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Who do you wish to win the Democratic primaries?
This poll is closed.
Joe Biden, the Inappropriate Toucher 18 1.46%
Bernie Sanders, the Hand Flailer 665 54.11%
Elizabeth Warren, the Plan Maker 319 25.96%
Kamala Harris, the Cop Lord 26 2.12%
Cory Booker, the Super Hero Wannabe 5 0.41%
Julian Castro, the Twin 5 0.41%
Kirsten Gillibrand, the Franken Killer 5 0.41%
Pete Buttigieg, the Troop Sociopath 17 1.38%
Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Fake Latino 3 0.24%
Jay Inslee, the Climate Alarmist 8 0.65%
Marianne Williamson, the Crystal Queen 86 7.00%
Tulsi Gabbard, the Muslim Hater 23 1.87%
Andrew Yang, the $1000 Fool 32 2.60%
Eric Swalwell, the Insurance Wife Guy 2 0.16%
Amy Klobuchar, the Comb Enthusiast 1 0.08%
Bill de Blasio, the NYPD Most Hated 4 0.33%
Tim Ryan, the Dope Face 3 0.24%
John Hickenlooper, the Also Ran 7 0.57%
Total: 1229 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Democrazy posted:

My serious analysis is that a secret winner of this debate might be Bernie Sanders. While he didn’t do anything spectacular in the debate, he didn’t do anything too bad, and debates were never going to be his strong suit, anyway. He also is likely to benefit from Biden’s meltdown, as there has been some polling showing an overlap between Biden and Bernie’s support.
I dunno, if I was his campaign manager I'd be Guarded but not at outright Concerned yet. Debates have more potential to kill campaign than to boost it, so him coming out unscathed is definitely a good thing. But it was a weak first impression to make, and it's making him vulnerable to an attack on his age. Standing next to Biden while Slalwell is calling him an old gently caress isn't a great look.

Hopefully he gets through the next debate alright and gets a chance to show more energy in September when the stage isn't so crowded.

Edit: if I'm Biden's campaign manager I'm telling him to start listening to his debate coach or I'm quitting before he ruins my reputation.

Tibalt fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Jun 28, 2019

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Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

KIM JONG TRILL posted:

14 people have already qualified for the 2nd debate.
To clarify because it's so stupid:

The next debate (second debate) in July will have the same requirements and rules as the one last night. I'd be a little surprised if almost everyone didn't make it off of cannibalizing the polling or donors from the no-namers who aren't on stage. Sorry Gravel.

The first debate of the second round of debates will have stricter rules and will occur in September. I think 538.com estimated 10 candidates are on track to get in? The media keeps referring to the debates by rounds, so it's easy to get confused.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Democrazy posted:

I dunno, I thought the only part where he looked bad were the parts where he felt attacked by Swalwell’s comments about age and getting a new generation in there. That kind of defensiveness did not suit him.

I’m just not convinced that he’s the best fit for the back and forth of a debate. I think he gets too heated; he’s better where he can talk about what he wants to do, rather than feeling the need to respond to others.
He's not, and I expect him to do better when he has more room to breath. It's hard to tell how much of the debate is going to affect a voters' initial impression - he's got a lot of name recognition, so maybe his impression is already locked in. But I'm not sure how much your average voter has been paying attention to him these last 4 years.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Lightning Knight posted:

I respect the Gravel teens ultimately using the campaign as an elaborate mechanism to gently caress Tulsi Gabbard’s staffers.
Did I miss this story?

Gabbard's my personal "Hell loving No" candidate.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Lightning Knight posted:

I think they deleted the tweet now but they posted a picture of them hanging out with some Tulsi staffers with strong “we’re going to go to the hotel room and drink now” energy.
Lol, misinterpreted your post there. Welp, #CancelGravel

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

OB_Juan posted:

I might have missed something, what's "lanyard" about?
The various staffers, interns, and reporters that hang around politicians. They wear their passes on a lanyard.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

SimonCat posted:

Court packing has been brought up several times. Can someone explain how this doesn't lead to the court continually expanding every time a different party has control of the Congress and White House?
It requires unified control of the government which is usually not the case, and would eat up a lot of the legislation calendar if did it

And also it totally would but a 20+ SCOTUS would do a lot to minimize the importance of each individual judge.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

You think ACA ate up a lot of Obama's opportunity to pass legislation, imagine trying to pass the court packing bill followed by 5+ lifetime appointments.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Groovelord Neato posted:

do people actually remember how that went down or?
ACA wasn't introduced until until September 2009 and wasn't signed into law until March 2010.

