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I can’t keep up I was just expecting to see cool valkyries and stuff like that. I’ll just watch vln again and forget all about it. They could have all just hybrid powered stuff and talked about future sustainability blah blah.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:46
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track day bro! posted:LMP1H was cool when there were 3 competing teams, but like all sportscar stuff it never lasts. Everyone is cutting their motorsport stuff as it costs too much and it doesn't align with pushing for EV's idk. I don't even have anything against ev's I'd love to see a balls to the wall ev series openwheel or hybrid. Porsche and Audi. It's kind of sad really, the thing is literally an LMP2 chassis with a 40hp off the shelf kers unit. Theoretically there are still three hypercar teams, Toyota, Glickenhaus and Peugeot coming later. Four if you count bykolles, and I don't know quite what Alpine are up to. They're running one of the rebellion LMP1s this year.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:49
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Hypercar has been bad since the day they announced it, and Toyota deciding to trash the aero they were developing and bolt the P1 bodywork to the car instead because it’s going to be running alone in class really sums up how bad an idea the whole thing was in the first place.
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Jan 15, 2021 19:16
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The only real change from P1 is the single hybrid system (optional) on the front axle that is limited on when it can be deployed, less power, more weight, bigger cockpit (to sit the drivers upright and lessen lower back injuries), and a limit on aerodynamic efficiency (hard limit on lift:drag ratio) The aero efficiency limits are what the ACO helped would bring more styling. They're still prototypes. They can have a road car chassis (because aston martin asked for it and then never came) but it's far cheaper and more efficient to use a carbon prototype chassis
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Jan 15, 2021 19:19
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orange juche posted:Formula E gonna pack up shop in a season or 2? Okay, bumping for a dumb question about Formula E. They used a shorter track at Monaco, without the hairpin, but this year they're using the whole thing if Covid doesn't cancel it. Why'd they use the shorter track before, couldn't the cars make it around that turn?
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Jan 15, 2021 19:27
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Cessna posted:Okay, bumping for a dumb question about Formula E. I believe it was because Monaco wasn't willing to close off that additional section of the city for Formula E in its early years. Now it's gotten bigger and has bigger names on the grid they have a bit more pull. Nothing to do with the casino hairpin as far as I know, if F1 cars can get round there with how long they are pretty much anything can, I don't think it would've even been the tightest hairpin on the FE calendar at that point.
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Jan 15, 2021 19:40
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Track for sx tomorrow is looking pretty good: https://youtu.be/F2WszMdDREY
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Jan 15, 2021 19:44
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Makes sense, thanks. If things line up and I can get a vaccine before July I might try to go see their race in Brooklyn. I'll have to right up some sort of anti-noise-cancelling headset to make it sound right.
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Jan 15, 2021 19:45
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njsykora posted:I believe it was because Monaco wasn't willing to close off that additional section of the city for Formula E in its early years. Now it's gotten bigger and has bigger names on the grid they have a bit more pull. Nothing to do with the casino hairpin as far as I know, if F1 cars can get round there with how long they are pretty much anything can, I don't think it would've even been the tightest hairpin on the FE calendar at that point. I wonder how they're going to handle battery drain issues on the full track. The run from Portier through the tunnel down to Nouvelle Chicane will be one of the longest flat-out sections in Formula E, right?
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Jan 15, 2021 23:13
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I think it's about equal with the straights at Berlin, and it'll have more braking than that track for regen too so shouldn't be an issue. Assuming the race actually takes place of course.
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Jan 15, 2021 23:30
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Bape Culture posted:I can’t keep up I was just expecting to see cool valkyries and stuff like that. I’ll just watch vln again and forget all about it. They could have all just hybrid powered stuff and talked about future sustainability blah blah. that stuff was because what became LM Hypercar was being pulled in three or four different directions, and the ACO said "yes" to all of them:
So the Hypercar rules became a bit of a mess. They allowed for road-car based with or without hybrids, and race cars with and without hybrids. The Toyota is a hybrid, it's still under development but the Peugeot is also a hybrid, while the Glickenhaus is going without. These will be allowed to run in the WEC, and possibly at some of the top events for IMSA, but that's still a bit of a question mark. Meanwhile, we know that the IMSA LMDh rules will allow those cars to run in the WEC and/or at Le Mans alongside the primary job of forming the top class in IMSA. Those LMDh cars are, like current DPI, based off of LMP2 car chassis -- with slightly different bodywork, more for marketing than performance, and a homologated engine. Big difference is there will be a hybrid system - but a spec one, starting at about 40 hp, which should fit all of the chassis. The cars will also all be BoP'd together to ensure a close window of performance. As of now, LMDh should include
Note that both have said they'll support customer teams, so that's a good sign for those who long for Group C/GTP days.
