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See, I read that quote and it seems like he's saying computer games will NOT be a threat to their business model. Specifically, he is saying most of their player base were born after computer games were already a thing and yet have gravitated to buying GW miniatures anyway. I don't really interpret that as saying video games are a competitive threat to the company. EDIT: Oh my lord, what a shameful snipe.
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Mar 27, 2024 18:26
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He's pointing out that it's young, yeah.
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Mar 27, 2024 18:30
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Yeah that's the thing, he wasn't regarding computer games as a threat... but the company's actions over the course of 30 years have been to never, ever let someone re-implement their core games, putting the lie to that statement. At the same time, that statement kind of highlights how the company didn't put much effort into its licensing. It'd sort of happen randomly, without clear plans for succession, and they'd have a year with big VG revenues followed by several without as a result.
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Mar 27, 2024 18:56
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FMguru posted:The original Dawn of War PC game was the gateway drug for so many of my friends into 40K. Handled correctly, video games can be a huge long-term customer acquisition machine. Another example is Bloodlines getting people into Vampire.
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Mar 27, 2024 19:26
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Colonel Cool posted:Another example is Bloodlines getting people into Vampire. Baldur's Gate 3 also did pretty well in that regard, from what I heard.
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Mar 27, 2024 19:55
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I wonder how Blood Bowl would do if they let someone actually competent get the computer game license.
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Mar 27, 2024 20:16
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Leperflesh posted:that one and "market research is otiose in a niche" This... this may actually be on par with the time a former employer, in 1998, declared that the internet was a fad and took the company all in on satellite delivery.
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Mar 27, 2024 21:19
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Sage Genesis posted:Baldur's Gate 3 also did pretty well in that regard, from what I heard. According to some numbers though, DnD didn't really get to convert those numbers into kept players and considering how they killed off BG3 DLC/Expansions and BG4 despite the absurd success the game had just shows how bad these companies are with looking at their customer base and divergent commercial trends.
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Mar 27, 2024 23:00
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Mr.Misfit posted:According to some numbers though, DnD didn't really get to convert those numbers into kept players and considering how they killed off BG3 DLC/Expansions and BG4 despite the absurd success the game had just shows how bad these companies are with looking at their customer base and divergent commercial trends. While I do think there are some things that the folks at Larian aren't telling us, I think they aren't really lying when they talk about wanting to do something else as a motivating factor. It's just almost certainly not the only motivating factor, and probably not as important as they're making it out to be. I also think the Larian rep who went off about big companies being short sighted saw Hasbro lay off almost everyone his company worked with and probably didn't really want to work with that company anymore.
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Mar 27, 2024 23:06
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Leperflesh posted:Yeah that's the thing, he wasn't regarding computer games as a threat... but the company's actions over the course of 30 years have been to never, ever let someone re-implement their core games, putting the lie to that statement. The atrocious Adeptus Titanic game did. That wasn't why it was bad, it was just super ugly and slow, and not in the "big ponderous death machines" way.
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Mar 27, 2024 23:15
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Warhammer 40k: Final Liberation was an implemention of Epic 40k, not just adeptus titanicus, and it was... yeah, not pretty, but actually worked. But like I said: a specialist game, not the central Warhammer 40k or Fantasy rules. also I think it was just humans vs. orks, no other factions
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Mar 27, 2024 23:36
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King of Solomon posted:While I do think there are some things that the folks at Larian aren't telling us, I think they aren't really lying when they talk about wanting to do something else as a motivating factor. It's just almost certainly not the only motivating factor, and probably not as important as they're making it out to be. Swen says that’s not the case, but I could see it being a factor. The biggest thing for sure seems to be something new as BG III was eight years of work for them. And there was apparently elation when he reported they were moving off BG and into new stuff.
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Mar 28, 2024 00:13
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MonsterEnvy posted:Swen says that’s not the case, but I could see it being a factor. The biggest thing for sure seems to be something new as BG III was eight years of work for them. And there was apparently elation when he reported they were moving off BG and into new stuff. Yeah, like I said, I don't think they're lying when they say that's why they're moving off of Baldur's Gate and D&D. I just don't think that's really telling the whole story.
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Mar 28, 2024 00:19
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Daniel Fox sold Zweihander to "World of Game Design", who apparently didn't realize that they could also just steal the WFRP2E rules for free.
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Mar 28, 2024 01:38
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Bruceski posted:I wonder how Blood Bowl would do if they let someone actually competent get the computer game license. I enjoyed the 1995 version. but even in 1996, I enjoyed 1993's Mutant League Football more. Not a very fair comparison as they were different kinds of games.
