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Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

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Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

CaptainPsyko posted:

More likely than either, it seems like some top level was going wild.

The 4 week delay that preceded those emails tells us that there was probably an awful lot of internal debate going on about this. And of course it immediately backfires on them which is the funniest part.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I priced that system out while watching that video because I was bored. These are the exact parts except for the memory, which is a slightly different version that only seems available to OEMs.


+$45 for the keyboard and mouse (not on part picker)
And then minus some if you have a cheaper source for Windows OEM keys
(edit: the 1660 Super price is set to MSRP just for reference. actual price will be much higher and vary wildly)

Prebuilt machines are always gonna come with a hefty premium, but this seems not super terrible if you want a low-end to midrange gaming machine but don't want to build anything yourself. Though not great, either, clearly. At least they use actual name-brand products for the most part. That's how low the bar is.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Jun 14, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

mewse posted:

AFAIK you can't get that video card for that price

Correct. But the street price for it is like $700, so I gave it the MSRP just for reference. That is basically what that machine would cost to build yourself in a sane market. Considering the 3x inflated street price of the GPU, you could consider the PC a bargain at $1000 I guess.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

mewse posted:

If you're doing a pricing comparison and using theoretical prices I don't see how that's useful, but sure

All prices are theoretical right now. GPU prices found today will be different a week from now. For their part, ABS/Newegg is likely only paying wholesale price for the parts they're using anyway. So using MSRPs at least gives you an idea of the markup happening.

But ultimately it wasn't even meant to be "useful" really, it's not like anyone here is gonna buy this thing. I just did a thing because I was bored and shared it here because it was relevant to the discussion.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Jun 14, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

EvilBlackRailgun posted:

The best tech channel on youtube just uploaded a new video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmcZsQXOKEA

This guy's videos are exquisite. :discourse:

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

The point isn't for it to be useful, but for it to be interesting. And it succeeds at that, I think. It's neat.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Fame Douglas posted:

Those were always unbelievable.

It's not unbelievable when nvidia was openly posting job listings to work on DLSS for "gaming consoles" lmao (they only build SoCs for one console).

I believe the rumors were true but Nintendo backed down due to the current chip production situation. They decided they couldn't build enough of the switch pros, nor could they reach a price point they were happy with, and decided to only go with the OLED screen.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Okay, dude

edit: since you've edited your post:

Fame Douglas posted:

It was an entirely unbelievable rumor given the current limitations of the technology in terms of resolution and its silicon budget.

Nvidia is has added tensor cores to their Tegra line to make them DLSS capable. The current switch chip can't just have DLSS bolted onto it, but if they were to upgrade to a newer tegra (or maybe a custom cut-down version of one to reduce tdp), then DLSS is not entirely unrealistic. If Nintendo is sticking with Nvidia, then it's clear that this is where their future together is headed whenever they do their next new hardware launch. It's just a matter of when that launch is. My hunch is that it was supposed to happen soon-ish, hence the rumors, but the launch was pushed back due to market conditions. I'm not sure what's so implausible about this.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Jul 6, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

It really is amazing how good the built-in screen recording stuff is nowadays. I can record at a 30mbps bitrate and only lose 3 or 4 fps in a 140 fps game with my 5700 XT. I don't use it often, but I pretty much just keep the instant replay feature on all the time unless I'm running into framerate issues just in case.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

AMD also lets you use your system memory as the recording cache for its instant replay feature, which is really nice for people who have eschewed HDDs and are worried about writing too much temp data to their SSDs.

Thanks Ants posted:

Was it Half-Life that had to be recorded by dumping still images of each frame to disk and then reassembling them? And audio had to be captured separately? We've come a long way.

Maybe it's still like this (lol if anyone still uses it), but for a long time Fraps couldn't record anything but raw, uncompressed video data. So you'd end up with like 10GB of video on your 80GB hard drive after recording for 20 minutes at 800x600.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Jul 18, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Someone in the youtube comments pointed out that the actual metal chassis comes from the Dell Precision 3640 / 3650 series workstations. I checked out Dell's page for that, and yep. They're slapping gaming components into a workstation chasis while using substantially worse cooling and attaching an airflow-stifling plastic shell over it. At this point, I'm convinced that the entire consumer desktop side of Dell's business exists as a means of offloading surplus workstation/enterprise parts.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Klyith posted:

Dell didn't gently caress anything up.

Lmao. The weird nerds taking a bullet for elon musk meme but for loving Dell of all companies. Gotta defend Dell's dignity at all costs.

