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Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Woot! Love this goddamn game. :dance:

Shitenshi posted:

First time I noticed that the opening title in-game and the localized title are completely different. This game was just Shadow Hearts 2 over in Japan, "Covenant" was simply attached there by Midway when it was brought over here.

Though, that weirdness is nowhere near as wonky as the US version of Breath of Fire IV having the title on the opening screen completely untranslated and left in katakana. I remember thinking it was just some fictional fantasy language or some graphic meant to look cool, but nope! It was simply Buresuobufaia.

The localisation on this game (though we've yet to see it) is pretty top notch. It was worked on by Jeremy Blaustein, and it feels a lot more naturalistic (and with less nonsense errors than the last game).

Oh, and TDI, sent you a PM.

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Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Brainamp posted:

Was the german military actually that progressive that a woman could make lieutenant in ww1?

Not unless they were disgusing themselves as a man.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Robindaybird posted:

sad thing is, you can see parts of the system where it would work if it gotten some polish - and realize they didn't because of so many lovely subsystems that don't interact with the other systems or even work against it - for example you can't have a weapon break and a weapon skill level up in the same system especially with some weapon types being rare or will break quickly.

It's biggest killer is the complete lack of any information; you never know which character/enemy is going to act next, whether your weapon will break next turn, what element an enemy is, what an enemy drops, if you're on the right screen for the particular enemy you want - and even then you're still at the mercy of the RNG.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

GimmickMan posted:

Blanca is a female name, game! Come on!

They get the sex wrong, but it's a loose reference to a story.

And of course Gepetto is Gepetto. Proably got a girl puppet after getting sick of Pinocchio's poo poo.

quote:

Upon being born, Pinocchio immediately laughs derisively in his creator's face, whereupon he steals the old man's wig.

Or after Pinocchio was lynched.

quote:

…a tempestuous northerly wind began to blow and roar angrily, and it beat the poor puppet from side to side, making him swing violently, like the clatter of a bell ringing for a wedding. And the swinging gave him atrocious spasms….

His breath failed him and he could say no more. He shut his eyes, opened his mouth, stretched his legs, gave a long shudder, and hung stiff and insensible.

Children's stories are hosed, yo.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Accordion Man posted:

Pretty much everyone is viable in this game, unlike in the first game where Zhuzhen just falls off a cliff. (Though like the first game Yuri is still far and away the best character) I always had Karin in my team plus two more party members that we haven't met yet.

The whole Crest system is a massive help to that, if you feel a character's own move set is lacking for the current fight, you can just plop them straight on to another character. IIRC, benched characters also gain a small percentage of EXP? And new party members levels and stats are based on the current party average as well, if I'm recalling correctly.

Again, so it's not like trying to play catch up with Zhuzhen. It's honestly kind of amazing just how much improved this game is mechanically to the first.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Tulul posted:

I appreciate how much this actually looks like Montmartre, down to things like the stair railing. This is probably supposed to be the Anvers station, which did exist at the time and does run right over to the Champs-Elysees, although the specific view here isn't accurate.

For reference:


On the whole the game is pretty okay with places that are approximate likenesses of the real locations they're based on. One hard-to-see anachronism is a poster advertising the 1900 Exposition Universelle - but this game is like :lol: what's another anachronism on top of the mountain we already have. Also talking-wolf bouts.

I only bring that particular one up, because a hypothetical Koudelka 2 was going to be set at L'Exposition Universelle and feature a little trek through the early Métro and other parts of Paris.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Space Cadet Omoly posted:

Am I misremembering, or wasn't the hypothetical Koudelka 2 going to star her son? Was that supposed to be Halley's game?

Hypothetical K2 was Koudelka going through Paris, two years after the events of the first Koudelka. Hypothetical K3 was going to star her grandson (from her daughter) in 1970s Chicago. And Hypothetical K4 would again be her grandson in the early 80s in Japan.

These were just ideas mulling around the devs heads should the game be a success - as we know it wasn't, and Shadow Hearts became the weird spin-off sequel thing instead.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

BioMe posted:

Yeah, I that game was something else there, especially for a PS1 one. I don't know much about acting or direction, but it kind of felt like the actors were let play off each other and improvise parts of the dialogue. If I don't completely misremember the game I noted it in, there were a few parts where the characters talked over each other slightly. Which is not really something you often get even in movies unless it's exaggerated to emphasize a chaotic scene. Maybe that's even seen as a bit amateurish in some circles, since script dialog and natural dialog are two completely different things, and it'd be hard to listen to characters cutting off each other to the degree real people do. I don't think it had that effect though, just a couple natural sounding exchanges where you'd normally expect a much more theatrical pace to the line reads. Especially in a video game where voice actors usually aren't even in the same room when they record.

Also every game needs a fully voice acted drunk scene, I cannot think of a single one that wasn't amazing.

They were mostly local stage actors based in LA, and from what I understand, even though Kikuta wrote the script in Japanese, he did the sensible thing of leaving the direction to a native English speaker (who could speak and liase with him in Japanese), and actually recorded all the dialogue live (excepting any pickups), with all the actors in mocap suits actually acting the scenes together.

