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Nazgul posted:They don't go into it further beyond the fact it was Venom's idea but she liked it. I don't think it'd be a good conversation to try to work out exactly how PROBLEMATIC the movie venom is but the hero getting to kiss the girl because she was mind controlled but her liking it is the most 80s thing imaginable and it really is true that this whole movie feels like it slipped in from some other universe where this was made in like 1994 or something. Like everything about it feels so throwback, but not even in a nostalgic way, just like they hired someone that never watched another movie since the exact day he read the first venom comic.
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Oct 14, 2018 01:12
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What would making it rated R have functionally allowed? Just more blood or something?
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Oct 14, 2018 01:29
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Drifter posted:What would making it rated R have functionally allowed? Just more blood or something? Having a lack of blood or gore when gigantic razor blade arms swoop across a crowd full of people is more jarring than otherwise. Owlofcreamcheese posted:I don't think it'd be a good conversation to try to work out exactly how PROBLEMATIC the movie venom is but the hero getting to kiss the girl because she was mind controlled but her liking it is the most 80s thing imaginable and it really is true that this whole movie feels like it slipped in from some other universe where this was made in like 1994 or something. Yeah, I'm sure they didn't mean to seem like that and more people seem to think Venom kissed him over the girl, but the lack of info leads me to only speculate What Would Venom Do? Which is a question that belongs on the bumper of a car tbh.
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Oct 14, 2018 01:52
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I don't think the kiss was that farfetched she said she loved him, they were engaged, and he was just vindicated about the bad guy being bad. Did they NEED to kiss? Definitely, no, it was a complete asspull. Something that did bother me though was that apparently symbiotes can just fall out of their hosts like nothing and switch hosts on a whim. If not for that there would not be a lady venom kissing scene though I'm sure they would still kiss anyways. I like the idea that the symbiotes in the movie were apparently like a beefy special forces A-Team. It would have been cool if we got to see the other two symbiotes maybe their codenames would be like "Tango" "Buzzsaw" "Maverick". Or just any name from "The Running Man". It really sucked that Dora died I wanted to see her hook up with Dan after Venom inevitably got back together with Annie.
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Oct 14, 2018 01:56
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The whole kiss thing seemed so fetishy and weirder the more you thought about it. My best guess on the logic was venom didn't actually infect the lady and was just physically encasing her. Because this movie seemed really harsh on how damaging symbiote infections are. And we saw how transfer usually goes: literally a one second touch that makes the person's eyes flash instead of the mass of the blob being on the outside and having to physically enter the person's face.
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Oct 14, 2018 02:11
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:did venom mind control the ex wife lady to make out with eddie, physically control her or ask her to do it? That whole scene seems really creepy in retrospect.
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Oct 14, 2018 02:22
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TheMopeSquad posted:I like the idea that the symbiotes in the movie were apparently like a beefy special forces A-Team. It would have been cool if we got to see the other two symbiotes maybe their codenames would be like "Tango" "Buzzsaw" "Maverick". Or just any name from "The Running Man". For the hell of it, here's a list of every symbiote name from the comics. All of them pretty much work for this. - Venom - Carnage - Riot - Lasher - Phage - Agony - Scream - Hybrid - Toxin - Scorn - Mania/Maniac - Rex
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Oct 14, 2018 03:36
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Gavok posted:For the hell of it, here's a list of every symbiote name from the comics. All of them pretty much work for this. Please tell me that this is the goodest symboyite.
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Oct 14, 2018 03:54
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Man I didn't know Tom Hardy was this good at comedy, and I now want to see him recreate several of Charlie's best scenes from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. It's a fun movie. I like how it starts pretty serious more or less, but the comedy builds as the story becomes more absurd. It's as much a monster movie as a superhero flick and in that regards, hugely entertaining.
