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This is my ridiculous cartoon car you all know and love                         The fun stuff: 19 feet long, 5120lbs 8 cylinders, each one with 944ccs of displacement for a 7.5 liter or 460 cubic inch engine. 220 furious horsepower. I've enjoyed this car for going on 5 years now, but the fuel economy suuuuuuuuucks, so i've decided to remedy that. Meet the two lumps, Larry and Barry.   Two ford duratec 30 3.0 engines. all aluminum, DOHC, 24 valve 60 degree V6s. famously used in minivans, Tauruses, the Mondeo 220ST, Noble M400(with turbos), and Every V12 Aston for the last 20 years(bolted together a lot better than i will be doing) It uses a remote water pump, with these 2 engines it's driven off the back of an exhaust cam, meaning not only do i not need a belt on the rear engine, but i can plumb the two cooling systems together and the only thing restricting how close they can get are the water inlets on the back of the front engine's heads. They're also under 20 inches and under 300lbs bare each which means they'll only be 6-10 inches longer than the 460 and i shouldn't have to cut anything. Combined they're also 3 inches narrower, 4 inches shorter, and over 100lbs lighter. I got a lot more bits than i expected. a lot of junkyards pretty much just give you the long block, but i got engine mounts, remote oil filters that i should be able to shim/clock to meet my needs, exhaust manifolds, and full uncut engine harnesses. Left to track down: -Lincoln LS 5R55S transmission -2 ECUs and someone who can code out Ford's passive anti-theft -2 Jaguar S-type 3.0 upper intake manifolds -2 dash harnesses from almost any vehicle -coupler to tie them together -tons of little fiddly bits LSes and Jags often show up in pick-n-pulls, so the plan going forward is to build this all up on the super cheap while doing a little bit of other work on the car, and continuing to enjoy it. The goal is to hit the road next spring with a straight piped ~450-500hp V12 powered landyacht. WITNESS ME, WINDBAGS
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Jul 4, 2019 15:37
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What really has me psyched is this. This is a DB9 manifold.  These are $80 headers for the 3.0  This is DB9 without the mufflers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L3Tu8SKQW0 I would expect the cam profile on the DB9 is different, although each of these engines makes 205hp and the early DB9s only made 450 with one set of accessories to drive, so they might not be that far off. Powershift fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Jul 4, 2019 |
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Jul 4, 2019 16:53
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Beach Bum posted:Real talk what kind of coupler setup are you thinking about? I was initially thinking flex disk, but i don't know if i'll have the space between the engines for it, so i think i'll be using a jaw coupler with one side keyed to the crank on the rear engine and drilled to bolt onto the crank of the front.  I'm looking for aftermarket harmonic balancers that i could get machined and pressed onto the rear engine side of the jaw coupler. A rigid coupler would be simpler, but i would worry about the engines transmitting vibration to eachother. Wrar posted:You could use two megasquirts instead and use electronic throttle bodies with an electronic throttle pedal and add another sensor. I think that would simplify a lot of this mess. I was looking at that, both engines have electronic throttle bodies and COP and I could theoretically run both engines off one if i can get them clocked together right but the tuning seems like it might be a nightmare especially with 1-2 degrees of give in a soft coupler. I'm looking at ~$150 in ECUs and harnesses, although tuning will then be more expensive unless i can get the entire harness, ignition cylinder, and key. That way i could also feel like a bad-rear end launching a missile, put the first key in and turn it, put the second key in and turn it, lift the safety flap and press the button. The factory ECU will also control the 5R55 slidebite posted:Shine on you crazy diamond. Everything diesel is crazy expensive and crazy heavy. I was thinking of sticking my 7.3 in there but that would involve both of my vehicles being out of commission for a period. and another 2-300lbs on the front end. I was also looking at electric stuff, but that's still a no go because of battery cost and temperature limits. Powershift fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Jul 4, 2019 |
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Jul 4, 2019 20:49
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https://www.amazon.com/Propshaft-Vibration-Damper-MERCEDES-2024111447/dp/B006DHQM9M oooh, hello there, gorgeous.
