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The culprit's calm demeanor throughout this seeuence is deeply disturbing. When killing no longer gave them the pleasure they sought, instead of, you know, not killing, they commited a complicated revenge plot/serial killing just to get those sensations back. What a loving psychopath. Also, Date is a Zero Escape-style SHIFTer or something. I'm not entirely sure how that works across multiple bodies, but considering the Psync machine is borderline magitech with our current knowledge I'm not going to start questioning things here. Oh, and this means that in the Mizuki path, the one in Iris' body is actually So - even after his original body dies. I'm really curious how that gets worked out post-ending. An aging career politician suddenly thrust into the body of his (now one-eyed) 18 year old internet idol celebrity daughter born from an affair, presumably forced to keep everything a secret for the sake of national security. On the bright side, at least he gets to live longer, assuming they deal with that tumor she has.
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Aug 29, 2020 17:09
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mycelia posted:I don't think they use the kanji in the titles in Japanese, so I'm not sure which it would be, but I got two results for Ihai: "ashes of the deceased, remains from cremation" and "violation, transgression". It's the former. 遺灰, cremated ashes. I think the word 遺骨 is a more common but it's broader, too (it's more like "remains").
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Aug 29, 2020 17:37
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:It's the former. 遺灰, cremated ashes. I think the word 遺骨 is a more common but it's broader, too (it's more like "remains").  There ya go. Somehow I got it in my head that they were in katakana. Kinda neat that you get the double reading in romanji.eta: And this is how you know I haven't always been watching the videos before I post, since I've already played the game 
mycelia fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 17:45
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Ah, so we had the order of the body switching wrong: Date switched first with Rohan, then with Saito. That's interesting. I'm still inclined to think that the first switch was unintentional, but I can't piece together the sequence of events after that. We're probably missing some key information about the events six years ago -- Rohan's case of hemispatial neglect will likely be important to the story, but it hasn't come up yet (other than indirectly, in the fact that he only removed the victims' right eyes). I wonder when Falco/Date started working for the police. If what Rohan has told us of his backstory is accurate, then maybe it was shortly after he met Hitomi? He might have decided to go to the police in an attempt to find a way out of the Yakuza milieu. I'm really curious about the prototype Psync machine, now. Specifically, why did the police never find it? It was stolen six years ago, so it could have been used for one of the switches back then. If it was used for the second one, when Date-in-Rohan's-body switched with Saito, that would explain why Saito knew of it five years later. But why would Date not have told the police about it after the switch? It's not like it would be a secret that he had used it. Unless maybe he lost his memory in the second switch, and was unable to remember the location? On that note, I kinda feel like Pewter and Boss and whoever else knows about the Psync machine's secrets should have done more to investigate Rohan's suicide. I mean: Saito's been stuck in Rohan's body and hospitalised for five years, and then one day he leaves the hospital and commits suicide by jumping from a building shortly afterwards. And one of the machines that can be used to switch bodies is still missing. Did nobody think that maybe, just maybe, he'd managed to switch bodies with someone else and then thrown Rohan's body from a building to cover his tracks?
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Aug 29, 2020 19:02
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Our highly advanced AI companion, defeated by TOR.  Huh, I was expecting the explanation about the eyes to come a little later. I had also forgotten the game's brief explanation about it being possible to put eyes that had fallen out back into their sockets with no adverse effects. (It was a digression during Ota's retelling of an urban legend, IIRC.) In retrospect, I guess it was a primer/clue for the reveal of why the victims of the prototype Psync machine had their eyes taken out. It's also interesting that one of the timeline "splits" seems to be Saito neglecting to give Iris a sleeping pill on the way to the chemical plant. I wonder if that was a mundane timeline split or if SHIFT-esque knowledge of a parallel world factored into his decision to do so. NeverHelm posted:Also, Date is a Zero Escape-style SHIFTer or something. I'm not entirely sure how that works across multiple bodies, but considering the Psync machine is borderline magitech with our current knowledge I'm not going to start questioning things here. There was that thing in ZTD about Sean being able to SHIFT because he was a quantum computer. Maybe having Aiba hooked up to his brain gave Date the ability to move memories across timelines? quote:Oh, and this means that in the Mizuki path, the one in Iris' body is actually So - even after his original body dies. I'm really curious how that gets worked out post-ending. An aging career politician suddenly thrust into the body of his (now one-eyed) 18 year old internet idol celebrity daughter born from an affair, presumably forced to keep everything a secret for the sake of national security. On the bright side, at least he gets to live longer, assuming they deal with that tumor she has. I assume he gets amnesia like Date and Saito did. I think So would probably spill the beans to someone in ABIS otherwise, and then the "we never really solved the mystery" tone that the ending has wouldn't really match, y'know?
