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if they ban me from hollering at the bugs i will face The Radiance and walk backwards into the void
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Feb 16, 2019 00:28
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I can't wait to find out how Hornet's going to lose most of her abilities at the start of the game.
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Feb 24, 2019 20:32
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The original Kickstarter ran November-December 2014 with the game having started development some time before (I presume April 2014, around the time of Ludum Dare) and promised to ship June 2015. That was, obviously, a little optimistic in retrospect, since the game eventually shipped in February 2017, although it was playable in beta in September 2015. Development continued until August 2018 when Godhome was released. I lay all this out to say that if they had their plan together and were effective at production (which, as a small team working on an established sequel with years of experience, is likely) it's not unreasonable to suggest that by February 2019 enough work had been done on Silksong to warrant announcing it, even if it were a ways off from release. A hypothetical August 2021 release would make for a development period of three years, assuming work began immediately after Godhome. If the scale is comparable, and past experience helps them, it's not unreasonable to think it might happen quicker. Or maybe they'll opt to spend the same amount of time to make something bigger. All of which to say, by all means continue moderating expectations and practicing patience, because that's great and I wish more gamers would do that. But also by god I want it now drat those lazy devs--
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Oct 30, 2020 01:21
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Something I've idly wondered about (and seen some others wondering about) is if Silksong is going to have any kind of accessibility options or even a straight up easy mode, for people who want that kind of thing. I'm sure the usual people would whine about such an addition but it's exactly the kind of thing I'd hope for in a more considered sophomore production. Also, and not entirely unrelatedly, I don't think it's ever been explicitly revealed how Silksong will handle dying and respawning. Hollow Knight of course did The Souls Thing, although it also (very wisely) went out of its way to lessen - almost to zero at times - the impact it had on you, firstly by only really having so many things you particularly need to be saving money for, and secondly by moving the ghost out of boss arenas and eventually letting you bypass it entirely if you want, to the point where there's only a handful of times having to do a corpse run really becomes a big problem (like maybe a handful of rooms in the game if you die in them). Silksong is different enough in enough ways that we know of that it's likely that dying is going to work differently too, if at the very least because she's not part Void.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:40
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You know, when Silksong finally does come out tomorrow I'm really going to miss all those times a Nintendo Direct says "oh there's one more announcement" and it turns out not to be Silksong and the entire chat screams in agony.
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Apr 14, 2021 17:34
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Reveilled posted:Jokes aside, why do people assume that a Nintendo direct would have details of Silksong, anyway? I know a switch version is planned but it's coming out (lol) on PC too, right? Why would it be announced by Nintendo as opposed to just announced by Team Cherry themselves whenever they have something? Switch was Hollow Knight's first console port, it got a huge fanbase there, Nintendo for all their sins know a winning partnership when they see one, and Silksong has previously been demoed specifically (and, I think, exclusively) at Nintendo events (on reflection I think this might represent a sample size of one, but.)
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Apr 14, 2021 17:53
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Well I know what I didn't expect.
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Aug 11, 2021 17:25
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The great thing about being a backer of Heart Forth Alicia is that I will never be bothered by a late-running development ever again.
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Feb 10, 2022 22:49
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I'm just mad that the one conference I skipped turned out to have loving Silksong Xbox reaching out to them isn't the most shocking thing in the world - platforms would naturally love to partner up with a dev with this kind of a reputation - but I always figured Nintendo had them sewn up after the Treehouse reveals. I guess not. Sony were never going to go for it because Sony are in the haughty and arrogant phase of their generational cycle, while MS loves getting indies on Game Pass. The maximum comedy option would've been an Epic Games Store exclusive although that would've burned a lot of Kickstarter backers.
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Jun 13, 2022 04:31
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No guys I'm sure it's gonna show up in Sony's Nintendo Direct on Thursday, they said there'd be some 3rd party stuff, that's basically confirmation
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Feb 21, 2023 19:01
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Alkarl posted:Ender Lilies is pretty solid if it hasn't been mentioned; lots of fun upgrades and an interesting story. Also you can summon a Fishman to punch people and that's always cool Excerpt from the OP of an Ender Lilies LP that never was and probably never will be: Fedule posted:Ender Lilies: Quietus of the Knights (2021, Adglobe, Live Wire, Binary Haze Interactive) is a game that after five minutes of play you will call "a Hollow Knight clone", after a few hours of play "a great Hollow Knight clone", as you approach the end "probably the best Hollow Knight clone ever made[/i]", and as the final credits roll "a shining exemplar of its form which happens to draw from many of the same aesthetic wells that inspired Hollow Knight but absolutely puts forth a character and identity all its own and which on reflection deserved far, far better than to continually be introduced by means of invocation of another, overwhelmingly more popular game by literally everybody who plays it, myself included, even as in the same breath we profess to love it on its own considerable merits", or something to that effect.
