SSSS.Dynazenon - Beast Wars is Essential Watching (Dynazenon Chat Starts on pg 31)

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Arist: Feb 13, 2012; _{who, me?}

I think people say that because Yuta is only in Gridman for like two minutes

# ? Feb 12, 2023 22:31

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# ? May 7, 2024 08:30

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

Fivemarks posted:

They literally s-

Am I the only person who watched the show? Are we all so anime brain poisoned that we need to go full on "no Subtext Whatsoever" whenever there's a het relationship in anime, otherwise people with home in on a relationship between two girls and assume that's the only romance going or chemistry going on?

did you just fly in from reddit or something? getting people to acknowledge lesbian relationships in media even when its literal text is like pulling teeth, its not the hets who are oppressed

# ? Feb 12, 2023 22:50

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

i cant believe people saw the show where the ed is entirely about rikka and akane and half the official art is rikka and akane in wedding dresses hugging each other and assumed the show was leading them that way. heterophobia at work? you decide.

# ? Feb 12, 2023 22:51

Waffleman_: Jan 20, 2011; I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

Hell, Gridman was actually unique for how it didn't just put the main guy and main girl together at the end.

# ? Feb 12, 2023 23:00

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

Yuta/Gridman doesn't even interact with Rikka a lot in the second half of the series!

# ? Feb 12, 2023 23:57

Runa: Feb 13, 2011

People are complaining that Rikka and Akane was a rugpull and aren't interested in Rikka being with Yuta, simple as.

No need to write heterophobia on a windmill to tilt at.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 00:10

Blockhouse: Sep 7, 2014; You Win!

In what way was it a rugpull

# ? Feb 13, 2023 01:23

Fivemarks: Feb 21, 2015

Man I don't know what media you're watching, or Actually maybe I'm just spending too much time with crappy people who treat every single relationship between two female or male characters as if it HAS to be romantic, because i'm much more used to dealing with people trying to say that every single relationship between two men or two women in a show has to be romantic.

Which is not as bad as erasing LGBT+ relationships, but its still feels weird to me.

Edit: As far as I care, Rikka and Akane having a thing is a perfectly valid read. But so is them being close friends, that's also a valid read. But so is Akane and Rikka's closeness being a metaphor for IRL Akane being unable to love herself. There's a lot of valid reads, because I don't think that close emotional relationships are necessarily only of the romantic kind.

Fivemarks fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Feb 13, 2023

# ? Feb 13, 2023 01:40

Lessail: Apr 1, 2011; tell me how vgk aren't playing like shit again

p.s. help my grapes are so sour!

looking forward to lycoreco s2/movie

# ? Feb 13, 2023 01:51

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

Fivemarks posted:

Man I don't know what media you're watching, or Actually maybe I'm just spending too much time with crappy people who treat every single relationship between two female or male characters as if it HAS to be romantic, because i'm much more used to dealing with people trying to say that every single relationship between two men or two women in a show has to be romantic.

heterophobia is real and its plaguing this nation.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 01:58

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

for real though people that like bl and yuri a lot exist but most of those people arent actually the dominant force in society or even in a fanbase and 9 times out of 10 any time a gay relationship or gay interpretation gets remotely popular in a fanbase it gets shouted down constantly or treated as deranged, even if its basically explicit

my personal favorite example of this is whenever lesbian pairings get popular in genshin fandom the ao3 fanfic tags get flooded with fic of them getting sexually assaulted by men. you know, normal behavior that proves that 'crappy people who treat every single relationship between two female or male characters as if it HAS to be romantic' are the dominant force in online discourse.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:00

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

when i was a kid i got banned from a utena forum for saying that i thought utena and anthy were gay.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:00

lih: May 15, 2013; Just a friendly reminder of what it looks like.

We'll do punctuation later.

