 17:25
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weekly font posted:No one with any sense is celebrating the fact that Amber Heard did damage to women who have been victims of abuse. Who did the damage? Depp brought the lawsuit to court. After he lost in the UK, he brought it to America. What was she supposed to do? Like it or not, court precedent is a thing (edit: not for jury trials lol sry). Heard had more evidence than most victims who apply for restraining orders. This case will likely be cited in lots of other cases from here on out. emo-ignorance fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 17:40
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emo-ignorance posted:Who did the damage? Depp brought the lawsuit to court. After he lost in the UK, he brought it to America. What was she supposed to do? Not lie on the stand  Also he didn't lose to Amber Heard in the UK he lost to The Sun over their ability to publish accusations.
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Jun 2, 2022 17:41
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weekly font posted:Not lie on the stand Where did she lie? I can find lots of parts where Depp and his witnesses' lies were disproven by their own text messages.
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Jun 2, 2022 17:42
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emo-ignorance posted:Where did she lie? I can find lots of parts where Depp and his witnesses' lies were disproven by their own text messages. You asked me about Heard so maybe stop the whataboutism. Depp is not a good person either. They held up two pictures of her alleged abuse that were identical save for alterations in saturation and she insisted they were different. She said she had nothing to do with leaking information to TMZ when there is deposition video of her letting that slip and a former worker for TMZ showing up to say "yeah that's literally the only way we could have got that video or information about where she'd be to photograph her." This is going to have impact on a jury who isn't extremely online Pac-Maning up every tweet and piece of information about the case. Also, to acknowledge other posts, get out of my face with the idea that not believing Amber Heard means that you love abusers and think all women are liars. I can support believing women and not believe Amber Heard after seeing evidence and interpreting it for myself. I also think it's gross that so many people who are supposedly vehement supporters of victims can't or refuse to imagine a world where a woman could have committed abuse on a man. weekly font fucked around with this message at 17:49 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 17:44
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weekly font posted:You asked me about Heard so maybe stop the whataboutism. Depp is not a good person either. How is it whataboutism when the two people are inextricably linked through the case? That's like saying it's whataboutism to compare two candidates for office lmao. If they're both lying, Depp's lies are way more damning. On the stand, he said that he never laid a hand on anyone in his life, but that's disproven by audio clips of him admitting to hitting Heard. His sister said she had no knowledge of his drug problems, which are disproven by texts from her like "My brother has a problem and he needs help." As for TMZ, Team Depp has always had way more connections to them than Heard, so I don't doubt that they were the ones to call. Heard didn't admit to calling them, she just said she was aware that they had been called. As for the pictures, idk. You've got a point there. To acknowledge your edit, it's not that I personally believe, as a Heard supporter, that women can't commit abuse. It's that one party has evidence dating back years and the other one doesn't. One party, most of his witnesses are on his payroll, and the other one's aren't. I resent the idea that I haven't paid attention to the evidence, because I have. If Heard has to be a perfect victim in order to be believed, so should Depp, and he has been the least credible person in this case. emo-ignorance fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 17:53
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emo-ignorance posted:How is it whataboutism when the two people are inextricably linked through the case? That's like saying it's whataboutism to compare two candidates for office lmao. If they're both lying, Depp's lies are way more damning. On the stand, he said that he never laid a hand on anyone in his life, but that's disproven by audio clips of him admitting to hitting Heard. His sister said she had no knowledge of his drug problems, which are disproven by texts from her like "My brother has a problem and he needs help." Yeah I also saw the evidence, thanks. I'll say it again: Depp is an rear end in a top hat and was very likely part of a toxic, mutually abusive relationship. You asked me to point to where Heard was lying. I did. That, after coming out and stating I AM A REPRESENTATIVE FOR ABUSED WOMEN, makes her a bad representative for women who have actually been abused. emo-ignorance posted:If they're both lying, Depp's lies are way more damning. On the stand, he said that he never laid a hand on anyone in his life, but that's disproven by audio clips of him admitting to hitting Heard. I'd be interested in hearing this cause I don't recall it in the trial
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Jun 2, 2022 17:57
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“Never did I, myself, reach the point of striking Ms Heard in any way, nor have I ever struck any woman in my life,” Depp said. If their relationship was mutually abusive, that would mean that Amber is in fact a victim of abuse and was not defamatory in her op-ed. That being said, I think that's a mischaracterization, as she has detailed his abuse as beginning in 2012 and his earliest instance of suffering abuse at her hands comes much later.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:03
