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 ABSOLUTELY NO SEASON 4 SPOILERS IN THIS HERE POST SPOILERS FOR SEASONS 1-3, THE MOVIE, AND MAYBE THE BOOKS BUT I DON'T REMEMBER THEM THAT WELL IN THIS HERE POSTVeronica Mars is the best show your friend has never heard about. It's central character, the titular Veronica Mars, fights injustice in her rich town of Neptune California after being completely changed by the murder of her best friend Lily Kane (played by Amanda Seyfried) and sets out to find out who did it herself after her father is ousted as sheriff over his handling of the investigation. That's how the show starts out, and it definitely dives in head first. The show doesn't shy away from anything. One of the first episodes even features a transgender character (back in the 2000's) and it's incredibly dark even in the first episode. At one point, a character casually steps backwards off a building to kill himself...and succeeds. And yet, the show is still incredibly charming. One liners, cute sidestories, and fleshed out characters (for the most part). It's incredibly well done and had so much life left before it's untimely cancellation. Anywho, let's get caught up with our favorite residents, shall we?  Keith Mars, portrayed by Enrico Colantoni "Whose your daddy?" Veronica's PI father and knowing/unknowing mentor. Smart as a whip, incredibly capable, and not afraid to stand his ground. He was the former Sheriff in town until the city called for his dismissal following the original Lily Kane case. His wife left after their fall from grace and he became a private investigator, moving into a cheap apartment complex with Veronica with whom he got really close. Just as quick-witted as his daughter, he wants her to follow a different path than the one he's on, but also understands and quietly concedes that's not who Veronica is. Veronica's gonna Veronica so he just does what he can to keep her safe. He rarely tries to force her to stop investigating something, leading to fights. Often keeps his own bigger cases to himself. In season 3, he runs again for Sheriff but loses after Veronica gets accused of vote tampering due to something unrelated. When we last left Keith: He was investigating corrupt cops and met with one of his former deputies, but was attacked by an unknown assailant in a car, landing him in the hospital. He survives. He's also trying to get Veronica to leave Neptune and be a lawyer like she went to school for.  Logan Echolls, portrayed by Jason Dohring "Annoy, tiny blonde one. Annoy like the wind" Logan Echolls, son of actor Aaron Echolls, must have pissed off a gypsy as a young child because Mother of gently caress he has the most tragic story in the entire series. He was Lily's boyfriend before her death, his father beats him, his mother kills herself after a fight with Aaron, he gets a brief glimmer of hope that she's alive when he finds her cards are being used but it turns out to be his half sister Trina leading him to feel that pain all over again, and he finds out his dad was sleeping with Lily and also killed her. And that's only season 1. After ostracizing Veronica from the elite 09'er clique at school prior to the series, he comes off as a much crueler Dick Casablancas. He and Veronica start an incredibly toxic off-and-on relationship towards the end of season 1 that lasts through the rest of the series. He's (understandably) a very angry person and an incredibly tortured soul. Life never really lightens up for this poor guy, but he still maintains a (fairly heavy) sarcastic attitude while still caring deeply for those he's close to. This extends to Veronica, Keith, Wallace, Dick, and a few others. Sometime between the series and the movie, he joins the Navy and dates a former high school classmate-turned singer, whose murder prompts him to call Veronica for help. When we last left Logan: He was happy. As happy as Logan gets, anyways. Back with Veronica and living together in a beachfront condo.  Wallace Fennel, portrayed by Percy Daggs III "You're a marshmallow, Veronica Mars" Wallace has been Veronica's loyal sidekick/minion ever since she cut him down from a flagpole in the pilot. They form a quick bond once he sits down with her at lunch, and become really close really quick and it's completely platonic. There's absolutely no will-they-won't-they at all between these two, which is awesome. Wallace is the new kid. He mostly helps Veronica with cases by means of stealing student files during his Student Aid period. He rarely shows resentment for constantly being asked for favors, but Veronica does show her affection for him (albeit much more rarely) and the few fights they have are handled rather well. When Wallace leaves to be with his dad in Chicago for a while, Veronica shows just how much she's depended on him by writing him all the time. She never gets a response because he's mad at her at the time. After a not-great start at college, he lands a job as a teacher at Neptune