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Generally you would probably want the main line running past the stop to avoid congestion. Then make a branch to/from the stop on either side.
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May 5, 2019 22:54
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Finally decided to pull the trigger on this with the extra content they've been adding, hopefully I can avoid bouncing off it.
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Jan 1, 2021 10:43
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Do workers use overlapping transport routes intelligently or do I have to manually gently caress with it? As in, can I set up a route that shuttles people across a city, and then another one that runs them direct to the factory, and people will get on the city line and then transfer to the factory line? E: also am I just supposed to be like, throwing huge piles of workers at everything to ensure proper staffing? OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 11:45 on Jan 2, 2021 |
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Jan 2, 2021 11:37
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Can you add more cabins or upgade it to a heavy cable way which can use the 10 person cabins? I know it's not what you asked but it does help increase throughput on cableways.
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Jan 2, 2021 16:21
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The micromanagement seems to be the point, yes. I dunno, I'm struggling with it. The combination of really finnicky placement rules, complete inability to adjust anything afterwards, and the need to manually connect every goddamn thing all the time and no things like the different viewmodes you would get with cities skylines is making it hard to enjoy. Everything is just such a chore, and seemingly for no good reason too.
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Jan 2, 2021 19:29
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I am used to playing with move it in CS to be able to line things up nicely. I appreciate that the game does make time and resource investment important but for that exact reason I would appreciate being able to nudge things around in the blueprint phase. I have tried to level things but I also find the leveling tools to be very crap, again especially compared to CS. They are slow and it is hard to notice if they are doing anything and also there is no contour mode that I can find, to actually see if you have leveled things. There is a wireframe overlay but that is hard to read and also doesn't show actual absolute flatness. The distribution centers seem like an appealing thing but given that the throughput rate of trucks seems pretty inadequate for industrial purposes the game seems to prefer that you use conveyors and such, but the restrictions on things like that seem arbitrary. You can't build conveyors around objects, you have to daisy chain the weird towers together to do that, and everything needs to be wired up and connected and you can't split lines without installing splitter buildings and stepping up and down voltages and then they need substations to actually distribute the power and every line has a wattage limit and jesus christ why? Getting roads to build under conveyors is extremely fiddly, bus stops are buildings you have to build on your roads, you can't build roads over inter-factory connections... There are elements of micromanagement that I appreciate and would enjoy, but they are buried in what is extremely finnicky basic systems that do not need to be that finnicky or poorly visualized, especially in comparison to the complexity. It would be like if factorio did not give you grid specific control of conveyors or something. If it had any of the interface quality of CS, or if it dropped some of the needlessly restrictive placement restrictions so that you could connect things more fluidly, either would improve it, but it seems dead set on having both a terrible interface and making you use it as much as possible. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Jan 2, 2021 |
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Jan 2, 2021 20:35
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I haven't gotten to the point where I have used railways, the things prior to that are already too tiresome. Never mind building things without using money. I just really hate the interface, even down to things like the lack of "buy and add a vehicle to this line" or even a bloody "apply line to all vehicles and launch" button. The entire approach to things just seems rear end backwards. It's like the whole game is designed around a push focused approach, you can't set some workplaces to have higher priority so your infinite kindergartens don't get understaffed which makes everyone stay home which leads to more understaffing, you have to micromanage each building to send people to work at the vital services, and then keep doing that because people seem to be incapable of doing anything outside of walking distance. There is seemingly no point in the game where you can click on a building and set its needs and then something comes along to fill them using an existing network, you have to set everything up all the time. There is no demand focused form of management that I can find, you have to push everything fromt he bottom up, it's like transport tycoon or whatever, which was fine for a game 25 years ago or whatever but it's daft for a modern game. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Jan 2, 2021 |
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Jan 2, 2021 20:52
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I haven't even gotten half of the necessary materials to build anything without using the funding and trying to allocate resources to being able to do that would take far too long, I have enough trouble trying to stabilize funding as is.