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Jul 4, 2019 22:00
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meatpimp posted:Would a BMW guibo work? If so, I'll contribute one to the effort. That balancer is off of a W124 driveshaft, and simplifies things a whole bunch, a new flex disk is only $35 shipped from rockauto so i'm probably gonna build the coupler out of W124 bits. Should be able to get a transmission output flange machined or sleeved to match the crank on the rear engine.  It's all designed for similar torque/speeds.
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Jul 4, 2019 22:52
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Dagen H posted:I'm absolutely not an engineer, but I think you'll want the engines solid-mounted to each other (but not the chassis, obvs) to avoid strain on whatever coupling you use. Yeah, that's the plan, but there isn't a whole lot up top to tie the two together, which is one of the reasons i want a flex coupling. I don't want the stress of holding them straight to be put on the crankshafts. I'll have a little better idea of what i can do to secure them once i get them cleaned up a little and get rid of the poo poo i don't need. I might be able to put a heavy metal plate under the motor mounts against the block on the front engine and bolt them into where the A/C compressor would mount on the rear, then find somewhere up top to tie together to box it in. Powershift fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jul 5, 2019 |
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Jul 5, 2019 00:09
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Seat Safety Switch posted:Are there threaded holes for lift points on the top of the engine? Chevy loved to do that so I'm assuming Ford does too. You could brace from there to tie the shortblocks together (with an adjustable torque-strut kind of thing in between), if so. There's nothing. I can't even see where the factory torque strut would have gone through. The front timing covers are silky smooth. There are a couple nubs up top where there would have been an upper engine mount for some applications but they aren't drilled or threaded. The valve cover bolts on both engines are tiny so that's out too. There are a lot of little nubs all over the place that would have been drilled and threaded for different applications i might be able to use and the factory torque rod had to mount somewhere. I still have to pull the itty bitty baby power steering pump off the rear motor, and it seems to be fairly rigidly mounted in the valley, so i might be able to make a gussetted Z-shaped plate that goes from power steering pump holes to the bell housing bolts on the other. I can't get over how small and simple these little fuckers are. Like, once the water pump is off and the water returns shortened, it's pretty much 20 inches dead on.   I'm a little concerned that the one engine is a lot higher mileage than i was told, but the other one is clean clean clean. It's going to be a lot of extra work, but once i get a trans and ECU and everything i'm going to bolt them each up, get them running and compression test them before i go further with them. They also both still have the old oil in, so i should be able to see glitter if something has gone wrong.   It's hilarious looking at the aston DB9 stuff how it exactly the same, there's just more.   Intake manifold gaskets for an aston are $350, for the Freestyle they're $9 and they're pretty much the same thing. $20/piece Db9 exhaust manifold gasket  $5/pair freestyle exhaust manifold gasket.  The 04 DB9 was only 444hp@6000RPM and 420ftlbs(nice)@5000rpm. The freestyle was 203hp@5700rpm and 207ftlbs@4500rpm. Doubled is 406hp and 414ft/lbs driving 2 alternators, 2 water pumps, 2 power steering pumps, 2 A/C compressors Powershift fucked around with this message at 14:20 on Jul 5, 2019 |
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Jul 5, 2019 14:18
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Mental Hospitality posted:A lesser man would have probably thought "I wonder how much a used 6.2 or V10 from a Super Duty costs?" SHO V8s show up in the pick-n-pulls here, but it's probably BECAUSE they grenaded themselves. I did actually look at the lincoln LS 3.9 V8 which is a Jaaaaaaaaaaag AJ but all the LSes that show up at the pick-n-pull or on kijiji listed for parts are low mileage V8s for some strange reason  Other things i looked at and why i was steered away: gas: 2 x 3.7: $1000+/engine, factory ECU unusable, 6R80 requires $1500 trans controller 1 x LS truck engine: $2k+ engine, good power/economy, crossbreeding, boooooooooooring 1 x JDM 2JZ-GTE + trans: $3kish all in, tons of support, good power, only gets 20mpg in lighter flowier aristo. 1 x 1GZ-FE V12 + trans: $3ishk all in,:okay power, okay support, very limited parts availability, ghetto stepper motor throttle bodies means a lot more custom tuning work. 2 x VG30DETT+trans: $5kish all in, people have enough trouble keeping 1 running. 