|
There's a lot of "agree to disagree" happening around this movie.
|
# ? Jan 23, 2018 23:55 |
|
|
# ? May 4, 2024 15:22 |
|
For it to be redemption you have to walk in the other direction - dixon merely turned around and stopped getting worse by the end of this one.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:00 |
|
Uncle Boogeyman posted:as someone who has seen some pretty vicious mother-daughter screaming matches irl, i completely bought it Yeah, I had the same opinion about that moment. The absolute worst, most vicious fights I’ve had have always been with my mother. In my experience, family arguments have the potential to be nasty in a way most other relationships can’t really measure up to. And this is from people I actually get along with!
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:04 |
|
Magic Hate Ball posted:For this movie it's a redemption - there are loads and loads of people who never approach that level of self-awareness and desire to change. If you approach redemption as some kind of epic biblical saved-eternal concept, then no, he does not experience redemption, but within the limitations of the film's narrative he absolutely does. this is a tautology. it counts as a redemption for this film for no other reason than because you say so. granted you're not the only one that came to this conclusion, but it seems like people came to it because of the expectations they brought in for how these movies are supposed to work, not on the evidence of the movie itself. Uncle Boogeyman fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Jan 24, 2018 |
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:07 |
|
Magic Hate Ball posted:There's a lot of "agree to disagree" happening around this movie. While that's true, I enjoy your thoughts and posts in general and I like that we're engaging in this debate
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:19 |
|
yeah for all I've bitched about the controversy surrounding the movie, part of me is glad for it. it's a button-pushing movie, it wouldn't be very good at that if it didn't push people's buttons. i do agree with the criticism that the black characters could've been more fleshed out. i really wanted more of the guy that helps put up the billboards, granted he's tangential to the story but i thought he could've been a cool character.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:23 |
|
Uncle Boogeyman posted:i do agree with the criticism that the black characters could've been more fleshed out. i really wanted more of the guy that helps put up the billboards, granted he's tangential to the story but i thought he could've been a cool character. Yeah, I was hoping we'd get more of both him and Mildred's friend once they met each other, and I'm sad that the story didn't include them more.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:41 |
|
Uncle Boogeyman posted:yeah for all I've bitched about the controversy surrounding the movie, part of me is glad for it. it's a button-pushing movie, it wouldn't be very good at that if it didn't push people's buttons.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:43 |
|
Franchescanado posted:Yeah, I was hoping we'd get more of both him and Mildred's friend once they met each other, and I'm sad that the story didn't include them more. it would've been a bit of a tangent but no more so than Peter Dinklage's subplot really, and probably would've bolstered the main plot more.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 00:44 |
|
Uncle Boogeyman posted:this is a tautology. it counts as a redemption for this film for no other reason than because you say so. It’s a fairly literal arc of redemption - he undergoes a change of values that saves him from a life of sin.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 01:43 |
|
Magic Hate Ball posted:It’s a fairly literal arc of redemption - he undergoes a change of values that saves him from a life of sin. the second part seems pretty up in the air
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 01:46 |
|
I think McDonagh has no idea what small towns r like & his weird abstraction where all the pivotal characters r essentially celebrities that every1 reads gossip mags about hurts the story.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 01:59 |
|
Uncle Boogeyman posted:the second part seems pretty up in the air Sure, but that's where the earnest drama and dark humor meet (which, for me, doesn't work) - she's got steely perseverance and he's learning lessons about empathy, but they're both pushing all their energy in a terrible, ugly direction, which wavers at the end.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 02:01 |
|
Magic Hate Ball posted:There's a lot of "agree to disagree" happening around this movie. The amount of backlash surrounding this movie that most people never even heard of until the Hot Takes started circulating on the internet a week ago is absolutely insane.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 02:35 |
|
Guy Mann posted:The amount of backlash surrounding this movie that most people never even heard of until the Hot Takes started circulating on the internet a week ago is absolutely insane. It's really entertaining.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 02:46 |
|
I’ve honestly never seen a backlash quite so rooted in people’s personal politics and that has so little to do with the actual thing that’s supposedly so problematic.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 02:58 |
|
It's almost like we live in a hyper politically charged world right now and people are really sensitive to the way race relations are presented in movies because of so many hosed up things happening all around them. The movie is obviously aware of the environment it exists in, but it's up to you if you think it handles that well or not (and doesn't make others snowflakes if they disagree).
