|
The Colonel posted:technically, omikron is an isekai game LawfulWaffle posted:"Another World is a famous example of a rotoscoped isekai* game" Heart of Darkness would count though, with your treehouse-made laser gun is the most powerful weapon in the world.
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 21:02 |
|
|
Ar Tonelico is the oldest JRPG I can remember whose marketing was entirely "are you horny? well so is this game!!!"
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:45
|
|
|
Chev posted:Isn't a key element of isekai that the protagonist possesses some kind of otaku skill useless in their original world that turns out to be all-powerful and/or extremely relevant and makes them a key player in the new one? I mean, you could vaguely make an argument for Omikron because the demons specifically target video game players and your skills as a player (no to mention patience for quantic dream second act derails and bad gameplay) will see you through the end as the chosen one but in Another World you're hopelessly outmatched throughout and nothing good ever happens to you. i don't think that's a required thing, it's just a way to add a spin to the story. like the dude in re:zero not really being super powered so much as mega cursed in a way he has to plan around cheetah7071 posted:Ar Tonelico is the oldest JRPG I can remember whose marketing was entirely "are you horny? well so is this game!!!" it's funny because at least in at1 it kind of just. ends at the game having some sexual innuendo. the actual plot of ar tonelico turns out to be more about, emotional support and understanding and the ending is literally a battle against the barriers set up by a victim of severe emotional and physical abuse out of their own fear of the world, in order to comfort them and let them live a happier life The Colonel fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Jul 31, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:50
|
|
|
Chev posted:Isn't a key element of isekai that the protagonist possesses some kind of otaku skill useless in their original world that turns out to be all-powerful and/or extremely relevant and makes them a key player in the new one? I mean, you could vaguely make an argument for Omikron because the demons specifically target video game players and your skills as a player (no to mention patience for quantic dream second act derails and bad gameplay) will see you through the end as the chosen one but in Another World you're hopelessly outmatched throughout and nothing good ever happens to you. Having an uber power is a common trope but not required. There's even at least one isekai whose schtick is that the protag is not special at all other than being from the real world.
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:51
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/DudeDra/status/1024296312060215296
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:52
|
|
|
I played the first Ar Tonelico and it was cute but also it beat you over the head with the innuendos It also was cool for letting me charge my support character to an insane level and laying down a massive attack on a poor sod
|
|
#
?
Jul 31, 2018 23:59
|
|
|
The Colonel posted:it's funny because at least in at1 it kind of just. ends at the game having some sexual innuendo. the actual plot of ar tonelico turns out to be more about, emotional support and understanding and the ending is literally a battle against the barriers set up by a victim of severe emotional and physical abuse out of their own fear of the world, in order to comfort them and let them live a happier life that level of innuendo was pretty scandalous at the time like all PS2 JRPGs it's the story of a boring, bland male protagonist emotionally and physically supporting a much more interesting heroine (though there's two of them this time what a twist) while she works through her problems they're cool heroines though
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:00
|
|
|
Chev posted:Isn't a key element of isekai that the protagonist possesses some kind of otaku skill useless in their original world that turns out to be all-powerful and/or extremely relevant and makes them a key player in the new one? I mean, you could vaguely make an argument for Omikron because the demons specifically target video game players and your skills as a player (no to mention patience for quantic dream second act derails and bad gameplay) will see you through the end as the chosen one but in Another World you're hopelessly outmatched throughout and nothing good ever happens to you.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:01
|
|
|
Edit: misread
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:05
|
|
|
LawfulWaffle posted:Excuse me, the protagonist of Another World clearly uses his Earthling intellect to rock a hanging cage back and forth to free himself. None of the indigenous prisoners had figured that out, and it's what leads to the alien revolution His power is smallness
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:08
|
|
|
Looking through the list of PS2 JRPGs I've play, it's only like half of them that have the cool heroine and bland hero who is inexplicably the actual main character dynamic
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:10
|
|
|
wait, i have a compromise real yakuza use a gamepad, keyboard will never help you
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:10
|
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:Should I throw it onto my Gamefly queue above Octopath Traveler? Or is this a goof between the two of them I'd probably put octopath higher tho, but it is a difficult comparison sometimes because the atelier style is very appealing