1 x Ford 5.0: $5k+ engine, good power/economy, great support/documentation, $1.5k harness+ECU needed 1 x Ford 6.2: $4k+ engine, ^^^^^ 1 x BMW M73 V12: meh power, meh economy, BMW uhh... "character" 1 x Ford 6.8 V10: boat anchor for boat anchor. Diesel: 2 x VW 2.0 TD: length would put me at the rad support, would need narrow radiator and would need to hack some stuff up. Still only 200ishhp/450ish ft/lbs combined. Limited RWD transmissions 1 x 7.3 powerstroke: would have to hack a bunch of stuff, or put the engine to far forward 1 x 6.0 powerstroke: Cheap but lol 1 x 5.9 cummins: heavy, available engines are ragged, large transmission options would need extensive firewall mods 1 x VW V10 TDI: meh, nuf said. 1 x Detroit 8V71+ trans: $1500. 1500kg, 1500 L/100km. 1 x Isuzu NPR 5.2: meh power, meh economy, heavy, expensive 1 x cat C6.6: Interesting but heavy 1 x Navistar DT466: Cheap, powerful, lots of cutting, probably stuff sticking out of the hood, very heavy, questionable mileage. 1 x Cummins 4BT: prices going crazy, not much power Electric: Siamese warp 9s: Battery cost Tesla drivetrain: Battery cost Chinese motors and batteries off alibaba: car weight, battery cost Other: Nuclear: Big government  Sail: low bridges and stop lights Pedal power: I'm horribly out of shape Horses: poop Dogs: also poop Flywheel: Maybe next time. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Why i settled on these: Simple solid timing system $200/engine Lightweight Tons of support from dudes sticking them in locosts 5R55S RWD trans that came bolted to one Very short $200/engine remote water pump Future tuning options Aston martin pedigree Powershift fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Jul 5, 2019 |
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Jul 5, 2019 17:05
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Olympic Mathlete posted:How wedged in the front are these going to be? Is the engine bay big enough to not have to have the radiator off to the side and stuff? Not at all. The rear engine without accessories is going to be under 20 inches, The valve covers should be separated by a sliver. The front engine with accessories should only be about 22 inches. If i can snug them up against the firewall without any major issues, the front of the front motor should actually be further back than the front of the 460 is right now. They're also shorter height wise, and narrower width wise than the bare 460. If i have to move them forward for trans or crossmember clearance, I can still move the radiator forward 2-3 inches without modifying anything but the rad bracket.
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Jul 5, 2019 17:11
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wesleywillis posted:How are the two engines connected in the Aston? If the V12 is just two of these V6s literally bolted together, Can you not use the same coupling used to join the cranks on them together? They got all kinds of fancy machines at aston. Somehow going from this  to this  costs $25,000.   This just pisses me off that fomoco never put that V12 in a lincoln Mark car. QuarkMartial posted:Well then it's simple. Just JB Weld the blocks together. I've actually thought a lot about this(surprise), but you could theoretically, with a machine large enough, saw the front off one engine, and the back off the other, leaving an extra 1/4 inch and friction weld the two blocks then machine off the stuff that squirts out. You could probably do the same with the cams if they're solid and maybe even the crank if you're crazy or if it's just for static art. slidebite posted:Are you planning on offsetting them in the sense of crank timing? IE: Are you going to have them both TDC when you put them together or offset them 90-180? Or..? Yeah, the ones i found on acklands were either good for power or RPM but not both except for the ones with $400 brass spiders. As for timing, i'll probably try to match the Aston V12. That leaves me 2 points of tuning, the length of the headers going into the 2>1, and i was thinking an adjustable trombone style chamber to tune out drone.  They did put a mantrans in these cars, so what i could do is Front crank > junkyard flywheel 1/2 inch $50- > Junkyard W124 driveshaft yoke welded to a plate and balanced by a machine shop 1 inch $50-200 > New W124 flex disc 1 inch $35 > New SWAG W124 driveshaft damper 1 inch $95 > Junkyard T722 output yoke bored and keyed to the crank. 0-1 inch$50-200 That gives me flex between the cranks that i hopefully won't need, vibration isolation of the cranks, and harmonic balancing of the rear engine without needing to modify a harmonic balancer which is known to fly apart even unmodified. All in $300-$500 and 3.5-4 inches.(insert your mom joke) If i need more distance it can be added between the flywheel and flex disc. I really do appreciate the input. I'm just an idiot with a dream, so this is definitely going to be a team effort. Also, i found this at a used poo poo store, and i think it's my bible.  It includes all sorts of soul soothing tales like what's inside a C6.  And what chryslers look like  Really makes you think. Where did chryslers even come from?
