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Maybe I missed this, but was there anything deeper to Jill? Was she actually in poop jail to do research or am I just reading into her last scene?
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Sep 26, 2020 03:37
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Relin posted:the central theme of most anime/japanese games is the maintenance of the status quo which is oft obfuscating by sky freedom cage~ window dressing This. Also environmentalism. Maybe with a splash of "discover your true self by fighting against conformity a little bit".
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Sep 26, 2020 06:17
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Darth Walrus posted:Kaburagi immediately calls the System out for trying a puppetmaster defence in order to convince itself it's completely in charge. It's like a real-world capitalist claiming crashes are just part of a functional society. Don't mistake ego for competence. Maybe, but you're assuming that the system cared enough about what Kaburagi thought to lie as you claim rather than just be honest about it. It's basically the scene with Neo and the Architect as Neo's told that his this has happened before and will happen again and he welcome to try changing things if it makes him feel better.
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Sep 26, 2020 09:44
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Xelkelvos posted:Maybe, but you're assuming that the system cared enough about what Kaburagi thought to lie as you claim rather than just be honest about it. Kaburagi claims it's lying to itself. Hence the 'are you scared?'. Events are out of its control, and it needs to pretend they aren't for its own comfort and security.
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Sep 26, 2020 12:59
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witchcore ricepunk posted:Maybe I missed this, but was there anything deeper to Jill? Was she actually in poop jail to do research or am I just reading into her last scene? I assumed she either had minato's position previously or was just some higher up In Solid Quake, but i don't think there was a definitive answer given in the show.
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Sep 26, 2020 13:08
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Yeah all that's mentioned is that she helped make the game itself.
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Sep 26, 2020 13:42
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I dont think you can attribute human characteristics to the system, its not the same as the cyborgs and by the end of the show its mentioned that the system still exists and continues to get upgrades.
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Sep 26, 2020 13:58
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Cao Ni Ma posted:I dont think you can attribute human characteristics to the system, its not the same as the cyborgs and by the end of the show its mentioned that the system still exists and continues to get upgrades. The show itself attributes human characteristics to the System. Again, Kaburagi literally asks it if it's scared, and draws a distinction between surviving a situation and controlling it. The System exists at posthumanity's sufferance. They don't exist at its.
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Sep 27, 2020 03:06
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galagazombie posted:Ending was a cop out pretty much where i'm at Relin posted:the central theme of most anime/japanese games is the maintenance of the status quo which is oft obfuscating by sky freedom cage~ window dressing i agree with the existence of the "type" you identify here, but i'm not really comfortable with the generalization we just need more Osamu Tezukas and less mealy-mouthed soft conservatives in the director's seat Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 04:45
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Kaiser Mazoku posted:Honestly it wouldn't have made sense if Pipe didn't die. They killed all the Gadoll. Pipe is a Gadoll. I'm glad they didn't pull the "well he can't die because he's the cute adorable mascot!" card. I gotta give the show props for that, if nothing else. this post got me thinking about the parallels between the ending of this show and the ending of Shin Sekai Yori, a show that has a similar "young protagonist discovers the truth about their dystopian society" structure, except that SSY humanizes the Gadoll-equivalent underclass and makes their decimation and subsequent re-subjugation a horrific tragedy instead of a triumph or put another way: "Omega did nothing wrong"
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Sep 27, 2020 05:01
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Squealer. 
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Sep 27, 2020 05:11
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also lmao at everyone suggesting the show about an evil corporation that keeps treats people as sub-human zoo animals, keeps two other lower classes constantly at each other's throats in order to maintain control, and makes you shovel poo poo so you can later eat it "isn't about capitalism"
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Sep 27, 2020 05:29
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:also lmao at everyone suggesting the show about an evil corporation that keeps treats people as sub-human zoo animals, keeps two other lower classes constantly at each other's throats in order to maintain control, and makes you shovel poo poo so you can later eat it "isn't about capitalism" Oh, sure. There's a lot of capitalism. But it isn't about how capitalism itself is the enemy that must be destroyed so the world may be at peace. They're still doing plenty of capitalism at the end. The problem was the constant threat of the gadoll, and humans being killed for entertainment while being kept ignorant of the nature of the world; and even that was being spun as the punishment that humans deserved for wrecking the ecosystem.