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:12
|
|
|
cheetah7071 posted:Looking through the list of PS2 JRPGs I've play, it's only like half of them that have the cool heroine and bland hero who is inexplicably the actual main character dynamic i think tales of symphonia is still like the most egregious example
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:13
|
|
|
cheetah7071 posted:Looking through the list of PS2 JRPGs I've play, it's only like half of them that have the cool heroine and bland hero who is inexplicably the actual main character dynamic
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:13
|
|
|
corn in the bible posted:Yes. The fine posters in adtrw claimed that kill la kill was going to be a satire of fanservicey animes but then it just actually was one and they were dumb Its not so black and white. Lots of people think Bayonetta is fanservicy but it was designed by a woman to be empowering. Lipstick feminism is a thing. Women can be sexual for themselves and not just because of the male gaze. Kill La Kill kinda goes both ways. Darling in the Franxxx on the other hand... lol.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:14
|
|
|
I can actually see the reason for having the main character be relatively bland compared to the "focus" character--the character the plot is about almost definitionally has to have strong ties to the story's world. The main character usually wants to be someone who doesn't know very much, so that there can be tutorials and exposition for their benefit. Of course, the main character always being male and focus character always being female is just this homeless snail posted:you cant make a girl the main character in a video game haha, you gotta have the boring boy player insert protag
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:15
|
|
|
to reiterate: Trails in the Sky is good
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:18
|
|
|
I thought the Tidus/Yuna dynamic in FFX worked since the entire plot kind of hinges on Tidus being a dumb jock who doesn't know what's going on.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:19
|
|
|
Making Jr. the main character in Xenosaga Ep 2 though, what were they thinking.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:20
|
|
|
homeless snail posted:you cant make a girl the main character in a video game haha, you gotta have the boring boy player insert protag -hideo baba, five minutes before getting kicked off the plane so that tales of berseria could be made Zaphod42 posted:Its not so black and white. Lots of people think Bayonetta is fanservicy but it was designed by a woman to be empowering. Lipstick feminism is a thing. Women can be sexual for themselves and not just because of the male gaze. i don't really think, kill la kill has any kind of point it wanted to go for in the end, empowering or otherwise cheetah7071 posted:I can actually see the reason for having the main character be relatively bland compared to the "focus" character--the character the plot is about almost definitionally has to have strong ties to the story's world. The main character usually wants to be someone who doesn't know very much, so that there can be tutorials and exposition for their benefit. i think ffx is kind of alright about it, since tidus ends up getting tied into the plot in a decent way without totally overtaking yuna's role as a lead. tales of xillia is kind of an odd one about this stuff cause both jude and milla are definitely written to be co-leads but it's clear that for the same reasons everything else in xillia feels kinda messy, jude kinda gets more focus overall
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:20
|
|
|
exquisite tea posted:I thought the Tidus/Yuna dynamic in FFX worked since the entire plot kind of hinges on Tidus being a dumb jock who doesn't know what's going on. Yeah it kinda does. I'm getting sick of the fish out of water protagonists though cheetah7071 posted:The main character usually wants to be someone who doesn't know very much, so that there can be tutorials and exposition for their benefit. This works but it works so well everybody does it all the time  FFXV's boy-band character dynamic worked so dang well. I want another game like that, but we really really need women in the party, and ideally also some kind of non-human weirdo thing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:22
|
|
|
The Colonel posted:i don't really think, kill la kill has any kind of point it wanted to go for in the end, empowering or otherwise It is mostly style without substance, yeah. And I never finished it. I saw it having some cool themes about puberty ala FLCL, which is easily one of my favorite anime of all time.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:23
|
|
|
i'm excited for whatever the next tales game is cause the series is leaning more into less genre standard protags and that owns
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:23
|
|
|
My favorite PS2 JRPG stories are Valkyrie Profile 2 and Disgaea. If anything Disgaea has the reverse situation where you have the supportive heroines helping the hero work through poo poo, though the boy is still the main character. VP2 just doesn't fit anywhere on this axis and it owns
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:25
|
|
|
This talk reminds me that Shadow Hearts was mostly so good with unique JRPG protagonists, Koudelka and Yuri were just fantastic. Johnny was pretty lame in comparison and exactly what you're all describing, but FTNW was still a good game. Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Aug 1, 2018 |
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:27
