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 Originally released in 2012 as X-Wing: The Miniatures Game, X-Wing was a huge success. Nearly 60 ships across three factions. Over 7 million ships and accessories sold. Over 50,000 organized play events. X-Wing owns. In 2018, we got a long-awaited update to the core rules of the game. This second edition was a big improvement over the first. In 2021, ownership of X-Wing was moved from its original creators, Fantasy Flight Games to Atomic Mass Gaming by Asmodee, the parent company of both. In February 2022, AMG released a massive update to the core rules of the game. The community has dubbed this "X-Wing 2.5". Here's a summary. Big sweeping changes: Here's a google sheet about most of the big changes: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1l--J7333ZM6LKme3p28QzWigO4F_xFLRU5VT2W4Lb4o/edit#gid=288716757 Below I'll put my own personal thoughts about them, except Random Order After Dials and the bumping rules; those have been discussed to death. Change: Minimum of 3 ships (still max of 8). Goal: Two-ship lists are generally about attrition and running away, so let's get rid of that. Initial Impression: Good. I loving hate playing against most two-ship lists. Change: Squad Building is now 20 points. Only ships count towards your squad. Upgrades are tracked separately as Loadouts. Different pilots have different Loadout Values to spend on upgrades. If two ships cost the same in squad points, the one with the "better" pilot ability will generally have a lower Loadout Value. Goal: Simplify squad building. Allow players to field the ships they want rather than juggling ship vs upgrade costs. Initial Impression: Good. Finally a way to incentivize people to take a pilot with a lovely pilot ability over a generic of the same initiative. Think Joy Rekoff, who reduces defense dice when shooting secondary weapons. Change: Upgrade costs (which count against Loadout Value) are no longer variable. Instead, they're priced according to their strongest use. Goal: Simplify squad building. Initial Impression: Neutral. Since every ship has its own LV that doesn't count against squad points, so it's probably okay if some upgrades are "overcosted" a bit for that particular ship. What really matters is if there's a better upgrade available or not...and then you just take the better one. Generic ships got hit HARD for some reason. I can see no reason to ever fly one now. Change: Added scenario play. There are four scenarios. Goal: Give players a clear, well, goal, and a way to force people to interact in the game over discrete concepts instead of an abstract positioning advantage. Plus alternate win conditions. Initial Impression: I have no way to evaluate the nature of each scenario yet. EDIT: the scenarios have been tweaked after their initial rollout and are much better balanced now. Change: Games are now 12 rounds, not 75 minutes. EDIT: tournament play is still 75 minutes but in general games are won on points around turn 5-6 before time is up. Goal: ? Initial Impressions: Good because no one is incentivized to slow play to win on points. Players can still delay engagement or run, of course, at the risk of losing out on scenario points. EDIT: Since games tend to end around turn 5-6 this is working as intended. Change: Mission Points. Players receive "mission points" for stuff like scoring objectives or destroying enemy ships. Goal: Codify the alternate ways to win Initial Impressions: Fine. You need to codify scoring somehow. EDIT: very much codifed in the new rule book Change: Deficit Scoring. If someone doesn't spend all their squad points, the remainder is a "deficit". the opponent automatically earns Mission Points equal to their opponent's deficit. Goal: ? Initial Impression: Neutral. There's no point to bids anymore so I'm not sure why this is necessary, but whatever? Change: Addition of a Ban list and a Restricted List. Goal: Remove or limit problematic cards. Initial Impressions: Very good. It's about loving time. Ban list includes any card that messes with dials after placement is banned, which is probably due to the addition of ROAD. Both the Ban and Restricted list are only for Standard play. Extended players, go nuts. Change: New game modes, Standard and Extended. Goal: "Standard" game mode should be accessible to new players and not require players to hunt down ships + conversion kits that only existed in first edition. As such, it highly restricts which ships are available and is generally analogous to Hyperspace mode. "Extended" allows everything. Initial Impression: Good. This is basically Hyperspace/Extended from before, except now Hyperspace is called Standard, and Standard generally includes all stuff released for second edition. That's less confusing. Misc Rules Changes: -Primary weapons are defined as having range 0-3 and having no cost by default. -Primary attack at range 0 cannot add additional dice unless stated otherwise. They do not get range bonuses. -Primary attacks at range 0 can only be modified by spending Force for the default effect -When defending at range 0, you cannot cancel, modify, or remove dice or results (in other words, the defender can't gently caress with their own dice OR the attacker's) -Clarification that ships that are allowed to dock mid-game can do so after partially executing a maneuver to