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 03:21 |
|
Bottom Liner posted:It's almost like we live in a hyper politically charged world right now and people are really sensitive to the way race relations are presented in movies because of so many hosed up things happening all around them. The movie is obviously aware of the environment it exists in, but it's up to you if you think it handles that well or not (and doesn't make others snowflakes if they disagree). If that was the case then you'd think people would be able to channel their impotent fury into something more constructive.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 04:14 |
|
I don't know the video or comments you're referencing but it sounded like hostility towards any criticism of the movie so that's what I was responding to. Sorry if that's not the case.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 04:21 |
I just sat through MOVIE ABOUT HOW BLIND HOSTILITY, NO MATTER HOW RIGHTEOUS, MIGHT BE BAD FOR YOU? and I am fuckin' DISGUSTED that they didn't have the racist guy die and all the black people give a speech about race relations and maybe Donald Trump on fire.
Disgusting Coward fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Jan 24, 2018 |
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 04:27 |
|
Who said anything of the sort?
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 04:35 |
|
Your average thinkpiece writer would probably have a conniption if they saw how Americans were portrayed in In Bruges lmao
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 04:38 |
|
The movie has So of course, cue the hot takes: Three Billboards is a lazy, problematic film which didn't deserve an Oscar nomination in any way https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/three-billboards-outside-ebbing-missouri-oscar-nominations-racism-frances-mcdormand-a8174431.html%3famp quote:A story which should be about a woman rapidly becomes a story about a racist policeman's white redemption. And this is what we're saying is award-worthy in 2018? LadyPictureShow fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Jan 24, 2018 |
# ? Jan 24, 2018 18:29 |
|
That article is frustrating to read
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 20:16 |
|
sponges posted:That article is frustrating to read At least it reminded me to see The Florida Project.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 20:57 |
|
Solitair posted:At least it reminded me to see The Florida Project. I couldn't stop talking about and recommending this movie weeks after seeing it. I liked it more than 3 Billboards.
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 21:14 |
|
Bottom Liner posted:Who said anything of the sort? And then two posts below this the answer appeared lmao Saw this for the third time today and I’ll grant that the black characters, especially Denise and Jerome, could have had a little more development. But other than that I still think the whole backlash is absolutely insane and anyone who uses the word “redemption” wrt Dixon is a complete dipshit
|
# ? Jan 24, 2018 21:37 |
|
Escobarbarian posted:But other than that I still think the whole backlash is absolutely insane and anyone who uses the word “redemption” wrt Dixon is a complete dipshit
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 03:47 |
|
sponges posted:That article is frustrating to read "Why is it that even when telling the stories of women, conflict is centered round the white male struggle?" did the loving retard who wrote the article even watch the movie in its entirety (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 05:37 |
|
Gavok posted:The scene that stays with me the most is the sudden cough bit. There's all this tension and we see Hayes and Willougby inch towards becoming enemies, only for this sudden moment that brings them back to earth. It's both relieving and incredibly sad to watch. The way Mildred reacts to it in such an empathetic, human way was really moving. This movie did a great job of fleshing nuance to characters that seemed like they would be archetype caricatures in the beginning.
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 06:06 |
|
The real moral of the story is that rural dying towns are irredeemable, with bad people or people willing to stand by and do nothing outweighing the good. For every Willoughby who is genuinely trying to make the best of a bad situation and do right by his family and the town with the crappy resources he has, there's a bunch of messed up unlikable folks who nobody would miss if they were gone. There are many dying rural towns, and they are best left to die, and good luck to those that manage to escape that death for better areas and better people.
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 14:55 |
|
bewilderment posted:The real moral of the story is that rural dying towns are irredeemable, with bad people or people willing to stand by and do nothing outweighing the good. For every Willoughby who is genuinely trying to make the best of a bad situation and do right by his family and the town with the crappy resources he has, there's a bunch of messed up unlikable folks who nobody would miss if they were gone. now THIS is a hot take
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 15:00 |
|
Was Willoughby genuinely trying to help? He seemed to content to let his police station be a refuge for shitheads with no interest in justice while he lived in a nice country house and tended to his horses.
