Star Wars: Jedi Fallen Order - our boy Cal is no fashionista, to say the least.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Star Wars: Jedi Fallen Order - our boy Cal is no fashionista, to say the least.

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

I really like that Cal is not some super special overly angry rear end in a top hat who is always 5 seconds away from falling to the dark side. He's a good guy who has been through a lot of poo poo and his biggest issue is self confidence and fear of letting down others.

It is infinitely more appealing to me than yet another grey Jedi jagoff who is defined by being edgy enough to electrocute people without repercussions.

# ¿ Nov 26, 2019 22:54

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 17:20

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

JBP posted:

This is exactly what will happen in the sequel when they need to expand force powers

I don't know. They still have a well of untouched stuff still. Mind Trick is one of the big ones, as is super speed plus improvements to the other skills.

# ¿ Nov 26, 2019 23:27

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

precision posted:

Fights against multiple enemies were definitely something that needed more work. A few moves you get were basically useless because they left you vulnerable and have no I frames. Like the triangle triangle combo that does overhead slash then leaping slash, doing that was never a good idea, but it was clearly intended to be powerful

Those moves are great for using when an enemy is stunned or knocked over or whatever. You don't really need Iframes when you have the ability to stun pretty much any enemy in the game in like 4-5 different ways. Even in groups you can knock most of them over and then go to town.

# ¿ Nov 29, 2019 06:46

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Captain Hygiene posted:

Someday I hope to see a Star Wars movie that accurately captures my fighting style, just endlessly dodge-rolling around the room to avoid attacks while occasionally sneaking in a couple hits when the badguy gets confused.

# ¿ Dec 8, 2019 21:02

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Yeah if I had any complaint about the game it was that it was too easy for the most part. You are basically a walking god with a ridiculous amount of I-Frames. If you're getting wrecked by someone on Story Mode I donno. Are you blocking/dodging?

# ¿ Dec 9, 2019 00:45

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Spergatory posted:

Looking like it's a race between Fallen Order and the Mandalorian for Best Star Wars content this year.

Can you imagine buying one of the most popular, enduring, and beloved IPs in the world, jettisoning 90% of its canon, and then running it into the ground because you have no actual plans or good ideas of what to do with it? Incredible.

So you think The Last Jedi was fantastic then since it has a 91% on RT?

Also "90% of its canon" being... What? The New Republic falls within Luke and Leias lifetime? Han and Leia's son turns evil? The Emperor Returns? Thrawn?

# ¿ Dec 18, 2019 15:48

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Spergatory posted:

Posting the RT page is an easier shorthand for "people didn't like this" than posting the Twitter hashtag, which probably has a bunch of spoilers. But if it helps; we're getting to the point where normal people have watched the movie as well, and they didn't seem to like it very much either.

Literally everything except the movies, including both KOTORs. Look, I'm not saying all that stuff was great, but you know, they could've been a little more selective in what got the axe. Why not just kill all the post ROTJ stuff? It seems like a really easy solution and a great way to, like, not spit in the face of long time franchise fans while still leaving yourself plenty of room to do your own thing.

Of course, that still wouldn't fix the problems with the sequel trilogy, which boils down to them having no plan or vision or artistic integrity of any kind. Everyone complained about episode 7 being too similar to 4? gently caress! Throw out all the stuff that was setting up, give the sequel to a different guy and take it in wildly new directions! OH poo poo, everyone hates it, go back, go back to the previous guy! Course correct! Course correct!

The RT score is critics.

Also the EU was loving awful. Disney is doing exactly what you are saying and keeping parts of it and that is part of the problem. The old EU had like four good ideas most of which came from one trilogy of books

It also doesn't help that if they do something different people scream angrily about how they are murdering their childhood. Pretty much all the complaints about ROS are "this film puts pleasing fans and being safe over being a good stand alone film." Which sucks if you wanted something else but was inevitable after TLJ.

# ¿ Dec 18, 2019 16:42

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Owlbear Camus posted:

I'm not up on TOR, how's it ruin them?