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Jul 5, 2019 21:06
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This video says the Aston uses the same cam profiles as the Duratec. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E54Nyfc_yvw
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Jul 5, 2019 21:40
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Yeah, Aston Martin in that era had at least double the engineering budget i do.
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Jul 5, 2019 21:47
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Status update: tranny is being pulled right now. Found a cool junkyard that's gonna let me pull the entire harness from key to engine plugs on monday. By the end of next week i could have one engine running on the bench. The engines have returnless fuel rails. The car has 2 good hard lines from the tank. Should i do 2 external fuel pumps or one external fuel pump to a tee, each to a fuel pressure regulator, or something else? Keeping in mind cost is an issue, my fuel tank pick-up is on the bottom. I worry about both being fed from a single regulator, even though it should in theory be fine. mekilljoydammit posted:The Ford GT90 is where that engine originally came from, and it was two of those welded together. Ford Indigo apparently, too.  Now it makes me even angrier that the Mark VIII died with a 4.6 mod motor
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Jul 5, 2019 22:08
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Chain couplers, but they only had to last the weekend. e:  The conrod journals in the aston are in pairs, 3/9 and 4/10, 2/8 and 5/11, 1/7 and 6/12. Firing order is 1-7-5-11-3-9-6-12-2-8-4-10. Firing order on the 3.0s are 1-4-2-5-3-6, so Engines A and B, To match the Aston i would want A1-A4-B2-B5-A3-A6-B3-B6-A2-A5-B1-B4 meaning cylinder 3 on engine A and cylinder 1 on engine B should be clocked 360 degrees apart. When engine B is at TDC on the compression stroke on cylinder 1, engine A should be on the exhaust stroke on cylinder 3. Looking for pics of the cranks, i found this and can't stop laughing at it.  I sure hope he figured out why it wasn't coming off. e2:  e3: it seems the Aston has shared crank pins, the 3.0 has split crank pins. Would this be for balance? e4: yeah, it's for dynamic balance and even firing intervals. That being the case i would probably want to match that so i would imagine the second engine could be clocked anywhere as long as it's 30 degrees out from the front engine. I'm too tired to think this out, but i figure i'll get it. e5: lol  Those crazy bastards. https://aston1936.com/2016/04/12/getting-more-from-your-aston-martin-db9-using-an-obdii-code-reader/  quote:Does this give us DIY guys as much information as the Dealers AMDS? I don’t think so. One certain limitation was that I was only seeing six (6) cylinders of information, not twelve (12). As I mentioned there are two (2) PCMs running our DB9s engines (like two separate six (6) cylinder engines that are interwoven). I suspect my approach here is just talking to the primary PCM, and there is no way to switch over to the secondary PCM to learn the specific information only it might know. And of course, who knows if there are even more Aston Martin proprietary codes beyond the standard Ford codes that might hold even more information. Powershift fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Jul 6, 2019 |
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Jul 5, 2019 23:56
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Captain Foo posted:I'm just an idiot that got pulled in somehow but.... On a real basic level, how do you keep two separate motors timed in sync?? They will each be running their own ECU. If i chose megasquirt to run both together as a V12, I would probably have to tune it conservatively to account for a couple degrees of give in the flex coupler. I can't believe what a shitshow the real V12 is. It runs 1 Ford Taurus PCM for each bank, meaning it needs 8 O2 sensors.The owners are just as bad.   https://aston1936.com/2016/07/22/lumpy-idle-misfire-on-an-aston-martin-db9/
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Jul 6, 2019 04:23
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charliemonster42 posted:My little brother’s boss has an ultima gtr with a jag v-12 with custom ITBs. He’s running a single ford v6 ecu with the outputs doubled up to drive everything in pairs. It sounds like an oakey setup but it runs like a scalded cat. Could be something worth thinking about. Dude..... I wonder if i can clock them the same and just split every signal. Greater chance of mechanical failure, but a lot easier and cheaper. It would reduce strain on the coupling and allow the ECU to cut torque on both engines for shifts reducing strain on the trans.
