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MassRafTer posted:The scale was never a five star scale. DEAN! established that the scale went up to million billion stars. Just that no one ever deserved it outside of like Bull Pain.
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Jul 7, 2023 02:55
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NikkolasKing posted:When I first got online and started talking wrestling in the mid 2000s, I met a lot of Hogan haters. Not because of who he is but because they're the ur-smark crowd who want nothing but Bret Hart super technical matches. I never understood this because it seemed incredibly obvious to me the first and only real important part of a pro wrestler is connecting with the crowd. Face or Heel, if you get a reaction from a crowd, who gives a poo poo if you can't work or talk. Find a manager to talk, find somebody to carry you in the ring, all you need is that "It Factor." This is why there's a difference between a great wrestler and a great worker. Hogan was never going to work a match like he was Dean Malenko, but with his size and stature and place on the card, you wouldn't want him exchanging wrist locks with someone smaller.
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Aug 11, 2023 02:15
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Lid posted:He was always always ALWAYS over but never pushed, tellingly during The Invasion when he came out of all the invaders, WCW and ECW, he was the only one cheered and it wasnt light cheers it was ravenous applause. And when they finally pushed him, after five years, he got busted for drugs in a traffic stop which of course RVD has weed on him its RVD but then it was well we can never trust you again so they never pushed him again. RVD also never evolved once he figured out who he was around '98-'99. He had to modify some things once he came to WWF due to the larger rings/no weapons once he moved on from the hardcore stuff, but the RVD of 2002 was the RVD of 2012, just older and slower. It's been the same way with Jeff Hardy; he never really changed his style up into anything else and it's the same spots he's been doing for several decades now. That he still does the Swanton despite stiffing the gently caress out of everyone with it despite having the Twist of Fate right there as a viable finish speaks volumes.
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Aug 11, 2023 22:28
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Justin Credible was the very definition of a 0.0 VORP wrestler.
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Sep 7, 2023 03:12
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El Gallinero Gros posted:I definitely think coming up in Memphis (one of the carniest territories there was), and being undercut by Hogan every time he was getting over didn't help, but being a cokehead didn't help either, especially wrt paranoia Not just Memphis, but legit outlaw mudshow Memphis. His dad promoted against the NWA so you know the Poffos were always looking over their shoulders. There was a story of Macho planning on shoplifting at a grocery store; either he'd get arrested on a minor charge and make the papers which would lend credibility to his wildman character and serve as advertising for their upcoming shows, or he'd get free steak out of it. When your logic tree works like that, you have no chance of being normal.
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Oct 27, 2023 20:12
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CombineThresher posted:Funk worked them unless it was a big spot, and his first punch of the match was always a live round to remind people not to gently caress with him. Funk was also punching them right in the middle of the forehead, as opposed to lower on the actual face where bad things can happen.
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Nov 9, 2023 08:09
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I wonder when the transition from "Pay a guy $500 to learn how to lock up and bump and the rest is all on the job training" to dedicated academies occured. I'd guess the 90s once Vince killed kayfabe and you could openly advertise a wrestling school, but I'd be curious if it happened earlier.
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Nov 13, 2023 07:59
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Kvlt! posted:being a kid and watching 2000s CZW is some of my fondest wrestling memories How do you report someone to CPS after they've become an adult
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Nov 30, 2023 01:02
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Kvlt! posted:my parents were a "violence is fine as long as there's no nudity" people which i never understood. I could watch Tournament of Death, but not Titanic because it had a tiddy. I was almost an adult by the time I found CZW, so my folks never got to see what it was all about. I'm more glad I didn't find it until I was almost done backyarding, though I have the scars from a ligttube gone wrong on my tricep. That's always fun to explain.