(Yes, Dell hosed up massively in multiple ways here)

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Klyith posted:

Ok, elaborate.

Dell put in zero effort towards understanding the guy's needs or letting him make an informed decision, and they actively misled him on multiple occasions, all while heavily overcharging him for poo poo he doesn't need. He obviously made a lot of really dumb decisions as well, but Dell's customer support could've made the problem go away much sooner had they actually been halfway competent. And they could've prevented the problem entirely with a better online shopping experience that actually informs inexperienced purchasers about the nature of their products and what they're meant for.

The guy who made the video hosed up, but to act like Dell is a perfect company that literally does nothing wrong is just a baffling take. Like, there's nuance to this story beyond "one side is a massive fuckup and the other side literally did nothing wrong." Dell's inability to let customers make informed choices and their labyrinthine customer service system are legendary, and it seems bizarre to act like those didn't play any role here at all.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

If you admit that their customer service and online shopping experience sucks, then maybe that's something they should be criticized for? I refuse to be harsh on the guy because criticizing an individual for making a dumb decision doesn't do anything. Calling out the multi-billion dollar corporation that turned his bad decision into a nightmare at least points the criticism in the more helpful direction.

Like, the other OEMs being just as bad does not exonerate Dell one bit from this. They are all terrible and need to be massively reformed/regulated.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

They simply misplaced the H710 and the TD500 on that chart.

I'm kind of surprised that the GPU runs as warm as it does in that case. Not that it runs especially hot or anything, but with three fans blowing up at it, I would've expected better performance. Perhaps with their positive pressure, limited exhaust approach, the front 180mms are overpowering the bottom intakes and those can't pull in as much air as a result?

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I've recently gotten super into LGR's videos and now I'm browsing ebay for 486 PC parts. Send help.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

KozmoNaut posted:

At least wear clothes that fit instead of some formless baggy mess and shorts with gigantically wide legs that go beneath the knees.

It's not that hard to buy a decent pair of jeans or well-cut shorts and a short sleeved shirt or polo shirt. Maybe you won't be the height of fashion, but at least you won't look like you just grabbed something at random from the closet, without turning on the lights.

he's just helping his brother move some furniture dude

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

GN Steve reigns victorious once again.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Their monitors are decent at least. They tend to make smart choices to reduce cost without sacrificing functionality, making for some pretty solid mid-budget displays that are competitive with the high-end displays out there. As for everything else they make, I think I'd rather stay away unless they're selling me a graphics card at msrp.

Speaking of gigabyte monitors, good news:

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

It doesn't have to snap in to be flush. I have a motherboard with a built-in IO shield too (most decent mobos come with one now) and it fits in very snugly.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jYB-RpkmUc

As an enjoyer of silence, I actually really dig the concept here. I wonder how a card with a lower TDP than a 3080 would hold up here.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Hopefully it gets cheaper once they get their kickstarter going and start making more of them, though I would still expect it to be at least a few hundred dollars.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Almost everyone who has worked for Linus since the early days are either still there with him or are still friends and make occasional appearances. He legitimately strikes me as a boss that cares about creating a good work environment. For being a rich tech bro, linus comes off as a pretty decent dude all things considered.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Sep 26, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I don't think anyone was seriously mad. I don't know what Monitor Steve meant when he said that people "lost their minds" over it, but I went searching for a few minutes and couldn't find anyone who was genuinely angry. :shrug:

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I don't really understand what the deal is here. Are you mad about the concept of tech youtubers in general, or are you mad that someone with a large platform is promoting environmental causes?

If you don't think that being a tech youtuber is inherently a bad thing, and if you don't think that promoting environmental causes is bad, then why would doing both together be bad?

Steve from GamersNexus posted a blog-ish post on their Patreon a couple weeks ago about how he's basically putting all of his personal income into local conservation efforts, with the most recent one being a parcel of land he saved from being turned into a parking lot so he can basically turn it into a park instead. Are you also mad about that?