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Jan 2, 2021 21:10
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Anime Store Adventure posted:Would you want me to spend some time and try to write you a decent early game guide to help you get to manual building? Totally fine if not - but just wanted to ask before I take the time to write it out. It would kind of be a build order + a few tips and tricks - probably wouldn't help you much with a lot of the UI futzing. No it's fine I don't think it's an issue of me not understanding how it works, I suspect from looking at the construction office interface that I would be able to understand it but it seems entirely unapplicable unless I figured out what the hell even the point of the rest of the game is. As it stands I have yet to manage to reach the end of the year without spending everything constructing a small town and a basic coal industry and ending up entirely stagnant with no money, capacity to do anything, and at best net zero income so anything more complex than that seems rather academic.
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Jan 2, 2021 21:30
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I had assumed you would need to do a mix of import and production for some time, but it is more that I can barely set up a semi-functional gravel factory with 10 million starting cash so it seems pretty useless to bother with until a later point. I am going to put it down and see if I can try it again when I find it less frustrating or if/when they do anything to make it more playable.
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Jan 2, 2021 21:45
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Went to bed, came back to it less frustrated, set up a new map and tried making an import based construction compound first thing, along with an import distillery to stabilize funding. I'm starting to see the appeal a little, also I downloaded some useful things off the workshop including better conveyor towers and the big kindergarten which seems like it might help. It is more enjoyable when you're actually using the resource based construction, feels less like you're just plopping poo poo down wherever. E: It's weird that there doesn't seem to be a way to use the parallel construction snap with roads, only railways. Anime Store Adventure posted:I have no tourists and they definitely visit it but I have no idea what it grants them. Maybe just a happiness boost? I have a sight tower (mod - a church tower that’s a “cathedral tour”) and it gets visited, but it doesn’t seem to improve any citizens cultural enjoyment. It does “attraction” but citizens aren’t measured on that so who knows? RE: this, I think an indoor pool seems to satisfy sport desire, so useful in winter when your footy pitch is frozen. I would assume perhaps the cafe doubles as a bar? OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Jan 3, 2021 |
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Jan 3, 2021 12:09
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Apparently seven people didn't go to work in the heating plant and so several thousand people froze to death and now nobody lives in my country... Game is really trying to make me hate it.
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Jan 3, 2021 21:29
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I reloaded and put one in the middle of town for security. gently caress em, they can breathe coal if they're too dumb to turn the goddamn heating on.Grevlek posted:Does anyone have a guide on how to use the distribution centers? Say I want to help feed a gravel>concrete>cement industry, and a coal industry. Just fill it with the aggregate shipping vehicles, indicate loading at the quarry and mine, and drop-off at the various plants and the game will sort it out? Basically yeah as best I can tell, you assign it to all the buildings you want it to cover and then set up general ideas of what you want to load and unload to what level and it sorts the trucks out by itself. It's actually one of the nicer features and it's weird, IMO, that there is no equivalent for workers. It's very good for last mile logistics where you need to fill up a whole bunch of tiny shops in a city, pulling from a main depot connected via rail or whatever, but the truck throughput capacity renders it suboptimal for large scale transfer. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Jan 3, 2021 |
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Jan 3, 2021 21:50
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Apparently tourists also make hella cash, somehow. Gonna build more hotels.
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Jan 3, 2021 22:02
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Oh can you drop people directly at factories? Will they also disperse to other facilities so you don't need to fit a bus stop in at the factory complex? Also, if I set a platform to distribute workers say, 90%/10% to two factories, if the 90% factory is fully staffed, will the remainder go to the 10% factory? Or will they just disappear/not get on the bus?
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Jan 4, 2021 00:06
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In that case I feel like the distribution percentages really should be like... numerical priorities? Like staff this building first, this one second, etc.
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Jan 4, 2021 00:31
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Grevlek posted:If I have trucks already running routes, can I reassign them to a distribution center without purchasing new ones If you select the vehicle there is a house button at the top, which allows you to set the building it works at, I would think that would work.
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Jan 4, 2021 00:50
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They literally will which is the funny bit  E: Can pedestrians path through buildings to reach other buildings? Or do you have to have paths going direct to every building you want? I know construction equipment needs a clear path but can people walk through buildings? OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 17:01 on Jan 4, 2021 |
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Jan 4, 2021 11:05
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That is just normal soviet leg and feet technology.
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Jan 4, 2021 18:17
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Frequent small deliveries is exactly what cable cars provide though?
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Jan 4, 2021 19:38
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Is the car spacing not determined by how many you buy? Or does the light cableway also support more cars?
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Jan 4, 2021 22:48
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Anime Store Adventure posted:Does anyone have a solid handle on the mechanics of oil/fuel pumping?
