|
I played with an XBox 360 controller, and had a similar "accidentally did diagonal jumps" issue even though I was using the D-pad. I think the game just requires you to do rapid and precise inputs and it's easy to accidentally tag the up/down directions while pressing left or right if you're trying to change directions rapidly. I'm absolutely not convinced that the game is failing to read input correctly.
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2018 18:28
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 2, 2024 07:58 |
|
|
Dzhay posted:I just finished the this game['s story] and this LP is making me realise how bad I am at it. Explopyro posted:This LP is really excellent, I'm still enjoying it. Even if watching you do this does make me feel very inadequate as a player. quote:Out of curiosity, Iggy, do you mind telling us what you're playing this on and what kind of control setup you use? Fun fact: The very start of the LP, the part with the main menu right until the time the game starts, is actually from the PS4 version because on the PC I couldn't record the very start for technical reasons. I was originally gonna do the entire game on PS4 but then someone pointed out to me that the music is somehow a lower pitch on PS4.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2018 18:50
|
|
|
The Belly of the Whale is the hero's darkest hour. This is the part of their journey where they're cut off from all of the help they have received so far, alone against the cruelties of the magical world. In many stories this is precipitated by the mentor's death - in this one, Theo is fine, but he is helpless, and needs to rely on Madeline. The hero must find the resolve to go on when hope is at its lowest ebb. I thought it was a nice touch that until now it's been Madeline's dark side that came from the mirrors, but after passing through one herself, she sees her courage in her reflection. I feel like the backmasked confession goes a long way to explain the significance of mirrors in this game. And of all the creepy easter eggs in video games, this one to me hits so much harder because you can tell, deep down, that it is not fiction. Incidentally, Theo can die in the section where you're carrying him around, if he falls into a pit or gets crushed under a moving block. He has the same death effect as Madeline, except in green instead of red or blue. (Then Madeline immediately dies because you can't continue without him)
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2018 18:58
|
|
|
Dzhay posted:I just finished the this game['s story] and this LP is making me realise how bad I am at it. Remember that every death is just a learning experience. Seriously, the game itself does not care how many times you die or even if you turn on assist mode to get everything.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2018 19:37
|
|
|
TooMuchAbstraction posted:I played with an XBox 360 controller, and had a similar "accidentally did diagonal jumps" issue even though I was using the D-pad. I think the game just requires you to do rapid and precise inputs and it's easy to accidentally tag the up/down directions while pressing left or right if you're trying to change directions rapidly. I'm absolutely not convinced that the game is failing to read input correctly.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2018 01:44
|
|
|
Ramos posted:Well, it was skirting magical realism for a while until the game flat out said, "This temple is actually magic!" B Sides. Holy gently caress! This game went from chill with a challenge to Meatboy levels of spikes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2018 03:34
|
|
|
pointlessone posted:B Sides. Holy gently caress! This game went from chill with a challenge to Meatboy levels of spikes. I deeply appreciate that the B-Side music for Mirror Temple is some smooth jazz, because if it were anything that wasn't super-chill that place might have upset me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2018 03:47
|
|
|
Madeline's courageous reflection is a neat touch. Odd that she doesn't look any different. Or maybe not. Authentic Woman needs no costume, because she is true to herself.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2018 05:13
|
|
|
This game is a lot of fun to see played by someone who knows what they're doing - wanted to pop in and say thanks for making this LP.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2018 09:51
|
|
|
   An SSLP version of that big dialogue bit in the beginning may or may not be coming at some point. No promises. For the time being, though, this is very basic and contains some of the code/directions from the game files: https://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=150764 It's basically just for people who don't want to sit through the 20 or so minute intro sequence. The truth is I had a more full fledged post prepared but lost part of my progress (some gifs lost completely, resized screencaps. Basically busywork I'll have to do again.). Since this is a video LP anyway this will have to suffice for the time being. And oh yeah, you can just get the entire game script from the game files. It's kinda great. You can edit it too! 