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Nov 30, 2023 05:30
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Hirez posted:only tag? pfft. howling at 5 refs lol And now let's hold it in the middle of an abandoned Discovery Zone https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2qBIXjXw7c
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Jan 6, 2024 23:32
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History Comes Inside! posted:And at the other end of the wtf scale there’s those 1v1 in a phone booth/front seat of a car promotions X-ARM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAAJ2GUzWz8
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Jan 7, 2024 01:30
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The Taxman posted:My particular favorite was fully armored medieval fighting with swords and axes Well that happens in the US as well. https://twitter.com/ESPN_BillC/status/1744013012866843128
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Jan 7, 2024 19:55
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personally i blame the dog
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Jan 8, 2024 03:12
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Diabolik900 posted:The thing that gets me about this is that anyone who knew their history and has two brain cells could easily guess that this is why Colt went away. The idea that someone must have talked to the dirt sheets to put this idea out into the world is just dumb. There was a thought that the initial All In was in Chicago so that Punk would be on the card, and when he wasn't it allowed Colt to be in the pre-show battle royale. Even after that, Colt wasn't one of AEW's initial signings with the potential idea that they would bring in Punk; when Colt finally showed up the immediate general consensus was that AEW wasn't going to be bringing in Punk after all. I can't remember when, but after Punk did join there was one Dynamite where both were on the same show, and after that Colt didn't appear on Dynamite again until one of Punk's extended absenses. No one had to leak poo poo to anyone; everyone put 2 and 2 together and realized that these two people weren't going to be in the same locker room. Erin M. Fiasco posted:Brian Zane/Wrestling With Wregret's summation video on the situation is very good and nuanced, explaining in depth the situation and understanding the various points of failure all around it. Tony should have ran a tighter ship and the Elite shouldn't have done some snide shots, but Punk's reactions were far beyond the pale. Everyone managed to do the wrong thing afterwards, but Tony's lack of leadership still stands out. I don't believe the notion that the booker/promoter has to rule with an iron fist, but they do need the ability to command authority and demand respect when necessary and it's not in Tony's nature to do this. It's why Andrade thinks he can smack Sammy and believe he can get his way, and why Perry thought he could do what he wanted and get away with it. Say what you want about Vince, but he absolutely would have gotten all parties involved in the same room and nipped this poo poo in the bud. Maybe you make money off of this, maybe you don't, but unless you were Shawn Michaels in '97 you weren't going to go on TV and make any reference to this without it being approved beforehand.
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Jan 8, 2024 20:08
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Alaois posted:Bro how can you say Vince would have 100% nipped it in the bud and then in the same sentence reference an incredibly high profile example of a time he didnt do that Vince in '97 was scared to death of losing Michaels to WCW, since he didn't know Michaels was going to get hurt and Austin was going to go nuclear and end his money woes. As for the Hogan match, Michaels basically turned back face immediately after and everyone acted like it never happened and no rematches were ever teased. No one's ever been able to explain Vince's soft spot for Michaels, outside of the WCW fears, and I'm not going to be that one.
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Jan 8, 2024 20:33
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NikkolasKing posted:I always love this, Bryan reading a letter from a fan in 1999 about how Vince stumble into success despite his best efforts to the contrary. Nearly every single success story has involved a certain degree of luck, from ridiculous to pants-on-head stupid amounts. Yes, there's talent and hard work involved, but the amount of good fortune and near-disasters and whatcouldhavebeens are infinite. Someone once told me that the road to success is lined with sure things and can't miss prospects. Makes it all the more impressive when someone/thing does make it.
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Jan 9, 2024 00:15
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PublicOpinion posted:Trying to translate the figure four leglock to arms at strictly as I can, I guess it would be something like this? now kiss
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Jan 21, 2024 02:09
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You also need a stabilizing field of view shot for the audience's perspective. Everyone in attendance has their in-person view, the home audience needs a stable shot so they understand where everything is. A show shot completely from ringside or some other constanty moving perspective would end up unwatchable after a while. Try watching something like racing, where the area is too big for it to be all on one shot, and count how often you're confused on where exactly the action is at times. It's the best they can do given the limitations, but if you can avoid it, you should.
