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WombatCyborg posted:Ah, by fillers I was referring to grain products, I was under the impression those were basically useless for cats? It's less about grain so much as things that have low bioavailability to cats. Sufficiently rendered, a cat can access carbohydrates from grain products; and from top of my head and not looking back to double check but I think a lot of the corn products in food has high bioavailability despite not seeming like a "normal" diet choice - and some ingredients touted as better alternatives are actually less available for digestion. I care significantly less about ingredient content now vs nutritional composition.
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Sep 15, 2020 04:54
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MikeyTsi posted:It's not the case for cats, cats are obligate carnivores and get no value from grains...I've gotta say, I'm kind of concerned that your vet doesn't know this, that's REALLY basic level feline biology.
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Feb 26, 2022 04:07
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Arsenic Lupin posted:From the VIN page you linked: What you are quoting does not negate what I said. Both of the quotes you've referenced refer to vegetarian and vegan diets, which are not recommended for cats. That doesn't mean they can't derive nutritional value from cooked grains; the cooked grains by no means constitute a nutritionally complete diet in isolation but can still be used as a component of a nutritionally complete product. The cooked grain content in nutritionally complete commercial diets have rendered it into a bioavailable form for feline digestion so saying cats get no value from grain content is not accurate. From both articles - WSAVA posted:Cereal grains are ingredients that mostly provide energy (in the form of starch), but they also provide essential nutrients like essential fatty acids, vitamins, and minerals. Moreover, many cereals also provide fiber, which has beneficial effects on the intestinal tract among others. VIN posted:Dogs and cats can digest cereal grains in species appropriate amounts as long as they are properly cooked and the overall diet is nutritionally balanced. Every ingredient in a pet food must have a purpose, whether nutritionally (cereal grains provide energy in the form of carbohydrates as well as nutrients such as essential fatty acids, vitamins and minerals). Cereals also provide dietary fiber that while considered “non-essential” in the diet is functionally essential for optimal intestinal function. Tamarillo fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Feb 26, 2022 |
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Feb 26, 2022 04:42
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If your vet is recommending a prescription diet to treat a medical condition and prevent it recurring, always go with the prescription diet.
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May 13, 2022 08:34
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Kilometers Davis posted:I’ve been researching my rear end off on foods and my brain/gut honestly steers me towards the standard vet recommended brands like Hill’s, Purina Pro Plan, Royal Canin and such. The WSAVA/AAFCO/etc backed foods. People will say it’s junk, just look at the ingredients, but that really doesn’t tell the whole story. It’s also really disingenuous that you hear how vets are paid to push those when it’s not quite the truth. I’ve also heard things like how the WSAVA only exists to lobby for their partners which… just is not true at all as far as I know. Plus the smaller more “natural” brands market their stuff like crazy and make deals with tons of businesses and influencers as well. The more I read the more i’m kind of realizing I’ve been pulled in by boutique pet food that sounds and looks good to me vs food that is ideal for dogs, if that makes sense. Not that Acana doesn’t seem like good quality food, but yeah. It’s all very tricky to navigate. I’m just wondering if you all could give me some input here. I know at the end of the day it’s going to boil down to everyone trying their best to make the right decision based on a very hard to navigate field. Thanks! I'm glad people are being more discerning reading about this stuff. I can only speak for my institution but Hills and Royal Canin had little meaningful input beyond a couple of optional lunch-time lectures, the nutritional curriculum was spearheaded by a brand-agnostic boarded nutritionist and WSAVA member. We're not told to hawk the big brands and they're not funding secret junkets or kick-backs. I just want to put sick animals on food which has actually had trials, which boutique brands tend to not do. I also find that the vast majority of people who ask me what to feed their new pet just want to be told a brand and dislike being given a variety of options - so yes in that instance I'm probably going to default to recommending a brand that runs trials. I should also add that part of vet training involves spotting bullshit in published papers but I'm not going to pretend I'm fully up to date on all published literature and don't have any particular insight into the veracity of recent trials. Ultimately I care that a diet is providing the correct amount of fats, carbohydrates, amino acids and vitamins/minerals; that the animal will actually EAT it; and that it isn't causing detrimental health effects. There is a lot of creativity in the industry around how ingredients are presented (e.g. wet weight instead of dry matter) so I don't even put a lot of credence in the "look at the top 5 ingredients" anymore (within reason, it still needs some protein in there), and I'm a bit skeptical that people are actually checking the bioavailability of the scads of natural ingredients going into the highly marketed newer diets. I used to be very tightly wound about pet nutrition and it's part of the reason I went on to be a veterinarian. I unwound significantly after formal study. Your puppy will likely continue to do well on Hills' over the counter diets. They will probably also be fine on Acana once they've reached adulthood. I'm not going to write an essay but my general guidelines tend to be avoid supermarket brands because they do tend to be junk-foody (having said that my rear end in a top hat cat will only eat Fancy Feast), do stick with a puppy diet to support them through that rapid growth stage, feed your pet something they actually like and will maintain condition on, and feed what you can afford. I don't like raw diets for a list as long as my arm which I'll not get into. Personally, over the years I fed my dog Go!, Hills for a while, Orijen 6 fish for omega-3 support until the DCM risk was identified, and then Acana because he liked it. I'm sure not everyone will agree but I don't really mind. Lastly just a small plug for "fillers". They get such a bad rap. I'm not talking about corn, which is actually surprisingly bioavailable and probably one of the most studied ingredients, but just general fibre content. There is a place on the diet landscape for physically larger kibble that gives the stomach stretch to encourage a feeling of fullness and aids with faecal bulk but doesn't have the calorie density to match. There's no harm in pooping that out. And we like poop because it expresses anal glands so you (we) don't have to. Tamarillo fucked around with this message at 11:00 on Feb 9, 2023 |
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Feb 9, 2023 10:39
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