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2018 23:05
|
|
|
I call it Super Madeline 2.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 00:42
|
|
|
Man, there is a ton to unpack in this chapter. It's easily the most significant one in the game, and it doesn't even involve climbing the mountain. So, let's start from the start. I don't think it's a coincidence that Madeline and Theo are climbing the mountain together. We've already seen how important he's been in giving her the mental tools to tackle the problems she faces. Now we get to see how important Madeline is to him. As far as we know he hasn't faced any magical stuff specific to him until he got caught in the mirror temple, because the mountain didn't need magic to show him what he needs. He came to Celeste seeking a direction, and a purpose. And he finds a woman that reminds him on so many levels of his sister, whom he loves, and who is going through major challenges herself. A woman who he's both managed to help, and helped him in turn. He'll figure out where he needs to be. Speaking of which, if you name the character Alex at the start, Theo's sister is instead called Maddie. It's a nice touch. I find it interesting to note that when Madeline starts talking to her Badeline, her reflection is actually quite happy to co-operate at first. Even sympathetic. In fact, she gets downright hurt when Madeline says she doesn't want her around any more. And I'm reminded of when they first met in the old ruins. The first thing Madeline does is insult her appearance. Sure, she's probably less guarded than she would be with a real person since she was already told Badeline was part of her, but it shows that the aggression isn't just one-way. When I first saw the game I was a bit put off by the mix of art styles - pixel graphics for the gameplay, 3D for the menu screen, and traditional art for the dialogue. But Badeline leaning through the dialogue box to scream at you makes it totally worth it. There's no strawberries in the chapter, and that's an interesting decision in terms of unpacking what it means. For one thing, this cave isn't on the mountain any more - though obviously within its sphere of influence - so if strawberries are a part of the mountain's challenges, they wouldn't be found down there. But it also plays into Madeline's mindset, where she is now done trying to conquer the summit, so why should she care about challenging herself? I didn't notice this when I was solving the crystal heart puzzle, but the chapter title tells you exactly what the symbols mean once you've figured out how they relate to directions. It's a nice touch. The old lady never gets a name. The game files call her Granny. She represents more than just a person on the mountain - more than anything, she seems to be its mouthpiece, explaining the mountain's challenges and pushing Madeline on a little. She's been doing it the whole time. And her every appearance is heralded by the same crows that give you tutorial directions, which seems significant to me. Another, more meta read of her is that she represents another kind of player of the game. She's the one who not only played and enjoyed the story, but stuck around for all the extra challenges. She chose to live here for a reason. If you get to that point, you might start to find her quite relatable... Oh, and, of course, the hero's journey. This is the big climax of the whole story. Madeline has her Apotheosis moment, where all the lessons the hero has learned culminate in a shift of their viewpoint. She's gone from running away from her reflection to chasing it down - you can really feel it after the talk with Granny, when the tentacles are retreating away from her. Then comes Atonement. The hero resolves exactly who they are, and what their purpose is, with a figure of ultimate authority in their life. In many traditional stories this is their father, or perhaps a god or king, but in absence of those, it can be the hero themself. Of course, Madeline has a more literal time than most in making amends with herself. This culminates in The Ultimate Boon. The hero's reward for passing all their trials is enlightenment - they get true power within the magical world, and can now conquer whatever it is they originally came to struggle against. This is a very popular moment in video game stories, as it's a great opporunity to give you a thematically-appropriate power-up, as here where Madeline's double-jump becomes a triple-jump. It's a real explosion in your power as a player. And it goes without saying that you'll need it to conquer the summit. Consider for a moment that, even if Madeline had never fallen from the mountain, she mechanically wouldn't have been able to reach the peak without going through this resolution. Tenebrais fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Apr 13, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 00:48