end up at range 0 of their carrier ship. -Obstacles are generally much more harsh when you hit them. -Tractored ships cannot be moved through or onto obstacles. -New classification: Unit. Ships and remotes are units. -Added Blaze obstacles. Uh, don't run into these okay? They are mean. Errata: -Generally anyone whose special ability let them attack at range 0 (which they couldn't before) gets language about treating that attack as range 1. Think Arvel, Oicunn, etc. -Nantexes must now fully execute a maneuver to rotate their arc. -Buzz Droid swarms agility reduced to 1 -Zeb crew upgrade allows you to spend focus when attacking or defending at range 0. -C1-10P now requires you to fully execute a maneuver. -Dooku crew now only works "during an attack", booo -Dedicated gets keyword restrictions updated to "republic" or "clone", loses "non-limited" -Ferrosphere paint now gives a stress to the ship that locks you if you aren't in their bullseye -Grappling and Landing Struts text updated for clarity. (Is the "you cannot barrel roll" text new?) -Leia crew (rebel) only allows you to reduce difficulty of non-stop maneuvers. No more U-Wings that never move. -Luke gunner gives you a deplete when you rotate your turret. -It's now Officially Okay to remove your ships from the pegs during bump scenarios. lol ConfusedUs fucked around with this message at 22:15 on Aug 30, 2022 |
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May 1, 2018 21:43
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enigmahfc posted:Gencon is not in June, FYI Thanks! It's august. I don't know why I thought June... canyoneer posted:This is so rad. I'm anxious with anticipation and also completely uninterested in any of the x-wing meta happenings between now and then Agreed. I got in just before Wave 7 myself.
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May 1, 2018 22:05
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jivjov posted:New thread smell. I like it. Thanks for the old thread. It was great.
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May 1, 2018 22:15
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Some Numbers posted:Having jumped into 1e with the TFA starter, I'm excited for all these shiny new changes. So the problem with the old dice in 1.0 was that the design space around dice modification was extremely limited. WIth only three possible results, there's only so many ways you could change those up. As defense dice got better, red dice had to get better, and eventually everything started creeping upwards. The charges system on upgrades helps with that a lot. It allows them to put in really powerful, but limited, effects in that do unique things a few times without risking them being auto-includes and invalidating stuff just by existing, for the entire length of the game. I'm not sure we NEED new dice now that we can have any number of limited ways to tinker with them.
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May 1, 2018 22:37
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I don't know what you're talking about
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May 1, 2018 22:39
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banned from Starbucks posted:They gonna have to jumpstart the gently caress out of FO and Resistance factions. FO has 4 ships and Resistance only has 2. Is it even worth it to them to make conversion kits for a faction with 2 ships? Splitting them off always seemed like a dumb idea esp since Empire and Rebel ships span loving huge amounts of time and EU. I imagine wave 2 is gonna have a shitload of stuff for them. I also wouldn't be surprised to see a combo conversion kit.
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May 1, 2018 22:40
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Oh wow the core set they're using on that Covenant game includes a right-angle ship-marking template/tool. About drat time. thespaceinvader posted:I am super loving hype. THis is gonna be great; 1.0 is sytill a great game but it's been creaking at the seams since before I started playing and that's been getting more and more obvious. The ability to flexibly bupdate points and slots to tweak balance will be SUCH a boon, and more moving parts means more interesting options for design, and more design space, without half-arsedly juryrigging new mechanics in. Yeah like 1/2 the panel was referring to adding design space, so they knew it too.
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May 1, 2018 22:45
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Panzeh posted:I'm also pretty sure not every upgrade from 1.0 is going to be in the conversion kits. They've never said that there would be 1:1 conversions for everything. Just that every ship will be usable. To me, that reads that not every upgrade will even exist. I'd be shocked if every pilot had a 1:1 analogue, too.
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May 1, 2018 23:22
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AndyElusive posted:How long until 2.0 becomes a bloated mess and we are calling for 3.0 or worse, pining for the days of 1.0? Early pushback over price - starts now Resurgence of 1st Ed players pining for the good old days - Starts wave 2, all but gone by wave 8 2.0 starts feeling bloated around wave 12 By which time I'll be old enough not to care.