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Jul 6, 2019 04:54
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Darchangel posted:You could. It would only use one set of sensors, of course. You’d just need a second set of injector drivers piggy-backed. I say “just” - I don’t know how to do it. Hopefully the extra ~20 inches between the front manifold and rear manifold change that a bit. Look at what unequal length headers do to a subaru. Doing it this way: Pros: 1 ECU 1 dash harness 1 tuner as long as mods are matched front/back. cons: Weaker engine grenades if conditions don't match. Engine without sensors can't give cylinder or bank specific error codes. Can't clock cranks for sound Timing will vary a few degrees on the non-sensor engine Extra time/money spent confirming 2 equally healthy engines. Compression tests, plugs, coils, injectors, although this is all stuff i should do anyways. I could probably compensate for the timing variance by running better gas until i get a proper tune, although 200hp out of 3 liters with 10:1 compression these things aren't tuned to the limit anyways.
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Jul 6, 2019 15:46
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angryrobots posted:My gut re: using one ECU to control two engines with a timing variability, is that it will be fine at idle, but would create unmanageable ignition timing issues as RPM increases. That's what i'm thinking, but it would think it would be at most 1-2 degrees out either way. They're simple engines with no VVT or VVL. Bad things happen with too much timing, engines pull timing to be safe and the rear engine would be ahead under load if there is any real flex so it seems like it would be safe to run the engine off the rear engine's sensors, as basically any flex would have the effect of pulling timing from the front engine, which the ECU would already do. If the front engine is even 2 degrees ahead at full load and the 2 matching cylinders are set to inject and spark at the same time, It would basically have the effect of pulling 2 degrees of timing from the front engine, which is the safe direction to go. Once i get the flex disk, i can put a couple hundred ft/lbs of torque on it and measure the flex to see if it will really be an issue, but i think as long as it's set up to pull timing under load from the piggybacked engine, i think it should be fine.
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Jul 6, 2019 17:34
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Beach Bum posted:I don't suppose there's a fiscally feasible method to measure torque load on the coupler for purposes of tuning? I'm thinking of how digital torque wrenches work, scaled up, for measuring deflection differential. Alignment marks with an optical sensor? Hall sensors? Youd have to have a good idea of the couplers flex and tensile strength. This might be overly complex. I just love data, really. Use the crank position sensor on the front engine for delta between crankshaft angles. 
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Jul 6, 2019 18:57
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Suburban Dad posted:
Yeah, that's what i figured considering even the Aston has 8 O2 sensors.  It would have been so much cheaper and easier. I just don't think there are enough mounting points on the block that i could tie them together solidly enough that i would be comfortable tying the frankshaft together rigidly. e: Hmmmmmmmmmm quote:Twin 40IDFs can feed 1500-2200cc engines. Lamborghini used 4 of the 40IDFs on the 2.5L V8 Urraco in the 1960s. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carb-Carbu...lEAAOSwu4JcYPB9 hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Powershift fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Jul 6, 2019 |
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Jul 6, 2019 19:45
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Or a MS that will use sensors from both.
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DoLittle posted:+ simple wiring loom https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6PqKhMtbvc  what the gently caress am i doing
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Jul 6, 2019 22:59
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mekilljoydammit posted:Man, don't. The EMPI Chinese Weber IDF clones are about $400 apiece. So, six. I think you could probably come up with an engine management solution for that. Yeah, it seems with those cheap chinese shits it's hard to find even 2 that mach, performance wise, nevermind 6. Hard to believe with the $150K+ DB9 they couldn't figure out something more exotic than what is basically 2 Taurus throttle bodies and 2 Taurus ECUs. Powershift fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Jul 6, 2019 |
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Jul 6, 2019 23:33
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McTinkerson posted:I'll build you a megasquirt and help you wire it up. I think i'm going to have to just use factory ECUs because i'll need one to control the 5R55 anyways. The second will hopefully be out of a manual transmission LS. My wallet and body are starting to degrade so i'm going to have to slow down. I'll be pulling a harness/PCM on monday, and should have the trans then too. I've got a little solid state pump that should be able to make it at least idle if it ever will. It could be a few months before i can afford to move much further. Hopefully in that time a W124, and manual trans LS or S-type show up in the pick-n-pull. When the plan initially started with the 3.7s, i figured i could run 1 while putting everything together for the second, but i don't think 1 3.0 would be sufficient.