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Apr 11, 2023 10:19
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That was kind of the joke, as I wrote it then; it's really not a clone, it just gives off this incredibly powerful aesthetic impression at the start, and there was a bit of buzz comparing the games when it launched, and that sticks with you and it's only on reflection after playing for a fair bit you see it's really totally different. A lot of it is really the imagery of a very dark background and a very bright main character sitting on a bench.
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Apr 11, 2023 10:31
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Yeah, the game generally looks lovely, the tone is pretty bleak and the fallen glory architecture is all present and correct but the style it's realised in is beautiful in a way that's even distinct from fare like Hollow Knight if you look, their particular blend of darkness and colour has a characteristic bittersweetness to it that I think distinguishes it from basically any other setting of this kind. Also there's the music, which adds a few notes of whimsy to the funerary tone typical of souls-likes but then when things get clutch and someone hits their second phase, instead of getting more epic, it just gets sadder. The whole thing is a tonal slam dunk. The thing that I think puts the most subconscious pressure on me and others to keep comparing it to Hollow Knight is the rain. By far the most lastingly-impactful place in Hollow Knight is the City of Tears, it hits you with everything, the awe, the beauty, the melancholy, the piano, and the rain. Ender Lilies kind of has that kind of vibe extrapolated out to the whole setting, everywhere above ground is like this, and that combined with the brightness balance and most of the music being piano and the benches existing just wakes up the pattern recognition brain.
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Apr 11, 2023 15:00
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Hollow Knight bosses are great, if and only if Team Cherry henceforth realise that they no longer need to have damage pillars coming out of the ground attacks, the form has been perfected, there is no more work to be done. If they don't stop then some Hollow Knight bosses start losing quality. Don't be mad at me, this is just the laws of physics at work.
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Apr 11, 2023 21:47
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I don't in principle have a problem with Dread's quite streamlined design sensibility where you're continually being nudged onto the streamlined critical path but the thing that really grates for me isn't them pushing you forward but them slamming the door behind you. Arguably the absolutely most quintessential metroidvania element, the actual one thing that if you remove from a metroidvania makes it no longer a metroidvania and if you add it to another game will make people describe it as having "metroidvania elements", is the experience of obtaining a new powerup and having three or four locations you've been to float unbidden to the front of your mind, and if you want you can go back and clear those places out (or discover where they lead). And Dread fucks with that. No sooner do you recall those places than the game slams a door behind you that actively prevents you from backtracking even if you want to, and that's what bothers people about Dread.
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Apr 15, 2023 02:01
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It's pretty decent. One of the great flag bearers for Xbox Live Arcade back in the day. Definitely more vania than metroid but it's got the goods. Beautifully animated for a one man show. Writing is basic but earnest. Tone might be hit or miss. Combat is fun as poo poo and there are a good range of approaches.
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Apr 21, 2023 16:51
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Tunic is an extremely good albeit unconventionally premised game about uncertainty and discovery and all that good poo poo, but it has very little in common with Hollow Knight and while I'm sure people (eg, me) can love both I don't see how liking Hollow Knight will predispose you to liking Tunic. Tunic should be approached like a puzzle game in which one element is combat and you should come in prepared to not know at all times where you stand.
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Apr 22, 2023 19:48
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HampHamp posted:While we all wait patiently for Silksong, I'd like to recommend two other indie games in the meantime - Crosscode (top down action RPG, heavy on dungeon puzzling) and Unsighted (top down action RPG, very replayable, timer mechanic for NPC deaths). Both are extremely good, Crosscode in particular is one of my favourite games in years despite some flaws (mainly to do with perspective when platforming). 
