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People on something awful dot com slap fighting about who is more terminally online lmao
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Jan 11, 2023 01:59
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Lmao
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Jan 11, 2023 02:14
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weekly font posted:People on something awful dot com slap fighting about who is more terminally online lmao It’s not a slap fight. Everyone here is probably some degree of too online (I certainly am), it just isn’t a useful lens through which to view a movie made for a broad audience who isn’t necessarily familiar with the nuances of Joe Rogan vs Andrew Tate vs Alex Jones but can comfortably identify them as similar sorts of assholes and identify Duke as the same.
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Jan 11, 2023 02:26
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I guess for me what makes Rogan a bit more unique is how wide his podcast reaches. And how wide his net of guests are. He’s probably one of if not the top podcaster one the world and his influence is so large. Where’s Andrew tate is seems like from my mild knowledge another jorp guy who young disenfranchised young men cling too because they’re lost. And Jones is either just a meme or fringe
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Jan 11, 2023 02:30
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Lol at saying a Rogan character has to be a podcaster. What universe do you live in where satire maps 1:1 with reality.
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Jan 11, 2023 02:54
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weekly font posted:People on something awful dot com slap fighting about who is more terminally online lmao
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Jan 11, 2023 03:09
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YOLOsubmarine posted:It’s not a slap fight. Everyone here is probably some degree of too online (I certainly am), it just isn’t a useful lens through which to view a movie made for a broad audience who isn’t necessarily familiar with the nuances of Joe Rogan vs Andrew Tate vs Alex Jones but can comfortably identify them as similar sorts of assholes and identify Duke as the same. I mean, I'll cop to it. I told the guy to log off Twitter but it's because that poo poo is mind poison and I would tell anyone to log off Twitter. But as far as being "too online", no way dude. Stay off Big Tech social media but post here 500 times a day, hang out in Discord 24/7, I don't give a poo poo (I'm sure the approval of me, an anonymous online stranger, is very important to you) Vegetable posted:Lol at saying a Rogan character has to be a podcaster. What universe do you live in where satire maps 1:1 with reality. No one is arguing that Duke isn't a satirical character, although I think it's a bad satire because it's a smug lib "this misogynistic alpha male is actually a cuck who is afraid of his mother" poo poo. But he's satirical, yeah. The problem here is that we're discussing whether not he's a parody of Joe Rogan, because Joe Rogan is a famous podcaster with very very distinctive personal mannerisms, of which Duke portrays exactly one (shilling nootropics, which is also done by dozens of other podcasters in the 'guys who are convinced they could train for 20 years and become Batman' demographic). Rogan hasn't fired his gun in public, Rogan isn't begging for a spot on a news channel, Rogan isn't releasing youtube style "what's up fam" videos, none of it. So he's a bad parody of Rogan whose primary "parodic element" is that he's bald and mentions nootropics once.
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Jan 11, 2023 03:11
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Elon Musk was in Iron Man 2 and Rick & Morty, if anything going on Joe Rogan made him look like (or rather, revealed that he actually is) a crazy dipshit and not a savvy businessman and inventor
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Jan 11, 2023 03:14
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Ditocoaf posted:If you can draw a circle around a category of person that includes both Alex Jones and Joe Rogan, Duke is a pastiche of that category. None of these characters are 1:1 riffs on a single real human. I'll add to this: If you can't draw a circle around a category of people that includes both Alex Jones and Joe Rogan, try harder. Ditocoaf fucked around with this message at 03:28 on Jan 11, 2023 |
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Jan 11, 2023 03:21
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imo they cannot make him too obvious a parody of joe rogan (if he is indeed supposed to be one) because someone may go on rogan's show and convince him over several seconds to sue netflix in a multi million lawsuit
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Jan 11, 2023 03:56
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Vegetable posted:Lol at saying a Rogan character has to be a podcaster. What universe do you live in where satire maps 1:1 with reality. I just can’t draw rogan much if he isn’t super famous and talking to every celeb ever
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Jan 11, 2023 04:04
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I agree that Duke is more of a general amalgamation of the "manosphere" which we honestly probably need a better word for. I think for better or for worse, I would say that Duke is also a pretty charitable take on things. The actual manosphere includes Christo-fascists, people who try to orchestrate bomb threats on children's hospitals, maniacs who run women out of their homes through harassment campaigns, and straight up sexual traffickers. Like Duke sucks, but he is relatively toned down compared to his real world influences. I think in that sense, I kinda sorta get the Rogan connections that can pop into people's heads. Joe Rogan is kinda only manosphere adjacent, and you can definitely find videos of him not only making good points, but standing up to assholes. His transphobia and his gullibility are unfortunately big flaws that lead him to platform assholes. So, I kind of get when you see Duke who is this super bro-y shithead but like, not screaming blood and soil or talking about bombing drag shows or doxxing a lady who made a sad indie game, that your mind might go to Rogan who for all of his flaws is more of just a shithead than a foaming bigot... I mean a shithead that still platforms and mainstreams transphobia and vaccine hesitancy, but relatively speaking. Whiskey also makes it sound like his MRA bend is a more recent thing that he's leaning into.