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Jan 24, 2024 00:12
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Timby posted:I dunno, Konnan has to be pretty high up there. And I'm having a hard time making a case for Cowboy Bill Watts, but that's largely because of what a drunken, racist, moronic piece of poo poo he was running WCW. I'd imagine Konnan's in for his time in Mexico and not for anything he did in the US. The case for Nakamura is that he was the top guy for a minute, before Tanahashi got the bigger push, and the #2/3 guy when New Japan started to go through a boom period, and was consistently on top of the cards alongside Tanahashi and Okada. Ishii's case is far weaker imo; never held a world title, has never been considered close to a top guy in New Japan where he's spent more of his career, was more over in the US then in Japan but never had an extended US run to take advantage of it. Had Ishii had a run with the ROH world belt while the iron was hot maybe there'd be a better case for him, but Ishii is a firm case of "man wrassle good" being the reasoning behind his induction vs "man draw lots of money". How much of this is a changing of the business vs. changing of fans' taste in the modern era is up to debate. I'd argue The Rock has a weak case. Debuted in late '96, world champ late '98, hit megastardom in '99 as part of the Attitute boom led by Austin, takes time off right after Wrestlemania '01 to film Scorpion King, effectively done as a full-time wrestler after Summerslam '02. He'd have his returns and short runs and the Wrestlemania trilogy with cena, but there's only four years where he was on top, and he was always a solid number 2 behind Austin. I'd say it's worth nothing that before Rock became a legitimate Hollywood star, whenever he was in the ring with someone like Austin or Hogan, they'd get cheered and Rock would get booed. Rock had his moments on top but he was never the guy of the era, Austin was. Looking at it, Rock and Nakamura have similiar cases in terms of short arcs on top overshadowed by a period-defining star, Nakamura has more longevity on his side while Rock burned brighter.
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Feb 2, 2024 07:52
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He was trying to externally decapitate his opponent.
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Feb 15, 2024 10:07
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It's also worth noting that part of the fallout from the Screwjob is the rise of multi-man matches. Vince never wanted to be back in a position where a belt could be held hostage and such if you put a third or more person in who could take a fall it keeps you from booking yourself into a corner. What's that, Jeff Jarrett has the IC belt and his contract's expired? Whatever he's a pro's pro we'll be fine. The screwjob also led to the belts Not Mattering but that was later down the line.
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Mar 2, 2024 19:44
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Defenestrategy posted:There was definitely a point during hangman vs elite that with some minor changes an ssb tag run for a month or two would have been fine. Bucks vs lucha bros part 8 was really good but there was no reason you had to have lucha bros end the bucks reign and could pass it from ssb Yeah, there could have been something in the first leadup to Omega/Hangman, but the Elite winning that 10-man after the Dark Order had their big fancy entrance that people loved killed them. At this point it's really time to cut bait. They've had three strikes: the first failed spooky push that led to that disasterous end show beatdown and forced Tony to revamp the whole show, when Brodie died (not anyone's fault obviously but still), and then once Hangman basically left them out to dry. It's a dead gimmick and all parties really need to move on.
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Mar 6, 2024 06:03
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History Comes Inside! posted:Things he has in common with his dad: fyp
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Mar 13, 2024 01:20
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Kosmo Gallion posted:Awesome was so great. I know it was WCW 2000, but man, they completely wasted a 6'5" 250lb killer who was strong, could move fast and fly, and knew how to work. Awesome had his match in that there's big bombs and big bumps and if he has someone who could take them like Tanaka or Spike Dudley, there's a spectacle. But there wasn't much once you got past the surface and the top guys in the major promotions weren't going to take the kind of bumps that an Awesome match would require. Awesome looked big in ECW but he's about the size of Billy Gunn, in terms of sneakily big guys, so you'd have someone doing power moves who isn't the biggest or most impressively looking guy. Awesome was a Sid-level talent who could move a bit better, but he was a one-trick pony who's one trick wasn't going to work outside of FMW and ECW.
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Mar 19, 2024 00:07
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Lid posted:This is objectively wrong. Not subjectively but like have you seen Awesone work in non-extreme Feds? I compare Awesone to a proto-Konosuke Takeshita often because Takeshita is better in every way but they have the same talents and style. Awesome was even a high flier, limited but man could jump. In ring Sid as a comparison point is just the gently caress. Show me an Awesome match that's worth a poo poo and doesn't involve furniture then.