Fivemarks posted:

Man I don't know what media you're watching, or Actually maybe I'm just spending too much time with crappy people who treat every single relationship between two female or male characters as if it HAS to be romantic, because i'm much more used to dealing with people trying to say that every single relationship between two men or two women in a show has to be romantic.

Which is not as bad as erasing LGBT+ relationships, but its still feels weird to me.

Edit: As far as I care, Rikka and Akane having a thing is a perfectly valid read. But so is them being close friends, that's also a valid read. But so is Akane and Rikka's closeness being a metaphor for IRL Akane being unable to love herself. There's a lot of valid reads, because I don't think that close emotional relationships are necessarily only of the romantic kind.

maybe you should stop exclusively talking to the goofiest gay shippers if you think they're so weird idk

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:07

Runa: Feb 13, 2011

Blockhouse posted:

In what way was it a rugpull

mostly the ED if I'm being honest

EDs baiting more interesting relationships than are actually in the show are also a time honored anime tradition so I can't even be mad

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:11

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

i mean most of the ending of the original show was built around rikka and akane's relationship, regardless of how you interpret it

you could argue that means that relationship is wrapped up but imagine if you flipped the script so that, say, the ending of the show was about, idk. yuta reaching out to akane and the depth of their relationship and akanes plan and arc was actually centered on yuta.

and then the sequel movie trailer was rikka going 'i wanna confess to yuta'

thatd be kinda weird

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:16

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

also i realize promo art is just promo art but

i dont think people can be blamed for interpreting this a certain way, lmao

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:19

Fivemarks: Feb 21, 2015

Endorph posted:

when i was a kid i got banned from a utena forum for saying that i thought utena and anthy were gay.

I cannot fathom this. Its like banning someone from an X forum for going "I think that Kamui is gay for Fuuma."

But I suppose I'm just kind of put off by the whole "A het relationship, EWW" thing, like people saying that Bayonetta 3 is bad because Bayonetta gets with a guy in it.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:28

Runa: Feb 13, 2011

there a number of reasons why people don't like Bayo3 and that's just one of them

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:31

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

Endorph posted:

i mean most of the ending of the original show was built around rikka and akane's relationship, regardless of how you interpret it

you could argue that means that relationship is wrapped up but imagine if you flipped the script so that, say, the ending of the show was about, idk. yuta reaching out to akane and the depth of their relationship and akanes plan and arc was actually centered on yuta.

and then the sequel movie trailer was rikka going 'i wanna confess to yuta'

thatd be kinda weird

Yeah...series where you have a definite relationship rarely go back on it cause it just doesn't work for story telling. Hell you can look at something like Macross 7 where Max and Miriya start it separated and end up back together. So Gridman potentially changing tracks like this is going to feel odd especially if you got into the series cause of the Akane/Rikka relationship

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:34

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

Fivemarks posted:

But I suppose I'm just kind of put off by the whole "A het relationship, EWW" thing

yeah thats a real thing that happens in frequency and not just a strawman for homophobes

the bayo 3 thing wasnt just because 'she got with a man,' it was because her characterization was completely thrown out, the game focused a ton on the idea of her being a mother in a weird way, jeanne was completely sidelined, she was paired up with the lamest dude in the series, even his characterization was ruined, etc.

if it had just been 'bayonetta hooks up with a guy' and it was executed competently nobody would have cared.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:35

Fivemarks: Feb 21, 2015

Endorph posted:

yeah thats a real thing that happens in frequency and not just a strawman for homophobes

the bayo 3 thing wasnt just because 'she got with a man,' it was because her characterization was completely thrown out, the game focused a ton on the idea of her being a mother in a weird way, jeanne was completely sidelined, she was paired up with the lamest dude in the series, even his characterization was ruined, etc.

if it had just been 'bayonetta hooks up with a guy' and it was executed competently nobody would have cared.

