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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Fedule posted:

Rise of the Ronin has my attention. I have made it known consistently since the first time I played Nioh that I loving hate Nioh's basic outermost structure of repeating missions, so taking that game and making it open-world is certainly the kind of move I can get behind. If they also jettison the loot churn and just lean into the joyous, boundless depth inherent in the mechanics in their combat systems - you could make an all-time action game with just the sword moveset in Nioh and absolutely no progression otherwise - this could singlehandedly redeem Team Ninja for me. There is a motherfucker-tier game in Nioh/2 (and I assume in Wo Long but I've not heard anything encouraging) and it could be revealed for all to see if they just have the courage to discard all the cruft laden on top of it. I believe. I am listening intently for any word of how characters are built in this game.

Also it has a grappling hook and glider so, look, it's an all-timer, my hands are tied here.

Also: Stellar Blade is going to live or die based on whether or not it is actually any fun to play, and that's the one thing I couldn't get any sense of whatsoever from the trailer. I don't mean it looked not fun, I mean it's impossible to tell how fun it will be. This kind of thing really wants a demo. We need to feel it click.

Wo Long is good, but it's not Nioh 3 which is what a lot of people were probably expecting. It's definitely more streamlined on purpose, so you can just jump into combat more easily. I can understand why people who were expecting it to have as many systems as a fully DLC complete Nioh 2 were disappointed, even if I don't agree.

Wo Long is more straightforward while also getting rid of some terrible, tedious poo poo from Nioh 2 like stacking a ton of buffs before every boss. Having the Sekiro style combat also let's you be way more aggressive without having to worry about running out of stamina. And the changes to how spellcasting works was fantastic.

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Feb 1, 2024

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Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

Wo Long felt like Nioh 0.5

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Jack Trades posted:

Wo Long felt like Nioh 0.5

Do you feel the same way about Sekiro? Because that comparison doesn't really make sense. Just the fact that Sekiro and Wo Long don't need stamina for attacking let's them play quite a bit differently than Nioh / soulslikes with a stamina bar.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:

Do you feel the same way about Sekiro? Because that comparison doesn't really make sense. Just the fact that Sekiro and Wo Long don't need stamina for attacking let's them play quite a bit differently than Nioh / soulslikes with a stamina bar.

Kind of? I didn't care much for Sekiro really.

Nioh does not in fact have the stamina management of normal soulslikes, which is one of the reasons why I like it.
Flux and Double Flux mechanics allowed you to easily have infinite stamina at the cost of added execution (which I thought was very satisfying to do) and some mental overhead.

Fighting Elegy
Jan 2, 2007
I do not masturbate; I FIGHT!
Beat Wanted:Dead again last night on Japanese Hard. Reminds me of an old school arcade game with how each level in distinctive and different enemy types, something that every game used to do. It really helps the pacing which is definitely part of why the game excels.

Don't ignore guns though. In the first mission it can seem like they're not working but your default gun can take people down with just 1-2 headshots even on hard mode, and once you get the shotgun you can use it delimb enemies and blast approaching enemies at close range. You can do some very sick nasty stuff if you start using guns to transition into and out of combos. Going back and forth between fighting people in the foreground and shooting people in the background, putting your gun away right in time to get a perfect parry and then taking your gun out again to shotgun a ninja in the head is incredibly addictive and cool.

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.

Wanted: Dead posted:

`PATCH 1.12`

**DAUER HQ LEVEL — FIRST NINJA ENCOUNTER REWORK:**
• The First Ninja encountered now has a health bar displayed, and his HP and damage have been modified to provide a better combat experience.

• A new checkpoint detail: Respawn point now happens right before the first Ninja encounter.

• Extra Stimpacks are now placed on the level.


**PC IMPROVEMENTS:**
• DLSS 3.5 and FSR 2.2 are now available for Steam.

• Cloud saves are now available on Steam.

**IMPROVEMENTS AND ADDITIONS:**
• FSR 2.2 for better performance is now available on PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X/S.