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emo-ignorance posted:“Never did I, myself, reach the point of striking Ms Heard in any way, nor have I ever struck any woman in my life,” Depp said. lol yes this was what I meant and not the smoking gun audio clips you're referencing
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Jun 2, 2022 18:05
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weekly font posted:Yeah I also saw the evidence, thanks. I'll say it again: Depp is an rear end in a top hat and was very likely part of a toxic, mutually abusive relationship. You asked me to point to where Heard was lying. I did. That, after coming out and stating I AM A REPRESENTATIVE FOR ABUSED WOMEN, makes her a bad representative for women who have actually been abused. el oh loving el like clockwork reminder, mutual abuse is not a thing
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Jun 2, 2022 18:06
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pentyne posted:el oh loving el You're a disgusting person. Congrats on turning something that matters into team sports
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Jun 2, 2022 18:07
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pentyne posted:That "hundreds" of victims withdrawing statements, what is going on there? Legal advice? Panic? The entire Depp trial hinged on a specific set of words Heard used in a WaPo op-ed, not the act of accusing your abuser. I really doubt that even a fraction of 1% of similar cases would play out the same way. I really don’t want to downplay the chilling effect this verdict could have, but I suspect that this stat may be not 100% accurate. It isn’t based on any kind of like publicly available data or reporting, it’s a quote in the Rolling Stone article from a person who is not a lawyer. It may be the case that it is true, but I think it isn’t out of the question that it’s hyperbole.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:08
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weekly font posted:lol yes this was what I meant and not the smoking gun audio clips you're referencing Whoops, sorry. Here's reference to the audio clip: The lawyer asked if he agreed if there’d been a head butt, to which Johnny responded, “No, I would vehemently disagree with that, sir,” ... After Johnny’s response, they played an audio recording of Johnny and Amber talking. “I head butted you in the f**king… forehead. That doesn’t break a nose.'
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Jun 2, 2022 18:10
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emo-ignorance posted:Whoops, sorry. Here's reference to the audio clip: Ah, thanks. I only remembered this in the context of him defending it as an accident which really isn't explicit in the audio. I know the jury had full audio from which only portions were played during the trial. I'd be curious to know if they listened further. Also, since you asked about stuff that I think hurt AH's credibility (and you seem to actually be interested in another perspective and not a bad faith shitlord) one of the things I forgot that I think turned her heel in the eyes of the jury was when it came out she had 18 months between the settlement and new lawsuit and didn't donate much money to the charities she "pledged" to and then argued the meaning between pledge and donate. Again, I don't think this says anything about who beat who, I just think it showed some dissonance between the public persona she has tried to create for herself and reality. The fact that this very unique case between millionaires that is actually about nationally published op-eds has became any kind of parallel for your "standard" abuse cases sucks because it's so weird and one of a kind. weekly font fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 18:15
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weekly font posted:You're a disgusting person. Congrats on turning something that matters into team sports Read literally anything besides your twitter feed if you're going to try and have an opinion
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Jun 2, 2022 18:16
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weekly font posted:You're a disgusting person. Congrats on turning something that matters into team sports Try responding to the content of the statement instead of personal attacks. Mutual abuse isn’t a thing.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:32
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pentyne posted:el oh loving el Mutual abuse is absolutely a thing and it is genuinely hosed up to say abuse can only ever be one way. It basically forces the 'one side can do no wrong' mindset that is so often turned against women. If you start saying that anyone who is a victim can't be abusive as well gets into gross territory. It doesn't have to apply in this case for it to be a real thing.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:32
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weekly font posted:You're a disgusting person. Congrats on turning something that matters into team sports The National Domestic Violence Hotline says mutual abuse does not exist. Abuse is about power imbalances and rarely do those imbalances change back and forth. Both/all partners can engage in unhealthy behaviors but the term "mutual abuse" is not considered an accurate way to describe it. If you have other information on the term mutual abuse I think you should share it. Also the hostility in this thread is loving awful knock it off.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:35
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MacheteZombie posted:The National Domestic Violence Hotline says mutual abuse does not exist. Abuse is about power imbalances and rarely do those imbalances change back and forth. Both/all partners can engage in unhealthy behaviors but the term "mutual abuse" is not considered an accurate way to describe it. Fine, I'll just openly say I think JD was the victim since apparently it's all or nothing. Does that make it better or does that get me a probe?