Man that does sound lame.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:42

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

bayo 3 ends with every bayonetta from across time getting owned

like twice each

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:44

Runa: Feb 13, 2011

there is one interesting thing about it and it's the implication that every bayo game takes place in its own timeline/universe, like when the bayo from the first game drops by to help and she addresses bayo3 in a way that implies that she's the cereza from the first game

but it still suffers from the multiverse problem of okay so do these other universes just not matter or what, because narratively they don't

# ? Feb 13, 2023 02:48

Big Leg: May 22, 2020; a corpse is talking

sorry yuta... time to die

# ? Feb 13, 2023 03:19

chiasaur11: Oct 22, 2012

SatoshiMiwa posted:

Yeah...series where you have a definite relationship rarely go back on it cause it just doesn't work for story telling. Hell you can look at something like Macross 7 where Max and Miriya start it separated and end up back together. So Gridman potentially changing tracks like this is going to feel odd especially if you got into the series cause of the Akane/Rikka relationship

Except Max and Miriya ended the first show together, while the ending of Akane and Rikka's relationship was Rikka telling Akane that, despite how much she hates it, the healthiest thing for both of them would be if they never saw each other again. The arc finished.

It kind of feels like how Asuka shippers try to act like the ending to Shin was a win for them. Shinji and Asuka had feelings for each other, but they moved on, and where they wound up, they couldn't go back. There was something, it mattered, but its time ended.

Meanwhile, despite the attempts to downplay it, Yuta's feelings for Rikka were a huge part of his motives, to the point they formed a huge part of the motives for the alien possessing his body, and jealousy of Rikka formed a big part of why Akane kept trying to win over Yuta instead of just stabbing him. Whatever Rikka had was supposed to be subordinate to Akane's whims, but instead, there was one thing that kept being Rikka's, no matter how hard Akane tried.

(There's even a bit in one of the audio dramas where 'Yuta' manages to get a memory back during the dream, of the day he fell in love with Akane. The memory of seeing her long black hair.

Akane is not pleased.)

Yuta's feeling for Rikka are the biggest unresolved relationship in the plot, just like Rikka's relationship with Akane is the biggest resolved dynamic. If there's a direct sequel (which there is now), that's the thing that has to get dealt with.

(Yuta's even got some big conversation with Rikka right before the start of the series that hasn't been elaborated on, but it was important enough that forgetting it has Rikka, otherwise the nicest person in the series, a bit pissed off with Yuta for the show's whole run.)

# ? Feb 13, 2023 03:41

Fivemarks: Feb 21, 2015

chiasaur11 posted:

Except Max and Miriya ended the first show together, while the ending of Akane and Rikka's relationship was Rikka telling Akane that, despite how much she hates it, the healthiest thing for both of them would be if they never saw each other again. The arc finished.

It kind of feels like how Asuka shippers try to act like the ending to Shin was a win for them. Shinji and Asuka had feelings for each other, but they moved on, and where they wound up, they couldn't go back. There was something, it mattered, but its time ended.

Meanwhile, despite the attempts to downplay it, Yuta's feelings for Rikka were a huge part of his motives, to the point they formed a huge part of the motives for the alien possessing his body, and jealousy of Rikka formed a big part of why Akane kept trying to win over Yuta instead of just stabbing him. Whatever Rikka had was supposed to be subordinate to Akane's whims, but instead, there was one thing that kept being Rikka's, no matter how hard Akane tried.

(There's even a bit in one of the audio dramas where 'Yuta' manages to get a memory back during the dream, of the day he fell in love with Akane. The memory of seeing her long black hair.

Akane is not pleased.)

Yuta's feeling for Rikka are the biggest unresolved relationship in the plot, just like Rikka's relationship with Akane is the biggest resolved dynamic. If there's a direct sequel (which there is now), that's the thing that has to get dealt with.

(Yuta's even got some big conversation with Rikka right before the start of the series that hasn't been elaborated on, but it was important enough that forgetting it has Rikka, otherwise the nicest person in the series, a bit pissed off with Yuta for the show's whole run.)