• Mini-bosses now have a 100% Stimpack drop chance.

• The cover system has been updated to enable a manual cover option. It is set as default but can be switched back in the Options menu.

• Easy “Neko Mode'' difficulty is now available from the Start menu.

• A new Player Stats menu has been added, listing various combat stats performed across the game for the related Achievements/Trophies progress tracking.

**BUG FIXES:**
• Further stability improvements have been implemented.

• The game no longer registers controller input while minimized.

• Gamepad vibration/haptics no longer occur when the game is being controlled via mouse
and keyboard.

• Reset options in the Display section now work correctly.

• Graphics settings are now saved after restarting the game.

• HDR no longer switches off upon restart.

• The “Space Runaway” music can no longer be heard in the Police HQ after quitting Stage 2.

• Flickering issues were corrected in Kowloon Park.

• Redundant prompts have been removed in Kowloon Street.

• Various boss health bar bugs have been fixed.

• Hannah is no longer able to go back and repeat fights in Kowloon Street after a save/load.

• The chainsaw can no longer be dropped during the hand attack animation, which used to
cause an incorrect animation with invisible weapons.

According to devs they are planning to do more updates in spring so I guess the gsme's not quite dead yet

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

It's not Dead but is it Wanted?

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNIXOOun1ng&t=267s

Timestamped to some firearm usage in combat. Also firing rockets while using your glider. And swapping to party members and then using their gun too.

Game is gonna be great.

swims
May 5, 2014

Waiter, this band keeps shooting pearls at me.
Hit a wall in tekken 8 and saw that Wanted is $30. Bought it. Played a little bit of the first mission. Seems like it’s a solid game. Enemies are a little hard to distinguish and their attacks are too. Probably just one of those things that works itself out after a few rounds.

Has gun customization lol I had never noticed that mentioned ever when looking at this game. I don’t know how deep it goes but a few checkpoints into the first mission alone i unlocked like 5 attachments. They do basic poo poo like add stopping power and decrease stability by 20 points or whatever so basic but a cool surprise!

I sort of like the death mechanic. You get stimpacks, but if you die fully once, a teammate revives you pretty close to where you died. Second death is game over/ return to checkpoint. Enemies hit hard but seem fair.

This game also has a skill tree that I haven’t really looked over yet. Basic starting skill is bullet time/ focus that auto shoots at whoever is by you with the handgun.

Enemy tracking is like Sifu. No dmc target lock that I can see. The assault rifle actually feels pretty good. Over the shoulder shooting feels arcade style is how I’d describe it. In a good way. I’d say overall the controls feel snappy and there are some… brutal takedowns.

I’m down for whatever this story is. Usually I skip cutscenes but because this one is supposed to be so incoherent I’ll watch them. You can pause cutscenes which I always consider a plus for beer runs too.

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.
According to the official Wanted Dead discord this is what's coming in next patch;

Good news everyone. Let's talk about next patch, that will be released in 2 weeks. You should expect:

- Skill Tree rework
- Weapon rebalance
- New Bullet Time
- Melee combat improvements
- Dismemberment for guns
- Stun for weapons/modes
- Slide attack with katana or handgun
- Space Runaway tweaks
- Fixes for shader caching
- Save data transfer from PS4 to PS5
- Grenades tweaks
- Many small fixes and improvements

swims
May 5, 2014

Waiter, this band keeps shooting pearls at me.
Nice looks like I picked it up at the right time

One thing the game is lacking is the over the shoulder aiming swap from right shoulder to left. Like division and remnant have. Feels like this game would really benefit from that.

Pulcinella
Feb 15, 2019
Probation
Can't post for 21 days!