It shits all over both Raven (eeeeevil) and The Exile

# ¿ Dec 18, 2019 18:57

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Bust Rodd posted:

Because TLJ is, structurally, a very bad and sloppy movie. Say whatever you want about TFA, it has a clear through line and the movie’s acts all make sense and contribute to the storyline.

All of the major plot points from TLJ basically don’t matter or are generated by the characters behaving incredibly stupidly, and the casino planet scene is like 40 minutes of runtime that leads to absolutely nothing. Poe being at odds with the rebel captains adds such a bizarre level of strain on the film with no payoff, and Rey/Ren’s relationship sequences feel like they written for a different movie.

The problem is that it’s impossible to criticize TLJ without nerds claiming that you just hate minorities or women or whatever, there are two distinct camps of people who hated TLJ. The people who hated it because it has a blue-haired lady, and the people who hate it because it’s just extremely badly written, shits all over TFA for no reason, and basically doesn’t further the plot that TFA started at all.

TFA was far more poorly written than TLJ and the best thing it did was to tell TFA to gently caress off. TLJ is far more thematically coherent especially in modern times when plots about angry self entitled dudes assume they know better than women because they are men (I.e most of TLJ) resonate more than "what if Star Wars but again"

The reason why the misogyny so often gets intertwine with hatred of TLJ is because it is so often the root. It gets dinged for flaws all Star Wars have not because they are movie ruining flaws but because they provide an excuse.

That isn't to say everyone who dislikes TLJ is that way but any online conversation brings them out.

# ¿ Dec 19, 2019 15:37

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Fuzz posted:

The problem with the new movies, though, is that in their attempt to make Rey a strong and powerful female protagonist, they also made her utterly pure of heart and infallible. In TFA she is a crack pilot despite having never flown before, doesn't actually need anyone's help to escape the First Order (which would have been fine and great on its own, but combined with everything else just made her even more ridiculous), and totally kicks the rear end of a dude who has been living and breathing using a lightsaber since he was a child. In TLJ this theme continues with her showing Luke how he's being a silly lump, trying to endear/turn Kylo around to the point where he seizes power to try to rule with her, and dives down into a dark side cave to... look at a mirror or something, it wasn't much of a fail. Top it all off with her saving the day at the end. I guess she kinda fails when she cuts a rock in half? That's the closest she comes to not being perfect.

She has Superman/Jesus syndrome - she's inordinately powerful to the point of it being pretty ridiculous, it all mostly comes naturally without her having to actually work for it, all of the "tests" that get thrown at her are mild challenges at best, and she never, not once, straight up fails and falls on her face and has to get back on her feet again. She's too infallible. If I wanted to watch a supposedly infallible woman who somehow keeps succeeding without much effort or training, I'd watch a biopic about Ivanka Trump. Rey's story is infuriating in the same way.

They had an opportunity to really tell something good and inspiring and truly turn Rey into an inspirational and strong female protagonist, but all we get is a girl that the movies keep TELLING us, "OH MY GOD, ISN'T SHE GREAT?!" instead of them actually SHOWING us or her actually earning a deep respect by overcoming hardship. Han dying was supposed to be that story beat, maybe, but then again she'd only met him like 24 hours prior and everyone felt worse for Chewie, especially when Leia doesn't hug him and instead hugs the random white girl she met for 15 minutes before.

And that's just talking about Rey, when there's so much else to discuss when trying to encompass everything bad in the new trilogy. It's just the most frustrating part because you really WANT Rey to become this classic heroine of cinema for all time a la Luke, but she never will and honestly shouldn't be, not because of her gender at all but because the people writing her have brain worms and just don't understand what endears characters to viewers and makes us respect them.

The problem there is that none of that is true or is also true for other protagonists.

Like your Han thing. Luke met Ben Kenobi like a day before and when he died you know who was comforting him? The woman whose entire family and planet was just murdered.

Luke was The Best Pilot Ever and one of like two people to survive after making an impossible shot. He took down an ATAT on foot. He redeemed Space Hitler. His brush with the dark side lasted about as long as Reys.