It really does add a lot to scenes - captures some of the energy from actual people acting these things out together, and not stuck in a booth. It's genuinely shocking to compare it to RE1, and listen to these stilted, strangely intoned conversations, because they were given bad direction from a non-native speaker and trying to figure out all this fancy new tech with loadtimes.

That drunk scene is still so loving good. That actress just sells it, and the captured body movements gives it this great fluidity. It's just so good.

But yeah, shame the gameplay is mostly tedious garbage. And even in this game, as good as it is, the voice acting and mocap stuff never really captures the same feeling of energy, as in Koudelka. IMO, anyway.
This game is still my favourite of the series to play though.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Neddy Seagoon posted:

How many Stud Cards are there in the game? Because I'm going to be awful mad if it's seven.

There's a bonus one if there's a SH1 save game detected on the memory card

...

:ssh:...But only for the Japanese version - and it doesn't work properly on the English version, even though it's fully translated - speaking of which;



:toot: TDI is kindly allowing me to show off some of the Director's Cut edition content. There's not much, but I'll be chiming in from time-to-time during relevant sections.

Little non-spoiler preview:


Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Nimsant posted:

Hi!
I have caught up to this LP, and it is much fun

I have not played SH2 before (only Koudelka and SH1) and I am playing along now.
I realize I miss this kind of PS2 RPG games.

I have been thinking, what kind of alternate outfit could make Gepetto's doll look less creepy.
So I made this. Do you think this works?



Perfecto :allears:

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
So sorry. Condolences to you and your family :(

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Thank god you only have to go through this once. That and the Metro level drat near kill my interest in replaying every single time.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Wonderslug posted:



This was a good use of my evening.

Bravissimo! :golfclap:

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Tarot is basically worthless and only gets worse the more cards you get. Although I must say it was pretty neat of them to put the effort to redraw the Rider-White tarot.

It's just as well they gave Lucia Aromatherapy which can be useful, it's just a shame you need to actually use a mixture first to figure out what it does - and a vast amount of the time crest magic will be simply better. There are some neat things with it later on though...

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Mokinokaro posted:

The character in FTNW with a similar gimmick is improved a bit in that all of their forms are pretty close in power, just in different areas though you're right that Joachim never feels like a burden even in bat form.

Mechanically I feel they made it worse though - Joachythms are passive; if you wait long enough, through the battles, eventually he'll be in the form you want - and random dungeon wandering is pretty part and parcel of that.

The other character has to actively expend an inbattle action that can only be performed once per enemy, for a tiny blip on a 200 digit scale. I mean, yeah there are the items, similar to Joachim's but it's still kinda tedious.

That said, yeah they had sense enough to make the forms all pretty viable - and same for Joachim.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

achtungnight posted:

The whole party going berserk is just the tip of the iceberg for bad things that can happen to you thanks to Tarot's RNG nature. :( Good things can happen too, but I never used Tarot enough to notice.

And yes, there are other actions that characters can take only while Berserk.


Some of these might be useful, I guess. I'm surprised there aren't more abilities for Joachim's alternate forms.

Kinda neat they programmed in a load of unique berserk actions. They could have easily left it as just attacking random targets, but they went to the extra effort instead for a status the player will try not to be in for very long, or avoid all together.


StandardVC10 posted:

"Don't hit the fart gas generator!" :ohdear:

"Why do we even have one of those?"

*Holding nose* ""Great job Lenny, now it's going to take forever to get the fart smell out of those books"

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Sounds pretty rough, take care TDI, and hope you have a swift recovery.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
They added even more of those light pathways in the Director's cut version of this dungeon, because, you know, it wasn't tedious enough. Speaking of...

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
It happened with Final Fantasy. It happened with Kingdom Hearts.
Yes, I'm talking about the ultra-special re-releases with added bonus content and adjustments to gameplay.



Frustratingly released one day before the PAL version of the standard Covenant, the Director's Cut included two new dungeons, some new cutscenes, and a few other additions.
While not the most essential of content, it builds on the pretty solid base on Covenant, and overall just adds a bit more to the experience.

The Dark Id has very kindly allowed me to show off the DX content, and I'll be chiming in every so often with it.
---

First, a brand new dungeon! This technically happens during a weird interstitial point when in Cannes, but it fits a lot better immediately after the Neam Ruins.




Music: In Darkness of a Labyrinth ~ Dungeon






Finally! Let's get this show on the road!
Oh, put a sock in it! I've been walking all morning! I'm exhausted!


Yeah, but if you charge in like a bull - as usual - you'll just end up lost, and won't be able to find the exit. As to be expected from a dunderheaded oaf like you.
What'd you say?! Why I oughta-!
Enough! We need to finish our investigation here before they bring us the Émigré Manuscript! We haven't the time for your petty quarrels!
Pft! Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So yeah, we're playing as the quirky antagonist squad for this little section.

Nakhásh is Hebrew for snake, incidentally. So, we're in "Snake Temple".

Let's have a quick look at their menus and items.


Their stats are fixed, and they don't share Yuri and co's inventory, but they start with a few healing items.