The tl;dr is that with a more reasonable budget, less need to develop (which is what killed the LMP1H days), BoP to keep things close, and ability to race in the U.S., World Championship and Le Mans, it looks like the LMDh formula could be the right choice for this era. Especially if customer cars can fill the grids for the top class. The downsides? Looks like GTE is dead man walking as a pro, factory-backed class. Porsche's out in the U.S., Aston's out in the WEC, and that leaves 3 full-time cars in IMSA and a small grid in the WEC. While they've gotten things controlled for prototypes, next question will be what the ACO does for the sports cars.
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Jan 16, 2021 03:09
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All of which means, why the hell would you spend any money on your hypercar when they're going to BoP an LMP2 in a dress to your speed anyway? They would already have sunk a lot of money into the Toyota when this was decided. It's a shame really, you'd get some "racing" sure but it's yet another series being transformed into effectively spec. For all the technical interest you might as well just mandate Oreca 07s and Lambo Super Trofeo cars and call that LeMans, at least it'd be cheaper. Dudley fucked around with this message at 11:49 on Jan 16, 2021 |
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Jan 16, 2021 11:46
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Dudley posted:All of which means, why the hell would you spend any money on your hypercar when they're going to BoP an LMP2 in a dress to your speed anyway? I think this is a way to try and revive the event ahead of that centenary running, and I also think if they're going to have a true open prototype class again, it won't be with internal combustion engines - think Group C but with a set amount of hydrogen (or, more generally, energy spend in mega joules) for the race distance. That would be 'road relevant,' that would require some R&D again, and that would be attractive to both engineering and marketing for many of the OEMs. There are hints that in 2023 there might be a Garage 56-style car running with alternative fuels, if they weren't so in the poo poo right now I'd suggest it's BMW running a hydrogen car, but I can see a few other makers wanting to do that.
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Jan 16, 2021 11:55
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Glcikenhause has been saying he wants to do a hydrogen thing
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Jan 16, 2021 11:56
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harperdc posted:I think this is a way to try and revive the event ahead of that centenary running, and I also think if they're going to have a true open prototype class again, it won't be with internal combustion engines - think Group C but with a set amount of hydrogen (or, more generally, energy spend in mega joules) for the race distance. That would be 'road relevant,' that would require some R&D again, and that would be attractive to both engineering and marketing for many of the OEMs. Yeah, and I get RIGHT NOW is the wrong time to be asking people to spend. But the thing is, it's kinda always the wrong time, especially as there are fewer and fewer manufacturers every year. Hell this week the entire Fiat and Peugeot empires merged, so it'll be harder and harder to convince them to compete against themselves.
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Jan 16, 2021 12:02
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Dudley posted:For all the technical interest you might as well just mandate Oreca 07s and Lambo Super Trofeo cars and call that LeMans, at least it'd be cheaper. With how much of a joke WEC has been for actual racing lately, that would be an extreme upgrade.
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Jan 16, 2021 17:16
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harperdc posted:The downsides? Looks like GTE is dead man walking as a pro, factory-backed class. Porsche's out in the U.S., Aston's out in the WEC, and that leaves 3 full-time cars in IMSA and a small grid in the WEC. While they've gotten things controlled for prototypes, next question will be what the ACO does for the sports cars. We've seen this story when GT1 died out and GT2 became the premier pro GT class. Everything should slot down to GT3 and GT4 cars.
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Jan 16, 2021 20:54
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Double post for Supercross! I will be stream sharing the NBCSN live broadcast on Discord as often as I can this year, including tonight! I'll start after the Chili Bowl stream switches over to MavTV and Facebook.
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Jan 17, 2021 00:10
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Dudley posted:All of which means, why the hell would you spend any money on your hypercar when they're going to BoP an LMP2 in a dress to your speed anyway? This is kind of a backwards question. Hypercar isn't failing because LMDH is an option, LMDH is an option because Hypercar failed.
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Jan 17, 2021 00:20
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WindyMan posted:We've seen this story when GT1 died out and GT2 became the premier pro GT class. Everything should slot down to GT3 and GT4 cars. Of course, but it's a little different now considering the scope of GT3 use worldwide. But that doesn't mean they shouldn't go forward with it. your friend wicka posted:This is kind of a backwards question. Hypercar isn't failing because LMDH is an option, LMDH is an option because Hypercar failed. yeah, that's a better way to look at it. despite the necessity of BoP, at least they'll be able to compete together.