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Apr 23, 2023 21:34
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Mymla posted:Heart forth, Alicia looks so good. I hope it comes out soon. Fedule posted:The great thing about being a backer of Heart Forth Alicia is that I will never be bothered by a late-running development ever again.
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Apr 28, 2023 23:05
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phil xbox lied to us
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May 10, 2023 03:11
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There's something to be said for considered use of "empty" content in games to space things out, whether it's for pacing or just because it feels more organic sometimes for there to be space. It's great when games are lean and mean but sometimes this can backfire on the suspension of disbelief and you can kind of feel the artifice of the thing, the sense of everything being game designed rather than being the thing it's pretending to be. As long as the vibes hold out and it's not actively monotonous or repetitive this kind of thing is fine with me. It's better this than having a map full of five hundred icons to methodically check off one at a time.
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May 10, 2023 11:55
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"bapanada! bapanada!" i continue to insist as Hollow Knight: Silksong slowly shrinks and transforms into a corncob
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Jun 25, 2023 14:04
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sirtommygunn posted:If you have completionist brain worms and can't be satisfied by hitting 110% completion then I don't think there's a way to make you happy. There very much is a way to make these people happy: Understand that OS/Platform-level completion/trophies is a disease, make your Platinum Trophy sane to obtain for a normal but determined player (subject to some interpretation regarding appropriate difficulty of this, but honestly that's like five separate and very nuanced discussions), and leave the real completionist poo poo entirely intrinsic. If your game has advertised completion metrics you should, as a developer, be mindful of how players are likely to interpret them, especially that some people are likely to feel compelled to do things based on there being metrics for them, and if you're going to make things compulsive to players you should do so responsibly. This is a balancing act. It's new and weird and difficult and most developers wouldn't think to do it and if several of them did they would stop at "lol players can just ignore that stuff". To get the Platinum Trophy on PS requires you to complete the Pantheon of Hallownest. This is utterly insane. (It also requires you to do the Mr Mushroom quest) (On the whole I think there is a fascinating disconnect in... culture? I guess? between Steam Achievements and Console Achievements, because Steam Achievements are generally happy to be weird and exclusive while consoles are the platform on which players are explicitly and extrinsically compelled to try and Get All Achievements, and when the two meet it is frequently a disaster)
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Sep 19, 2023 14:38
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:e: i hate the way Steam / XBL / etc. achievements are presented too but kind of for the opposite reason: none of this stuff should be assumed to carry over or work the same way from one game to another. the notion that what you do with mechanics and presentation is there to be interpreted is completely incompatible with a commodified, prescriptive, "everything has to fit into these specific neat little boxes" approach I don't know if this was specifically in response to me but if it is there's clearly been a misinterpretation somewhere because it sounds like we're of a mind on this account. Would that I could go back to 2006 and make the Xbox Achievements never happen, because their presence is imposing itself on games now. I think developers should take a defensive approach to Achievements; a big reason I have for thinking Platinums should be made 10x easier is because it would spite the system. I think it's fine that internally in Hollow Knight there is an achievement for letting Zote die and another mutually exclusive achievement for saving him. It's fine because so long as it's confined to within the game it becomes part of player expression if you think there's a canonical option to always choose. But to bubble them up to the system level and tie it to a generic completion rate demeans the process of making it a choice in the first place since it introduces a completely extrinsic incentive for players to do a thing (notably, on the PS version, in which I complained about the Pantheon of Hallownest being mandatory for Platinum, there aren't system level trophies for Zote, or for completing a Steel Soul run). I think it is (sometimes) interesting to have collected metrics about player choice or even player achievement (one thing I like about PS Trophies is that sometimes the relative completion rates are interesting: did you know that a little under two thirds of people who start Nioh 2 quit before getting halfway through the first stage?) but the compulsive collectible nature of Trophies is poisonous to video games. Very rarely I've seen games take the extrinsic compulsions and channel them into art but it's usually parody on some level. Eg. pretty much the entire list in The Stanley Parable: Ultra Deluxe is an assault on the whole idea of the Trophy List which I respect even as I went out of my way to cheese the Platinum on PS anyway (everyone knows about Super Go Outside, but that can be obtained in a minute, unlike the trophy for playing the game for the entirety of a Tuesday). Or you've got the subtext in Nier/Drakengard, and NieR:Automata is a high point in this discourse because even as it's leveraging this subtext it also lets you literally hack the trophies in-game because it understands better than to actually gently caress with people for a joke even if it's a good one. I think Shadow of the Colossus remains the best artistic examination of compulsion and obsession in video games and it should not go without reminder that SotC predates system Trophies.