Nicholai still has his stuff from the beginning - although it's been buffed to keep him from becoming the "never-catch-up Zhuzhen" of the group. He's the most balanced of the three, but also the only one with the ability to heal the others.



He's still got his Cure and Bright Light moves, but he's also learnt a new one, Divine Light.



He's technically had this all the time, even in the standard English game...but he only ever does it while Berserk. :ssh:




An interesting little programming oversight?

That's the healing bitch outta the way, now we have the dumb ox Lenny.



Yep. He's the beefy boy whose job is to smack things hard. He has only one special move, Iron Claw.



It's pretty great. :allears:

And finally, she-of-the-silly-outfit, Veronica Vera.


She's the black mage of the group, with her own BDSM skills named Punishment.

Two are the standard Heal (cures status abnormalities), and Hail Beak, which is the bog-standard water-element attack.


Her personal skill is Aroma Oil - Stun Perfume, which damages enemies, and has a chance to paralyze them.



Neat.

Shame there's only one enemy vulnerable to paralysis in this entire area though.

An interesting little thing is that all their unique equipment was actually properly translated, and Lenny and Veronica are fully playable in the English games via this game's debug mode, although their sounds are bugged, and their moveset names are blank.


(This is "Rude Spanking" in the Japanese version. The very horny devs are obviously fans of Le vice anglais.)


Can't be comfortable with that boob window.


A Khanjar is a type of Omani dagger. Not...traditionally used as a bludgeon.


Lenny really needs to be riding some kind of hog. Harley-Davidson was actually producing motorbikes around this time.

They must have been pretty close to finishing when developing this stuff, as all the enemies and bosses are fully programmed. It's literally just missing some minor cutscenes and the dungeons, although there's some lingering evidence in the files that they were removed.
But oh well...



We're locked in if we're try to leave.



Onward!



Immediately into a battle!


Music: Vicious 1915 ~ Battle in Europe




So yeah, we've got some neat new enemies as well, although they all use moves that are in the standard game. This purple bird tit thing is Baphomet - weirdly translated in the debug data as "Baphemetous".


Baphomet, beloved icon of heavy metal bands, and goths, even if they don't know anything about the occult. The Knights Templar were accused of worshipping it, although that seems to have been a very convient excuse for the then French king to confiscate their wealth.

The name is believed to be a corruption of Muhammad ("Mahomet" - "Baphomet") - crusades era, after all. Its iconography is probably the most famous image of a devil that people have, and generally ends getting linked with Satan.

It's got 68 HP, and is dark elemental. It has Dark Claw, and can inflict Sp-DEF Down.



The eye squid with the legs is Luvart -"Luvar" in the debug info.
It has 85 HP, and is fire aligned. It's got Magma and can inflict Mental Break.

Luvart is a super-obscure demon mentioned in Sébastien Michaëlis's My First Book of Demonlogy, L'Histoire admirable de la possession d'une penitente, where it was possessing the body of a nun.

How the Shadow Hearts devs got "eyeball manta-ray ballet dancer" out of that, I don't know.





It's a quick battle.


Music: In Darkness of a Labyrinth ~ Dungeon






Did my boys get their butts whooped by these punks?
I doubt it. It's difficult to imagine they fell to a group of that caliber. More likely, there's a powerful demon among their ranks.



This door is the way to proceed.



Hm? This gate ain't opening?
Ah, I forgot to mention. The gates in this place are rigged to be opened by two switches. We can find those on the same floor.
Sounds like a pain-in-the-butt if you ask me...But if that's what it takes, then let's pull those switches and get back here, pronto.

That's the first half of the gimmick in this temple - to open the doors to the next area we've got to flip two switches.


Fortunately there's one of the handy dandy switches round the corner.

If we examined the switch first, there's actually a slightly different conversation that occurs.


Hey, what's this switch?
You see that door there? It's a switch to open it. It seems that if you don't operate two switches on the same floor, the door won't open.
drat, pain-in-the-butt switches...C'mon then, let's find this other switch.



*Flip*




*Flip*




And down we go.



In the chest is a silver bracelet. None of the stuff we find here will carry over to the main party, by the way.



So this is the second half of the dungeon gimmick. As we approach this gate...



Whoa, awesome! An automatic door!?
It is somewhat remarkable, yes...





Wha-!? H-hey! Did I just get locked in!?
Oh, stop your snivelling! This fence is one-way only. Look, there's an arrow carved down there, right? It means that if you aren't coming from the side of the arrow, you won't be able to open it.

Veronica steps on the arrow.



W-what?! Who came up with this stuff...Don't screw with me! Geez!

Oh Lenny, you so dumb. :allears:

There's an alternative scene that plays out if we examine the closed gate on the other side of the room.



Hey! Why ain't it opening?
The gate only opens one way. You see that arrow on the floor? These gate will only open on the side with the arrow, following its direction.

Not nearly as fun as Lenny being a dumb dumb. :nallears:



So yeah, now the switches will be placed at the end of these hallways you can only approach from one side. It's honestly not difficult though, and this dungeon is short enough for it not to be a hassle or getting lost.



Not like that goddamned Parisian subway or Welsh mine.