WaltherFeng posted:

According to the official Wanted Dead discord this is what's coming in next patch;

Good news everyone. Let's talk about next patch, that will be released in 2 weeks. You should expect:

- Skill Tree rework
- Weapon rebalance
- New Bullet Time
- Melee combat improvements
- Dismemberment for guns
- Stun for weapons/modes
- Slide attack with katana or handgun
- Space Runaway tweaks
- Fixes for shader caching
- Save data transfer from PS4 to PS5
- Grenades tweaks
- Many small fixes and improvements

Lol looks like I should have waited a bit. Just played it a bit this weekend and it feels terrible. Basically every complaint everyone else has had. Ill try again when this patch comes out.

Ulio
Feb 17, 2011


Jack Trades posted:

Kind of? I didn't care much for Sekiro really.

Nioh does not in fact have the stamina management of normal soulslikes, which is one of the reasons why I like it.
Flux and Double Flux mechanics allowed you to easily have infinite stamina at the cost of added execution (which I thought was very satisfying to do) and some mental overhead.

Although I agree with Capslock's point, Wulong is definitely more of an action game than Nioh in the fundamentals but because of Nioh's systems you can sort of bypass some of the rpg limitations.

The other thing is that Wulong does have a resource in the ki system, which if you spam too many specials you basically stagger yourself. The brilliance is in Wulong that the ki/posture system of Sekiro can be used aggressively instead of just defensively. In Sekiro you start at 0 posture and can go to -100. But in Wulong you can get up to +100(or -100) and spam abilities. So it does incentivize you to take more risks.

Sekiro is one of my fav games but at launch they really hosed up with the emblem cost for the abilities, like it was really not worth using abilities since they cost so much emblems and was a shared resource with your tools as well. Which is stupid because it basically locked up some of the best combat abilities in Sekiro behind a limited resource. I went later and they did patch it but I felt like they should just make it based on a unlimited resource or give you positive posture ala Wulong and use that for special abilities.

Also as far as action games go, I have Rise of the Ronin in my backlog, DD2 and Stellar Blade. Gonna probably replay MGRR and HiFi Rush. Two games where I got hard difficulties completed but could go further.

Pulcinella
Feb 15, 2019
Probation
Can't post for 21 days!

Jack Trades posted:

It's very amateur but it's not bad if you want to scrape the bottom of the barrel for the genre.
Turns out Soulstice was indeed very amateur. I wouldn't say its terrible but it runs into the same "my first character action dev attempt" problems a lot of CA games do. Like it also has the boring color-coded enemy design that DmC does.

In other news, the Wanted: Dead patch came out. From Steam:

quote:

This is the first major update for Wanted: Dead that introduces key changes to the combat system, featuring an overhauled Skill Tree system for more strategic gameplay, improved Adrenaline Mode, and new abilities. Weapons, both ranged and melee, have been rebalanced to reward skilled players. This update focuses on enhancing the gameplay experience — making combat deeper and the game more enjoyable for all players. Additionally, we've packed a ton of requested features, fixes and optimizations to make everything run smoother. Have fun!

Combat improvements:

Skill Tree rework:
The Skill Tree has been expanded, adding several new skills, and modifying some of the existing ones. (Players will need to re-distribute the skill points on any previously started playthroughs.)
Melee and ranged weapon rebalancing has been introduced.
Weapons no longer become invisible after releasing the chainsaw during the handgun attack animation.

Updated Skills:
Sliding Attack: This attack can now knock a shield out of an opponent's hand.
Severed Limb Finishing Strike: Leg finisher and arm finisher combined in one skill.
Finishers: Grants adrenaline gauge, around the same as normal kill.
Bullet Time Aim: Duration increased, only enemies are slowed down.
Grenade\Incendiary Grenade: A quick button press now tosses grenades closer to the players allowing usage in melee (toss grenade, roll back etc.)
Extended dodge and combo: Can be initiated after being unlocked from the beginning of the game and doesn't show in the skill tree.
Extended dodge i-frames (x3) unlocked from the beginning of the game and doesn't show in the skill tree.
Extended parry window (x2) unlocked from the beginning of the game and doesn't show in the skill tree.
Charge Attack: Can now flinch\disrupt enemies canceling their attacks\getting thru super armor.
Cutting limbs and stunning enemies with headshots (works better with improvement skills described below) and then using finishers will give players adrenaline.