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Oct 14, 2018 03:56
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PJOmega posted:Please tell me that this is the goodest symboyite. No, that would be Lasher.  Rex was part of a failed experiment when the government tried giving soldiers symbiotes in Vietnam (in a story called, awesomely enough, Ve'nam). One of the hosts was named Rex Strickland and when he died, the symbiote took his form and copied his personality.
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Oct 14, 2018 04:14
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I was kind of disappointed with the direction this movie went at first, but then I though to myself, what if a studio tasked me with writing a script to a Venom movie that couldn't have any references to Spider-Man at all? Venom works as a comic book character works since both the Symbiote and Eddie Brock hate Spider-Man/Peter Parker in their own ways. And then when they combine it makes a villain that is pretty unique as far as comic book villains go. With that in mind I can see why they went with the change of Tom Hardy playing Eddie as being a naive person who gets attached to a creature that is violent in nature since that goes against a normal human's sense of right and wrong. As far as the stinger scene suggest, it looks like they are going straight into Carnage territory which I think is probably not the right idea. A better idea I think would be to delve into the Venom: Lethal Protector story line since then you get the juxtaposition of Eddie trying to do the right thing against the symbiote which just wants to kill/eat everyone since that is the simplest course of action.
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Oct 14, 2018 05:46
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Doesn’t take away from the matter but part of the symbiotic-host relationship that’s touched on in the comics talks about how the Venom symbiote was spurned and rejected by Peter as if it was a lover but it would go back to him any chance it got if he’d have it back and he does that in the comics getting it to separate from Eddie. Plus the “Ive had it up my butt!” Comment. I’d say the kiss scene was more of a twisted play on that sort of relationship but done through Michelle Williams. They say there isn’t but if there’s scenes on the cutting room that expand the movie like Hardy says I’d like to see it.
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Oct 14, 2018 14:16
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Did I miss something or did this movie have a plot point where in Eddie had to deliver pictures via a smart phone in person to his former journalist team, necessitating breaking and entering, climbing a huge building, and battling countless henchmen. It's a smart phone. Why didn't he just email the pictures? For what it's worth, this is no question, a bad movie, but is a lot of fun. Those saying it feels like it came from the early 2000s are spot on. I think what saves it, especially after the dreadful first half, is that Venom as a antihero is quite funny and fresh in that they're not shy of showing him bite a head off or two from people who probably didn't deserve it. Interesting to see a 30% rotten critic rating with a 89% audience score.
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Oct 14, 2018 14:20
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Isometric Bacon posted:Interesting to see a 30% rotten critic rating with a 89% audience score. Either critics are out of touch, conspiring against X studio/director/actor or hate fun. Or the general moviegoing public just likes trash and is causing the slow death of film. Or RT is an awful metric.
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Oct 14, 2018 15:44
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Steve2911 posted:Either critics are out of touch, conspiring against X studio/director/actor or hate fun. Or the general moviegoing public just likes trash and is causing the slow death of film. I feel like movie critics by and large just don’t know what to do with movies that are cinematic dumpster fires but also wildly entertaining. By pretty much any critical standard, Venom is a real bad movie. The tone is inconsistent, the writing is a mess, the cinematography and score are nothing special, the CGI is shoddy. The only thing I think most people could agree is actually good is Tom Hardy’s performance. It’s a bad movie. It’s also really loving fun.
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Oct 14, 2018 18:23
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Steve2911 posted:Either critics are out of touch, conspiring against X studio/director/actor or hate fun. Or the general moviegoing public just likes trash and is causing the slow death of film. I think movies are good and bad on a bunch of different metrics. Is cars 2 a better or worse movie than food fight? The answer varies wildly based on what you mean by "better".
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Oct 14, 2018 20:33
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Vakal posted:As far as the stinger scene suggest, it looks like they are going straight into Carnage territory which I think is probably not the right idea. There probably won't be a third movie for him to appear in so better to do it as soon as possible.
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Oct 15, 2018 04:08
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I reiterate: they should have just made Carnage the villain in this, and expanded the concept beyond that for sequels. Aesthetically, Riot is just Carnage with a duller color scheme.