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Jan 6, 2021 17:19
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Yeah trains I think you can set up how you like but the roads are based on driving on the right side which is a bit annoying. It would be nice if these embankments were part of the normal game and also integrated better, if you could path through them (which vehicles can for some buildings) and you had stair options and also they would snap together it would be a lot of fun. 
OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Jan 7, 2021 |
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Jan 7, 2021 12:46
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I'm struggling to see how trains are practical for delivering passengers. Frankly I'm struggling to see how long range commutes are practical at all. Trains have high volume but I can't see how you'd use more than a fraction of it, and you also seem like you would lose a huge amount of productivity with staffing shortages unless you somehow flood your train lines with trains, which jams them up because of block restrictions. Also I wish that like, different structures had different walk radii. Like a large train station should serve a whole town, a hospital, a university etc, it seems stupid that a bus stop has the exact same amount of appeal as a major train station, what's the point of using anything but buses for passenger transit?
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Jan 9, 2021 20:32
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When I say I struggle to see how you would use the capacity I mean on the loading end, I struggle to see how you would be able to push enough workers into the rail system in order to utilize the capacity of the trains. I can entirely see how you would want to move vast quantities of workers to the later factories, but because of the limitations of the walking distances it seems like you would need to try and jank together some kind of bus system anyway to get them to actually go to the rail yard and also to staff the entire factory at the other end, so why bother with the rail system which is already very fiddly to make work. I already tried building an interconnected food factory and because you can't build paths across factory connections the workers won't staff the whole thing without having a bus to move them to the other side of the factory, which is equally just... bizzare? It's not a big factory, I live right next to a gigantic industrial site so I know how big they are and the bus services drop workers at the gates and it has an internal rail station, neither of which are practical for this game. It just seems... weird? And needlessly so because it seems entirely within the capability of the game's systems to provide any number of solutions to that problem but it seems like it just doesn't want to for some reason? re: creating situations requiring player intervention, the game already has tools that let you do that so if you did have an edge case you already have the ability to resolve it, but I don't see the need to make players do that all the time? Also didn't you say earlier that the point of the game was to avoid having to do that? Isn't that why it has distribution centers and the walk radius anyway? It seems weird to just... not allow you to utilize more things like that if you want to? Basically I just don't see how the game is enhanced by having to put down extra mass transit stops and use more vehicles to achieve a pretty no-brain goal? It's not really interesting to have to keep putting down sequences of the same half dozen buildings over and over and remember to add more stops to the lines as you do. And furthermore I think that having to do that and the propensity for it to break down a lot really just encourages you to not engage at all with any of that and just build factories in the middle of cities and who gives a poo poo? Either it's about creative expression in town layout or it's about maximising productivity and neither case really seems to support the way the game handles a lot of its logistics. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Jan 10, 2021 |
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Jan 10, 2021 01:35
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I wish that distribution centers could handle pickup from fields, seems daft really to have to store trucks in the agro farm when you only use them for a fraction of the year. E: wait what the gently caress I just tried it again and it seems they can?? That makes farming a lot less grief. It didn't work the first time I tried it.
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Jan 11, 2021 22:42
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I think I need to rejigger the agro factory to add road cargo stations offloading to grain silos which then direct connect to factories. Previously I had the agro farms connecting direct to the silos which makes it hard to get direct connections to all the various crop processors. If I don't need to keep adding agro farms just for truck capacity or use them as the dropoff that might make it easier.
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Jan 11, 2021 23:01
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I got the big silo and I could probably store it OK, main issue is with factory connections being so limited, you're not allowed any kind of other pathway or they lose their instant transfer, which is the whole point of having them becuse forklifts cannot throughput enough. It's weird that grain can't be moved by bucket lift, that's literally how it's normally moved. I guess I would need a distro center to move it from the fields to a silo, then a second set of silos in the actual factory area to store the stuff for processing, with cargo stations to increase truck throughput volume.
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Jan 11, 2021 23:11
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Will silos connected directly to each other share resources then? I tried that and it seemed like it was just sitting in one of them. Also can two silos connected to a cargo station transfer across the station to each other?
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Jan 11, 2021 23:17
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That makes more sense if it only shares when it overflows one silo. I think that cargo stations with silos connected is likely to be the best long term storage solution. Possibly it may be viable to use the distro center fill level rules to equalize between multiple or something, I don't know.