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Jan 11, 2023 04:13
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My God man how are people still arguing about what character maps 1:1 onto which real life figure like nobody has ever heard of a pastiche before
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Jan 11, 2023 04:17
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It’s pretty clear each of the characters draw inspiration or resembles from a variety of archetypes and actual humans. They’re all composite characters. Duke quite obviously gets his visage from the big bald idiot internet men like Rogan and other parts of him from some other idiot internet men. Quibbling that they are not exactly alike seems like a dick wanking excuse to tell the whole world how much you know about Rogan.
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Jan 11, 2023 04:34
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Pirate Jet posted:My God man how are people still arguing about what character maps 1:1 onto which real life figure like nobody has ever heard of a pastiche before Considering this is a movie with "sometimes the truth is in fact the super obvious thing right in front of you and not some overcomplicated bullshit" as a main point, I'm not sure how people keep ignoring the obvious explanations in favor of insisting it must be way more complicated than it is.
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Jan 11, 2023 04:42
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I think Miles is more of a Rogan pastiche with his malapropoisms than Batista
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Jan 11, 2023 04:46
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Timeless Appeal posted:I agree that Duke is more of a general amalgamation of the "manosphere" which we honestly probably need a better word for. I think for better or for worse, I would say that Duke is also a pretty charitable take on things. The actual manosphere includes Christo-fascists, people who try to orchestrate bomb threats on children's hospitals, maniacs who run women out of their homes through harassment campaigns, and straight up sexual traffickers. Like Duke sucks, but he is relatively toned down compared to his real world influences. Yes, the reason that I'm calling Duke a bad parody is because none of the actual truth of the MRA sphere is there on the screen. Nothing is illuminated. Duke quite literally lets himself get cucked for a shot at mainstream news (which none of these guys care about - they thrive on being dangerous and outside the mainstream), his mother bosses him around, he's definitively dumb. He's a clown with no ties to virtually anything real beyond hawking nootropics and liking guns, and as you said - that's extremely soft compared to its real world equivalent and what these guys actually say and do. The movie is actively impeding understanding of this subculture. Not good.
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Jan 11, 2023 05:05
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You sure like the word cuck.
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Jan 11, 2023 05:13
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duz posted:You sure like the word cuck. What exactly are you insinuating here?
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Jan 11, 2023 05:15
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I originally thought that Duke was Jordan Peterson + Andrew Tate but that was when I thought Whiskey was his daughter.
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Jan 11, 2023 05:42
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YOLOsubmarine posted:It’s not a slap fight. Everyone here is probably some degree of too online (I certainly am), it just isn’t a useful lens through which to view a movie made for a broad audience who isn’t necessarily familiar with the nuances of Joe Rogan vs Andrew Tate vs Alex Jones but can comfortably identify them as similar sorts of assholes and identify Duke as the same. I might be less online than some because if you put up pictures of those three guys I wouldn't be able to identify them.
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Jan 11, 2023 05:48
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YOLOsubmarine posted:If you think red faced, steroided, supplement hawking, masculinity obsessed podcaster is an entirely different market than red faced, steroided, supplement hawking masculinity obsessed twitch steamer *you* may be too online and seeing fine distinctions that don’t register with people who don’t enmesh themselves in the fine distinctions between alt right weirdos. thank you
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Jan 11, 2023 05:54
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duz posted:You sure like the word cuck. Cuck is an incredible word.
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Jan 11, 2023 06:08
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Everyone posted:I might be less online than some because if you put up pictures of those three guys I wouldn't be able to identify them. teach me your ways!