I'm confused as to what the issue is here.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

mobby_6kl posted:

E: Linus reviews an Asus prebuilt system too: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BKVt0w7ZYeU

I don't fully agree with this one. The issue that led them to a misleading conclusion is that they compared the canadian retail price of the prebuilt (converted to USD) with the US retail prices of its components. The problem with this should be obvious to anyone familiar with canadian and US pricing (as I would expect LTT to be). The retail price of that exact same prebuilt is $1800 in the US, not $2200, which is the price they used for their comparison. Likewise, the parts of the individual components would be higher if they used canadian retail pricing for those. Either way, the end result is that the cost of the prebuilt is cheaper than the cost of the individual prices of the components when using scalper prices for GPUs. If you're at the point where you're considering buying a gpu from a scalper, it is absolutely worth considering a prebuilt instead and fixing it up if necessary.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 11:19 on Nov 3, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Mr.Radar posted:

It looks like LTT got jealous of all the fancy test equipment Gamers Nexus was buying:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pt3-6BsWlPk

This is very good news for everyone in the industry except maybe the large corporations that benefit from tech illiteracy. One of the biggest issues in the tech industry right now is the lack of awareness of how tech works among both the customers and the tech media. Take monitor reviews for example. There are way too many major tech media outlets that just read the specs off the box and then write a few subjective paragraphs about how it's like to use the monitor. Nobody seems to understand what half of the specs even mean. There are dedicated monitor review sites out there that suggest monitors based on their advertised gtg response times. TechPowerUp ranks the noise to performance efficiency for the fans they review based on CFM per decibel, which is just comically wrong. What is even going on with PSUs? It's impossible to know what's good or not without reading thousands of forum posts. And that applies for most products in the PC tech industry. The only products that get consistently decent reviews are graphics cards and CPUs, it seems. And a dumb media leads to dumb consumers. Both of these combined lead to a culture of dishonest marketing in the corporate tech world. Unless you're making a GPU or CPU, you can basically say anything, and most of the media—and the consumers—will take your word for it.

This is why Gamers Nexus is such a valuable resource for product reviews. They have a philosophy of rigorous testing standards that is second to none in this industry, but there's still a downward slide in standards happening. LTT hiring actual engineers to test products more rigorously is a great move. Hopefully their videos for more casual viewers will manage to educate them better on all the marketing BS going around these days, improving tech literacy all around. And they'll also hopefully be able to help raise awareness of the marketing BS in the tech media, leading everyone else to improve their own standards as well.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Nov 18, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Who's ready for the worst prebuilt yet?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqK9wR6KMLs

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Steve didn't say it in the video (he probably should have), but GN confirmed with ibuypower that they did indeed design the system that way. On purpose. With an entry-level fermi gpu. The hosed up amazon listing is the reseller's fault, though.

They also have listings on the microsoft store, newegg, and walmart, from different resellers. It seems ibuypower doesn't sell that system directly, but instead sells it to other retailers or resellers, hence not being on their site. But it is a legit ibuypower system.

There's a company that buys up old Dell 6th-gen intel optiplexes and resells them on newegg with 16gb of ram and an rx550 tossed in them for less than $450. Even those would be a huge improvement over this ibuypower abomination.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Nov 22, 2021

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

It gets a whopping 3 frames per second in red dead redemption 2, which is honestly more than I thought it would.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

gradenko_2000 posted:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cHn7VADBqyg

A Bulldozer APU with a Radeon R7 integrated GPU still does better than it

I think with RDR2, it was demanding more VRAM than the 730 had, and when that happens performance always craters. The fermi GT 730 has just 2GB... of DDR3. Meanwhile, the 5700G can run RDR2 at 1080p medium settings at over 30fps (though with some awful 1% and 0.1% lows). On paper, the 5700G is approximately 3.5 times as powerful as the fermi 730's GPU, so this disproportionate improvement tells us that even a pathetic GPU like this rebranded GT 430 can be held back by lovely memory configurations.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

LTT is like the biggest, most expensive example of this where they have over 40 employees now with a massive office, and they're buying new offices to expand even more. It seems ridiculous, until you realize that they run like 5 channels, and their videos are probably the most well-edited tech videos on youtube. Say what you will about a lot of the content, but the production work on their videos is seriously impressive, especially for a group that puts out videos every single day.

It seems like GN has a huge backlog of stuff that they've run most of the testing for and just need to write and film the content. Hopefully they can process that backlog more easily now that they've moved to a new office.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Arivia posted:

No, I don’t think Steve’s business plan is to get sued. Steve’s business plan is to provide scientifically rigorous, detailed and informative hardware journalism to consumers. Unfortunately, companies that do do that kind of thing often get sued by manufacturers who are unhappy when reviewers call out issues with their products.

If a company can demonstrate that a review cost them business (such as Gigabyte or NZXT), that is grounds for a defamation lawsuit, same as you hear people getting sued over negative Yelp reviews. When GN claims that a product is bad or defective as a legal defense, they must be able to prove that legally. GN is setting themselves up so that they can legally defend themselves if they are sued. Not that they want to be sued but they are making sure they do things right so they are hopefully safe if they are sued.