New Skills:
Sliding Shot: Players can shoot a handgun while sliding multiple times.
Adrenaline Rush: After using Bullet Time players will automatically activate slow-mo mode for 10 seconds. Receiving damage during this time will decrease duration instead of HP.
Dismemberment Up: During Adrenaline Rush, dismemberment with melee attacks increased by 30%.
Stun Up: During Adrenaline Rush, Katana and Handgun stun increased by 50%.
Damage Reduction Up: During Adrenaline Rush all incoming damage is reduced by 50%.
Limb Shooter: Shooting at enemy limbs with primary or secondary weapons has a chance to cut them off.
This skill synergises with "Severed Limb Finishing Strike."
Concussion: Headshots stun increased by 50%.
With this skill there is a possibility to stun an enemy instead of killing it thus gaining opportunity for a finisher.
Improved Limb Shooter: During Bullet Time Aim dismemberment chance with ranged attacks increased by 30%.
Improved Concussion: During Bullet Time Aim Headshots stun increased by additional 50%
During Adrenaline Rush mode players can attack additional enemies before using finishers to set up multi-finishers and regain a good chunk of adrenaline

Melee balance changes:
Y-X-X-X-X: Additional 20% stun for every katana move (Handgun only had +5% from ranged weapons balance).
Y-X-Y-X-X-X: Additional 20% damage for 3 moves (Handgun has +5% stun from ranged weapons balance and one attack had +20% stun from combo buff above).
Ranged weapons balance changes:

Handgun stun chance increased by 2x (From 5% to 10%).
Gunsmith Rifle base damage now correctly applies 133% damage bonus (from 60 to 79.8 damage).
LMG Hellhound damage increased by 70% (from 70 to 120).
SMG Hyena base damage increased by 20% (from 54 to 65) and stun value increased by 4x (From 5% to 20%).
SMG Avenger base damage increased by 42% (from 42 to 60) and stun value increased by 3x (From 5% to 15%).

Optimizations and graphics:
snip

Health bar fixes:
Mr. Holiday’s health bar no longer disappears after defeating his twin.
Fixed an issue where the Spider Tank’s HP bar would disappear after defeating an enemy.
The health bar of the first Ninja no longer flickers green at full health.
August’s health bar no longer flickers when hitting enemies with GL Flying Pig or grenades.
The health bar of the Tanks in Kowloon Street now disappears when they are defeated.

Grenades:
Hannah is no longer able to change the grenade type while it is still in flight.
The red trajectory line for grenade throws now displays instantly.
Grenade indicators are now visible all the time, even if Hannah is not close to it. Being in grenade range is now shown with a flashing red icon.

Controls changes:
Default weapon swap controls have been changed to left d-pad press on controllers or “2” on keyboard.
Default grenade swap controls have been changed to right d-pad press on controllers or “3” on keyboard.

Bug Fixes:
snip

https://steamdb.info/patchnotes/13893466/

Pulcinella fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Apr 9, 2024

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.
I tried the new patch last night. Its still Wanted Dead with all the jank that comes with it but the combat does feel improved. The new sliding shot looks cool and you can now dismember with guns + do melee finisher

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

CAG subreddit is having a public vote on what the best games in the genre are and the current Top 3's are DMC3, DMC5 and Ninja Gaiden 2.
Considering the fact that I have never touched a Ninja Gaiden game, I feel like I should see what that series is about, since it's one of my favorite genres.

Is the PC port functional?
Does the game do a reasonable job of teaching you important techniques, or should I start by looking up a guide so that I don't miss some important mechanic ala MGR Parry, or Dodge Offset?

Barudak
May 7, 2007

Are they talking about the 360 game, Ninja Gaiden 2? I love that game but lord it has edges so rough it can rend flesh from bone.