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Aug 29, 2020 19:15
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The changes in Boss and Date’s models’ expressions when Saito was in their bodies was really well done. I didn’t quite understand the bad end in the most recent update. Date refused a bunch and then the shock of seeing Hitomi explode got to him?
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Aug 29, 2020 19:29
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On the topic of "So in Iris's body in Mizuki's ending": I think the implication being made by the fact we don't see Iris making a recovery is that he/she doesn't wake up and the tumors do the rest, given that there seems to be no route for Hitomi to get the money she needs for the surgery, so Iris's body is on a hard time limit, and the stress that So would have adjusting to the situation would probably just make things worse. So claiming that he's, well, So would just be met with "that must be the tumors".Mecca-Benghazi posted:I didn’t quite understand the bad end in the most recent update. Date refused a bunch and then the shock of seeing Hitomi explode got to him? I think what happened is that Date lost it and either attacked or more likely straight up murdered Saito (implied by "Boss's body rolled into the corner of the room." and "I ran my palm across my face. I could taste blood."), and then he might've gotten the taste of the elation that Saito always got when killing back when he was still in his original body. This would imply that the medication failed when faced with Date straight up murdering someone out of passion, and Date is now on the same road that Saito is on. I have no real hard facts to back that up, but it seems fitting for a bad end. TheMcD fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 19:44
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I was absolutely certain the worst ending would end with Saito entirely victorious, but at least he didn't find a way to shut down Iris.
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Aug 31, 2020 00:30
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Iris' mind is already strangled and her body cut in half tho?
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Aug 31, 2020 02:56
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They mean Aiba, presumably. And yeah, her knocking Saito out there is a little victory in a sea of poo poo.
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Aug 31, 2020 10:56
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Yeah, my brain shorted out on Aiba's name and I just went with Iris because eye motifs. I should have thought a little harder and realized a lot of this game is eye motifs.
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Aug 31, 2020 15:14
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Supersonic Shine posted:Yeah, my brain shorted out on Aiba's name and I just went with Iris because eye motifs. I should have thought a little harder and realized a lot of this game is eye motifs. Hitomi's even in on it; her first name is literally "eye" or "pupil". (That might have gotten mentioned during the Iris naming segment?)
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Aug 31, 2020 15:52
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Hey Pewter and Moma are both also around at the end of this branch! 
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Aug 31, 2020 16:33
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mycelia posted:Hitomi's even in on it; her first name is literally "eye" or "pupil". (That might have gotten mentioned during the Iris naming segment?) There are several the game doesn't even bring up. The kanji in Nadami Shouko's name (硝子) mean "glass" and are part of the word for the vitreous body of the eye (硝子体). Matsushita Mayumi has no kanji for her name, but "mayu" means "eyebrow". Kumakura Mouma spells his first name 猛馬 ("ferocious horse"), but 網膜 ("moumaku") means "retina". These next few are debatable but I wouldn't put it past the writer to use bilingual puns given his other works (and of course, Aiba/aibou is a reference both to the word "eyeball" and the Japanese word for "partner"), so let's also note that Okiura sounds like "ocular" and Saito like "sight". It has nothing to do with eyes, but the Sunfish Pocket waitress's name is Doi Amame, which is... an anagram for "mermaid" in Japanese. There's also a weird kind of mermaid-like creature in Japan called an "amabie" which might be part of it, I guess. Hyper Crab Tank fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 19:22
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Manaka could be a bilingual pun name too: mon- (one) ocu- (eye), appropriate for the first cyclops victim.