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May 1, 2018 23:26
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Man, I look at those conversion kits and think "that's pretty awesome." It's got 2-4 of everything. That's a fuckload of new content.
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May 1, 2018 23:47
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Real talk No backwards compatibility would be the worst possible option for the viability of the game. Any kind of backwards compatibility has a cost associated with it. They could have parted out the upgrade kits one ship at a time. Which would be a huge forecasting and logistical nightmare for both FFG and game stores. So they did the thing of a big upgrade per faction. With enough stuff to cover most players. More stuff would have just driven up the price per box. It’s incredibly reasonable and generous.
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May 2, 2018 00:08
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Also look how close I was! https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3657860&userid=50067&perpage=40&pagenumber=61#post483465888 ConfusedUs posted:They're going to announce X-Wing 2.0, with associated big-box cardboard/card-only upgrade packs (probably in the $50 per faction range), to be released this summer with early packs available at GenCon in June. No idea why the gently caress I thought GenCon was in June.
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May 2, 2018 01:22
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May 2, 2018 14:43
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CODChimera posted:Sounds like you should've thought about it a little bit beforehand. I'm pretty sure he did it wrong, as he'd spent a good five minutes earlier talking about how 1.0 barrel rolls allowed you to slide around was a huge mistake and just complicated things.
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May 2, 2018 14:54
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Also, here's a Reddit post with literally everything we know about 2.0 as of today. https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/8gfnyi/every_scrap_of_info_i_could_find_on_20/ There's a wee bit of author commentary from a notoriously salty poster, but given who it is, I'm surprised at how little there is. This is a good post.
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May 2, 2018 14:55
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Finster Dexter posted:"Rebels unfortunately still have a TIE (Booooo)" Yeah that's one of his pet peeves. Still it's nice someone put together that list, even if there are a few minor inaccuracies and a few tears.
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May 2, 2018 15:10
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JerikTelorian posted:So all the info is actually in the app, right? What do you need the actual cardboard for, then? Tournaments and official play? Yep. Also probably easier to glance at a bunch of cards than to scroll through an app on a phone. My big hope is that the official app doesn't suck. That's really the make-or-break point.
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May 2, 2018 16:00
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CODChimera posted:Where are you guys seeing people rage about the price? I just checked the FFG forums and it's mostly positive. The top-level comments are mostly positive, but replies have a salty minority. Also the assorted large Facebook groups are cesspools (as usual).
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May 2, 2018 16:11
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CODChimera posted:It is. I only play casually(that might change with 2.0) but still prefer having all the cards out. Yeah I hate proxying an entire list. I've been known to print out the squad lists tho
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May 2, 2018 16:12
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Yep. He can and it owns.
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May 2, 2018 17:05
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alg posted:How about $25 or $30, FFG and Disney both make a nice profit, and keep a bunch of people buying and playing. In raw materials, yes, that's a reasonable price. But there's no way that pays for the time spent designing, testing, templating, making graphics, etc.
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May 2, 2018 18:02
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Admiral Joeslop posted:I've only played a handful of games in the last few months at league, and I kinda don't feel like it until 2.0. I might still hit up some tournaments but man playing this game without the coming changes is going to feel like a slog. I think the next couple months will be PERFECT to play some HotAC as a swan song for 1.0.
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May 2, 2018 18:18
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Just a heads up, the conversion kit information (no details, just number of ships supported per kit (counted by number of maneuver dials per ship)) is back up over at FFG's site. Expand the FAQ section here. https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/x-wing-second-edition/ And there are some minor changes over the early, brief appearance of this list. For example, now there are only 2 decimator dials listed instead of 3. Three deci dials were a prime complaint of the angry faction, since (today, at least), there was literally no way to fit three in a list. I'm not sure what else changed.
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May 2, 2018 18:44
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From the new list, this covers almost my entire collection, which is on the large end. If I get one of every box and the core set, there are only a couple of cases where I have more of a ship than comes in the box. To fully cover my collection, I would need: 1 more TIE 1 more Y-Wing of each faction (I have three total, but boxes only have two per faction) 1 more Starviper Literally everything else is covered by the three boxes. I'll have a shitload of extra stuff for many other ships for all factions too.