High sometime before the movie, and still Veronica's best friend. When we last left Wallace: He stole a student file for Veronica  Eli "Weevil" Navarro, portrayed by Francis Capra "Well if I did it, it's outstanding" Weevil is the head of the biker gang, the PCH'ers. Fiercely loyal to his family and crew, his relationship to Veronica is incredibly complicated (again, completely platonic, except for a suggestive joke now and again from Weevil). After forming a tentative bond in the Pilot, where they stand depends on the day. Even as antagonists to each other, they openly express admiration and respect for the other because ultimately, they're both trying to do what's best for their families. Weevil is central to a lot of "mystery-of-the-week" due to his nature as a PCH'er and status compared to the 09'ers. He's a scapegoat a lot. Once season 2 hits, he's the prominent character in the season's B mystery and shows just how far he's willing to go. Veronica is in his corner just as much as she pins him to the wall and honestly, their relationship is probably my favorite in the entire series because of that. When we last left Weevil: He had hung up his motorcycle leathers and become a doting father and husband. However, after Celeste Kane shot him out of fear when he was trying to help her, he went back to his old PCH'er ways  Cindy "Mac" Mackenzie, portrayed by Tina Majorino "Your wish is my Shift command" Yes, I'm fully aware she's not in the revival but she's my favorite character so you can just deal. Mac (born Madison Sinclair) was switched at birth. Great start, right? Mac's intro to the series is helping Veronica find out whose posting fake Purity Test results all over the school using her computer skills, and they quickly form a bond, helping one another out. Ultimately, it's revealed that Mac made the test and sold the results to get a new car (earning a fond smile from Veronica as she drives by), but did not do the fake ones. Veronica's the one who finds out Mac was switched at birth after Mac asks her to find out why she's so different from the rest of her family. In season 2, she starts dating Cassidy "Beaver" Casablancas. It seems to be a fairly steady relationship, and they try to consummate their relationship at the Neptune Grand Hotel in the season 2 finale. But when Veronica discovers Beaver set the bomb that killed a bunch of students in the season 2 premier, Veronica texts Mac to get the gently caress out (just a heads up, if any of you discover your friend is sleeping with a murderer, that's a phone call, not a text conversation). She is, unfortunately, in the shower, and Beaver intercepts the message. He steals her clothes so she can't follow and confronts Veronica on the roof. Afterwards, she heads down to Mac's room to find her sobbing asking why Beaver did that to her. Enters therapy before college and has a (mostly deleted, unfortunately) arc as she gets comfortable around men again. When we last left Mac: She left Kane Software to become Veronica's assistant.  Dick Casablancas, portrayed by Ryan Hansen "It's a sorority party. It's why I left the womb" We all know Dick in real life, but his name is usually Chad. Or Dylan. Or Dave (but not David). Kyle. Broccoli Rob. Boner Champ. Any male who wears boat shoes well inland. That spoiled rich kid who only wants to party and get laid and is obnoxious as gently caress to pretty much everyone. Insufferable, but somehow Logan's best friend even after all these years. After Cassidy (his brother) kills himself, he goes over the deep end and starts partying harder than ever. He hits rock bottom and Logan takes him in. He shows no real signs of remorse or anything over Cassidy until his dad (who goes by "Big Dick" because seriously this family is the worst) shows up and he blows up at Big Dick over how they tortured Cassidy, showing that he blames himself and finally showing a hint of a softer side to Mac. Dick really suffers from wasted potential. That arc could have been beautiful to see, but it's really only 3 scenes over 2 episodes. They could have really fleshed him out, but as it is I really don't feel sympathy for him because when the movie rolled around, he hadn't changed a bit. When we last left Dick: He was on medical marijuana for depression and doing what Dick does best. Being a douchebag. Did I leave anyone out...? Oh, right  Veronica Mars, portrayed by Kristen Bell "Why do you insist on pissing me off?" This chick. She does stuff sometimes. When we last left Veronica: She was fighting to change how the Powers the Be handle our souls in the afterlife Rabbi Raccoon fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Jul 21, 2019 |
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Jul 20, 2019 02:17
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Getting in early here to ask if anyone can suggest a recap for everything that’s come before, because I can barely remember the three (?) seasons, and can pretty much not remember the movie at all.