|
|
|
exquisite tea posted:I thought the Tidus/Yuna dynamic in FFX worked since the entire plot kind of hinges on Tidus being a dumb jock who doesn't know what's going on.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:28
|
|
|
Yeah I think FFX is the only game with that dynamic I've played where it 100% worked
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:29
|
|
|
i think tales of the abyss is actually pretty funny coming right off of symphonia for how it similarly has a setup of a dumbass kid following around a group of people who have a way better picture of what's going on, but it actually frames the entire story around how his lack of understanding extends to him not really understanding himself as a person and all of the mistakes that he makes because of that. and it does all of it without forgetting tear's own stakes and growth in everything that happens
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:32
|
|
|
At the time I was so used to not really liking the male lead of JRPGs it came as a massive shock when Tales of the Abyss came out and told me that this time I wasn't supposed to like him
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:33
|
|
|
cheetah7071 posted:At the time I was so used to not really liking the male lead of JRPGs it came as a massive shock when Tales of the Abyss came out and told me that this time I wasn't supposed to like him i like luke a lot, because his growth as a character heavily recontextualizes everything about him constantly across the entire game and he's never just solidly portrayed as a bad person or as a pure being of good who does no harm. he's just, kind of an idiot who fucks up a lot even in the first act his fear of killing isn't actually portrayed as a weakness, and it's an aspect of his personality that other people in the cast respond to and grow from as the story progresses
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:37
|
|
|
The Colonel posted:i like luke a lot, because his growth as a character heavily recontextualizes everything about him constantly across the entire game and he's never just solidly portrayed as a bad person or as a pure being of good who does no harm. he's just, kind of an idiot who fucks up a lot Yeah he's an interesting character because he starts thoroughly unlikable and grows out of it. If he was beginning-of-the-game Luke the whole time he'd be terrible
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:38
|
|
|
exquisite tea posted:Making Jr. the main character in Xenosaga Ep 2 though, what were they thinking. they were thinking they were going to get a lot more games because iirc each volume was supposed to have a different protag or somesuch.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:39
|
|
|
my favorite moment in FFX, is how supportive and positive Tidus is about Yuna's pilgrimage and then he suddenly has the rug pulled out from under him when he realizes that he's the only one that doesn't know that actually Yuna is preparing to commit ritual suicide. its a big betrayal to tidus & the player because its a huge part of the world that everyone deliberately neglects to tell you about. still stings when I replay itThe Colonel posted:i think tales of the abyss is actually pretty funny coming right off of symphonia for how it similarly has a setup of a dumbass kid following around a group of people who have a way better picture of what's going on, but it actually frames the entire story around how his lack of understanding extends to him not really understanding himself as a person and all of the mistakes that he makes because of that. and it does all of it without forgetting tear's own stakes and growth in everything that happens
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:42
|
|
|
Zaphod42 posted:FFXV's boy-band character dynamic worked so dang well. I want another game like that, but we really really need women in the party, and ideally also some kind of non-human weirdo thing. Breath of Fire 2, but Ryu is a woman.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:48
|
|
|
The new thread title should be: Augustus Bloop
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:50
|
|
|
Zaphod42 posted:FFXV's boy-band character dynamic worked so dang well. I want another game like that, but we really really need women in the party, and ideally also some kind of non-human weirdo thing. Scooby-Doo?
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:51
|
|
|
homeless snail posted:its a big betrayal to tidus & the player because its a huge part of the world that everyone deliberately neglects to tell you about. Really? It was pretty obvious before you leave on the pilgrimage that she was on her way to death. I get it being a surprise to Tidus but if you talk to the NPCs in the first town that all the characters besides Tidus live in I'm pretty sure its spelled out for you if you're paying attention.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:53
|
|
|
In Valkyrie Profile, I’ve been improving people’s traits (e.g. Snobbish, Brave, etc.) at the exclusion of combat stats, because maybe I’ll get rewarded for it? Am I wasting my time?
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 21:02 |
|
|
Jay Rust posted:In Valkyrie Profile, I’ve been improving people’s traits (e.g. Snobbish, Brave, etc.) at the exclusion of combat stats, because maybe I’ll get rewarded for it? Am I wasting my time? The only purpose of those stats is to make them better soldiers for Odin in Asgard (in particular, Freya will ask for einherjar with certain characteristics). They don't do anything for you in the party.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2018 00:55
|
|