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 17:53 |
|
Maarak posted:Was Willoughby genuinely trying to help? He seemed to content to let his police station be a refuge for shitheads with no interest in justice while he lived in a nice country house and tended to his horses. He has a face-turn midway through of course but let's also not forget that his plan to get Mildred tied up in legal fees so she can't pay for the billboards was pretty devious
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 18:22 |
|
Magic Hate Ball posted:It’s a fairly literal arc of redemption - he undergoes a change of values that saves him from a life of sin. Does he? I dunno, especially in regard to the note the movie ended on. I saw this movie myself a little while ago-I was with my mom and step dad; mom loved it and step-dad really liked it too- me, I thought I loved it, but thinking about it more and setting it against McDonagh's other work, I think I've cooled to really liking it. Part of the reason I've cooled is the treatment of Dixon*, however... to call his arc through the story one of "redemption" seems off, because McDonagh doesn't really do redemption, as the term is understood (at least in cinema). Thinking about mainstream movies, how does a redemption arc go down? As Franchescanado says, it usually involves a great big action in which the sinner endures great pain for his sin, or for the people who used to despise him, and then comes out triumphant at great cost, right? To show the audience that they suffer, and through that suffering prove the redemption of the sinner? Than never happens here, not for Dixon, or for anyone, and they all could use one. (And no, I don't see starting a bar fight with a suspect in order to obtain his DNA for evidence as an equivalent act, as it didn't come to anything, didn't get him back on the force, and really consisted of things he should have been doing anyway rather than any superhuman feat.) And they don't happen because McDonagh doesn't like them. I'm only speaking from experience with his works, I've never actually met and talked to McDonagh... but it's always seemed to me that he thinks a lot about the idea of sin and redemption, and is uncomfortable with the idea of great big cinematic acts that represent the purging of wrongs, real or imagined. I mean, I think we all would like to think that the bad things we've done in our lives might be forgiven if we suffer enough or perform that one great act that makes it all better, but it doesn't really work that way, does it? It's a lot more complicated than merely wanting to be a better person, and that's why McDonagh strenuously avoids such grand, symbolic, easily rewarded acts- not just in this movie, but in all of his works, he withholds a quick and easy redemption because it's never been that quick and easy for anyone in real life. So beyond the black humor he likes to pepper in when he can, McDonagh's works are about struggle- people who have committed violent, irredeemable acts through anger, ignorance or negligence that bring them up short and that they spend the rest of the film trying to reconcile or come to terms with....or in the case of Calvary, a good and decent man continually blamed for something he hasn't done, and who eventually sticks to his guns, stands by what he knows is right and true, and then dies anyway, murdered by another person consumed by anger and not knowing what else to do about it. And just as Mildred finds no release from her rage and guilt in any of her actions in the film, the murderer finds no release from his pain in this murder- the last shot in the movie is his face, being confronted by the daughter of his victim. There's no vindication, relief, or happiness there; he just looks...empty. (Calvary is real good, y'all.) Just my two cents... although I do agree with the criticisms that there could have been more representations of people of color that aren't stereotypes. And less stereotypes generally, although it didn't really bother me. *Given who he is and his role in the story, he really should have gone to jail or seen more of a comeuppance, and if the point of the movie had been as some say a commentary on the system and played the "both sides" card, I would have hated the movie, but there is something deeper going on here, and something tells me that McDonagh lack of any real punishment for a violent racist is an intended part of it. e: Dammit all! One of these days, I'll remember to check iMDB every time I try to talk about a movie, but today isn't that day... resurgam40 fucked around with this message at 23:01 on Jan 25, 2018 |
# ? Jan 25, 2018 22:44 |
|
Great post! Just to say McDonagh is the director’s surname. McDormand is the lead actress
|
# ? Jan 25, 2018 22:47 |
|
resurgam40 posted:Does he? I dunno, especially in regard to the note the movie ended on. A character can be both redeemed and misguided - Mildred is a chaotic flywheel of insane spite and he's suckered in by her desperate, unhealthy need for revenge (the broad point, again, being that people need to let the past be and not punish others for something they had no control over), but he does start as an overtly racist cop (he literally tortures black people) and, triggered by Willoughby's letter pleading him to "give up hate" as well as the scene where Red turns the other cheek and feeds him orange juice, vows to do right. It's an arc of redemption that would make Victor Hugo blush - that it unfortunately carries over into brutish eye-for-eye bloodthirst is the complication that comes with his association with Mildred (a theme that runs through the movie - actions and pride frustrate each other) and even at the end they both seem to be wavering.
|
# ? Jan 26, 2018 03:50 |
|
Escobarbarian posted:Great post! Just to say McDonagh is the director’s surname. McDormand is the lead actress And not to pile on, but Calvary and Three Billboards aren't by the same person. Calvary was written and directed by Martin McDonagh's older brother, John Michael McDonagh.
|
# ? Jan 26, 2018 05:37 |
|
Just saw this and I'm still processing, but I wanted to say that the soundtrack really worked for me. Fit the scenes well and added to the overall tone of resigned pain the whole film carried. Maybe that's just cause moody folk music is my jam, but when even the Abba song is about loss and change I have to appreciate the attention to detail.
|
# ? Jan 29, 2018 05:04 |
|
|
# ? May 4, 2024 15:22 |
|
Punkin Spunkin posted:The white trash dropping slurs every other line made me kind of uncomfortable. lmao
|
# ? Feb 12, 2018 00:15 |