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Jul 20, 2019 02:27
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One of those shows where the first season is among the best TV of all time. I’m not gonna stop watching S4 tonight until I’m through all 8 eps.
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Jul 20, 2019 02:36
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Ubiquitous_ posted:One of those shows where the first season is among the best TV of all time. I’m not gonna stop watching S4 tonight until I’m through all 8 eps. I think the second season is a lot better, less Duncan and less Lilly.
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Jul 20, 2019 04:59
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Season 4 hitting just as I am going on vacation, and so far it doesn't seem to be legally available here. Though that could change since it was just announced that it was here a week early.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:07
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Oasx posted:I think the second season is a lot better, less Duncan and less Lilly. While those are positives, I think Season 2 suffers from worse pacing and a less personal connection to the season-long case compared to S1. To be fair, this is a problem in S3 and also S4.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:29
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What in the gently caress with that finale Jesus Christ
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Jul 20, 2019 09:25
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Poor Wallace seems to be getting the Lane Kim treatment so far. Master post will be updated sometime over the next few days Rabbi Raccoon fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Jul 20, 2019 |
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Jul 20, 2019 20:42
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This was a good season. It feels like the best attempt at a revival that I can think of. Arrested Development seemed like it was revived by monkey's paw wish.
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Jul 20, 2019 21:38
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Man, I watched the first two episodes and I really dislike how Veronica behaves on a psychological level. Jesus Christ! Your boyfriend goes to therapy for his long time anger issues and you sabotage it, by claiming he's given up an essential part of himself. And once you force him to lose control, you get really horny and reward that with sex. I never liked Logan all that much, but honestly, he deserves better! That's incredible awful behavior and I hope it will be addressed further! Did they write that scene so the audience starts to like her less and him more? If they deliberately threw Veronica under the bus, it sure worked for me. The rest of those first two episodes was fun so far.
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Jul 20, 2019 23:06
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I wasn't using my heart anyways, so it's fine
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Jul 20, 2019 23:12
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Ending spoilers: I'm a little surprised they went with the most obvious choice and motive for the bomber. Furthermore, it's kind of a super bad look for Patton Oswalt to play a true crime buff who actually committed the crime when there's a dumb conspiracy theory out there about how he murdered his wife so he could remarry and then finished her true crime novel. I don't believe it for a second, but the entire time I was like, "oh dear god, no. Those dickheads are going to latch onto this." All in all, a good season, but I really missed the case-of-the-week format because that was where they showed off Veronica being clever every week as she slowly pieced together the larger mystery at hand which isn't presenting itself nearly as quickly. As a result, it felt like the information was just being revealed because it was time for it to be revealed instead of as a result of Veronica's actions. That was always the case, but the former format hid it better and left us continuously rooting for Veronica while this season seems to be running with her being too damaged to relate to other people, but not really doing enough with that either to justify having done so. I also missed theory-crafting with goons, which a binge-schedule won't let you do, so I sorta' wish they'd have played an episode a week for eight weeks. But maybe that's for the best because "the murderhead dead it" was, again, the most obvious choice outside of Casablancas, who, surprise, also did it, which was revealed to the audience not as a result of detective work, but through viewer omniscience.
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Jul 20, 2019 23:43
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alecm posted:This was a good season. It feels like the best attempt at a revival that I can think of. Arrested Development seemed like it was revived by monkey's paw wish. I'd put it up there with Twin Peaks: The Return for sure.
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Jul 21, 2019 00:00
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cant cook creole bream posted:Man, I watched the first two episodes and I really dislike how Veronica behaves on a psychological level. I mean, yeah, you're very obviously supposed to consider that awful and her behaviour lovely.