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Jan 11, 2021 23:26
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Presumably there is nothing stopping you from using two cargo stations if you want separate input/output, load at one, unload at the other. Obviously you get less actual storage without the mega silos.
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Jan 11, 2021 23:58
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Volmarias posted:Just be careful not to assign both of those to the same distribution center, or you'll have trucks load from the one just to immediately unload to the other. That is annoying yeah, it would be nice if the game could either be told or figure out not to do that.
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Jan 12, 2021 00:10
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I like quite a few things about the game, I just also see some elements of it that seem like they could be fairly simple improvements that would massively expand the usability, I keep running into things that are just... seemingly unecessarily awkward to do. And which could be improved seemingly without major simulation changes as they are largely interface and conceptualizing the simulation related. Even with that in mind though there is a lot to like and it is nice watching the things you set in motion move on their own. That is part of why I wish there were more options to automate things because I find the emergent behaviour the most pleasant part. I also finished the peninsula, more or less.  Also can someone who know how train flag go please sanity check my signals? I'm trying to maximise occupancy of this station without jamming the junction and it may conceivably need to allow trains to reverse out of either end onto the mainline. Also I'm making it left hand drive because it is easier on my brain.  I absolutely hate train signaling because it's just complicated enough that I keep loving it up despite being made of allegedly simple components. I think however that this should allow trains to exit from both sides of the station in reverse, cross to the correct side, but that it should also prioritize trains on the mainline to pass the station first by holding trains on the platform until there is a large block gap on the mainline. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 01:12
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Wait sorry that's the wrong picture, I noticed that and fixed it and changed some other bits to hopefully add the holding mechanism. It's not just this btw I am just universally garbage at signals in any game that has trains and signals, factorio, OTTD, this, anything. Also not helped by the fact that I can barely see the difference between the green(?) and red(?) block colours. E: I... think it's working? Does the... light blue? colour on the chain signal mean it will let a train onto the other platform? 
OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 04:10 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 04:00
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Right grand cheers hopefully that will work OK. I actually built a seemingly decent station for once rather than the horrible abortions in the other cities because I wanted to jam the thing in the middle. The joys of having a large area to work with and laying the rail line first.
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Jan 12, 2021 04:21
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Yeah you can't shift cargo by truck fast enough, also I did manage to make commuter trains work even, by using modded buildings and feeder lines, still not sure it's worth the effort but eh, the railway is there now so I might as well, presumably it will become more desirable as I build more towns.. But at the very least I don't see how industry can be viable using just trucks, sometimes you just need to shift hundreds of tonnes of stuff at once and boats need rivers. Even stuff like distro centers seem to want you to build rail depots and warehouses to store the bulk and then the distro center handles the last mile. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 04:38 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 04:34
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Train length is something I have already had to fight with in the lovely terminator branch in another city, so yes I am aware to limit train length to the space between the crossings. But I don't think I will need longer trains than I can fit in there and if it can use two platforms at once (which I think it can) that should greatly increase throughput. If I do end up needing to use longer trains I will probably just tell them to go onward and then build a train roundabout or something for them to turn round on. I think I can fit four carriages and a loco so that should be plenty for the moment, and I'm limited to the very low horsepower sets anyway right now because the proper locos overload the power grid. I do technically know how chain signals work it's more just that my brain overheats trying to actually work out the logic of what they do when you have several of them. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 06:12
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What is the mechanism for sustaining populations in towns? My established towns seem to refill buildings if I relocate people out of them, but my new towns do not seem super keen on spreading out from their residences. E: upon inspecting the city hall they do seem to slowly be having babies, guess the population level is just low and they won't migrate in from other towns that are full by rail or whatever. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 18:49
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The birth rate is significantly in excess of the death rate and nobody has escaped so it's just low population and the fact that all the new people are babies at the moment. I guess they don't move into other houses until the current one is full, perhaps. And they also perhaps do not do it other than via walking distance. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 21:06
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Is "escape" not just a euphemism for emigration? I haven't really been paying much concern to it. I also haven't noticed overcrowding, at least not to the point it seems to cause problems? Is there a problem with just letting a population sit without building new houses for a while?
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Jan 12, 2021 21:38
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