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Sep 19, 2023 15:16
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sirtommygunn posted:But then the trophy would be too easy and it wouldn't mean anything to platinum the game, and you would be pissing off other achievement obsessed people. There is no balancing act that can make all these people happy. It already doesn't mean anything to Platinum a game. To Platinum a specific game might mean something within the context of that game (though it usually doesn't), but the second the metrics leave the game everything evaporates. The idea of one Platinum being comparable to another is laughable. It's not even really a bad thing for system trophies to go fully into the Steam route and be as disconnected and esoteric as they care to be, and even for there to remain some around which an elitist sense remains, or even for certain trophies to have metrics attached to them which are visible from outside the game. But what needs to die is the extrinsic intrusion into games of the Platinum Trophy Disease, where games are designed to have stuff in them that gets tied to Trophies, and where players play games to unlock all the Trophies. I have absolutely no problem with there being a little badge that can proclaim that you, you special player you, have beaten the Pantheon of Hallownest, that you can display on your actual external profile if you're so proud of it, so long as everyone accepts that there's only so much people can do to ensure the authenticity of every instance of it. I think we can have that and not turn the whole affair into a Completion Meter that overrides other reasons to care. I think even if we have system-level badges they can be purged of their extrinsic factors. I think we should remember why these things were called Achievements in the first place.
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Sep 19, 2023 16:36
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sirtommygunn posted:So why is it so important that everyone is able to get it? If we can easily dismiss one group of achievement obsessives with a 'get over it' why can't we apply it to the other? Earlier I said that this got at like five different nuanced other discussions. Some day I'll write one of those enormous youtube essays about some of them but here's one attempt at a short answer to this: It would be preferable for the concept of the Platinum Trophy to die at the system level, for it to be removed, for the meter to be deleted, for all records of them to be deleted, for all references to cumulative trophy counts between games to just be permanently destroyed, leaving only the disconnected individual trophies and their rarity stats and possibly the ability for players to pin individual ones they're particularly proud of to their profiles. But before that happens, a thing that an individual game developer can do, powerless as they are to force Sony, MS and Valve to implement this change, is defuse the influence of Platinum Trophy Disease on their games by making it relatively painless to get the thing that increases the number in the system while retaining whatever internal achievement tracking system, including no system at all, the developer thinks is appropriate to their game. Notably, Sony actually already seems to be starting to do this with their first-party games. It struck me in Horizon Forbidden West that while there are a ton of kinds of open-world activity to do, for almost all of them the only requirements tied to Trophies are to do at least one of each kind, with the rest having only their intrinsic motivations to do.
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Sep 19, 2023 16:58
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Megasabin posted:You didn’t really say much at all here. Pardon me but this isn't at all what was asked of me nor what I answered. I was asked to justify how I can advocate for the dilution of one kind of trophy by means of making it easier to attain (the Platinum "get all other trophies" Trophy) while keeping another incentive for trophy obsessives (individual, very difficult, for some unobtainable, possibly even bullshit trophies that can be seen outside the game). My response is, basically, that actually I don't think it should be diluted, but deleted. Despite the bluntness this is a nuanced distinction because diluting the Platinum by necessity requires also diluting the other achievements required to get it while deleting it doesn't. I thought this was implicit in my response. But I also admited defeat; Sony will never unmake the Platinum Trophy and Microsoft and Valve will never remove the Achievement Meter from their interfaces because it serves their interests, so even though I think that's preferable I instead advocate for developers to defuse the lure of externally visible platform-level trophies by making the external metrics easier to complete while retaining internal metrics and achievements as-is. I would like to have both; a world of No Platinums with existing trophies retained as is and for players to negotiate the vaunted Bragging Rights between themselves and developers free to decide for themselves whether Get Every Trophy is an incentive they should even have to permit to exist in their games. Even more bluntly, I think if the choice is between a system that produces distress for the minority of players who feel unduly compelled to persist at games because of the platform-level metrics and a system that removes the ability for a minority players to more easily prove to others that they have completed certain tasks, the former minority should take precedence. An ideal solution exists that will fully accommodate both but the platform holders won't like it, so here we are.