Ninja Gaiden 2 for the Xbox Series consoles is the definitive version. If you can't play that version get an Xbox One and play that and if not get a 360 and play it there. If you are limited to Sigma 2 such as on PC or Playstation consoles just flat out skip, that is not the game people are talking about fondly.

Barudak fucked around with this message at 12:00 on May 3, 2024

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

Barudak posted:

Are they talking about the 360 game, Ninja Gaiden 2? I love that game but lord it has edges so rough it can rend flesh from bone.

Ninja Gaiden 2 for the Xbox Series consoles is the definitive version. If you can't play that version get an Xbox One and play that and if not get a 360 and play it there. If you are limited to Sigma 2 such as on PC or Playstation consoles just flat out skip, that is not the game people are talking about fondly.

Really? Google seemed to tell me that Sigma 2 is a port of NG2.
Is it one of those cases where they gently caress up a game by doing a bunch of bad changes?

Selenephos
Jul 9, 2010

There are mods for the PC version which try to undo some of the Sigma changes or combine the best of both worlds. So you can play through Sigma 2 with the new weapons and extra levels, but have proper decapitations and blood effects and vastly reduced enemy health but more enemy density, to be in line with the the original version of Ninja Gaiden 2 on 360.

Barudak
May 7, 2007

Jack Trades posted:

Really? Google seemed to tell me that Sigma 2 is a port of NG2.
Is it one of those cases where they gently caress up a game by doing a bunch of bad changes?

It is exactly that. Sigma 2 is effectively a complete overhaul of Ninja Gaiden 2. Whats critical is not so much the reduction in blood and increase in enemies delimb resistance per se, but that the entire game has been retooled to have less enemies with more health who are less aggressive which runs counter to the flow state combat where you push small advantages into a full room clear to minimize your attrition.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Sigma 2 is much better than Sigma 1 in that it doesn't butcher quite as much, but honestly I didn't think 2 hit the same heights as Ninja Gaiden Black to begin with. It's been a very long time since I played any of them though

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

Barudak posted:

It is exactly that. Sigma 2 is effectively a complete overhaul of Ninja Gaiden 2. Whats critical is not so much the reduction in blood and increase in enemies delimb resistance per se, but that the entire game has been retooled to have less enemies with more health who are less aggressive which runs counter to the flow state combat where you push small advantages into a full room clear to minimize your attrition.

That sounds so bizarre. Especially considering how there are no other options to play any of the games in the series currently.

Did the developers ever give an explanation to why they decided to do that? Was it an attempt at improving the game, that completely failed, or...?

Barudak
May 7, 2007

Jack Trades posted:

That sounds so bizarre. Especially considering how there are no other options to play any of the games in the series currently.

Did the developers ever give an explanation to why they decided to do that? Was it an attempt at improving the game, that completely failed, or...?

I believe its because they lost the source code to the non-sigma versions, honestly. The Xbox line of systems starting with the bone use emulation software rather than strictly hardware to emulate previous systems and as such can play the original lineage still at 60fps/4k thanks to their improved hardware. It was a genuine treat to experience no slowdown vanilla Ng2

i think Sigma 1 is a more significant drop in quality since I think the base game game is more polished, but I think Sigma 2 is just a complete misunderstanding of what the games strengths were and attempted to kludge it into something else so its more disappointing for me because NG2 did need some help.

hatty
Feb 28, 2011

Pork Pro
One of the Bayonettas should be up there, maybe above DMC3 depending on if it’s the vanilla version or not

PaletteSwappedNinja
Jun 3, 2008

One Nation, Under God.

Jack Trades posted:

That sounds so bizarre. Especially considering how there are no other options to play any of the games in the series currently.

Did the developers ever give an explanation to why they decided to do that? Was it an attempt at improving the game, that completely failed, or...?