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Mar 28, 2024 02:08
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Anonymous Zebra posted:See, I read that quote and it seems like he's saying computer games will NOT be a threat to their business model. Specifically, he is saying most of their player base were born after computer games were already a thing and yet have gravitated to buying GW miniatures anyway. I don't really interpret that as saying video games are a competitive threat to the company. somewhat tangential, but as someone who very recently got back into Advanced Squad Leader, I was able to play it essentially for free: - download the Starter Kit rules PDF from the Multi-Man Publishing site - download the VASSAL module for the game - download either some user-made Starter Kit scenarios (I did buy the electronic rulebook on DTRPG, and I do own the dead-tree boardgame, but still) and I was able to do this with at least one other game. For B-17 Queen of the Skies you even only need the VASSAL module, though I don't feel bad about that one at all because it's been out-of-print forever. I guess I bring this up because I wonder if it's on anyone's radar that this is a thing that can happen. Are boardgame publishers concerned about the ability of people to play their games without purchasing the physical product? I'm not saying that there should be "boardgame DRM", I just feel like I couldn't be the only person that's figured out that this is possible.
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Mar 28, 2024 03:20
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My best friend and I have been playing online Dawn of War 1 since it was first released in2006. These days we use the 'Ultimate Apocalypse--The Hunt Begins' mod which is batshit insane and detailed and so good.
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Mar 28, 2024 03:23
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Bruceski posted:I wonder how Blood Bowl would do if they let someone actually competent get the computer game license. They'd have to essentially make a new Mutant League Football. The Blood Bowl games are a huge drag because they hang on Blood Bowl's tabletop mechanics, which are poo poo. King of Solomon posted:While I do think there are some things that the folks at Larian aren't telling us, I think they aren't really lying when they talk about wanting to do something else as a motivating factor. It's just almost certainly not the only motivating factor, and probably not as important as they're making it out to be. That wasn't a rep, that was their CEO and the director of BG3. They canned work on expansions and BG4 because everyone they worked with at WotC got got in the Christmas layoffs and they saw the writing on the wall about working with Hasbro. They're not going to burn WoTC over it, because they want to play nice for future opportunities with other licensing situations. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Mar 28, 2024 |
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Mar 28, 2024 03:38
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Bruceski posted:I wonder how Blood Bowl would do if they let someone actually competent get the computer game license. I dunno how much better you could do than Blood Bowl 2. The problem with Blood Bowl is that it's an unintuitive and high-friction board game that really only shines when you play multiple full seasons.
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Mar 28, 2024 04:56
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admanb posted:I dunno how much better you could do than Blood Bowl 2. The problem with Blood Bowl is that it's an unintuitive and high-friction board game that really only shines when you play multiple full seasons. sounds like what we really need is Bloodbowl Manager
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Mar 28, 2024 05:01
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I'd rather get Bloodbowl Blitz where it plays fast and fun and there's a code that lets you play as Raiden.
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Mar 28, 2024 06:03
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gradenko_2000 posted:sounds like what we really need is Bloodbowl Manager Blood Bowl Team Manager was a decent direct conflict deckbuilder. Feels a bit janky and of its time, and would definitely make an even worse video game than Blood Bowl.
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Mar 28, 2024 06:22
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it’d be cool if Larian made an isometric Unknown Armies cRPG and you end up with something like “Disco Elysium with Magick.” Hell, they could even recruit some of the creators left over from the collapse of ZA/UM
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Mar 28, 2024 06:40
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Leperflesh posted:Warhammer 40k: Final Liberation was an implemention of Epic 40k, not just adeptus titanicus, and it was... yeah, not pretty, but actually worked. But like I said: a specialist game, not the central Warhammer 40k or Fantasy rules. I meant Adeptus Titanicus: Dominus. Final Liberation was a good implementation of Space Marine 2e and really wants a remaster. The only problem with it was the typica one for a campaign system, by the end of it you'd be stacking Warlords and smashing Gargants. For me, that's a feature, not a bug. I should have loved Dominus. I most certainly did not.
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Mar 28, 2024 06:44
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oh weird, I never even heard of Dominus! Sorry for making an assumption I knew what you were talking about, lol
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Mar 28, 2024 07:09
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Blood Bowl is a combo of the most boring aspects of Tolkien fantasy with the most boring sport in the world (American Football), so it’s never had an appeal to me.
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Mar 28, 2024 07:37
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Liquid Communism posted:That wasn't a rep, that was their CEO and the director of BG3. They canned work on expansions and BG4 because everyone they worked with at WotC got got in the Christmas layoffs and they saw the writing on the wall about working with Hasbro. They're not going to burn WoTC over it, because they want to play nice for future opportunities with other licensing situations. The CEO said very explicitly that they were doing something new because they wanted to, not because their relationship with Wizards/D&D soured. https://twitter.com/LarAtLarian/status/1771467986701819943 As tempting as it is to directly blame WotC for Larian moving on, that reading isn't actually supported by what he's said unless you decide that he was lying (but only when he said nice things about WotC, not when he said things that were critical of them).
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Mar 28, 2024 08:11
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That tweet can be interpreted a number of ways. He says WOTC really did their best, but that says nothing of Hasbro who could have been too greedy, too demanding, etc. It reads like a professionally worded cordial tweet that you can’t really read into too much either way.