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Sep 20, 2023 09:18
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Your Uncle Dracula posted:i only want this thread to update when theres serious silksong info the lack of a release is extremely serious
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Sep 28, 2023 11:20
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There's nothing really wrong with noting that this has all gone down a little weirdly, or that announcing a game with a trailer and demo on Nintendo Treehouse in 2019 and then going silent for four years is suggestive - although not definitive - of a plan having gone very awry but I draw the line at getting actually angry or really any emotion at all about it. I've mentioned it before in this thread I think but I've been waiting, nominally, for like ten years now for a different retro-styled metroidvania I kickstarted called Heart Forth, Alicia, and mostly I just find it funny (and, like Silksong, the developer insists it's still getting made but refuses to publicly commit to a timetable). I'm not about to run out of video games. It's healthy to look forward to things. Some of them won't pan out. I only need to discover one transcendent masterpiece every five years or so for this to have all been worth it. Bapanada.
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Nov 14, 2023 12:15
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Waltzing Along posted:So...Thursday night is the next disappointment? every night is the next disappointment.
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Dec 4, 2023 20:50
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When the motherfucker said "a small independent team from Australia" I really thought. But it was just House House. And I mean those guys rule and I cannot wait to have literally any understanding of what the gently caress their new game even is, but. Come on man. He knew what he was doing.
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Dec 8, 2023 05:10
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I never considered the charms system to be that characteristic to Hollow Knight but when I saw that PoP has you buying maps from a shopkeeper hiding just off the path but who you can detect through objects scattered around the surrounding environment and the sound of them humming to themselves an eyebrow did raise. To be clear I'm all in favour. I love to see all the really direct pulls it does. It's also got Celeste strawberries, an air dash that's Metroid Dread as gently caress and a mirror match fight (though, if anything, that one pulls from the original Prince of Persia, right down to having to parry counter his parry counters).
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Jan 25, 2024 21:24
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there's a non-zero chance Nintendo could still get the Silksong drop, but a non-non-zero chance it will be Sony.
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Jan 30, 2024 23:03
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My games schedule is currently rammed between the psychotic endgame grind in Granblue Fantasy Relink and the impending releases of - within a one month window - Splatoon 3 Side Order, FFVII Rebirth, Unicorn Overlord, Rise of the Ronin and Dragon's Dogma 2. For the first time since this day five years ago, there is a Nintendo Direct on the horizon and I earnestly do not want them to drop Silksong. Therefore, I can state with absolute certainty that Silksong will be released tomorrow.
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Feb 14, 2024 18:18
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There's some untrustworthy sources out there, but never in a million years would Xbox be wrong about Silksong.
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Apr 5, 2024 00:49
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I won't be able to watch this Triple I thing live when it goes down so I can only assume there is a 100% chance of Silksong
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Apr 10, 2024 17:13
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Like we were just talking about earlier, I don't think it's at all correct to say there is only the trailer as hype. The trailer itself is a follow-up to a promise made during crowdfunding of a game that attained widespread acclaim and popularity. The trailer was then followed up with a live demo at Nintendo Treehouse, which can't have been trivial to line up. That trailer and demo were, technically, the only direct marketing for Hollow Knight: Silksong, the video game with that name, when his thread started, but even being able to let Silksong market itself is a position they had to make an entire other video game (and market that) to be in. It's kind of a technical point but it's never only a trailer when this kind of thing happens, it's a trailer with an entire story behind it, for something people were already waiting for.
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Apr 16, 2024 18:45
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I think I posted about it in here before, but. Ender Lilies only ever seemed like it was going to be a Hollow Knight clone, by way of early looks that played up its aesthetic, and particularly the combination of a glowing white player character set against dark, melancholic black and blue backgrounds, and also resting on wrought iron benches. I guess it does also have a very light dusting of metroidvania elements in addition to the standard issue Soulslike Plot about a kingdom brought low by the literal and figurative blight of its hubris. But outside of these elements, and particularly with regards to the parts of the games in which you press buttons to do things, the games are nothing alike whatsoever. I suspect they deliberately played up the outward similarities in the publicity period, which I suspect got the game more attention than it would have otherwise. Also, I thought it was pretty good.
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Apr 24, 2024 14:34
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