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Jun 2, 2022 18:36
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edit: thing i was responding to got deleted so this post doesn’t need to exist
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Jun 2, 2022 18:37
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Maybe it's my cynicism doing my thinking for me, but it always feels like there's a new reason to declare #metoo dead, as if #metoo is a thing that can die in the first place, and because if it's dead, then you can point to it and say "Look what you've killed!" self-righteously. My understanding of the basic facts of this case was that it was never a poster child for #metoo, because both people engaged in behavior that doesn't reflect well on their character, but that the case falling in Depp's favor will negatively affect other high-profile cases involving high-powered lawyers--even though Depp lost his case in Britain. This is not to say that I automatically think Heard is a bad person or that she deserved to lose the case. It's not like Cosby needed this case's help to be sprung out of prison for raping like 85 people, or the U.S. gymnastics program being a giant abuse coverup for decades, so the broader context of our society not being poisoned and unable to deliver good outcomes on average hasn't really changed. As far as Depp stans going on the warpath, it's worth noting that stans being helped along by astroturfing is nothing new either. I guess my thought is that the source of any disappointment should be that there hasn't been much of a sea change and the Weinstein case didn't have especially broad implications outside of extremely similar cases.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:43
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weekly font posted:Fine, I'll just openly say I think JD was the victim since apparently it's all or nothing. Does that make it better or does that get me a probe? No? You're using the term mutual abuse and from my understanding it's a misnomer. I merely asked you to source your claim that mutual abuse is proper term. I don't think you're trying to do some team sports cheerleading, but using a loaded term is going to cause conflict with people.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:47
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If anything this case has already made "mutual abuse" the new everyday buzzword for anything but a faultless goose victim. Look forward to seeing that thrown around now the same way the GOP is using "grooming" for the slightest mention of a queer person around children.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:53
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emo-ignorance posted:Who did the damage? Depp brought the lawsuit to court. After he lost in the UK, he brought it to America. What was she supposed to do? This is a Circuit court civil case. Precedent setting cases are usually used persuasively from higher courts.
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Jun 2, 2022 18:58
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MacheteZombie posted:No? Things that will also cause conflict is OP lumping me in with twitter MRAs for using a phrase that seemed logical and concise as oppose to the much longer, "A toxic relationship wherein one person was lashing out in retaliation after years of physical, emotional and mental abuse." Sorry I didn't know it wasn't APA approved, I'll avoid it from here on out. weekly font fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 19:01
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If this thread is so lovely, why don't you leave like you said you would in your first edit. You've done nothing but be a defensive prick since you started posting. You keep name-calling others while claiming everyone is talking to you in bad faith and calling you an MRA type. Most people are plainly responding to you while you snark with every post.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:07
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Because you don't get to chase people out of threads because they disagree with you.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:09
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Shageletic posted:This is a Circuit court civil case. Precedent setting cases are usually used persuasively from higher courts. It was also a jury trial. Juries don’t create legal precedent because they aren’t ruling on the law but on the facts of a particular case.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:09
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YOLOsubmarine posted:It was also a jury trial. Juries don’t create legal precedent because they aren’t ruling on the law but on the facts of a particular case. Yeah I don't think it's so much settling a legal precedent as it is a societal one. Abusers (especially rich and powerful ones like Depp) have a brand new playbook that they can turn to to discredit anyone who points the finger at them. It's nothing new, per se, but it's going to drastically boost the confidence of abusers while silencing the voices of victims.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:15
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Thing for all the argument of mutual abuse existing or not, that should not matter. This was not a trial to establish Depp was abused it was a trial specifically to punish Heard for talking at all about Depp's abuse. So weekly font I have no idea what you're arguing about. Saying she was abusive as well (which I don't believe, but just for sake of argument) should not matter. Someone doing something wrong should not make it a crime for them to then talk about something being done wrong to them. But it has because of the dumpfuck jury, and all you're doing is arguing for enabling abusers to more easily use the legal system to silence victims.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:35
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Terrible Opinions posted:Thing for all the argument of mutual abuse existing or not, that should not matter. This was not a trial to establish Depp was abused it was a trial specifically to punish Heard for talking at all about Depp's abuse. So weekly font I have no idea what you're arguing about. Saying she was abusive as well (which I don't believe, but just for sake of argument) should not matter. Someone doing something wrong should not make it a crime for them to then talk about something being done wrong to them. But it has because of the dumpfuck jury, and all you're doing is arguing for enabling abusers to more easily use the legal system to silence victims. Yeah. Even if for some a reason you think Depp is blameless (you are wrong) this is going to be the playbook for anyone rich enough to afford an astroturf social media blitz in the future It is already impossibly hard for abuse victims to speak out without "lol pooped the bed got oooooowned" stuff destroying their life even uf they got justice.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:37
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Terrible Opinions posted:But it has because of the dumpfuck jury Again, the jury aren’t being asked to make a moral decision. They’re being asked to make a decision, given a very specific set of details, about a very specific set of circumstances. Blaming the jury is stupid. A jury isn’t supposed to find a defendant to not have done something just because they think (rightly or wrongly) that the plaintiff in question deserved what happened to them. History Comes Inside! fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 19:50
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I thought they were being asked if it was slander/libel which is quite obviously should not have been. Were they being asked for something else?
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Jun 2, 2022 19:51
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