The Sigma versions were produced by separate teams to the originals, and one of the big reasons Sigma 2 was retooled so drastically was for the sake of performance/graphics - OG NG2 was fairly low-res and had a lot of performance issues on X360 (partly because it was a barely-finished game) and many of Sigma 2's changes were to help it run better.

I don't think either Sigma game is bad on their own merits, or that people absolutely shouldn't play them in the absence of alternatives, but Sigma 2 in particular really isn't the same game.

Fedule
Mar 27, 2010


No one left uncured.
I got you.
look man if it doesn't slow down to the single digit fps on that one staircase it ain't ninja gaiden 2

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

loving up a game to compensate for bad optimization makes a lot of sense. It wouldn't be the first time that happened.

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.
Ninja Gaiden 1 Sigma is still a very good game despite some unfortunate changes and a lot people prefer 1 over 2. It's has more adventure elements and the combat is very methodical.

Barudak
May 7, 2007

Fedule posted:

look man if it doesn't slow down to the single digit fps on that one staircase it ain't ninja gaiden 2

It maintains 60 fps on series consoles now, so fair, because yeah the most burning memory of NG2 is that staircase and the 360 struggling to maintain a framerate that was just functional.

I realized the enemies werent infinite when the framerate finally started climbing back up.

Mr E
Sep 18, 2007

NG2 is good but I don’t think it comes close to Black. I wish the original versions of those were available outside of Xbone, it’s one of the few things I play on mine besides blu rays.

Hel
Oct 9, 2012

Jokatgulm is tedium.
Jokatgulm is pain.
Jokatgulm is suffering.

As someone who first played them for the first time a couple of years ago the Sigma versions are still pretty good, but you should know that at least NG1 is still tied to the survival horror ancestry the genre has mostly abandoned by now(which I think is a bit of a shame).
I can't remember the exact implementation, but I remember really liking the health system in 2 and wished more games stole it.

Storm One
Jan 12, 2011
DF ran an feature on NG2 vs Sigma 2 and the port had to significantly tweak the game to fit the PS3 because the huge enemy counts and associated alpha and particle effects were enough to bring even the 360 to its knees, if they tried to bring it over as-is they'd have a Bayonetta level disaster.

The downside to that tweaking is that apparently the feel of OG NG2 is diluted in Sigma 2. I suppose that's OK if you like the exploration bits but as someone who despises the character action tropes of skill unlocks and puzzle-solving, the raw aggression and singleminded focus on combat of NG2 is what's so alluring about it. I've yet to play either, but if/when I do I already know which version it'll be.

hatty
Feb 28, 2011

Pork Pro
None of the extra characters feel good in the Sigma games which wouldn’t be a problem if you weren’t forced to use them

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.
Thats my biggest gripe.

A lot of people dont talk about Razors Edge for reasons but excluding the bosses and alchemists, I had a pretty good time with it. Also Ayane is a fun character to play as.

Steel on Bone feels great when you pull it off and the gore exists unlike in NG2S.

RBX
Jan 2, 2011

The PC mods for the master collection look excellent, the mod for 2 is still being worked on and it pretty much is at parity.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqXZX9MiGQw

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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



hatty posted:

One of the Bayonettas should be up there, maybe above DMC3 depending on if it’s the vanilla version or not

:agreed: but only the first Bayonetta.

Storm One posted:

The downside to that tweaking is that apparently the feel of OG NG2 is diluted in Sigma 2. I suppose that's OK if you like the exploration bits but as someone who despises the character action tropes of skill unlocks and puzzle-solving, the raw aggression and singleminded focus on combat of NG2 is what's so alluring about it. I've yet to play either, but if/when I do I already know which version it'll be.

One thing I really like about the Sigma games is that they cut down on a lot of that stuff. iirc they cut out entire levels and bosses from 2 because they were bad. Like all the underwater stuff. But also the ghost fish boss.

NG Black is by far the best one. NG2 has a lot of unfun bullshit. See: every single ranged enemy peppering your rear end non stop from offscreen.

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