|
|
|
Granny's proximity to crows all the time makes me wonder if she is a kind of Odin-like figure. Giving wisdom and seeing all through her crow companions. Or maybe she just likes crows.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 01:45
|
|
|
I love Badeline bursting out of the text frames to emphasize her point.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 02:20
|
|
|
Quiet Python posted:Granny's proximity to crows all the time makes me wonder if she is a kind of Odin-like figure. Giving wisdom and seeing all through her crow companions. Nah, she's just some crazy old lady on a mountain, best to ignore her.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 06:01
|
|
|
To be fair to the old woman, Madeleine hasn't introduced herself either. And when she first met Theo, you have to re-initiate the conversation to make her tell him her name. Between that and insulting Badeleine's appearance the first chance she gets, she's kinda rude to strangers.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 10:54
|
|
|
I love how she's having a conversation with something called A Part of You and her opener is "well, I think it's time we go our separate ways and never see each other again...". I mean, how did she see that conversation ending? Getting tossed down a hill is a positively gentle response.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 11:36
|
|
|
sunken fleet posted:I love how she's having a conversation with something called A Part of You and her opener is "well, I think it's time we go our separate ways and never see each other again...". I mean, how did she see that conversation ending? Getting tossed down a hill is a positively gentle response. Plus, she's all excited and giddy about that. From the other side of the conversation, it sounds like she's gleefully announcing abandoning and possibly downright killing part of her. Even if you believe it, "You're everything that's holding me back and I have to let go of you." are kinda harsh words. This is also why I like this story so much. Many lesser writers would just play that straight: The hero has some kind of mental flaw, or insecurity. Some kind of magic manifests that stuff into an antagonist. The hero destroys it with physical violence and everything is fixed forever. cant cook creole bream fucked around with this message at 13:06 on Apr 13, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 12:51
|
|
|
I've heard of video games as art, but never video games as psychotherapy.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 14:57
|
|
|
Madeline's description of depression really hit home for me. Really, this whole chapter is beautifully constructed.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 15:19
|
|
|
Waltzing Along posted:I've heard of video games as art, but never video games as psychotherapy. Which is I think a big part of what makes Celeste so impactful for many people: it's doing something that hasn't been done before, and indirectly giving therapy to a lot of people who may not realize that they need it. Everyone has problems that they could use some help addressing. And there are tools for addressing those problems, but if you don't know about the tools, then the problems may seem unsolvable -- something that you just have to live with. One of the things the game does is show us someone learning to use some tools (like the feather, but also just generally introspecting and trying to understand and accept who they are) to help them cope with their problems. People are inevitably going to draw comparisons between themselves and Madeline, and try to figure out what "their" mountain would be and how they might go about climbing it. And like Granny says, the first part of solving a problem is confronting it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 15:53
|
|
|
cant cook creole bream posted:This is also why I like this story so much. Many lesser writers would just play that straight:
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 16:15
|
|
|
So by talking/battling it out with Shadow Madeline, Madeline has unlocked her Persona powers of the double air dash!