Music: Vicious 1915 ~ Battle in Europe



And here's the last regular enemy in the area, Amphisbaena.

These are the strongest ones in the section, with 222 HP. They're earth elemental and attack with P-ATK Down, and Rock Storm. They have an ultra rare chance of dropping a Mind's Eye - the item from the last game which doubled your attack damage, but made the Judgement ring invisible - although this area is not that difficult.


Amphisbaena are two-headed serpents found in Greek myth that were formed from Medusa's blood after she was beheaded. Pliny the Elder wrote, "The amphisbaena has a twin head, that is one at the tail-end as well, as though it were not enough for poison to be poured out of one mouth."

Yep, in place of an rear end, just another venom-spewing face.

They tend to get overshadowed by the more famous and interesting stock Greek monsters, but I'm pretty sure I've seen them as snake enemies in RPGS.


Music: In Darkness of a Labyrinth ~ Dungeon




*Flip*





*Flip*




In the main area one of Lenny's Clawed dudes appears.

You hurt? Tired? In your hour of need, leave it to me, Clawed Medic MD!

HP and MP Fully Restored!

I'll stand watch here. If something happens, please call me any time!

We can return to him anytime for a free heal - although we're well over half way through this dungeon with only the last section and the boss to deal with.



Downward!
Immediately into a cutscene.



Ya know, I still can't believe there's a temple like this on the bottom of the ocean.
Aah, that reminds me, this is your first time here, isn't it?
Long ago, worshippers of a heretical faith, built temples in unseen places to escape persecution. These ruins are most likely the remains of one such temple.
Huh...but, if it's under the sea and all, why's there still air... and how come the water don't get in, huh?
There's probably a certain power at work here. The fact our master had sent us to investigate this place is tied to that.



It's vexing me. As whatever is causing the disturbance here is hindering our progress.
Hmmm...



Nicolai clearly up to something here. Anyway, this is the final area. It's only slightly more challenging that the previous one, but honestly still not so bad.



I kinda like this section to be honest - it's short and sweet, and they don't drag the gimmick out so much. I can easily imagine making this four or five floors and have it be tedious as gently caress.



These a few more items down here, but nothing major, just a Tent, a Daphne Fruit, a Pocket Watch, and Poison Lv2 we can stick on someone. Useful, but not vital for this little section.



*Flip*



*Flip*




These stairs...
They weren't here the last time we were here...
Excellent, this might be it.






Music: Flame of Strain to Blaze ~ Tension




Oh...looks like we found the boss.



RIP Clawed Soldiers.




No doubt about it. Doesn't look like it's going to let us leave in one piece, either.




Boss time!


New Music: Ladder to Heaven




This sucker is Nuckelavee.



It's a giant, hosed-up, Scottish nightmare centaur with super-long arms, a single burning eye, and toxic breath that wilts everything. Oh, and it's also got no skin, black blood, yellow veins, with its gross uncovered muscles on display.

Wales isn't the only country in the British Isles to have a monopoly on hosed-up hellbeasts.

It's only weakness is fresh running water. Or being told to stop by praying to the Sea Mother. That's not a joke, by the way, there is an entity in Scottish myth called the Sea Mother (Mither o' the Sea). I'm guessing her other power was to over-enthusiastically tell travellers ghost stories with sound effects. *Shlooop! Shlooop! Splat! Skree!*

Anyway...

It has 1610 HP and is dark aligned - which is good and bad for light-aligned Nicholai here.
It has Slash, Red Blaze, Dark Claw and Blind Ring. It can also boost itself with Surge.



It particularly liked Surging and Red Blazing it during this playthrough.




There's not really any strategy to this fight.



Our trios specials can really wreck its poo poo, especially in a combo.






Although, I chose to end with combo-magic.



They're all ???? because this is the first time I've used them during this specific playthrough. Once they've been used, it reveals the name in any future combo.

The actual spells we can use are based on our party's elemental make up - Nicholai is Light, Lenny is Earth, and Veronica is Water, so we have access to Holy Pulse, Strong Earth, and Shock Max.

If some of those sound vaugely familiar, it's because they're also Halley's ESP moves from Shadow Hearts.



And to go back even further, they are actually the same name of the spells Koudelka uses in the Japanese version of Koudelka. Although, they were localised very differently for the English release.



Anyway, back on track;


I was hoping for Holy Pulse, to hit its elemental weakness, but eh, Strong Earth is fine.



That's 1/5 of its HP gone right there.

For some reason, Nuckelavee kept targeting Lenny, and he got KO'd.



C'mon Lenny, up you get.





All better. :v:



D'oh! Leave off Lenny for five minutes! :mad:



That's better, focus on Mr Backpfeifengesicht.



It doesn't last long under our assualt, and Nicholai gets the last blood.





We don't get anything for defeating the boss. As stated before, nothing we get here carries over to Yuri and co.


Music: ENDS




drat, never expected a monster like that to be here!
What do we do now, Nicolai?
As soon as we obtain the manuscript, we'll report to the Master. For the meantime, I suggest we halt our investigations here.
drat staight! I'm not letting you send any more of my boys to die at the bottom of the ocean!