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Jul 6, 2019 23:51
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opengl128 posted:Holy crap you could get an LS with a stick? Who was the market for that one? They must have sold like 11 of them. Yeah, they're rare but they're out there and i want one. V6 only, and only for the first few years. The LS is functionally the same as the S-type, which had a bunch of stick cars in the UK so it didn't really cost them anything. Also, i went on the internet and found this.  I'll be getting the engines bolted together first to determine how solid i can get them, but this might be a good option.
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Jul 7, 2019 01:30
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Mental Hospitality posted:Sure could! I don't know how much it shares with it's neighbors here, but it seems to be in good company. 
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Jul 7, 2019 16:28
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Got a trans, shifter, key, ignition, and PCM.  Still have a bunch of stuff left to find that i'm going to have to dig out of the pick-n-pull when cars come up. but at least i can start getting things set up mechanically.
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Jul 8, 2019 20:22
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autism ZX spectrum posted:Jesus Christ this is so ridiculous. Yeah, but the thought is it might gently caress with the load calculations of the rear engine having another 200hp coming into the front of the crankshaft. Once i get more things running i'll probably call SCT or Bama and get their thoughts on the situation. I still like the idea of clocking the engines the same and splitting the signal, but like some have said, then it might just sound like 2 V6s, rather than having them clocked 30 degrees out and having an explosion every 30 degrees like a V12 instead of 2 every 60 degrees. I'm hoping Bama can code both ECUs to 1 vin so i can control it all with 1 tuner. then tune the front engine to ignore the missing transmission and delete PATS, and then get them both tuned together on a dyno. That way down the road if i want to start looking for more power or more sound or something, it's easier to tune both engines. I'll need the one factory ECU at least to run the transmission. so if at that point they suggest megasquirt or something i'll go that way.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:58
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bird with big dick posted:Is this running yet No, i'm still waiting for a 3.0 lincoln LS or Jag S-type to show up in the pick-n-pull. The one i found in the local junkyard was hacked up with stereo and remote starter stuff, so all i got was the PCM and ingnition.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:13
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slidebite posted:What are your thoughts on cooling? Basically twin setup? The engines will be plumbed together, they have a single water inlet on the top of the block and 2 outlets on the back of the heads. I'll probably go with an electric water pump. I doubt the factory rad will be able to keep up, but i've got a lot of room to stick whatever aluminum bits in there. The DB9 rad is aluminum, but also maybe half the size of the stock lincoln rad.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:27
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Darchangel posted:Honestly, this sort of thing has been done a number of times with a pair of V8s, carbureted. I’m betting it won’t be that much of a problem with two independent fuel-injection ECUs, especially if the coupler used has just a bit of flex in it. Probably not even if it does. Only way to really know is to try it. Yeah, that's the plan. I was gonna find a cheap miter saw and mock up the engine bay out of 4x4s. that way i could get everything right up to the exhaust collector built outside of the car. it's pretty simply, the frame rails are pretty much straight, and there are no shock towers or anything to work around. Just a crossmember, brake booster, wiper motor and HVAC box
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Jul 17, 2019 22:07
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Darchangel posted:I meant "dyno" of course, but was "helped" by Apple's auto Get me a chain, a sawzall, and 2 FWD cars.
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Jul 18, 2019 00:16
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I could probably make it fit. 0.41 lbs of fuel per hour per horsepower sounds less than ideal
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Jul 19, 2019 05:12
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Krakkles posted:This is going to make for an interesting exhaust setup as well, right? (Which will then also affect the sound...) I was thinking of just going straight down and back off the first engine into a 2:1 collector just off the second, then into a Y-pipe. 6 firing pulses per revolution plus unequal length headers = V12 subaru? This is the stock DB9 manifold, and it's considered one of the best sounding cars of all time.  Not anything super fancy, seems all about space constraints. I have a lot of options either way because not only are there are ton of aftermarket headers for the 3.0, it seems i could just flip the manifolds upside down and switch sides if i wanted to do something fancy. At this point It's all about getting started and running on the cheap because nobody really knows exactly what will happen. If it works and works well, i can start adding cheap performance bits. Also, looking at pics of the upper intake manifold, i might be able to just pull it off the rear engine and flip it 180 degrees, and not need the Jag/Lincoln manifold.  e: even easier, i might be able to flip the front one around, not have them foul, and have the 2 throttle bodies side by side. Powershift fucked around with this message at 00:38 on Jul 20, 2019 |
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Jul 20, 2019 00:34
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Well the engine bay is 5 feet long, but only like 3 feet wide, so side by side is out. And yeah, the engines will be tied together on a single mount before going in the car. part of the reason for the soft coupling is vibration isolation as well. I'm only putting 200ish ft/lbs through it.