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Jan 17, 2021 05:42
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your friend wicka posted:This is kind of a backwards question. Hypercar isn't failing because LMDH is an option, LMDH is an option because Hypercar failed. It kinda doesn't matter which way round, if you won't or can't have a technical series you might as well go all out on the racing without needing to BoP it into the loving ground. harperdc posted:yeah, that's a better way to look at it. despite the necessity of BoP, at least they'll be able to compete together. One man's "compete" is another's "Take turns to be given the win" and GTE especially sailed very close to the latter thing a lot.
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Jan 17, 2021 11:54
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it's especially a problem in BOP series where teams have budgets and/or are manufacturers, where the entire series newsfeed becomes an endless series of BOP complaints and accustations WTCC was maybe the worst i've ever seen of this, at it's worst, the series consisted of SEAT 1-2-3-4-5 one week, BMW 1-2-3-4-5 one week, Chevrolet 1-2-3-4 one week, repeat et al
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Jan 17, 2021 17:16
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https://twitter.com/EraMotorsport/status/1350881035190464514?s=20 owns
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Jan 17, 2021 22:42
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deeply
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Jan 18, 2021 00:11
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Dudley posted:It kinda doesn't matter which way round, if you won't or can't have a technical series you might as well go all out on the racing without needing to BoP it into the loving ground. My point is that most manufacturers chose not to spend money on Hypercar long before LMDH was a thing, hence LMDH. You're right that there's basically no point in choosing Hypercar over LMDH unless you're Toyota and you love spending money, but it was either this or continuing with the 24 Heures du Toyota.
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Jan 18, 2021 01:13
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I mean, the latter route would have been more keeping with history than BOP
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Jan 18, 2021 03:19
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Didn't Audi race themselves for like 8 years?
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Jan 18, 2021 07:40
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I’m glad to have cars racing, anyway.
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Jan 18, 2021 07:57
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Frond posted:Didn't Audi race themselves for like 8 years? It changed, some years it was only Audis but at least there were customer teams, some years they'd be up against the Team To Beat Audi who would often explode in the race leading to a comfortable win, and occasionally they had a team put up a real fight and run them real close. I think 2012? Where Peugeot finished second by 11 seconds having run nose to tail all race was spectacular.
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Jan 18, 2021 09:02
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01eWObrfgLk Hypercar video confirming Toyota, Peugot, Audi and Porsche by 2023.
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Jan 18, 2021 12:26
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Hell yes.
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Jan 18, 2021 17:21
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algebra testes posted:It changed, some years it was only Audis but at least there were customer teams, some years they'd be up against the Team To Beat Audi who would often explode in the race leading to a comfortable win, and occasionally they had a team put up a real fight and run them real close. yeah, my first LM was 2005 and that one was an Audi semi-works team versus Pescarolo. Not exactly thrilling but it was still fun to watch. IIRC some of the Pescarolos put up a decent fight before mechanical issues. but yeah there's been several Le Mans periods which have been a single dominant manufacturer so having a 24 Hours of Toyota would technically be more "accurate" than running BOP at what is supposedly the top endurance racing event of the year
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Jan 18, 2021 19:17
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https://twitter.com/EraMotorsport/status/1350908533169123336 
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Jan 19, 2021 00:24
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Owen's a cool kid, good to see a young petrolhead
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Jan 19, 2021 01:20
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idk how many people here took advantage of that half off for a year deal on Motor Trend On Demand a year ago but it just renewed for the same half off price for me 
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Jan 19, 2021 21:25
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If you aren't watching sx you're missing out, pretty good racing last night and shaping up for a very good season with a DEEP field in the 450 class, something like 7 previous 250 season champions in one of the heat races last night. Basically 15 dudes who could be a winner on any given night and a tight schedule that should give some good racing as the season heats up.
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Jan 20, 2021 23:05
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meowmeowmeowmeow posted:If you aren't watching sx you're missing out, pretty good racing last night and shaping up for a very good season with a DEEP field in the 450 class, something like 7 previous 250 season champions in one of the heat races last night. Basically 15 dudes who could be a winner on any given night and a tight schedule that should give some good racing as the season heats up. Lots of crashes too if you're into that poo poo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=610bKfV-Rjs
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Jan 21, 2021 00:06
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https://twitter.com/Ourand_SBJ/status/1352700248800579588?s=19 No more racing on TV I guess
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Jan 22, 2021 20:38
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net work error posted:https://twitter.com/Ourand_SBJ/status/1352700248800579588?s=19 loving lol
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Jan 22, 2021 22:07
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net work error posted:https://twitter.com/Ourand_SBJ/status/1352700248800579588?s=19 Everything is moving to USA
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Jan 22, 2021 22:23
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