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Jul 21, 2019 00:34
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Boy the cartel plot sure went nowhere.alecm posted:This was a good season. It feels like the best attempt at a revival that I can think of. Arrested Development seemed like it was revived by monkey's paw wish. It was certainly more successful than its sister show The Gilmore Girls's revival.
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Jul 21, 2019 02:39
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I thought it was gonna be Langdon framing someone else. She seemed desperate to get out of Neptune to San Diego, solving a major case like that would definitely put her in a position to escape, and she's in the perfect spot to manipulate and plant evidence leading everyone on wild goose chases. I REALLY didn't want it be Penn also because of Patton's personal past couple of years. But y'know, I also don't personally know him so I guess he wouldn't have done it if he wasn't ok with it Also holy mother of poo poo I hope Dick never reproduces (even though he probably already has) and passes on the psychopath gene that apparently is strong in that family. Honestly never understood why Logan kept him around once he started growing up and Dick didn't
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Jul 21, 2019 03:11
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LesterGroans posted:I mean, yeah, you're very obviously supposed to consider that awful and her behaviour lovely. Yes of course, but it's a bit much. I don't really feel like rooting for her after that. It's not even badly written, because some people do poo poo like that. But those are awful persons. I also really hate how it portrays it, like women want real men. If someone watches this and agrees that these outburst make someone hotter, they are also terrible. I am probably just hung up on that scene, but the more I think about it, the more I hate it.
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Jul 21, 2019 09:27
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Well that was a downer note to end the season on.
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Jul 21, 2019 09:55
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The moral of this season is Veronica Mars is obviously a lovely romantic partner, and if you don't realize that you deserve to die
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Jul 21, 2019 10:11
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I will say, I was not into how much this season played to the horny segment of the fanbase, so ending it with Logan getting exploded literally between their wedding and their honeymoon was a beautiful gut punch in that regard
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Jul 21, 2019 10:14
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cant cook creole bream posted:Yes of course, but it's a bit much. I don't really feel like rooting for her after that. I think it's portraying "women who want REAL men" as a bad thing, though.
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Jul 21, 2019 16:26
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At no point does the show portray Veronica as being right in what she is doing.
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Jul 21, 2019 16:32
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She's always been hosed up and bad at relationships. Look at her treatment of Piz in the movie or her snooping and lack of trust. It even extends to her friendships, like using Wallace or what happens with Nicole this season. But the show does a good job of making you understand why she's like that.
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Jul 21, 2019 17:03
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I've got to say I really enjoyed the "Sorry." Such a brilliant playing with expectations and making sure we'd be off-guard for what comes next.
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Jul 21, 2019 17:08
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An actual Master Post now
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Jul 21, 2019 18:57
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I'm just finishing up episode six but I'm jumping in here so I remember to come back and talk about how much I love drunk Veronica dancing.
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Jul 21, 2019 20:28
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finale words Veronica's face hardening into concrete just after the bomb and then the narration sliding back into the show (had the whole season be devoid of narration up to that point?) was some Good TV. super duper hope they get to make more. Matty spin-off show when
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Jul 21, 2019 20:55
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I didnt realise how much i missed this show. I'm having a lot of fun with it, the writing's fresh and contemporary, the jokes land. Reminds me of how progressive VM was back in 2004. Plus Duncan isnt in it.
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Jul 21, 2019 21:12
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Finished it today. Overall I thought it was alright, but stuff seemed a bit more contrived than usual for Veronica Mars. Still its always nice to see these characters again. Spoilers for the entire season: I laughed at Matty's (non) reaction to witnessing big dick's decapitation. She just sort of watched and walked away, it was really weird. Did anything come of Logan's bruise? Weevil, young Dick Casablancas, and Wallace didnt really have any sort of closure, they just stopped appearing on the show. As someone mentioned, the cartel stuff didnt seem to really go anywhere I didnt find the death of Logan very compelling, it felt kind of cheesy that he gets exploded as they prepare for their honeymoon. Basically it was a "he was just 2 days from retirement" setup. I wonder if Patton's Oswalt will show up in future seasons as a hannibal lecter type. It feels like the type of thing where the more you think about it, the more flaws you notice, but whatever, it was enjoyable. I missed having smaller episode mysteries too.