Steve has proven himself to be a careful, forward thinking, pragmatic person at least as far as GN goes. He and his staff are working to keep the company/brand/etc safe and viable so that it doesn’t get destroyed when someone goes “you said my fans were bad” (which is what they say they’re going to be testing on the new fan tester).

Is this common? I can't seem to recall a lawsuit of this sort ever popping up in America. If it has, I have a hard time believing that it's commonplace. And in any case, I have no idea how this is meant to protect them during a lawsuit. They would most likely have to reveal most of this information during one anyway. If anything, it would hurt them by hiding this information. They would need to prove that their data is legitimate, and they'd do so by proving that their testing equipment and procedures are legitimate.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Gamers Nexus is auctioning off one of their exploded gigabyte power supplies signed by Steve and Patrick Stone in support of an e-waste recycling organization: https://www.ebay.com/itm/324958862408

Video about their e-waste disposal/recycling and also a tour of the the beneficiary of the above charity auction:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6LM_gNdG9c

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Yeah, I don't know what the point of that video was, exactly. They just stare at some circuit boards for a while waiting for something to happen, and nothing does. At this point, you'd think they'd go "well, this video's a wash" and try to approach it from another angle, but they just put the video of nothing happening up with no firm conclusions other than "dunno, guess some monitors just shipped defective?" I was hoping for an actual investigation on the scale of the Gigabyte PSUs.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

MLID has had unique information about Arc that has turned out to be correct (such as the appearance of the reference GPUs), so he actually does have some legit sources at Intel. I'll believe that he has legit sources elsewhere too, but he's also leaked some total BS in the past, and he also misinterprets some of his own leaks and says some wild poo poo from time to time. So you have to take everything MLID says with a huge grain of salt. He's not a total rumor regurgitator/BS spewer, but he's still plain wrong a fair percentage of the time.

That said, nothing in that video is hard to believe.

Begall posted:

https://youtu.be/xBDFCoGhZ4g

Turns out that no, modern games are not bottlenecked by 4C/8T 🤔

I mean, it's clearly weaker than most of the six-core parts, so I don't know if this is the takeaway here. They also didn't test many (any?) CPU-bound games that are heavily multi-threaded like Halo Infinite, or BF2042. I still see this more of a general-purpose productivity CPU for cheap workstations, but it looks like it will also be decent as a budget gaming CPU. Though I feel like even budget gamers should pay the extra $50 for a 12400.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 11:04 on Jan 11, 2022

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Begall posted:

It finishes above the 3600 in most/all benchmarks and is competitive with the 11400F, 3900x and 9900k in many benchmarks. And this is using a 3080Ti as the GPU (something I think we can agree is not exactly a budget gamer GPU), deliberately emphasising the differences between the CPUs. I think this absolutely demonstrates the flaw in thinking 6C+ for gaming is mandatory - I doubt on a right-sized GPU that you could find any gaming differences between it and a 12400.

I mean, saying the bottleneck disappears with a weak enough GPU isn't the same as saying there's no bottleneck. And these are old parts you're comparing it against. Compared to its contemporaries, it's definitely weaker than the 6 core CPUs. The 12400 reviews that are out so far have it as very competitive if not a little better than the 5600X in gaming, so it has a clear advantage over the 12100. That's not entirely down to core count, but it's a part of the picture. Ultimately, core count isn't what makes a CPU good or bad—it's its overall power level, and core counts are simply one part of that equation. The 12100 is weaker than the 12400 because it has a lower clock speed and less cache, but also because it has fewer cores. It seems fairly plausible to me that it would be scoring better on some of these benchmarks if it had six.

Don't get me wrong, it's good that it's able to perform so well compared to higher end parts from just a few years ago, but that's also sort of what I expect from a new CPU architecture.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

repiv posted:

gamersnexus rarely delves into image quality analysis, digitalfoundry are the main guys for that

i'm not sure what AI really brings to the table for a downscaler (it's not like they need to infer any missing information) but we'll see how it goes

Choosing which pixels to toss and which to keep seems important for having the best image quality.

This is going to come with a heavy performance penalty in any game that isn't CPU bottlenecked. Nvidia is talking like you're saving so much FPS over regular DSR, and I guess you are, but you can still probably expect to see your FPS drop in half in games that aren't CPU limited, right?

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Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

repiv posted:

Why toss away any pixels though? It's all good data

To make the final image? The goal is to downscale a high-res image into a low-res one. That requires throwing away pixels.

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