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Oct 15, 2018 04:14
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Avengers 5: Maximum Carnage
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Oct 15, 2018 04:17
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Doctor Faustine posted:and score are nothing special Ahem, there is a brand new Run the Jewels track on there you know.  Although that Eminem track made me lol irl.
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Oct 15, 2018 04:41
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two things out of many 253) This movie and another movie that came out in the united states in the same week called a star is born share the same cinematographer. as people of the thread have commented the movie looks like dogshit from the aesthetics to the bad-transformers fight scenes. a star is born however 1) has no aliens from the stars in it and 2) has been praised up and down for its "cinematography." the man who shot both movies got an oscar nom for black swan and is an early contender for the same nom for this movie. 430) some months back logan marshal "low rent tom hardy" green was in a movie called upgrade. it is about a man who is a bit of a loser who is symbiotically attached to a inhuman intelligence who murders people for him as he apologizes profusely. logan marshal green did some good campy body work for that film. lmg is in a pretty good miniseries called quarry that most people should enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hca2Xj_t2sw the first episode is on youtube with hardbaked spanish subtitles.
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Oct 15, 2018 04:47
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atrus50 posted:two things out of many Go back to your goddamn book, Atrus, we don't need you drive-by shitposting in here
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Oct 15, 2018 04:49
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Axetrain posted:Ahem, there is a brand new Run the Jewels track on there you know. It didn't bang tho
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Oct 15, 2018 11:05
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Fart City posted:I reiterate: they should have just made Carnage the villain in this, and expanded the concept beyond that for sequels. Aesthetically, Riot is just Carnage with a duller color scheme. This is what I hate about comic movies they always halfass the first one with some throwaway villain(s) then if it bombs you never get a chance to see a good villain. Like Sinestro in Green Lantern or Leader in Hulk are two that come to mind. Fantastic Four had another shot but still hosed up with fart cloud Galactus.
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Oct 15, 2018 19:42
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Doctor Faustine posted:I feel like movie critics by and large just don’t know what to do with movies that are cinematic dumpster fires but also wildly entertaining. By pretty much any critical standard, Venom is a real bad movie. The tone is inconsistent, the writing is a mess, the cinematography and score are nothing special, the CGI is shoddy. The only thing I think most people could agree is actually good is Tom Hardy’s performance. It’s a bad movie. Critics are people as well, and I've seen loads that can appreciate what a film is trying to do, even if it's not their cup of tea. Mark Kermode is usually good at this. But they still have jobs to do, and giving Venom a good review is like giving a good review to the Room. Yes it's a lot of fun to watch, but it's also a poorly made piece of poo poo. How do you professionally grade something like that? I can't really blame the critics.
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Oct 16, 2018 18:39
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It is kind of weird that all these reviews are "It's total poo poo but really enjoyable"
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Oct 16, 2018 18:54
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Hollismason posted:It is kind of weird that all these reviews are "It's total poo poo but really enjoyable" This film is a great example of the technical components being occasionally lacking, but the delivery and absurdity make it less distracting that stuff like the script, editing, pacing, and tone are all over the place. e: This movie is a lot like some of the F&F films for me, some aren't objectively good, but they are massively entertaining and that deserves recognition and credit. This movie has some issues, but if you enjoy comic/super hero films then this is an enjoyable entry into the genre. The Notorious ZSB fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Oct 17, 2018 |
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Oct 16, 2018 20:24
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CityMidnightJunky posted:Critics are people as well, and I've seen loads that can appreciate what a film is trying to do, even if it's not their cup of tea. Mark Kermode is usually good at this. But they still have jobs to do, and giving Venom a good review is like giving a good review to the Room. Yes it's a lot of fun to watch, but it's also a poorly made piece of poo poo. How do you professionally grade something like that? I can't really blame the critics. I mean, I feel like the solution is to eliminate a standard of objective quality for films, so don’t stick a number at the end, and if a movie is poorly-made but entertaining then just admit it. This is less of a problem for movies than it is other mediums, but Rotten Tomatoes sure does enforce their binary goals onto a review. I also don’t like the idea that Tom Hardy’s goofy-rear end acting or the movie’s new take on Venom being a dork are “accidents” and not things you should include in your analysis of the movie. Lord knows everything about the Street Fighter movie didn’t stop Raul Julia from being amazing.