Lenny walks off.



The Master won't be pleased...we'd better prepare for his displeasure.

Veronica walks off.



... ... ...




He walks over to this altar-thing.




With this ring, shall our pact be forged. With this power, maybe I'll be able to surpass him...



As Nicholai walks away we pan up the altar.


Music: Mysterious Theme






Ominous...





All in all, this section is a fun little distraction, but that's about it. It adds a bit more character to the antagonists, and a nice bit of foreshadowing so a certain plot point doesn't feel like an asspull outta nowhere, that's otherwise not present in the standard versions.

Monster:



Moral of the story; don't date crows. Don't trust girls with birdclaws for hands and exposed breasts.



I always wondered what happened to the career of [INSERT TOPICAL CELEBRITY HERE].



Ouroboros are way classier.



That's Wales and Scotland off my vacation list.




Video: Nakhásh Temple Showcase.
(Check it out for Nicolai, Lenny and Veronica's moves, and enemy animations).

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Nov 6, 2019

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

The Dark Id posted:

Hey, thanks a bunch! I meant to get back up to you again after you offered months ago and well... you know, my life took a huge poo poo and the LP did as well. Added the update to the TOC.

No sweat TDI, and thanks - you've had a nightmare year - hope things are going as well as they can be, for you and your family.

Also thanks everyone else - the DX stuff is pretty neat, and it's nice to share it with you all.

[e]: Thanks.
VVV

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Nov 6, 2019

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Tuxedo Ted posted:

To our friend playing along on the Japanese special edition, I always wondered how this exchange panned out in the original script? In particular, Joachim's retort to Yuri at the end.

More or less word-for-word from what I can gather - I'm no expert.
Something like:
It's empty! It's hollow! Because it's a drat soil pipe!
I'll use it as a straw, then.

Joey-boy even calls it a "Straw" (ストロー).

Also for all this game's kinda tedious parts (and this dungeon drags on way too long) the cutscene of Yuri trying to trick Veronica, while Lenny feels like the biggest doofus, never fails to make me grin,

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

amigolupus posted:

Pesky Splinter, something I'm curious about is just how many of Blanca's lines are straight up quotes from Char Aznable? I know the first wolf bout had Blanca saying the "Because you're a spoiled boy", which was something Char said during the Zeon speech in MSG.

No idea sorry. :v: I'm really not familiar with MSG - although any quotes are probably intentional as there is an explict reference later on. Characters modelled after the Black Tri-Stars, barely changed names and all.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Geostomp posted:

They know it’s more trouble than it’s worth. I’d say using it as a bargaining chip is the second smartest thing to do with that book. The first is burning it.

It's from earlier on when they're off to Wales to search for it, but when Yuri's telling them about the Emigre manuscript, he actually says that he wanted to burn the thing to be done with it, but was persuaded to hide it instead. :lol:

I guess Roger was like, "Look, do you know how much it cost to bind it in a skull-shape? I'm not burning that!".

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Schwartzcough posted:

So what is this "shortcuts" rating in the battle data screen? For some reason I feel like it was in Shadow Hearts 1 also, and also never budged above 0.

It's not in SH1 - its to do with the combo system. You can assign characters to do certain actions and activate them (when in a combo) with the triggers and bumpers to speed up the actual process of doing combo moves and cutting down on menu time. Or something like that - never actually used it :v:

[e]: Gave it a quick go:




Character State covers stuff like what Fusion Yuri is in (and presumably Joachim in whatever form he's in) so you can have presets for when they're in a specific form.



So for example, changing a standard hit into a Third Key hit.



And you can set magic as well


You still have to group up for the combo, and successfully hit the ring areas, but it can queue up the next character (you can also push left/right to choose which one is next) while in the active process of doing damage, bypassing manually selecting the move from the menu - and it'll default to the standard menu selection if you let the combo play out as normal.



I guess it speeds things up a tiny bit. :shrug: Cool it's there, but literally never touched it before now.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Jan 14, 2020

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

The Dark Id posted:

It's a very useless system I'm never going to touch.

Yeah. I mean, it's even in the sequel, where combos sort of matter a bit more (and the system is tweaked slightly so they can be started with any character), but it still suffers from the same problems as in this game, and is entirely unneeded in the grand scheme of the game.

As you say there's so many factors to take into account (weight in this game, height in the sequel) reducing the options to four to save...not really any great deal of time, doesn't actually really help things.

The Dark Id posted:

There are several quality of life in theory but not actually mechanically systems in this game. But, you know, they've come a long drat way from Koudelka...

Yeah, at least we can actually see which character is moving next, can see health, weaknesses, item drops, etc and not Koudelka's perpetual twin answers of "???" and "Should have bought the Japanese guide - hope you can read Japanese".

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Ubiquitous_ posted:

Yeah, it's definitely a retcon that doesn't work on a few different levels.

Part of the problem is in SH1, Albert's in things for the long con with three or four different world-ending plans in motion.