That's basically, in a much more eloquent form, what I'm saying here.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 05:25

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

chiasaur11 posted:

Yuta's feeling for Rikka are the biggest unresolved relationship in the plot, just like Rikka's relationship with Akane is the biggest resolved dynamic. If there's a direct sequel (which there is now), that's the thing that has to get dealt with.

(Yuta's even got some big conversation with Rikka right before the start of the series that hasn't been elaborated on, but it was important enough that forgetting it has Rikka, otherwise the nicest person in the series, a bit pissed off with Yuta for the show's whole run.)

i mean, i dont mind them resolving that, the issue i have is if they just have yuta and rikka get together. those are two separate things. i think that'd be boring on a number of levels. i also dont trust the writers not do that given how every interview about the series has been everyone going 'drr why didnt yuta and rikka get together.'

i think you can resolve that plot point and have the characters move in a new direction without going with the most obvious 'guy and girl get together' thing, but for some reason most of the staff and a large chunk of the fanbase seem to want that, so its probably going to happen. which is retroactively going to emphasize the parts of gridman i found kind of dull and deemphasize the parts i found interesting. thats what people are expressing here. we dont need a lecture about how actually we didnt understand the show.

Endorph fucked around with this message at 12:52 on Feb 13, 2023

# ? Feb 13, 2023 12:48

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

personally id also question the logic of spending six years crafting a mecha/toku saga where the moral of the story is that lesbian relationships are things that you have to move on from while heterosexual relationships are the endgame that prove you've matured, but hey, im just an idiot on the internet

# ? Feb 13, 2023 12:58

Fivemarks: Feb 21, 2015

Endorph posted:

personally id also question the logic of spending six years crafting a mecha/toku saga where the moral of the story is that lesbian relationships are things that you have to move on from while heterosexual relationships are the endgame that prove you've matured, but hey, im just an idiot on the internet

I don't think that's the message at all.

# ? Feb 13, 2023 14:49

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

Fivemarks posted:

I don't think that's the message at all.

i dont think its the intended message but something can have implications beyond its intent

# ? Feb 13, 2023 14:56

Waffleman_: Jan 20, 2011; I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSYm85ALVuI

Short version of the movie theme

There are reportedly three verses in the full song, this is the Gridman verse, there's a Dynazenon verse, and there's an Everyone verse that was in the trailer and the final chorus is different.

Waffleman_ fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Feb 25, 2023

# ? Feb 25, 2023 00:32

Larryb: Oct 5, 2010

And here�s the full version of said theme:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=UgYa0uUb6lk

# ? Mar 7, 2023 21:53

Cephas: May 11, 2009; Humanity's real enemy is me!
Hya hya foowah!

Theme song is a bop

One verse
Two verse
Three verse
Universe

# ? Mar 7, 2023 23:12

Hogama: Sep 3, 2011

SSSS.Dynazenon compilation movie came out, apparently it has some added scenes/cuts, in addition to a new post-credits scene featuring Koyomi that apparently bridges more directly to Universe.

Latest Newtype magazine also has some more info.

Exia posted:

https://twitter.com/SSSS_PROJECT/status/1623970028704915461?s=20

Apparently what Utsumi is holding in this poster is a script for a Gridman play he's been writing with Rikka and Yuta.

Edit: alright, got a little more on the post-credits scene. It's all technically before Universe, since this is from the compilation, but it's possible it will be an early scene in the movie, too, so spoilered for safety.

The scene is Koyomi and Chise hanging out. Some time has passed since Dynazenon but they are still as close as ever. We see Koyomi's scar; it's not very clear if Koyomi is living alone because there's only one toothbrush in the bathroom, and both he and the place give off strong independent vibes. His hair is longer and he is seen taking off his clothes next to Chise, forgetting that he should be more aware of her. He suddenly disappears with his clothes on the floor and Chise is freaked out.

Hogama fucked around with this message at 02:48 on Mar 13, 2023

# ? Mar 11, 2023 07:12