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Jul 20, 2019 13:17
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Bibendum posted:24 hour/day drone of c# played on the devils rear end in a top hat. My new prog rock bandname, NumbersMatching320 posted:Actually looking at the Detroit example got me thinking, while there's no off the shelf solution for blowering a Duratec it can't be that much more work to slap a pair of M90s off 3800s onto these lumps... the heads extend out so that the ports are all on a single plane, would make a pair of custom manifolds a piece o'piss. I really only researched these engines once i got them, but they show up everywhere from 508hp twin turbo Rossion Q1s to 395hp/8700rpm N/A track cars. If one eats itself down the line, i would expect to slap 2 $100 ebay turbos on it and see what the other one has in it. I think money and health are going to be an issue for the next little while, but I'm going to try to keep moving forward with what i can. Right now it feels like Hal trying to change a light bulb, i have to finish R&Ring the deck so i know how much wood i have left over to build the table and engine cradle to work on everything, but first i have to clean everything up underneath it which involves moving a bunch of extra concrete pavers the POs let which means i might as well put them where they need to be, which involves a whole pile of lndscaping https://i.imgur.com/rQIb4Vw.mp4 I'm glad i started the thread early though, because i would have hosed things up so bad without you guys.
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Jul 23, 2019 05:49
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Krakkles posted:Unless I'm misunderstanding, that "minus" should be "plus". The significance of the first and second engines being identical is that they would then both have the same output, so the result could be simplified to: Actually, the front engine will be driving an alternator and power steering pump, so they will vary a little. There's still going to be ~400ftlbs of torque going trough the rear driveshaft, but they're forged driveshafts, so i'm really not worried about that. I think the most likely points of failure are abnormal main bearing wear, or weird vibrations transmitted to the valvetrain, I can see the transmission not enjoying the whole situation, but as far as i can tell, the internals are identical to the mustang GT's 5R55S, and there are dudes with 500whp on those. Also, front what i understand, both the Rossion Q1 at 508hp/521ftlbs, and the Juno SS3 V6 at 390hp and 8700rpm still use the stock crank. Powershift fucked around with this message at 22:02 on Jul 26, 2019 |
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Jul 26, 2019 21:58
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Unless i accidentally install one backwards. I've learned not to work on poo poo when i haven't slept so the percentage chance of that happening should be down into the single digits.
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Jul 26, 2019 22:46
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I recognize the challenges, and my own limitations, but i don't think i've ever wanted something to work more than i want this to. Think of the possibilities it opens up, like 2 EZ36s + an STI 6sp in the back of a falcon wagon with 6 of those VW carbbies poking through the bed. You could have a really nice 3000lb flat 12 mid engine superwagon for like, 20 grand. This is more than just a project, this is the AI space program, i fully accept the first rocket usually blows up. Powershift fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Jul 27, 2019 |
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Jul 27, 2019 16:32
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QuarkMartial posted:I'll donate some ink pens. нет, спасибо, у меня есть карандаш
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Jul 27, 2019 17:31
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doogle posted:I’m not sure if you got your coupling situation sorted, but have you looked at lovejoy couplings? I have 0 experience with them, but I saw that they are used to couple electric car motors in series and say they work with ICE engines too. Yeah, we discussed it a page or two ago. Only ones good for high torque and rpm use brass spiders that are crazy expensive and would likely transmit too much vibration. I'm really liking the guibo and driveshaft balancer plan. Either that or a chain coupler I was really hoping to be making progress with this but I've got so much poo poo stacked against me in general at this point. Maybe I'll force myself outside and make a little progress on this today.
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Sep 16, 2019 17:03
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