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May 2, 2018 18:54
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Also without knowing how the ships are pointed or what abilities they have, I have no idea what I'm actually going to use. Imperial is my favorite factions in 1.0, but no way to know if that'll be true in 2.0. It might be Scum, or even Worse Scum (rebel).
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May 2, 2018 18:58
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Arquinsiel posted:The raw material costs are pretty low. It's actually getting it all to you so you can put it in the box, checking that you put the correct amount of each thing in the box, packaging up boxes in a bigger box and shipping that box to shelves by X time that costs. Cardboard is crazy expensive to ship due to sheer weight, so I'd honestly be amazed if they could do it cheaper. Yeah that's kind of my point. The prices seem quite reasonable to me, as you have to think beyond just the cost of the raw materials. Honestly the raw materials are probably the cheapest part of the whole thing.
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May 2, 2018 19:03
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Yep. There's nothing about this that isn't good from an Organized Play perspective.
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May 2, 2018 19:05
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Imperial Kath was hilarious and I won't hear anyone say otherwise. (Overcosted by AT LEAST five points, but hilarious)
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May 2, 2018 19:12
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AndyElusive posted:So is the Scurrg also Scum only in 2.0? I noticed there's no conversion for it in the Rebel kit. Looks that way! Unless somehow he's a Resistance pilot now. No more Rebel Nym!
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May 2, 2018 19:20
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Yep. Templates and plastic bases too. That’s about it.
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May 2, 2018 20:26
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The prequels flirted with greatness, but fell short while, figuratively, that greatness was within sight of the audience. That was their greatest sin.
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May 2, 2018 20:39
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Stream today showed the TIE Interceptor with linked Boost > Roll and Roll > Boost actions (second one is red). Only one we know of with both. A-Wings have Boost > Roll and just Roll.
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May 2, 2018 23:08
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EdBlackadder posted:So if I'm reading this right then the Wave I expansions are going to have the same cards as the conversion kit but they will diverge afterwards (but maybe with future conversion kits to come). No "maybe" on the future kits. Otherwise correct. I hope we get per-wave kits instead of a big kit every few waves to catch up.
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May 2, 2018 23:09
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I wonder if they plan to set up a public API to query for the squad-building stuff. It'd enable developers to tie into the same system to build any number of apps, pulling ship/cost/etc data from a central repository. And there'd be redundancy in case their app poo poo the bed; you could download Some Other App and use it instead in a pinch. Edit: The Devs of both Yet Another Squad Builder and Aurora said they don't plan on further updates past 1.0. ConfusedUs fucked around with this message at 23:30 on May 2, 2018 |
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May 2, 2018 23:24
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AndyElusive posted:However 2.0 pans out, I just hope K2S0 gets his own pilot card and/or crew card. Someone on Reddit said they hinted at it on stream, but I missed that part. I only saw a tiny part of the stream.
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May 2, 2018 23:26
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canyoneer posted:Stream said the only two ships that haven't had dials changed are the TIE fighter and the Lambda. Was that the exact wording? I recall them saying something like the dials changed on nearly every ship, with the TIE and Lambda being among those that didn't. Leaving room for others maybe. I was only half paying attention tho. I could be mis-remembering.
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May 3, 2018 04:48
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Get a second, fancy damage deck if you pre-order. Includes a diagram of the physical location of each crit, and it's full-sized instead of mini sized. https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2018/5/1/upgrade-your-damage-deck/ Automatic for any pre-order from FFG. Local retailers can get them too by contacting FFG. It's like every loving day is Christmas here.
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May 3, 2018 04:56
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hoiyes posted:The upside of this is that there'll be spare damage decks going around for even the poorest players who want to get in on 2.0. Yep! I really can't believe how generous this 2.0 conversion is.
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May 3, 2018 05:02
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overdesigned posted:That reddit post says that bombs *and munitions* happen in the systems step. So if you have a TL, you can fire a proton torpedo in the systems step, then do a regular primary attack in the engagement phase? Nah, the demo games all had the torpedoes fired during the normal combat phase. Edit: You're misreading that post. Each item is its own thing and has no relation. So even though the line about munitions comes after the one about bombs, there's no intention of passing the timing along from one to the other.
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May 3, 2018 05:17
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Those are “ship abilities,” and it’s what they’re doing in place of 0-point (or less) titles.
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May 3, 2018 14:37
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