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Jul 21, 2019 22:01
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WHY BONER NOW posted:I laughed at Matty's (non) reaction to witnessing big dick's decapitation. She just sort of watched and walked away, it was really weird. Dick literally killed her father. Remember, she was there to ruin his life and get revenge.
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Jul 21, 2019 22:03
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Lord Bob posted:finale words There was narration in the first episode, and I think the implication is that most of this season was supposed to be Veronica recounting the events to Logan's therapist? I'd need to go back and check though. I do remember an interview back when the show was on UPN where Rob Thomas admitted he thought a lot of Veronica's narration was clumsy way to inform viewers what's happening, so that's maybe why it wasn't that prominent in this season? (But on the other hand, like, iZombie)
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Jul 21, 2019 22:33
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cant cook creole bream posted:Man, I watched the first two episodes and I really dislike how Veronica behaves on a psychological level. Veronica is a danger whore 
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Jul 22, 2019 01:36
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:Veronica is a danger whore There's that, but it's a part of something bigger about her character. Veronica never thinks she's wrong. Ever. The possibility never occurs to her. Even in the movie when comparing her return to Neptune to an alcoholic having one last drink, she keeps implying it's the right choice to stay. And, as a result, she really doesn't grow that much. She's learned how to handle herself better, yes, but as a person she never really grows because she doesn't think she needs to. So she never grew out of that attraction to the "bad boy". And that attraction is at odds with Logan's constantly trying to better himself.
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Jul 22, 2019 01:57
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LesterGroans posted:She's always been hosed up and bad at relationships. Look at her treatment of Piz in the movie or her snooping and lack of trust. It even extends to her friendships, like using Wallace or what happens with Nicole this season. But the show does a good job of making you understand why she's like that. Yes. This has always been an undercurrent of the show—that Veronica’s work as a PI and her early traumas have damaged her ability to trust other people, that she routinely pursues justice or even vengeance at the cost of herself and others, and all while closing herself off from any sort of therapy or emotional growth. Full S4 spoilers: I was really loving how aware S4 seemed to be about this—everyone around her has changed or grown, but she’s still mostly the same. Logan putting in the work to improve himself delivered so many great moments and really drove home that Veronica herself needs to change. Then they had Veronica do a 180 to accept his proposal, did a last-second head-fake with the “sorry” text, got hitched in a courthouse wedding, blew up Logan within hours, then jumped a year ahead skipping past any sort of grieving or healing process, and then had Veronica drive off into the sunset while Logan posthumously extolls Veronica’s hardness as strength. I really, really loathed those last 10-20 minutes. And not because “omg how dare they kill Logan, LoVe foreva”—while I love Logan as a character, their relationship was always complex at best and toxic at worst. That’s why I found most of S4’s exploration of it so fascinating—it felt like the show was very aware that both of them had a lot of work to do. And then it just chucked it all out at the end and skipped ahead, presumably to set up what they felt was necessary for any future seasons: an unattached Veronica, able to go wherever a new big case is. I dunno. I really enjoyed seeing these characters again, and most of the season was solid, but that ending really left a sour taste in my mouth. It felt like the least interesting direction to take it.
