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Retro42 posted:Frankly I’m just baffled at people angry *insert candidate* declared victory/a good night before hitting the ground in NH. If any of them DIDN’T it’s political malpractice. It’s a golden opportunity to any candidate. There is a difference between giving a victory speech without saying we won and what Pete did which was say that he won without there being any results. You don't do that. That's how you start to plant the seed that an election is invalid as we're already seeing. If the other candidates are smart they'll take turns knifing him at the next debate.
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Feb 4, 2020 16:24
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Zotix posted:I'll be surprised if the youth turn out this election at all. I've the past few years I've added a lot of the 18-25 year olds to social media that I've worked with after I moved to the next job)hotel management) and I don't recall once over the past year that any of them have made a remark about politics nothing for mueller, nothing for Impeachment. You can make the argument that people don't want to see it on social media, but I see it all the time, just not from that age group. They're smart enough to realize that poo poo doesn't matter and their political energy is on healthcare and especially climate change. They're focused on the guns being pointed at their faces.
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Feb 4, 2020 16:28
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berserker posted:Exactly. Beat Trump FIRST at all cost. Then we can work towards fixing the apparent evil that festers within the Democratic Party. I will not sit home, I will not allow my part in the election to be one that helps him win. "We have to deal with the biggest problem, and only the biggest problem, first" is increasingly becoming a way to not talk about any of the problems.
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Feb 5, 2020 00:37
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OhDearGodNo posted:Because the alternative is far, far worse. This isn't enough. There is always a Trump. There will always be a Trump. If the party can't win over voters on more than "We're not the current boogie man" they've failed as a political party and need to be replaced.
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Apr 8, 2020 20:37
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Son of Thunderbeast posted:That's exactly what it is. Trump isn't so exceptionally evil compared to the other presidents, he just makes the exceptional evil obvious and draws attention to it. If it wasn't for Trump, tons of people wouldn't have any idea that Obama built the border cages. People who want Trump gone above literally every other consideration just want to go back to feeling like everything is okay and they don't need to pay attention to politics anymore, because they see Trump as an aberration of the system, rather than a natural outcome of it. I saw a bit ago that the problem with Trump is that he doesn't keep kayfabe. Every other president tells you how honest he is while committing crimes and tells you how much he cares while shedding crocodile tears. Trump just does all of the awful stuff out in the open.
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Apr 8, 2020 21:25
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yronic heroism posted:If you can’t see the difference between Republican and Democratic policies you just aren’t being honest with yourself. They're both rapists. They're not a lesser and greater evil, they're just evil. It's the realm of the morally bankrupt to rank out the severity of crimes that deny others their humanity. They're both just evil because they both show an inability to see other humans as human and deserving of basic human rights, any arguing beyond that is to make yourself feel better about voting for a rapist.
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Apr 27, 2020 17:51
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yronic heroism posted:Try again to comprehend the post rather than cherrypick. If you, as many, argue that Bernie accepts or does X bad thing, you are haggling over price. You can always outwoke others but can be outwoked in turn. How many good deeds outweigh a rape?
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Apr 27, 2020 17:53
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yronic heroism posted:Who are “most of” the Trump appointees who will retain their posts in a Biden admin? So which of Biden's policies makes it acceptable that he raped a woman? Why does he deserve to be the most powerful man in the world?
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Apr 27, 2020 17:58
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yronic heroism posted:It’s not about what the candidates deserve. We deserve a president who is not Trump. Period. I want to get what we deserve. There's more than two choices so you've got to convince me why either rapist deserves it. I also didn't vote Trump so it's not like I'm rewarding him. If you want me to help you put the crown on your king you better have a really good argument as to why none of the better options are available and why being a rapist running against another rapist doesn't just question the legitimacy of the entire process. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Apr 27, 2020 |
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Apr 27, 2020 18:09
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Mekchu posted:Do go one and explain how you stop fascism. I'm genuinely curious. Sure hope he gets around to answering this one. I'll put down my time volunteering with prisoner enfranchisement groups as how I'm fighting fascism.
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Apr 27, 2020 18:18
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yronic heroism posted:You’re aware of the arguments and are going to do what you want. Even Nathan Robinson has written that “Biden must win” against Trump, so I’m sure you know exactly what the leftist positions for and against are. Oh, the dude who looks like he drinks mint Julips on his plantation porch. How's your antifascist work going? Every 4 years at the ballot box?
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Apr 27, 2020 18:25
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Epic High Five posted:Probably a good time to remind everybody that the go-to for years for MeToo PR support and various other Dem machine functions, SKD Knickerbocker, is literally owned by a Republican pal of Trump, which means he has access to everything they've got. This is a big consideration considering that it's been revealed to be a catch and kill operation to protect prominent Dems since at least the Franken thing. They're the reason nobody found out about this a year+ ago Yeah, this is what's coming out before the oppo dump. This is Biden unvetted (ignoring all the red flags from his first 3 attempts which don't count for some reason)
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Apr 27, 2020 18:33
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yronic heroism posted:I’m sorry he’s not the classic neckbeard with the podcast and trust fund you’d prefer but it’s really a cosmetic difference. So how's your antifa work going? Ever going to expound or just be a smug ghoul talking about how adult they are for making the hard choice and voting for the lesser evil rapist.