I should clarify, in a hypothetical unified Republican government after the Democrats pack the court, absolutely they would spend the time to do this. The unified Democratic government after the SCOTUS has been packed to 9 Conservatives, 8 Progressives, and 1 to 6 Thomas-esque Wildcards, maybe not.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Almost all corporations are closed on federal holidays though.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

YMB posted:

Not the ones that the most frequently disenfranchised Americans tend to work at.
Wouldn't a hourly employee get time and a half on a federal holiday though?

Edit nope varies state to state jfc

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

The DNC is clearly trying to rig the primary for Williamson, I hope she doesn't steal it from Bernie.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

ELO Musk posted:

I mean I can't even be that mad at this concept because it's very true that a great deal of potential is lost in modern society because people aren't free to pursue what they can really contribute to it.
Look dude, it's not called the mortal science of Marxism-Leninism, alright?

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Personally I think Kucinich: Breath of the Wild is a welcome new addition to a veritable franchise that had become dated and frankly lost track of the core appeal.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Wait, hold on, is this a serious "Bernie or Bust" argument or an ironic "Williamson is the better candidate" argument?

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

generic one posted:

Just as a casual observer and infrequent poster, I’ve gotta ask, do you read the posts in this thread, or just skim for tweets and article links? ‘Cause, it’s all over the place. Some dipshit even suggested gulags for people who said they’d be fine with Warren if Sanders wasn’t the nominee.
I'm still voting for Warren and the pages of spilled ink in this thread hasn't really changed that, but people can rally for their candidate all they want. More people support Bernie in this thread, so most of the posts will be about Bernie.

I don't think the gulag post should really be taken seriously.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Cerebral Bore posted:

OK. While you're at it, would you also care to explain why Israel has an absolute right to blow Palestinian women and children to smithereens whenever they feel like it?
You realize that post was saying that Bernie posters in this thread aren't overbearing assholes who are trying to drive everyone out, right?

Warren and Bernie's policies on Israel are mostly on the same side, and I think she'll be a more effective president.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

I didn't say they're the same, I said they're on the same side - something their policies and votes reflect.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Who would you say has the closest Israel stance to Bernie's among the candidates on stage Wednesday and Thursday? Preferably one not polling at 1%.

That's what I mean, and you all know it.

Edit: anyway back to my original point I don't think this thread feels dog pile-y at all.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

joepinetree posted:

Yes, Warren has gotten better in recent months and joined several of Bernie's resolutions. But I don't particularly trust leftwing conversions on the even of announcing a bid for presidency.
Oh good, I was feeling a bit alone on this. Anyway, I understand where you're coming from, but politicians are always going to be different when placed in different contexts. I don't find it to be an uncross-able red line but more of something you need to take into account.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Cerebral Bore posted:

If somebody starts pulling obvious dishonest bullshit then they deserve to be called out for it. There's also an element of pattern recognition here, because a lot of the poo poo we see it the exact same poo poo that was pulled in 2016, such as the "well Bernie and X are basically the same" claim that we can see on this very page.
Claiming that Warren is like Clinton and that the DNC in 2016 is the same DNC now comes across as a bit paranoid, though. Warren isn't Clinton. The DNC made a point of trying to be even-handed and fair, which is why you had 20 candidates on stage over two nights.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

I mean, okay, I don't feel like enough people are going to do that to matter... but even if they do, so what? She'll still be polling at low %s and I don't think 'kooky' candidates hurt the party as much as people seem to think they do.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Martha Stewart Undying posted:

Actually, we call ourselves orbsons.
Can't we find a more inclusive term?

Crystal folk.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

I mean, you could answer the question I posed, but I thought we had all kind of dropped the subject.