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Jul 22, 2019 02:18
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I loved season 4. I thought it did right by all the major characters, even the ones with smaller roles like Weevil and Wallace. It's funny, I never liked Logan much as a character, and him and Veronica as a pair, especially in season 3 and the movie (Luv u piz). The season 4 self-improvement stuff was incredibly well done and compelling. I won't say I loved the decision to kill him off, but I didn't mind it, and it definitely seems like the show has a more interesting future now. With all the solid character work the show did, they earned the twist. Like the movie, there were a *few* too many callbacks for my taste - did we really need Tim AND Mercer to get trotted out to say "yeah, those guys who you knew were all in Chino together did in fact hang out"...then again I did like the brief appearances by Clemmons and Parker so maybe I'm hypocrite. Mercer was, for my money, the most terrifying villain the show ever had and him kvetching about Brock Turner felt cheap. I also dug all the new characters. Clyde, Nicole Penn and Matty were all interesting. The Clyde storyline ended up being a total curve ball and I loved it. mr. unhsib fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Jul 22, 2019 |
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Jul 22, 2019 03:26
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I don't think the mystery was nearly as compelling as Who Killed LIlly Kane but, as anyone who has tried to hook a skeptical friend or partner on season 1 can tell you, there's a ton of filler and some major pacing issues. That brought us a bunch of scenes I love (The Tritons mystery and payoff, election, That's Amore, all of poker night), but it's why I think S4's tight 8 episodes was on par with S1 despite the weaker central plot.escalator dropdown posted:Yes. This has always been an undercurrent of the show—that Veronica’s work as a PI and her early traumas have damaged her ability to trust other people, that she routinely pursues justice or even vengeance at the cost of herself and others, and all while closing herself off from any sort of therapy or emotional growth. Between that, reliving (parts of) her trauma vicariously through Matty, seeing Logan's growth (and Leo's support of it!), and watching her Dad do the same things that she always does, the season went out of its way to prove that Veronica needed help and support and to grow-that Logan pushing her towards his therapist was the best thing any character did for another all season, except for maybe rapist bombcollar guy running off to save the others- and that Veronica inability to connect the dots in her own life and take action are the character's fatal flaw. Also, the show's need to torture Veronica had me thinking TherapyLogan was either doomed or an act (he would have been a much more compelling red herring than Nicole) from the second episode on. When we had the closecalls with Matty and Keith, I knew he was doomed and the only question I had was if they got married first. quote:
TherapyLogan and Veronica were a much more interesting pairing to me than BrandoLogan and Veronica, but I don't know how you can build around them as a couple with all the work she has to do. I see that getting into "The only mystery she can't solve.... is herself" territory quickly and I'm not sure anyone other than you and I want that show? Maybe it's the beach vibe, but the finale makes me think of killing Rita in Dexter. That could have gone two directions-Dexter learning to manage his dark passenger and cope with his own grief while being responsible for guiding the kids in a way that may have given greater color to his relationship with Harry, or the writers clearing the board of the obstacles and baggage, and freeing the titular character to do whatever the plot demands. I hope that S5 avoids hammering the reset button, because if they do then I agree with your sour taste 100%. mr. unhsib posted:I also dug all the new characters. Clyde, Nicole Penn and Matty were all interesting. The Clyde storyline ended up being a total curve ball and I loved it.
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Jul 22, 2019 05:08
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These are good posts, and are generally around where my feelings are at for the season. I still don't know if killing Logan off works for me, but I can see how it's necessary to keep Veronica going in an interesting direction without devolving it into melodrama. I liked that early on in the season they basically gave Veronica the exact same complaints about Logan that fans had about his character during season 3 and the movie.
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Jul 22, 2019 06:38
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Clyde was the best new character by far. Maddy is second though. Show good. Season good.  the ending + epilogue didn't really do it for me. I didn't hate it but it wasn't good.
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Jul 22, 2019 07:21
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Overall shockingly good season, 8x50ish minutes works way better than 20x40ish. And I appreciated turning down the fan service compared to the movie (and I say that having enjoyed the fan service in the movie! Glad they restrained themselves here though). I grinned a couple times at continuing Logan's inspirational messages by having him just say quotes out loud to the congressman's family. Sometimes the most obvious approach works best!
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Jul 22, 2019 14:20
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My wife just kept yelling LEOOOO and wishing out loud that they’d kill off Logan so her and Leo could be together. She got half that wish at least. I’d love more Leo if they make a season 5, but that man’s going to hurt himself smiling so much.
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Jul 22, 2019 14:23
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