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Mar 19, 2024 01:36
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davidbix posted:The first match he had with Kenta Kobashi in 1999: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4psx0x That was pretty good. Kobashi's style meshes well with Awesome's though; Kobashi's willing to throw bombs and take ludicrous bumps. The Sid comparison may have been unfair but so is a Takeshita one; Awesome's not nearly as versatile. I'm also not watching a 3 hour video of Mike Awesome matches, no offense. I also maintain he wouldn't have fit in well in early 2000's WWF. No main eventer is taking his moves: he'd kill Austin and Angle, he's the same size as the Rock, HHH isn't taking those bumps, he wouldn't be able to throw around Undertaker/Rikishi/Kane/Show. Jericho/Benoit maybe but Awesome wouldn't be able to keep up with them. At best he's midcard with the Hardys and Christian being willing to take some of his moves, but he'd be SOL against someone like Test or Albert. We also need to be aware that a lot of the high flying stuff would be cut out. The dive to the outside for sure, maybe the splash off the top. Springboards would also be a no-go. At best he keeps the slingshot shoulderblock and that's it. Even assuming you don't get the Invasion and a super-bloated roster and the WWF side all trying to keep their spots, he probably fizzles out as a lower card Heat-level talent working five minute matches before deciding that Japan was a better use of his talents.
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Mar 19, 2024 04:17
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Alaois posted:much like the ultimate warrior, there have been multiple Shaggy 2 Dopes we're actually now on shaggy 7 dope
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Mar 20, 2024 00:36
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forkboy84 posted:You should not believe Paul Heyman, imo I remember Paul E saying he wanted Misawa/Kobashi for that Heatwave '98 tag vs. Sabu/RVD, and hooooo boy that would have been a different match.
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Mar 31, 2024 03:30
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Vandar posted:Vince genuinely had the two shows competing with each other. If you have to compete with yourself, you're a monopoly and need to be broken up. I attribute this to all things: corporations, schools, team scrimmages, the whole deal.
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Apr 5, 2024 02:38
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I didn't have a breaking point as much as I cut the cord sometime in the mid 2000's and once a habit is broken it becomes difficult to pick back up. Even once the network came out and at a very reasonable price point I never subscribed. The last time I regularly watched wrestling was pre-NJPW World when Russians would upload G1 shows to....Daily Motion?...and that's how I watched about a decade ago, sludging through Shelton Benjamin and Yujiro and Doc Gallows matches to get to the good stuff. Now days it's a match here and there that I find on social. I don't have the patience or wherewithal to sit through these marathon shows anymore; it took me three days to get through the ROH/NJPW MSG show when they posted it for free. I get annoyed when my Fire Pro recordings go past half an hour.
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Apr 9, 2024 21:20
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big black turnout posted:I don't think any television product can reach the highs of television products from that era ever again, due to fundamental changes in technology Women's college basketball seems to do the trick.
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Apr 17, 2024 23:46
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Integrated Houston posted:It’s not surprising in retrospect, certainly, but I remember Wrestlemania X-7 in particular being a hot show by any standard, possibly the hottest Wrestlemania ever. But even by then the “boom” had already ended if you look back. It could have continued on, but the two events of WCW/ECW ending and their fanbases not making the transition, combined with turnig Austin heel to a crowd that wasn't ready to boo him, followed by the panic booking of the Invasion, really did a number on the boom. It's not that wrestling would have remained the cultural zeitgeist forever without those two events, but they mark an identifiable point in time that the good times had ended.
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Apr 18, 2024 01:53
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Building 7 held all the good booking ideas.
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Apr 18, 2024 01:55
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Dr Kool-AIDS posted:I got back into wrestling recently and was watching some CM Punk matches (and promos) to see what all the fuss was about, and maybe it was because I was seeing too much of his work all at once, but it felt glaringly obvious when he was pushing his face into his opponent's head to call spots. At least he did that. Foley just yelled spots in the middle of all his other incoherent yelling.
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Apr 19, 2024 17:22
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forkboy84 posted:early ROH has insane misogyny and a good deal of homophobia too. the very first match iirc
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Apr 21, 2024 03:10
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Joe/Necro
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May 7, 2024 06:11
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