Comparing Warren supporters to Trump supporters is kind of lovely.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

FlamingLiberal posted:

lol why were we worried about Biden again
He's still the front runner so I wouldn't count him out just yet lol. But yeah, I've banged that "Biden wasn't a serious candidate the last 20 years and he won't be one now" drum Increasing Nervously since before he announced.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Gripweed posted:

How can all the sub 1% candidates justify staying in? It's one thing for Marianne or Yang, where they genuinely have something different to say. But Delaney? Bennet? They have nothing to offer to anyone.
Established politicians like Castro or Bennet are running for VP/cabinet positions, or are actually running in 2024/2028 and are trying to get national name recognition now.

Weirdos like Yang or Williamson are selling likely selling books or increasing their personal 'brand'.

edit: Like, that's literally what Biden did - keep running no-hope presidential campaigns for a couple cycles until he got picked for the VP spot, which would have usually have made him the heir-apparent if it wasn't for cough cough ahem ahem.

Tibalt fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Jul 1, 2019

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

oxsnard posted:

https://twitter.com/williamjordann/status/1126156518586494977?s=20

This study is very interesting. Never trumpers warming up a bit, but the actual "economic anxiety" vote (e.g. Obama to Trump) has soured. That's the swing vote in WI and MI and PA
I mean, I know Obama-Trump voters exist because Trump won Wisconsin and it wasn't just lower turn out.

But it still just blows my mind.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Calibanibal posted:

Biden even urged his son Hunter to honor the ancient Jewish tradition of Yibbum
Beautiful.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Potato Salad posted:

Abolish the senate at bayonet point :shrug:
On the one hand it DOES have some historical precedent.

On the other hand, is America really ready for a Jewish Emperor?

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Failed Imagineer posted:

Soros or Sanders?

E: or Kushner?
Citizen Sanders promoting himself to Emperor.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

VH4Ever posted:

More:

https://twitter.com/ActorAaronBooth/status/1148292573590675457

LOL @ Bullock being 7th in fundraising and yet not qualifying for the debates.
Who the gently caress is Bullock.

I know he's governor of Montana, I mean who the gently caress is Steve Bullock.

Edit: I think the bigger issue for me is that the same posters who are always complaining about double standards want to give the wine aunt a pass on the "Defeat Trump With Love" plan because she might be anti-imperialist based on a tweet.

Anecdote isn't evidence but all my wine aunts talk a good game but are the epitome of NIMBYism, white feminism, and white savior liberalism.

Tibalt fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Jul 8, 2019

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Cerebral Bore posted:

I notice that you keep repeating this as if it were relevant in any way. How come?
Because winning the electoral college while getting trounced in the popular vote is something that is possible but extremely improbable, and an election strategy that relies on it happening a second time is weak as poo poo.

edit: eh, on second thought.

Tibalt fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Jul 9, 2019

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Failed Imagineer posted:

...the possible exception of Hickenlooper
Naw, nope.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Failed Imagineer posted:

You don't think GOP would be happy to work with President Hickenlooper on his "Frack the Planet" New Deal?
Clinton's whole deal was triangulating a third way aka dropping the things that made Republicans mad like integration and gun control, and working out a Republican-friendly solution to problems like cutting entitlements.

What I'm saying is that the GOP would try to impeach Hickenlooper if he won the presidency.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Your credit score should be nationalized, not a service that you're charged for by one of three random organizations.

Edit: Remember when Equifax had that massive data breach affecting like 150 million people?

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Pembroke Fuse posted:

Credit scores or social credit scores shouldn't exist in the first place...
Naw, access to credit is necessary to thrive in our economy, and eliminating the credit score just means you're obfuscating the process - something that has historically lead to poo poo outcomes for poor, rural, minority etc. Borrowers

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Pembroke Fuse posted:

Or... we own the means of production publicly and don't have credit.
Well until the glorious revolution occurs I'd like to stick with the system that doesn't indenture farmers to the only local bank like 1920s sharecroppers.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Forget about the farms, my point was that saying various banking and credit regulations wouldn't be necessary under communism isn't helpful when we're in a capitalist system for the foreseeable future.

Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Wait, Bernie's Jewish?

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Tibalt
May 14, 2017

What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

Ruminahui posted:

As all hell
Are you sure? I've never heard this brought up before.

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