She beat Kylo Ren after Kylo Ren had literally been shot. She also had years of melee experience with her staff. And before you pull the "staff and swords are different" argument Luke was an expert spaceship pilot despite having only flown aircrafts before.

This is what I mean. I would argue the EU gave people brainworms about power levels and hard rules when literally all the film's say "no actually those don't exist and the people who claim they do are wrong."

ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Dec 19, 2019

# ¿ Dec 19, 2019 17:35

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Vinylshadow posted:

Would be nice if Disney wasn't so squeamish about letting you play as the bad guys and blow up some rebel scum

Battlefront II's multiplayer doesn't count, on account of being non-canon

Playing through Fallen Order with a red lightsaber is a lot of fun

I am okay with not having a Nazi power fantasy game TBH

# ¿ Dec 20, 2019 00:19

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

I mean we haven't even gotten past January and off the top of my head: Cyberpunk, FFVII, Doom Eternal, Resident Evil 3, The Last of Us II, Ghost of Tsushima, Nioh 2, No More Heroes 3, Spelunky 2, Watchdogs 3, Avengers, Ori 2, Dying Light 2, Halo... etc.

And I'm not saying I'm excited for all those games because I'm not but they're just literally off the top of my head games I know are coming out in 2020. 'dry' doesn't seem accurate.

# ¿ Jan 5, 2020 17:58

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

I admit I have almost no interest in blasters in Star Wars games because if I want a shooter there are ten billion on the market.

# ¿ Jan 11, 2020 18:27

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

codo27 posted:

This is officially the worst game ever seeing Cal openly, incorrectly pronounces AT-AT "@@". terrible.

Also, I better be about to become a lot more powerful oh Dathomir is much easier when I go back

That is how it is officially pronounced though. It's how it has been almost universally every time it is said in the history of the thing. Someone even asked Lucasfilms about it over a decade ago and they pretty bluntly said "it is pronounced so it rhymes with hat-hat"

# ¿ Jan 13, 2020 00:44

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

codo27 posted:

So what the gently caress is AT-ST then? At-stuh? Fuckin bull ding

It's like how we call HMMWV "Humvee" but SUV "S U V."

# ¿ Jan 13, 2020 01:05

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Captain Hygiene posted:

Well, that'd be kind of morbid and horrifying to implement as a regular mechanic for a good character. Now if you'll excuse me, I have some alive and aware stormtroopers to hurl off a thousand foot cliff.

They land in water. Everywhere. No matter what

# ¿ Jan 16, 2020 00:22

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

I honestly don't get the "this combat system isn't built for large numbers" when your force powers are hilariously OP and trivialize most fights against non-boss enemies and usually if they throw a big fight at you it is just after you got something that lets you tear through that fight like butter.

# ¿ Jan 21, 2020 01:51

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

JBP posted:

In an interview when the game came out.

Could you link it?

# ¿ Feb 23, 2020 23:28

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Vinylshadow posted:

Managed to get Taron done on Grand Master with do damage

Only slightly disappointed there's no "Face all saber bosses at the same time" medication challenge, but you can recreate it in the grid if you're feeling particularly sadistic

You can also photo mode during saber locks, which is nice

I feel like that would be a literally impossible challenge. I mean maybe someone's done it but it seems like you'd get stunlocked super easy.

# ¿ Nov 10, 2020 02:03

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Jose Oquendo posted:

Has there been any sort of DLC or extra content for this game since launch? I got the game at release, finished it, and haven�t touched it since.

They added a NG+ mode (just for cosmetics) and a battle arena plus the ability to use Inquisitor suit and a red lightsaber. I think they've said they are not doing DLC for it (and in fact "no DLC" was one of the selling points of the game.) A sequel is way more likely than anything more for it.

# ¿ Nov 29, 2020 03:56

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Lightsabers are not particularly special there. Enemy HP is not supposed to be realistic but an abstracted design of what is happening in terms of luck/near misses/whathaveyou in 90% of games because it'd be real fuckin' boring to be playing as a Jedi and die because you failed to block a single blaster bolt.