Like, he vows revenge against the church, spends 500 years plotting his revenge, steals the cursed books, gives one to Patrick knowing it's going to summon some twisted poo poo, aids Dehuai in Shanghai (which fails)...and then apparently mellows out and joins Sapientes Gladio, only to then apparently decide to...do his original plan anyway. And also cursing the rando he sold his house to because he wanted another cursed world-ending bug monster.

And then it's suddenly just "Oh no, all those bad things he did were in the cause of stopping Rasputin". Somehow.

Despite that, I do like how they tie Albert in to the plot. It makes zero sense, but whatever.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.




While Yuri and Karin go off on their little soul search, we immediately cut to an Director's Cut exclusive scene - a nice little scene that expands some more on the most underdeveloped party member. This actually occurs during another weird dialogue transition during the first few steps into Yuri's mind palace, but, again, it flows better here.


Music: Spiritualization ~ Holy Land of God




*Sniff sniff* Huh? This perfume...

Something the matter?

Huh? Oh, it's nothing. I've just gotta...powder my nose.



... ...









:aaa: Veronica!?

You think I'm some kind of dog?! You've got some nerve coming here! Yuri and Karin are getting the power to defeat Rasputin. I won't let you interfere!



Oh? And are you going to stop me?

I'm more than enough to stop you!





That's right. Your astrological powers would make you an asset to Lord Rasputin. Think about it, you could be "Astrologist to the Supreme Overlord". Has a nice ring to it, doesn't it?

Jokes on you Veronica - Lucia's "astrological powers" really put the "rear end" in astrological - she's already wiped the party once with her tarot cards, by all means, take her!

Astrologist to the Supreme Overlord, eh? Heh...hahaha...hah heh...Er! N-no! I refuse!

Lucia...please reconsider. If not, the next time we meet will be to the death.











I see... I didn't want it to be this way. Next time we meet, I can't let you live!













I like this little character scene - it's not integral to the plot at all, but gives Lucia a tiny bit of sorely-needed development and a little more personal stake in the plot, outside of just being along for the ride.

It's minor, but sometimes, that's all that's needed.

:ssh: Still not enough to save her from being permanently benched though.


Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Jan 19, 2020

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Neddy Seagoon posted:

All while the Tsar and Tsarina are presumably watching this poo poo go down from a palace window and asking to themselves "...Was that under there the entire time?" :confused:

"Where the hell was that hiding!? Was it under the haunted crypt with the secret passage that leads directly outside the throne room?"
".........Wait. Secret passage? Haunted crypt? How did I not know about these!?"
"Later dear, the devil just uppercut a Zeppelin, and our former vizier just summoned an alien space fortress. Wonder if it's anything to do with that alien and his green space-dog the peasants have been talking about?"
"...An alien and his space-dog!? I've been away at the war front for too long..."

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

EggsAisle posted:

This is the correct reaction to just about everything involving Cornelia.

There's something even worse with the puppet, that they removed for the western releases which I'll be covering in due course.

And add me to the people who completely missed the Nicolai dream cutscene thing, and literally only found out about it during kethryveris' LP of it.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


So this is breaking sequence somewhat for something that's not usually availble until the endgame, but it's entirely inconsequential to the overall story, and the quicker it's out of the way, the better, as it's one of the worst aspects of the game - it's all the good poo poo from here on out after this unfortunate little blip.

Just to forewarn, maybe don't read this one around other people. It's kinda grody.



So, the first order of business is there is actually a little secret bonus for having a SH1 save game on the memory card. And it was actually translated into English!

However it was never properly implemented in the international versions - only the Japanese versions of the game, and not, as previously believed, exclusively in the Director's Cut.

And it also only detects a Japanese SH1 save file.

I have a feeling it was removed for...well, you'll see soon enough. :shepicide:

There's going to be lots of jumping between the English and Japanese versions to show this off, if the sudden text flipflops are confusing anyone.
---

Now, the normal sequence of events is getting to the endgame, and visiting this guy in the Wine Cellar, who offers a little RNG "Lucky Chest" minigame, where matching all the items in the chest will give you an item.





I'll leave The Dark Id to explain the actual game itself when he revisits the Wine Cellar, but with a SH1 save detected, Jimote here unlocks an extra stage - the EX Stage, which will reward you with an ultra special item.



(Just pretend the above is what I'm talking about :ssh: )

But of course, there's no legitimate way to get this in the English version.

Nil desperandum, however!

There is a fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man.
It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity.
It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man’s fears, and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination.

It is an area which we call ...





Who you callin' a dummy, room!?

This is the games debug room - internally called Debug Island -from here we can modify the various game flags, give/remove items, teleport to maps, set up battles, and engage in general jiggery-pokery of the game.



It's very extensive, and even has some unused items, but right now we're after a very specific and exclusive item.



And yes!





It's Wanderer Meiyuan...the gross pervert molester from the first game - looking considerably more buff than last time we saw him.

The Dark Id posted:



Thankfully, we no longer need him to modify our Judgement Ring attacks, and he was replaced by a menu, which doesn't grope the male characters.

Oh, and the Soul Ring, a far better character.

Despite having this in our inventory, there is one more prerequisite; we need to have acquired all the previous dresses (and stud cards obviously).