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 18:01
|
|
|
There are so many things I want to say about the writing and characterisation in this chapter, but I'm not sure I can actually express them. I've struggled with depression for most of my life and a lot of lines in this game sounded very similar to things I've heard from my therapist over the years. I don't think it's perfect, but at very least it's believable. I have to suspect that at least part of this game is autobiographical; I'd have a hard time believing that nobody involved in writing it has any personal experience with depression, because the depiction here really rings true. (Okay, I also did a double-take when Madeline says "Mostly I drink. And get angry at people on the internet." That was disturbingly close to home, and I suspect it is for a lot of people. Though at the same time I also think it's a bit jarring because of the game's art style, the way she's drawn makes her look early teens at best even though she's clearly written to be an adult. I can't decide whether I think that dissonance is intentional or not, it could be trying to make a point about how she sees herself but I'm not quite convinced.) As to whether the game itself has therapeutic value, I suppose that remains to be seen. In terms of actual level design, playing this one made me really anxious, because the first time through there's no way to know there aren't any strawberries in it. Between that and all the branching paths (which all eventually lead to the same place), I kept thinking I was missing something major and searching for secrets that just weren't there. Then of course I missed the actual secrets, I had to look up the crystal heart (which I still think is appallingly cryptic) and while I was sure there had to be something up that elevator shaft, I never managed to actually get up there.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 18:59
|
|
|
Several of the development team have said in interviews that the story means a lot to them, because they've been through the same things. As for Madeline's age, the car you see at the start of the prologue is hers, it's how she got there. I don't know what the driving age in Canada is, mind. Her portrait doesn't look very adult, but I don't think she looks like a child either? Just kind of ambiguously cartoon.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 19:09
|
|
|
The music during the confrontation sounds like as if Madeline is singing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:06
|
|
|
Let me echo these other posters in saying this game's story is meaningful to me. Madeline's experience with depression differs significantly from my own, but there's still a lot I can relate to.Tenebrais posted:I don't know what the driving age in Canada is, mind. I don't know the age limit either, but if Canada's Worst Driver is any indication a literal child getting a legitimate driver's license when they shouldn't be able to doesn't seem farfetched.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:22
|
|
|
Samovar posted:The music during the confrontation sounds like as if Madeline is singing. Yeah there was some sort of chanting sound going on. Was wondering if something being spoken backwards was happening again.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:28
|
|
|
FeyerbrandX posted:Yeah there was some sort of chanting sound going on. Was wondering if something being spoken backwards was happening again. As far as I can tell, it's just someone saying "Hey-yeah!" over and over again. It's providing reinforcement that hey, you're doing the right thing! Keep doing that!
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:43
|
|
|
TooMuchAbstraction posted:As far as I can tell, it's just someone saying "Hey-yeah!" over and over again. It's providing reinforcement that hey, you're doing the right thing! Keep doing that! I love how the chanting distorts in the later part of the fight, when it gets more frantic and rocks start moving around.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:47
|
|
|
I kinda felt like the whole track was meant to represent the struggle with the Part of Madeline. As you back her further and further into a corner the chanting starts becoming glitchy and choppy, while the rest of the music starts to overpower it. The cutscene and track that plays afterward reinforces that, as she's clearly given up and willing to try and go away, until Madeline gives her another option.
Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 20:56 on Apr 13, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 20:53
|
|
|
Bloody Pom posted:I kinda felt like the whole track was meant to represent the struggle with the Part of Madeline. As you back her further and further into a corner the chanting starts becoming glitchy and choppy, while the rest of the music starts to overpower it. The cutscene and track that plays afterward reinforces that, as she's clearly given up and willing to try and go away, until Madeline gives her another option.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 21:09
|
|
|
I asked earlier if Badeline was actually a real entity, and she absolutely is. So there we go then. Looking forward to the next level.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 22:33
|
|
|
As a Canadian, I can say that the driving age is the same as the U.S, which is 16. I said before that the general art direction reminds me a lot of Steven Universe and I still stand by my statement.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2018 23:22
|
|
|
How many boss "fights" in games nowadays boil down to chasing someone down so you can give them a hug?
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 00:31
|
|
|
berryjon posted:How many boss "fights" in games nowadays boil down to chasing someone down so you can give them a hug? something something undertale
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 02:13
|
|
|
fractalairduct posted:something something undertale That's one. Anything else?
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 04:52
|
|
|
berryjon posted:That's one. Anything else? Well, in the Punisher you give Kriegkopf a hug. Albeit with nuclear arms.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 10:52
|
|
|
berryjon posted:How many boss "fights" in games nowadays boil down to chasing someone down so you can give them a hug? In Mother 3 the final boss gives you a hug.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 10:56
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 2, 2024 07:58 |
|
|
Tenebrais posted:Several of the development team have said in interviews that the story means a lot to them, because they've been through the same things. If I remember right, Madeline's supposed to be somewhere in her vague early to mid twenties. Don't quote me on that though, I just vaguely remember that from some developer interview.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2018 13:26
|
|