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Aug 31, 2020 22:26
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New videos! First, we take a quick look at the files again.  And then we go back to the only branch still available to us as we race ever faster towards the conclusion.
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Sep 1, 2020 19:58
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Why didn't Aiba just text to Pewter "Hey your lover was killed by #89, stop helping him"?
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Sep 1, 2020 21:00
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SITB posted:Why didn't Aiba just text to Pewter "Hey your lover was killed by #89, stop helping him"? Do you think he'd believe her? He's literally trying to delete her existence right now.
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Sep 1, 2020 21:05
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TheMcD posted:Do you think he'd believe her? He's literally trying to delete her existence right now. Can't she just send the video of what's currently happening to prove her word? It's not like Date and Aiba have a grudge against Renju and want to see him killed. And Saito confessed to everything in the video.
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Sep 1, 2020 21:08
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Pewter is a giant hipster and carries an 80s purse phone instead of a touchscreen phone
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Sep 1, 2020 21:12
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sousai (相殺): cancel out, counterbalance; like two things on opposite sides negating each other.
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Sep 1, 2020 22:06
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Well, at least Date/Falco can carry around Aiba in his empty socket if he's getting his old body back.
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Sep 1, 2020 22:26
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SITB posted:Can't she just send the video of what's currently happening to prove her word? It's not like Date and Aiba have a grudge against Renju and want to see him killed. And Saito confessed to everything in the video. I mean, she did short-circuit. Even if she were able to, if HQ "isn't responding," (i.e. ignoring them), there's really not much to do about it.
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Sep 1, 2020 22:49
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If Saito forgot to untie Date after giving him the knockout drugs, he's going to be in for a rude awakening after they swap minds. (I know that's not likely, but he wasn't shown taking off the restraints on-screen and it's an amusing thought.)
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Sep 2, 2020 02:11
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If you don't usually watch the files (like me whoops), this is a good one just for Saito's entry.
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Sep 2, 2020 17:31
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New video! Let's see what happens when we're the one being Psynced with.
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Sep 3, 2020 14:13
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Interesting that the harsh, ugly-looking filters used in Saito's Psync were reused here. I wonder if Date's Psync targets saw everything in black and white.
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Sep 3, 2020 19:13
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Whew! Just caught up, and at a disconcerting moment, too! At least Date is... kinda... better off now? Assuming he gets his memories back that is... (trying to see the bright side here!) The chain of "musical bodies" is still kind of a mystery to me, and what we learn this update doesn't really help... I guess that's intended, but how on earth did this even happen? Also, whoever voices #89 is really good at making him sound wholly different depending on who's "piloting" him, so to speak. When we first met him (and he was presumably Rohan), he was a lot more... flat, stoic and to the point, so much so that it was kinda up in the air as to whether he meant what he said about loving Iris and Hitomi or not. But these last scenes, when he is Saito... he's so much more animated and so much more gleefully malicious. It's really great.
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Sep 5, 2020 00:53
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#89 is voiced by D.C. Douglas.
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Sep 5, 2020 01:02
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resurgam40 posted:The chain of "musical bodies" is still kind of a mystery to me, and what we learn this update doesn't really help... I guess that's intended, but how on earth did this even happen? Well, this'll probably help! New video!  This is the big one. Strap in.
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Sep 5, 2020 02:02
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"MY BOOOOOYYYYYYY" - me at approx. 40 minutes also great job not restraining the dangerous prisoner for the wildly illegal and unethical mind transfer; ABIS more like ACAB Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Sep 5, 2020 |
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Sep 5, 2020 02:11
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Well, that's... a lot. The holes in the story seem mostly filled... although that initial episode with Rohan is just some horrific ineptitude and the reason why you let everyone possible involved know the details of it, so the bodyswitched criminal psychopath doesn't literally just walk out the goddamn door, Jesus Christ you lot should be fired... Though I guess it does speak to the strength of the writing that the various mishaps come off not so much Plot Mandated Stupidity as genuinely what the characters involved would do. Some very strong character writing...God, how loathsome they made Saito in not very many scenes comparted to other characters. When he was talking to Date about how Falco is a serial killer... gah, the absolute GALL. Still, it seems as though things ended as they should. Nearly. Aiba... 