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Jan 11, 2023 07:47
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Frankly after watching way to many munecat videos on manosphere I will have to agree that Duke is a bad parody. He is to nice - I mean he is a douche but comapred to real deal? On the other hand I can imagine why he is like that - no one who is not terminaly online would believe people like Tate exist and spout poo poo they do so it has to be toned down for mass audience
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Jan 11, 2023 08:31
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Duke's a mercenary, not a true believer. He only cares about the toxic masculinity stuff because it gets him clicks. The point of Duke being cowed by his mom and willingly let his girlfriend gently caress his friend/boss isn't just to be throwaway gags about how pathetic he is, they're a demonstration of just how little he actually cares about the ideas he publicly claims to stand for. A lot of alt-right celebrities are insincere about their public personas, but I don't think there's any one you can point to and say yes, this is the direct inspiration for Duke.
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Jan 11, 2023 15:02
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That explain a scene by Rian was really good. Are there any others that you all have seen that are as good?
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Jan 11, 2023 15:05
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euphronius posted:That explain a scene by Rian was really good. Are there any others that you all have seen that are as good? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYl48TKSAcE Incredibly informative and helped me understand who watiti is
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Jan 11, 2023 15:47
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CelticPredator posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYl48TKSAcE You could tell between the lines they didn’t think the movie was good at all Lots of bad vibes all around
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Jan 11, 2023 16:08
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:No one is arguing that Duke isn't a satirical character, although I think it's a bad satire because it's a smug lib "this misogynistic alpha male is actually a cuck who is afraid of his mother" poo poo. You say this like the daily mail didn't catch Roosh living in his mom's basement in silver spring, MD.
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Jan 11, 2023 16:46
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twerking on the railroad posted:You say this like the daily mail didn't catch Roosh living in his mom's basement in silver spring, MD. I didn't know about it, that's true. So that's on me. The question is, how does this trait look in the movie? The guy who is bankrolled by his billionaire buddy, strutting around with a CCW permit and pining for a mainstream news spot, in an open relationship of convenience with a young and ambitious paramour? Oh and he's also in his (very intelligent, but also nurturing) mother's basement? Put that all together and you get...a paradox who is mostly remembered as a big red faced bald guy. Must be Joe Rogan I guess? And that's why I keep saying he's a bad parody character. He illuminates nothing, he gives the audience no insight, he's thematically incoherent unless the theme is "MRA guys are pathetic clowns" and they are, very much, but they are also very very dangerous. There's a blade in those clown shoes and a gun under that rainbow wig and this movie just completely removes that. Also, Duke is by far the most sketched out character in the movie. Birdie is pretty well-defined too and she's also an incoherent mix of Persecuted Moron and Girlboss Actress CEO, which is a bad mix because those two types - an idiot lout who says whatever dumb poo poo crosses her mind, and a capitalist exploiter who gets their workers killed with their disinterest in anything beyond their own brand - actually describes Elon Musk! But because they couch it in all the celebrity aspect, it's muddled. Andi, Lionel, Peg, Whiskey and Claire are barely there. They're cyphers. I understand that this is an ensemble movie but Knives Out nailed pretty much every character, and the fact that Glass Onion had less characters and a longer runtime and still was unable to sketch them distinctly was very surprising to me. Maybe the COVID restrictions were part of this, I don't know. It's just weird because the director has shown he can do this. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Jan 11, 2023 |
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Jan 11, 2023 18:30
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:I didn't know about it, that's true. So that's on me. The question is, how does this trait look in the movie? The guy who is bankrolled by his billionaire buddy, strutting around with a CCW permit and pining for a mainstream news spot, in an open relationship of convenience with a young and ambitious paramour? Oh and he's also in his (very intelligent, but also nurturing) mother's basement? Put that all together and you get...a paradox who is mostly remembered as a big red faced bald guy. Must be Joe Rogan I guess? He's a pastiche of various people in the manosphere. Who are all pathetic in their own ways - Roosh loving with his mom, Rogan eating his brain away with drugs, Jones going on unhinged rants about gay frogs/"No, Jimmy Kimmel, I do not hate boobs", the Paul Brothers using their streams to advertise scams to their followers, a large percentage of them going crazy about guns... It's maybe worth asking yourself why you see so many of the female characters as cyphers (including Andi, who along with Helen is basically the central character), use the word cuck so much, and think these mra weirdos are actually cool dudes strutting around.