I've done that already, so now, Yuri and company stop off in Montmartre to have a little chat with Gerard and Pierre.






Music: Dear, My Dressmaker ~ The Tailor




What's up?

Can you help out? Pierre's so down, he's not doing any work.

What's the problem?



You're trying to find yourself? That's something you should have figured out twenty years ago.

It's this book I read recently. It really got to me. I've just been seeing things so superficially. Never really finding the true essense of things...All the dresses I make...They've got no substance. There's nothing to them! Oh, it's no use! I'll never be a top designer at this rate...

That's a shame. Just when I brought you a Stud Card too.





Is it...?! Just smell all those pheromones! Could it be...? It'd be too good to be true!

Huh? This? Jeez, keep your shirt on!

It is, isn't it?! I knew it! The most sought-after of all Stud Cards. The best of the best! The rarest of cards! Only one was ever printed! Meiyuan! Y-you're going to let me have it, right?

Well...I dunno. I mean, you're not making dresses anymore, right?

Yuri, you tease. :allears:

I will, I will! Don't worry about that! The best I've ever made! Oh, just looking at it makes my eyes water!

Really? This?

Oh, yes! Really! No question! You won't regret this, I promise! C-can I have it?!

What's so great about it?

Pleeeease! Just let me hold it!

Okay, okay! Here, have it!

<Yuri hands over the card>



I'll start designing a new dress right away! Like this...a bit here...a bit there...There! All done!

Let me see, let me see!

Ta-da!



It's bugged in the English version, giving Cornelia her starting dress and the wrong name. But with a bit of editing magic;



Et voilà.

Huh? There's no dress there...

Ah, this dress is invisible to fools, you see!



Surely...you can see it...right, Yuri? It's a beautiful garment, isn't it?



All those frills on the sleeves. It's very pretty!

There aren't any frills. It's a tube top.

Um...

:lol:

Okay, take care of it, now! It's my best dress! But don't use your eyes to look at it. Use your heart! See ya!



Gerard has an additional line that never actually triggers.



The book that made such a big impression on him was "The Emperor's New Clothes." You must be furious, huh?



Oh, we'll be furious in a minute Gerard, just you fuckin' wait.


To the dress menu!



Hopping over to the parallel Japanese dimension for a moment...



Oh dear...that sketch...

Music: ENDS. Drumroll begins.



Presenting the latest creation from my 1915 Pierre Magimel Collection! I call it...

:siren::nws::siren:



"Beautiful Fool"!!

Thanks. I hate it.



why game? W-H-Y.



Why, Pierre? Why?



So...yeah...this is the "Beautiful Fool" dress.

Obviously based on the story of the Emperor's New Clothes, it's a joke "dress", and doesn't teach any new skills whatsoever.

It has the property of "全ての特殊攻撃力減" - "All special attacks reduced" - though I'm not too sure if it's Gepetto's attacks reduced, or the enemies.



Gepetto please stop doing that with your cursed daughter substitute



It's honestly pretty grody.

It gets even worse with the fact that - Spoiler Warning - you can equip her in just white panites, or a black thong when you unlock them later. :barf:

Thanks. I hate it. :suicide:

Thankfully, the rest of the Director's Cut stuff is actually good and not gross.
---

Oh, Cornelia! You're pretty as a peach!

Hey Gramps, do us a favour and put some clothes on it yeah?

Oh yeah, her dresses are adorable!

You know, I'm really not comfortable with the...um...naked doll thing.

Same. You'd better keep it away from me пожилой человек.

It's alright. They're not including it in the international versions.

*Pant, pant* (Phew!)

C'mon! The quicker we do these sidequests, the quicker we can get back to Russia! It's only...1700 miles that way! Let's just pretend this never happened okay?

Fine! Fine! Fine! I'll put another dress on her, and we'll say no more about it. You're just salty you're too much of an idiot to see it.
---





To wash out that bad taste, have an goofy un-used concept for Cornelia.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Feb 16, 2020

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

MythosDragon posted:

I think the crest magic additions are an afterthought because they chose a 72 entry theme. Are there even 72 unique spells?

So how effective are hit area expands?

About 60 generic spells - 4 attack spells, 1 shield, and 1 buff for each element (excepting non-elemental), 6 single target and 6 party target buffs, and then a slew of miscellaneous heals and cures and other buffs. And that's just the crests - it's actually quite an extensive moveset in this game when you include the unique party moves, ring items, and combo magic and such.

Hit Area expands really need a few of them to have much of an impact - about 3 normally.

Unmodified:


+1


+7


MythosDragon posted:

How far can hit area expands go? Can you say cheat in the max and get everyone on the active party to have a silver hand effect?
Can you just plain cheat in permanent silver hand?
Failing the above is it feasible to get through with the auto mode without it being a hardhack?

Depends how many hit areas a character has on a ring - you can have a single one that will cover the entire ring, but they'll only do a single attack. Even with cheats the game also limits the hit and strike area expands to 99 across the entire party - so you could make a single character you could never miss on, but the rest would have few or no modifications to their rings.