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Oct 16, 2018 23:52
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By what metric is this really poorly made though? It’s trying to be a dark comic monster movie and, well, is. The plot makes sense and doesn’t get bogged down in exposition, the humor works and builds in a nice way, the photography is I guess just okay but I didn’t see anything egregiously ugly either.
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Oct 17, 2018 02:31
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It’s just kind of rough around the edges. The pieces don’t lock in perfectly. To me that’s a pro rather than a con because I dig messy films that work for the most part. I feel like without Tom Hardy I’d be a bland worthless product though.
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Oct 17, 2018 02:39
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If you had told me six months ago that Venom was going to be more fun than The Predator, despite both being nearly incoherent at parts, I would have called you nuts. But here we are.
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Oct 17, 2018 05:10
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God. Yeah. So sad.
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Oct 17, 2018 05:13
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Maxwell Lord posted:By what metric is this really poorly made though? It’s trying to be a dark comic monster movie and, well, is. The plot makes sense and doesn’t get bogged down in exposition, the humor works and builds in a nice way, the photography is I guess just okay but I didn’t see anything egregiously ugly either. It looks like poo poo. The script is awful. The first hour drags on for years. The forced bloodlessness is jarring. The plot is about as generic as it gets. It has an enjoyable performance in the second half. That's great, but it doesn't make it good.
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Oct 17, 2018 06:23
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Maxwell Lord posted:By what metric is this really poorly made though? It’s trying to be a dark comic monster movie and, well, is. The plot makes sense and doesn’t get bogged down in exposition, the humor works and builds in a nice way, the photography is I guess just okay but I didn’t see anything egregiously ugly either. honestly i feel like the movie could use a bit more exposition like not a lot but alittle.
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Oct 17, 2018 06:25
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The movie is entirely carried by Hardy, who does a phenomenal job, but there are parts that for me didn't work. The bad guy annoying and came off as whiny, and it was difficult to take him seriously (which I suppose may be the point), and i found venoms heel turn to be a bit abrupt. The first 30 minutes are kind of boring too, but despite these flaws it's still entertaining, and I would love to see the 30 or so minutes they cut out
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Oct 17, 2018 08:43
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The plot doesn't make a whole lot of sense and the three big action set pieces are garbage, particularly the last one on the rocket gantry holy heck.
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Oct 17, 2018 10:57
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I'd be more harsh on the terrible CGI on CGI in the dark fight-scene if it wasn't for the fact that Black Panther ended in the exact same rubbish way.
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Oct 17, 2018 14:42
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Isometric Bacon posted:Did I miss something or did this movie have a plot point where in Eddie had to deliver pictures via a smart phone in person to his former journalist team, necessitating breaking and entering, climbing a huge building, and battling countless henchmen. The same reason people in TV / movies never make a copy of any sensitive digital information that bad guys are chasing them over, and keep it on a single floppy disk / memory chip / whatever that they inevitably have to hand over to the bad guys as a bargaining chip.
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Oct 17, 2018 14:59
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MiddleOne posted:I'd be more harsh on the terrible CGI on CGI in the dark fight-scene if it wasn't for the fact that Black Panther ended in the exact same rubbish way. i didn't have too much problem figuring out what was going on but it would have been way better to make riot more white instead of dark grey
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Oct 17, 2018 15:46
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MiddleOne posted:I'd be more harsh on the terrible CGI on CGI in the dark fight-scene if it wasn't for the fact that Black Panther ended in the exact same rubbish way. I could see what was going on in Black Panther, and the two things fighting weren't amorphous blobs.
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Oct 17, 2018 17:45
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