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Jan 11, 2023 19:19
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I read Andi as an Elizabeth Holms type. Maybe because of the voice thing
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Jan 11, 2023 19:23
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twerking on the railroad posted:It's maybe worth asking yourself why you see so many of the female characters as cyphers (including Andi, who along with Helen is basically the central character), use the word cuck so much, and think these mra weirdos are actually cool dudes strutting around. You can't understand why I called Andi a cypher, who is a character that we only truly see in near-wordless flashback and whose sister says "everything she did was an affectation"? But since you managed to figure out these thinly sketched characters, please enlighten me. What insights can you give me about Claire - who, along with Lionel is given almost nothing to work with - and Peg, who is an ultra-generic put-upon helper character whose primary mode of expression is "being exasperated"? I mean, I'm willing to be educated here. What did you find compelling about these characters? Regarding the second point: I said "cuck" exactly twice to draw the parallel between Duke's right wing values and his actual behavior (exactly like if they had a character who appeared to be a right-wing business-friendly politician but was actually a secret environmentalist - I would refer to them as a "green treehugger"; if they were a left-winger who secretly backed an abortion ban I would call them "a disgusting CHUD" so that the reader would immediately grasp the conflict of values here) and now I've got a couple of people trying to make a federal case out of it, insinuating...what, exactly? None of you will actually say it. It's all "boy howdy that sure is interesting, maybe you should *think about it*?" Yeah ok buddy. Lastly that I think these MRA weirdos are actually cool dudes - hey fun thing about a forum is that you can see what I actually wrote, so here's my descriptions of all of them: Megaman's Jockstrap posted:He is very obviously a parody of Dan Bilzerian or the other type of inauthentic "alpha male" Megaman's Jockstrap posted:[Joe Rogan is] "agreeable but in a dumb way" Megaman's Jockstrap posted:"MRA guys are pathetic clowns" and they are, very much, but they are also very very dangerous. There's a blade in those clown shoes and a gun under that rainbow wig Does anyone else reading this think that these are positive or cool descriptors for MRA guys? Now here comes the predictable reaction: that I'm melting down, big empty-quote and "lol" or "lmao". None of the questions I posed above are going to get answered because that's not what this is about anymore. I'm done with the conversation because it's become typical bad faith internet horseshit and I hate that.
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Jan 11, 2023 19:58
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Andi was a shithead.
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Jan 11, 2023 19:59
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Claire is a politician who presents herself as a normal person who understands how you feel but she's really just in the pocket of whoever can give her money. Lionel is a scientist who is responsible for Miles' successes and is unwilling to push back and in fact enables his outlandish behavior. Peg is also an enabler. She gets Birdie out of all of her messes and never really holds her accountable, because if Birdie gets her wings clipped, she is out of her job. These characters aren't as well sketched out because of the antagonists in the film, Miles is our primary focal point. He's the one that we need to understand the most because he's the one who drives the plot.
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Jan 11, 2023 20:13
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I thinks it's fair to say a majority of the characters are underwritten tbh I didn't care because I was having a good time with the movie
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Jan 11, 2023 20:26
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:
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Jan 11, 2023 20:57
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Simply Simon posted:He literally wears a gun that is used for an attempted murder There was absolutely no danger to Duke's gun when it was in Duke's possession, even though there definitely should have been (Whiskey fires off a round on the dock, near a city, and that is insanely dangerous - and totally glossed over). It only becomes dangerous in someone else's hands, which I guess is kind of the point. I half-expected Duke to blow his own dick off with it. If you've ever been around one of these 2nd Amendment nuts, especially at a protest, they provoke a sense of unease, cultish devotion to firearms, and dangerous twitchiness that I didn't feel at all with Duke, who came across as a poseur. Can't speak for anyone else.
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Jan 11, 2023 21:16
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MacheteZombie posted:I thinks it's fair to say a majority of the characters are underwritten tbh I really do agree with all of what Megaman is saying. Duke is a pretty soft satire, and while I love Janelle, they're not really being given the meaty role that Ana de Armas was given. Harlan's actual death scene in that movie is absolutely harrowing and heartbreaking, and you really do feel for this love between the two of them. The big reveal at the end and Blanc's line about her being a good nurse is an emotional gut punch. But it's a movie in which our heroes are the ones who actively deceiving us more than the baddie, and the the tone of the film is just very different than what Knives Out was. This is also a very personal hangup, but I think a more accurate to life Duke would probably detract from the movie. I know materially Jeff Bezos does more harm in the world by magnitudes, but also, I do actually detest Matt Walsh more than him because the latter's essentially actively trying to kill me. It's not a very logical stance, but here we are. The answer then of course is that Duke could be replaced with a different character, but Bautista was still very fun and I had fun and ultimately love the movie both times I saw it. And there are aspects like "breastification" and the tone during the apology video that did feel pretty on point for MRA stuff. EDIT: I also do like that after really showing no indication earlier, once he starts to fall apart, it turns out that Bron is also just kinda racist and sexist too which felt right. Timeless Appeal fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Jan 11, 2023 |
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Jan 11, 2023 21:31
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