PJ's Authoritarian thread: C-SPAM edition

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Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

PJ you're claiming your approach is apolitical and from the perspective of personality psychology...and your subject matter is voting blocs and political behaviour. Rethink this from first principles.

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 02:12

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 05:04

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Jazerus posted:

that is the subject that the framework has generally been applied to, since it originated in a political forum, but it's not limited to that.

narrativism is a particular cognitive approach to the world that affects literally every aspect of a narrativist's life - by tying all of those aspects together into a grand unified story instead of the more compartmentalized and analytical cognitive strategy typical of a non-narrativist. the political behavior of a particular narrativist follows from their internal story, yes, but so does literally all of their behavior. the GOP is really good at providing a story that easily slots into the most popular types of personal narratives among narrativists, and the dems are, uh, not, which is why the voting bloc behavior emerges

"The theory applies to political behaviour, but it's not limited to that!" I knew that would be the first response. But we're pretty much only talking about political behaviour.

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 02:55

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

T-man posted:

All behavior is political.

Cool! Let's examine about the authoritarian personality at work, at school, in church, in art, in sport, in service organizations. If this lens is far broader than politics, let's have an analysis that actually goes beyond politics and doesn't rely on video clips of right-wing political activists as evidence or case studies.

Prester Jane posted:

Please go watch the video on the Final Fantasy 7 house and then revisit this post.

Yes, I'm familiar with this decade+ old Internet meme. I'll grant you this, but it's an exception that proves the rule--an extremely atomized situation involving extremely atomized people.

quote:

Structuralist Cooperators will cooperate with any authority figure that they recognize and find justifications for doing so after the fact. What defines authority in the structuralist cooperated mindset is control over access to "resources"- everything from controlling access to social networking opportunities to food or energy production will make one an authority figure worth being interacted with in the Structuralist Cooperator mindset*. ("Exposure/Attention" is a resource that can make one an authority figure worth respect as well, see noted Cooperator Bill Maher's treatment of Jordan Peterson and Milo Yiannopoulos.)

See, analyzing the material conditions of masses of people and how it informs their behaviour is political. You can't be "apolitical" in this field without being a crank.

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 14:13

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Certainly, and something I'm learning from the Trump presidency is that the difference between "mainstream" American conservatism and an explicitly fascist movement is largely a matter of circumstances, and that the mainstream is more open to influence from what we'd consider the fringes than I had ever believed possible.

I just don't think that personality psychology is the most useful heuristic for analyzing this, and when the analysis is explicitly "apolitical" that's a red flag to me.

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 14:53

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Prester Jane posted:

Then please explain how the Final Fantasy 7 house was political in nature. Either that or you have to dispute that the Final Fantasy 7 house is a clear-cut example of Narrativism. From my perspective the Final Fantasy house demonstrates quite clearly the inherently apolitical nature of Narrativism and

This is so unbelievably silly.

Look, you've come up with a very useful heuristic for examining the behaviour of authoritarian movements. But these movements do not form because of the number of Operationalist Dogcatchers or Liminal Poststructuralists or whatever the gently caress and their specific personality traits (which is what you are talking about). You have not presented evidence for this. A theory that you can apply to a situation by way of telling a story about it is not evidence. A YouTube clip of someone freaking out is not evidence. Any social science researcher you engage with will tell you this.

Halloween Jack has issued a correction as of 16:40 on Oct 23, 2018

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 16:33

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

BrandorKP posted:

And historically there have been cults that formed around every drat thing one think of.

Yes. Which is why applying her heuristic to, say, the Peoples Temple or Scientology or The Family International, for which there is a wealth of existing research, would be a much more natural starting point for realms outside electoral politics than the Final Fantasy House.

BOOSness Hammocks posted:

It�s definitely not an either/or, but why were those racist kids spending so much time on 4Chan after 2008? Their narrative is that the culture changes too fast and demands that they be less racist than they are comfortable being, but there are boomer shitheads in my family still mad about the end of segregation and who believe white supremacy is a founding ideal of the United States who never contemplated shooting up a mall or bombing city hall and just lived their lives as middle-class drones. I never even knew what shits they were until Trump let them know it was ok to be that way.

So I kind of feel like if the young nazis of today were distracted by building careers and paying for houses, they would never have moved into the �active nazi� category.

Let's also not ignore the fact that many, arguably most, of the most deluded right-wingers in the US are neither young nor poor.

# ¿ Oct 23, 2018 17:01

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Willie Tomg posted:

near as i can tell so far, The Authoritarians is basically what PJ is trying to write, almost entirely, but ~~with~~ Authoritarians has a greater emphasis on root psychology (which is general and broadly applicable) and less on the case by case particularization of rationalizations for that psychology (which change and skitter around like a drop of water on a hot griddle).

A big problem I have with Altemeyer is that his definitions of what constitutes left-wing and right-wing thought are...pretty much absent. It's just relative to the always-slippery North American context.

# ¿ Oct 24, 2018 15:35

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

I can't help but think that these polls are inaccurate, especially when Biden can't open his mouth without saying something that is absolutely disgusting to the base.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 21:46

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

chitoryu12 posted:

The one problem I'm hoping we don't run into is another 2016 where the DNC intentionally tries to shove out progressive candidates to put who they consider the most "electable" establishment centrist on the ticket. When it became apparent that Bernie was gaining they worked to get Hillary in instead.

It's happening. The Democratic Party leadership is looking to throw its base overboard so that they can become a controlled opposition. They'll lose everything forever, and it won't matter to them. Because their half-wit nephews will still get six-figure sinecures at the American Ideas Foundation, and they'll still be invited to all the cocktail parties.

# ¿ Jun 21, 2019 14:07

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Getting unsolicited emails from paranoid schizophrenics is just part of working in academia. TimeCube type guys tend to spam publicly available email addresses, and college faculty emails are often public.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2019 17:07

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Carlson seems to occupy an odd niche. He's obviously a wealthy scion from the blazer-and-bow-tie class, but his show is just naked white supremacy for the average Fox News viewer. He doesn't put much of a genteel veneer on it.

# ¿ Jul 10, 2019 14:08

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 05:04

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Yeah, but what did Neiwert have to say about the Final Fantasy 7 House?

# ¿ Aug 9, 2019 17:34

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > PJ's Authoritarian thread: C-SPAM edition