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Apr 27, 2020 18:50
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evilweasel posted:there is literally nobody who believes getting trump out of office magically fixes the damage he's done. hell, given that he will certainly react to a loss by immediately starting up a campaign for 2024 that will feature, as before, racist incitement, getting trump out of office will not even stop him from doing more damage. You shouldn't say this outloud because it makes Biden an even worse candidate. You should have no confidence or faith in that guy doing any cleanup work and his best bet for winning is in fact convincing people that everything will be better like magic instead of well, asking anyone to trust his skills at fixing this.
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Apr 27, 2020 18:52
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SgtSteel91 posted:Yeah, I admit it is flimsy, but given that Trump and Biden are basically interchangeable in policy, the only thing left that I'm basing off of my decision is who's face do I see on the news. I mean this earnestly, don't vote. If the difference is entirely down to "which rapist makes me less mad" just walk away and don't vote.
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Apr 27, 2020 19:35
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SgtSteel91 posted:Given Biden's track record at the moment, he isn't going to be tweeting bullshit everyday He will but it will be nice polite bullshit. Much more in the vein of "we're relocating certain non-citizens for the safety of America" instead of "We're kicking those criminals outta here!"
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Apr 27, 2020 19:41
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yronic heroism posted:Lol if you think he hasn’t gotten us into war with Iran. Tell everyone how you're fighting fascists or shut the gently caress up.
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Apr 27, 2020 19:43
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evilweasel posted:yeah no. see, this is why this is not a position people in this thread have reasoned themselves into and it is not a position that they can be reasoned out of. there is no comparison between biden's and trump's enviromental policies. that is very clear, and once pointed out the response is "well so what, its not good enough" Why should anyone believe that about Joe? He's made things intentionally worse for his own benefit tons of times. Or is it actually better that you can't declare bankruptcy from student loans? His "fix" is literally just undoing the thing he made worse for his benefit.
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Apr 27, 2020 20:59
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A4R8 posted:Imagine voting voting for the rear end in a top hat who put Clarence Thomas on SCOTUS, destroyed Anita Hill’s reputation, wrote the 1994 Nazi Crime Bill, voted for NAFTA/WTO, voted for the Iraq War, and has always empowered the banks and capital at the expense of labor. Oh, and he literally raped someone, too. And get this, when people ask you "how could you vote for that horrible man" you say "Oh no, he was the lesser evil, that makes him the good candidate"
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Apr 28, 2020 14:02
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Pomp posted:You have no principles, you are so poisoned by liberal idealogies that you laughably claim you do not have an idealogy. Voting is the least a person can do to change the world. How can you even claim to not have an idealogy? Everyone has one. Thinking you don't have one shows both an ignorance as to what it actually means and a lack of self awareness to recognize your own. It's like saying you have no biases, you do and if you don't realize that it just means you don't know what yours are.
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Apr 28, 2020 14:16
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yronic heroism posted:How can you think that thing a rando on the internet claimed without proof you think? Crack any fascist skulls yet today?
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Apr 28, 2020 14:22
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This is why it's still funny you tried to big dick everyone about fighting fascism.
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Apr 28, 2020 15:23
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Both things can be true at the same time. The ACA made it easier for certain people without healthcare coverage to get healthcare. It also left a lot of people without coverage or with coverage but spending more than they can afford. It's also the most progressive health reform we've had in the US and was intentionally held back so that it didn't damage insurance companies. That last bit is kind of the hangup. Your opinion of the ACA really depends on how you view the health insurance industry because it was a policy that tried to provide more people with insurance while also trying to not disrupt an industry that a lot of people will argue shouldn't exist. (They shouldn't exist)
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Apr 28, 2020 16:35
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Pomp posted:How is it unmoored from reality to see the entire system as complicit? Yeah, if it is impossible to craft a law that can't be calvinballed apart then the question of "Did the democrats intentionally hamper the ACA so that it could be dismantled" comes down entirely on what you believe their motives are. Unsurprisingly people who think the ACA was an intentional half measure to protect insurance companies will be more suspicious than people who think the ACA was a good piece of legislature because it helped out some people even if it didn't produce a serious structural change or take a government function, healthcare, out of the hands of the private sector.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:05
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Cpt_Obvious posted:The party has, in no way, moved left since the 90's. Hillary Clinton pushed for a single payer system back then. Yes, but gay people can get married. A position the party was brought to kicking and screaming. Honestly a lot like all other civil rights legislature, almost like activists are necessary to drag the party left.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:17
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Pomp posted:What have the democrats done to fight sexism, racism, or the exclusion of marginalized folks in housing, healthcare, employment or the ways in which they are targeted by law enforcement? I agree with your sentiment but I'll say that this is the wrong question because they do stuff. They absolutely try to help. But it is only if you look at each incident of racism, sexism, ect. as a single isolated incident. They will help you with that and they will try to make sure that specific incident will not happen again. But they will scream and cry if you ask them to make changes that acknowledge that the system was built racist. Once you ask for overhauls of a system that was quite intentionally built to be racist, we were a legal caste society for years, they refuse and pretend that nothing is wrong. The same goes for insurance. The ACA is good because some people didn't have insurance and now they do. Sure, some people still don't have it but hey, some people have it when they didn't before! Nothing wrong with continuing to support an industry that has to deny services to people sometimes because it might hurt profit.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:35
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evilweasel posted:a lot of blue states are doing it So they don't care about voting rights unless it personally benefits the party? Sounds like they don't actually care about voting rights.