That said, it's quite flexible on how it spaces the ring, although they seem to have programmed in some kind of limit so there's a minimum space between attack areas.
Pumping HAE and SAE into the first and third attack areas.


Resetting and pumping them into the second.


As for Auto ring, the devs clearly discourage people from wanting to play with it - It's a bit mean from an accessibility point, but the uniqueness of the system is the Judgement Ring - it makes a character do a single attack, and removes all strike areas, meaning no sweet extra damage (and that applies to all moves).

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 00:55 on Feb 24, 2020

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

MythosDragon posted:

Thank you very much. I never assumed they were divided by attack like that...

I already downloaded the game, so I'm committed but drat I'm dreading this. Most RPGs make you go through about 1000 battles, and I never really care too much, but Id dreading any and all extra fights in these games really goes to show exactly why most game's let you just turn your brain off and get that sweet sweet exp for the number porn between the battles that actually matter.

Though go past 1000 and even I start dying... Just got to Act 3 in Vesperia and my battle count is 1600.... I havnt grinded at all.

If you're not feeling the regular ring, under the "Ring Custom" menu, select the "Practice Ring" - it'll get rid of the Strike Areas, but keep the rest of the Hit Areas of the ring. Normally a ring is cancelled if you miss a segment, but the Practice Ring will keep on going, so long as you've at least hit one area. Again, that applies to everything - special moves, and magic.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Randomzx posted:

I think they do, doesn't the game gives you better rewards depends on how fast you finish fights? especially the boss fight.

Kind of. Technically all enemy groups have at least one battle bonus which'll give something if the player meets the requirements - these requirements are only written in the guidebooks, so it's basically pure chance in a standard playthrough.

Rewards are either a consumable (leaf,seed, etc, Joachim's transformation stuff, or lottery tickets), or a boost in EXP, Souls, or Cash.

But yeah, generally, the less turns the enemy has, the more likely you'll get an item.

From the guide it goes:
0-3 Enemy turns (some boss allow for more)
Number of Hits in a single combo (goes from 20-60 for the latter battles)
And Ring Perfect Victory (i.e, only ever hitting the red areas on the ring and never missing a ring)


The Dark Id posted:

Episode LXXIII: The Fort of Regrets

Huh, neat, :aaa: didn't know you could even get to the Fort in Disc 1

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Schwartzcough posted:

Are lottery tickets a finite resource? Seems dickish to require you to get multiple wins on this guy, when presumably you also need to find and win with all the other lottery members for THAT sidequest.

There's a finite number lying around the world in chests and on the ground, but some enemies do have them as a rare drop - like a 3% chance. So technically you could grind an insane out amount, but in practice, it's better just to save scum the few found in the world, or the guaranteed boss drops.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Qrr posted:

Do they just go in order and it doesn't matter where you trigger them

IIRC it's this.
---

Roman law (as with all law) was super complicated - dependent on the nature of the crime - if it was against an individual or their property (including slaves), or the state of Rome itself (considered to be much more serious) - the social status of the accuser, accused, if you were a Roman citizen, a freeman, a foreigner, a woman, in the military, etc, etc.

The very short version is, slaves had no rights and could be punished in any way, and crimes against slaves were considered crimes against another's property.
Freemen had some rights, but less than citizens.
Roman citizens were punished with death if the crime was considered an act against the state of Rome itself (treason, sacrilege - especially against Vestal Virgins), or parricide (kin-slaying) or rape against a freeman male, or female virgin (rape of slaves and sex workers was not considered a crime).

And even then the punishment for lesser crimes could be harsher or less severe dependent on your class; i.e, a freeman killing a slave, that's probably a fine as you've murdered someone's "property".
Another man's slave killing a slave - that man owes the other money, and there's likely a flogging (or worse) for the slave.
You as a high-ranking noble kill a freeman, probably exile.
You as a noble kill another noble or a citizen, probably death.

Don't need no fancy-schmancy crime scales when you have a class system :pseudo:

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

And an ios game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqGmbdO3u7o

Everything's comin' up Nier :yokotaro:

Shame the Shadow Hearts licence is in pachinko hell, and apparently the attempt to get Koudelka on GOG and/or Steam fizzled out into nothing.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Shitenshi posted:

The only thing I remember about this dungeon is that when I used a guide to deal with it's stupid gimmick, that as I was finishing it up, I realized I'd never be able to do it on my own due to how annoying it is. You're definitely making the right call here.

It literally bugged out on me at the last hurdle when I did this dungeon - somehow I managed to make one of the parties skip over a trigger at the very end leaving me wandering around aimlessly until it randomly triggered properly.

It's a bad dungeon regardless - it's visually unappealing, and the gimmick is basically a worse, more confusing version of the Gallery of the Dead's.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

NullBlack posted:

Ouka is the last of the three. Hien and Raiden may have been proofs-of-concept. Kato making sure he's got the process down perfectly before he does it to Kawashima.

"Day 6: Perfected the DNA sequencing on Raiden. Booty status; well within exceptable tolerances. Increasing to maximum booty for subject, 'Ouka'."

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Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Hear No Evil.
Speak No Evil.
Bazoonga No Evil.

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