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Mar 28, 2024 08:16
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gradenko_2000 posted:somewhat tangential, but as someone who very recently got back into Advanced Squad Leader, I was able to play it essentially for free: My own feeling in terms of why MMP has such a laissez-faire attitude to people technically playing their games for free is that it probably doesn't really impact sales. They have an extremely niche market with very limited print runs, and thanks to the way that both MMP and GMT handle their pre-orders, they already know that a significant majority of their print runs will sell after printing. Being able to play on Vassal also probably doesn't impact the purchasing decision of someone getting a complex wargame either, and from my own personal experience, I have bought games on the back of trying them in Vassal first. I think there is something to be said about the physicality of board games as well, and this really touches on both board wargames and more normie fare: there is a tangible difference between playing on TTS/Vassal/etc over playing the game in real life, and the tactile feel of playing games is a huge plus for a lot of people.
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Mar 28, 2024 10:05
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Bottom Liner posted:That tweet can be interpreted a number of ways. He says WOTC really did their best, but that says nothing of Hasbro who could have been too greedy, too demanding, etc. This for sure. Heads of companies can't just say anything publicly, regardless of the real motivations. Facts are pretty telling though. They had one of the most successful licenced games of all time, and had started work on dlc, but now have publicly said they won't be working with Hasbro going forward. The reasons don't really matter but they don't look great for Hasbro.
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Mar 28, 2024 11:50
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Gatto Grigio posted:Blood Bowl is a combo of the most boring aspects of Tolkien fantasy with the most boring sport in the world (American Football), so it’s never had an appeal to me. It's rugby tmk, not gridiron. Hooliganism and all
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Mar 28, 2024 12:18
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gradenko_2000 posted:somewhat tangential, but as someone who very recently got back into Advanced Squad Leader, I was able to play it essentially for free: Compass typically imposes a 3-month delay on the release of the VASSAL module for their games and will often require something to be missing in the module, either a CRT or some table. With Decision Games' Axis Empires Ultimate Edition, they actually put everything up except the ahistorical random scenario generator and the playaids, but you can play a vanilla game without needing to have bought anything. Also I think the logistics especially of large scale wargames means that they'll get so much more buzz and play if a vassal module is available versus just nothing and requiring all the dedicated space for every game played.
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Mar 28, 2024 13:47
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Leperflesh posted:The funniest part is how low-effort it is to license your property to a video game developer and let them make money for you. Yes, you have to do some brand management and make sure they don't accidentally (or intentionally) ridicule your product or insert a bunch of racism or something, but you can assign like one employee to do that, it's cheap and doesn't pull resources away from your miniatures business. Man, I wish. It’s easier than making computer games in-house but it pulls time from your legal team, your marketing team, and definitely whoever is doing brand management. You need to adjust your own schedules when the game slips. It’s an effort.
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Mar 28, 2024 14:29
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We talked about Satine too much. https://twitter.com/SandyPugGames/status/1773350835558211956
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Mar 28, 2024 15:30
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Dawgstar posted:We talked about Satine too much. uhhh, I missed that story. mmm sexual assault/coercion.
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Mar 28, 2024 15:49
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Dexo posted:uhhh, I missed that story. https://twitter.com/Madd_Minx/status/1535682012970987520 Spoiler: Goes on to include the phrase "explore each others' bodies."
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Mar 28, 2024 16:00
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Dawgstar posted:Spoiler: Goes on to include the phrase "explore each others' bodies." I know what she means but I also believe that we should put Jamison Stone in the graveyard and gain a +1/+1 counter.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:15
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Wow, Minot North Dakota, they're really stepping up in the world!
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Mar 28, 2024 17:30
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Thanlis posted:Man, I wish. It’s easier than making computer games in-house but it pulls time from your legal team, your marketing team, and definitely whoever is doing brand management. You need to adjust your own schedules when the game slips. It’s an effort. I don't think games workshop adjusts its product or marketing based on what its licensed games are doing, at least not in circa 2014 under tom kirby, but I can see how it'd potentially involve some legal work and like... it'd actually be good for the company if it did spend some effort on aligning its tabletop products with its licensing ventures in some way. e. I just looked and the warhammer web site shows no mention that I can find that computer or mobile games exist, much less actually promoting them, lol Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Mar 28, 2024 |
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Mar 28, 2024 17:32
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Leperflesh posted:I don't think games workshop adjusts its product or marketing based on what its licensed games are doing, at least not in circa 2014 under tom kirby, but I can see how it'd potentially involve some legal work and like... it'd actually be good for the company if it did spend some effort on aligning its tabletop products with its licensing ventures in some way. I'd say it's crazy that the Blood Angels don't even get faction rules of their own, but considering no codex-compliant Marines do anymore the ship for complaining about that's kinda sailed. Still, you'd think when Dawn of War was huge, they would've at least gotten to eat at the table.
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Mar 28, 2024 17:49
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