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Sep 5, 2020 04:34
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Saito wearing the same "rear end in a top hat intellectual rich guy" white turtleneck/suit jacket combo as high-school Renju made me laugh a little. And wow, Falco's terrible at the whole "being undercover" thing. I don't know how he managed to live a double life as an assassin for so long without getting busted by his terrible lying skills. Mizuki's dynamic entrance....  That whole fight scene was pretty well choreographed, actually. I'm impressed.For a guy who supposedly can't feel joy from anything but murder, Saito really had a ball with all that grandstanding. Edit: His fixation with fireworks feels weird; like it should have been foreshadowed sooner somehow. Even though it's something that doesn't really need an explanation per se, the game is good about laying down clues for all its other little details, so it really stands out as this noticeable yet unconnected thing. Bloody Emissary fucked around with this message at 04:47 on Sep 5, 2020 |
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Sep 5, 2020 04:37
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Boss may not have been the villain, but she's still a horrible person.
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Sep 5, 2020 05:27
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Bloody Emissary posted:
The fireworks thing does come up at the end of Mizuki’s route when Saito’s psyche is in So’s body, but not... really in other places, no. Araxxor posted:Boss may not have been the villain, but she's still a horrible person. I’m not sure how you’re getting this read, exactly. She did some terrible things, yes, but with... this resolved she has a chance to do better. On the other hand, she’s a cop, and one involved in presumably warrantless searching of people’s subconscious minds. In this age those two things alone are big red flags.
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Sep 5, 2020 06:11
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That's quite an impressive uppercut that Date delivers at 43:40.Hwurmp posted:also great job not restraining the dangerous prisoner for the wildly illegal and unethical mind transfer; ABIS more like ACAB resurgam40 posted:that initial episode with Rohan is just some horrific ineptitude Everyone involved with the body-switching seems to be a dumbass in this specific way. "I'm going to switch bodies with another person against their will. Should I perhaps restrain my own body so the person I'm switching with doesn't run off with it? Nah, it'll be fine." It's a weakness of Uchikoshi's writing in general, I think: sometimes characters act oddly because the plot needs them to, and the characterisation work can't quite smooth out the oddities.
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Sep 5, 2020 10:24
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Ah. Figures they wouldn't let Aiba blow up unless it came at a tremendous cost. Hopefully there's a copy of her that managed to survive?  The body switching was definitely meant to be disorienting, but I have some serious difficulty picturing Sad Dad Falco going sicko mode over porn.
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Sep 5, 2020 20:30
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Unavoidably lost in translation but in the Japanese version Aiba is called Aibou, which is 'partner' in Japanese, so Date gets to say 'Don't thank me, thank my....aibou'
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Sep 6, 2020 00:43
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AweStriker posted:I’m not sure how you’re getting this read, exactly. She did some terrible things, yes, but with... this resolved she has a chance to do better. Well, she resorted to extremely unethical and illegal methods in an attempt to bail out a known assassin. (And everyone involved was a clusterfuck of incompetence at that.) Tau Wedel posted:It's a weakness of Uchikoshi's writing in general, I think: sometimes characters act oddly because the plot needs them to, and the characterisation work can't quite smooth out the oddities. It was real blatant with Zero Time Dilemma too. Lot of contrivances in that game to make the plot work.
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Sep 6, 2020 13:32
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Araxxor posted:Well, she resorted to extremely unethical and illegal methods in an attempt to bail out a known assassin. (And everyone involved was a clusterfuck of incompetence at that.) Boss and Date have been doing blatantly unethical and illegal maverick cop poo poo (with very few actual results) since minute one of the game but nepotism came as a surprise to you? They've made up excuses to detain people so they can peek inside their heads without their consent, hacked into their electronics, tried to coerce them into confessions, trespassed, impersonated someone over the phone...the list goes on, but my point is that it's a little late to be having the ACAB realization, don't you think?
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Sep 6, 2020 19:46
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