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Apr 28, 2020 18:48
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She's a TERF but only when she's in the UK because she's literally just whatever the local well to do white women believe.
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Apr 28, 2020 18:52
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evilweasel posted:my evidence to support it is that the poll lists the endorsement of every person other than obama as a net negative, a thing that transparently people don't believe. again, it lists the endorsement of bernie sanders as a net negative for any presidential candidate. do you believe that's true? I mean, yeah. Lots and lots of people have been saying that Bernie is a racist sexist who wants to march the rich into central park and kill them. I hope those people would also consider it a net negative if Bernie suddenly endorsed their guy.
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Apr 28, 2020 20:31
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Rastor posted:Joe promised Medicare For All, but only for COVID cases, and rent amnesty, but only for select individuals They quite literally listed out a bunch of arguments for medicare for all and said it is a moral failing to not provide healthcare for everyone. Except it was to defend the ACA and covering COVID cases. I guess it's not a moral failing if you can't afford cancer treatment? No clue why.
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Apr 28, 2020 20:54
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They even took a moment of that stream for Joe to read his "If she won" fan fiction about COVID-19. It was two incredibly rich people just yucking it up while people die.
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Apr 28, 2020 21:01
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Yeah, that's why I joked that she's only one in the UK. She really doesn't give a poo poo but if liberal cis white women in the UK are into TERF policies then hey, when in Rome. When she comes back to the US it's all "Oh no, I meant trans people are human rights" even though you can't really get those two statements to agree. Her policies are what she thinks her audience wants to hear.
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Apr 28, 2020 21:56
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Pick posted:"Trans-exclusionary radical feminists" work against acceptance of trans persons as legitimately belonging to their gender. Clinton's policy was deliberately, and explicitly, and solely, to uphold the right of trans persons to be recognized by their gender. This is the magic of decorum. You can say things like "I don't think boys in dresses should be in -my- bathroom" but people will rush to defend it because you said it with decorum so it came out as "Well, I think people who don't want boys in dresses in their bathroom have a lot of valid concerns that we should balance out with people who just want to live their lives with full rights."
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Apr 28, 2020 22:01
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Not a TERF, just willing to say yes if it helps push the book.
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Apr 28, 2020 22:17
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Cpt_Obvious posted:I genuinely don't think that Hillary, Biden, or any of those liberals believe in anything other than stasis. They will fight against gay rights until they fight for gay rights. They will oppose the working class until they support them. Their views have the shape of water, fitting whatever vessel public opinion forms. Same. Which honestly isn't an inherently bad thing, there are benefits to politicians being willing to change based on the political tides. But, that can't be the basis for your party. You need some values and things to stand for or else you become a blob that becomes obsessed with not being whatever your enemies say you are. Which has hurt the party a ton, their fear of being the left wing radicals that the right constantly paints them as has been one of the reasons the party keeps moving right. They also still keep getting called left wing radicals, for some reason they have not clued in on the fact that it really doesn't matter what your enemies paint you as.
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Apr 28, 2020 22:44
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https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/elec...13odjh?ocid=sf2 The most progressive platform ever.
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Apr 30, 2020 17:00
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Yeah, the only part of that which is wrong is the part where people thought the party would move left for the best chance of winning the general instead of committing suicide in an attempt to take the left down too.
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Apr 30, 2020 17:27
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TyrantWD posted:When people had a chance to express that preference in primaries, they went for Biden by a large number. He even had higher favorability numbers than Bernie. Or the narrative the entire time was "you might not like him but everyone else does" so a lot of people got shamed into voting for him in the primary. We have anecdotal evidence that the electability arguments worked and a lot of people changed their votes to Biden because they perceived their own opinion to be counter to the general climate, which is generally dictated to the media. Biden won by convincing a lot of unenthusiastic voters that his energized base is right there behind the curtain and if you vote for him they'll be very happy and will help beat Trump. People are now realizing no one is stepping out from behind that curtain.
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Apr 30, 2020 18:06
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https://twitter.com/lizburgh/status/1250333473593683972
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Apr 30, 2020 19:26
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