# ¿ Apr 20, 2021 00:08

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Madurai posted:

I dunno, games where you can die to a single hit seem to be the opposite of boring, to me. Watching a HP bar go down seems like it takes more tension out of the problem.

There is a difference between the player dying in one hit and enemies dying in one hit. The latter is significantly harder to design around to the point where I have a hard time thinking of any game that actually sticks to that concept. Even games like Mario and Sonic may have their Goomba-alikes but bosses still take multiple blows. Creating a boss that is fun and engaging to fight but will instantly die the moment your laser sword touches them is not only difficult but tends to revolve around gameplay that is as far away from what people want as possible.

Also beyond that is the fact that "The player dies in one hit no matter what" is such an absurdly niche style of gameplay that it's basically irrelevant to game design. Even games praised for their difficulty or challenge don't tend to do that and the ones that do are remembered negatively rather than positively. Even if you're a super de duper hardcore gamer who regularly no-hit finishes video games you're a vanishingly small percentage of gamers and when you are talking about big franchises like Star Wars you're not really going to get away with that.

# ¿ May 1, 2021 05:57

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:

I mean my spitball for how to make lightsaber combat in a video game interesting was to just make your health a stagger/stamina meter where 'getting hit' just means you deflect a near-fatal attack, and the death condition was just you or the boss no longer being able to defend against blows. stormtroopers would be goombas of course but you could have more difficult enemies by way of giving them armor to shrug off a couple hits or have lightsaber-resistant melee weapons like those droids from RotS.

Yeah, but that is just a health meter. The only meaningful difference would be the animations at best.

# ¿ May 1, 2021 07:35

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Kobal2 posted:

This is why Kyle Katarn rocked and Cal annoys me. Just pick up a loving gun to obliterate these spiders with, idiot, you're not an ur-poseur like the Force Unleashed guy, it's ok.

Based off literally everything we see in the game the guns are almost certainly going to be less effective than a laser sword.

# ¿ Dec 18, 2021 05:10

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Kobal2 posted:

Well, when there's a troll-looking giant motherfucker across a gap, "just shoot him. In the face. Like, a lot" seems a more better option to me than "jump the gap and fight it like a MAN". Then again I'm no Jedi.

You are a magic space wizard with a laser sword. You are going to be using the laser sword because Star Wars isn't about Tactical Realism it is about being a goddamn space wizard with a laser sword.

# ¿ Dec 18, 2021 10:00

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Captain Hygiene posted:

I'm still surprised they never patched in a fast travel system. Of all the game's problems, that seems like the most glaring QoL issue, I've seen so many complaints about it.

They have a lot of events that occur during backtracking that they'd probably be worried about breaking. They could also just disable fast travel during all those situations but still.

# ¿ Dec 18, 2021 22:45

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

anatomi posted:

Another goon playing this on GamePass.

I think it's pretty drat good. Kinda wish we get a sidequel that takes place entirely on Bracca, that poo poo was cool.

Regarding the usually worthless exploration rewards, I bet the devs had a lightsaber/equipment upgrade system planned out at some point but had to scale back.

Where's my purple lightsaber. Where.

You get to pick new colors late in the game. Purple, Yellow, a different shade of Blue, Pink (the best one) and Indigo.

There's also a Red saber which I think is NG+ only and an Orange which was preorder DLC/"Deluxe Edition"

# ¿ Dec 19, 2021 23:39

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Tom Tucker posted:

I'm excited! Like others I feel like the game worked great but had a few rough patches that would be easily sanded down for a sequel.

Am I supposed to know who the dude in the tank is? I think I recognize the bad guy as the main inquisitor dude who's in charge of all the "sisters"?

Watch it be Joruus C'baoth

Like unironically that is my guess. "Old-rear end dude found floating in a tank." Claims to be a lost Jedi Master, is actually his clone, goes bonkers, eventually Cal has to fight him and probably a clone of Cal himself. Get that bit into canon even if it doesn't involve Luke.

# ¿ May 28, 2022 00:20