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Sep 27, 2020 06:03
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:this post got me thinking about the parallels between the ending of this show and the ending of Shin Sekai Yori, a show that has a similar "young protagonist discovers the truth about their dystopian society" structure, except that SSY humanizes the Gadoll-equivalent underclass and makes their decimation and subsequent re-subjugation a horrific tragedy instead of a triumph I mean, people brought up Attack on Titan when the show started, and there the Colossal Titan, the symbol of terror and merchandise poster boy was a traumatized child who just saw a friend eaten alive before being pressured into continuing the mission so his family wouldn't be killed. Meanwhile, the majority of the "regular" titans were tortured political dissidents. In Deca-dence, the system is the enemy and the Gadoll are merely an expression of its power, but throughout, the protagonists mostly just battle the Gadoll, with the climax being killing a bigger Gadoll. It's building up a conflict that never pays out. Meanwhile, in Attack on Titan, the real enemy is The World. Guess what Eren Yeager is fighting in the last arc?
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Sep 27, 2020 08:10
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chiasaur11 posted:I mean, people brought up Attack on Titan when the show started, and there the Colossal Titan, the symbol of terror and merchandise poster boy was a traumatized child who just saw a friend eaten alive before being pressured into continuing the mission so his family wouldn't be killed. Meanwhile, the majority of the "regular" titans were tortured political dissidents. Actually it was revealed the real enemy was Eren Yeager.
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Sep 27, 2020 09:16
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Yeah, no, I had no complaints. I've watched far too many anime that starts cool, meanders, then farts out an ending. This had a clear beginning, middle, and end, and maintained both interesting sci-fi concepts and dark humour the entire time. I laughed every time Tankers were horribly killed and it cut to the cyborgs being all 'aw man I lost a guy lol'. Also yeah that entire last episode had me hype as hell. Never get enough of limiter release poo poo in shows like this.
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Sep 27, 2020 17:48
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:also lmao at everyone suggesting the show about an evil corporation that keeps treats people as sub-human zoo animals, keeps two other lower classes constantly at each other's throats in order to maintain control, and makes you shovel poo poo so you can later eat it "isn't about capitalism" I mean these are all basically things communism has done too. Its more anti-authoritarian than anti-capitalism.
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Sep 27, 2020 17:55
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:also lmao at everyone suggesting the show about an evil corporation that keeps treats people as sub-human zoo animals, keeps two other lower classes constantly at each other's throats in order to maintain control, and makes you shovel poo poo so you can later eat it "isn't about capitalism" The system literally wishes everyone to "Have a profitable day" on multiple occasions. I literally don't know how much more obvious they can make it.
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Sep 27, 2020 19:20
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Sep 28, 2020 01:54
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For the back half of the show Natsume was just Kaburagi's emotional support, which felt like a let down after how compelling she was at the start. And the show had beats where we were supposed to care about other characters, but I couldn't tell you the names or interesting traits of almost any of them. A pretty thin show ultimately, carried by some nice animation and a catchy theme song. RIP Pipe.
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Sep 29, 2020 23:39
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Buzzsaw Roomba posted:For the back half of the show Natsume was just Kaburagi's emotional support, which felt like a let down after how compelling she was at the start. And the show had beats where we were supposed to care about other characters, but I couldn't tell you the names or interesting traits of almost any of them. A pretty thin show ultimately, carried by some nice animation and a catchy theme song. RIP Pipe. There was that robot with the comically large chin who made booze out of his excrement and made a tragic sacrifice to atone for his mistake in siding with Snidely Bugface The Traitor
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Sep 29, 2020 23:49
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Spiritus Nox posted:There was that robot with the comically large chin who made booze out of his excrement and made a tragic sacrifice to atone for his mistake in siding with Snidely Bugface The Traitor It wasn't his excrement he was making it from. It was gadoll excrement.
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Sep 30, 2020 00:13
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Xelkelvos posted:It wasn't his excrement he was making it from. It was gadoll excrement. Which he then ingested, as the oxyone fuel. And then re-excreted.
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Sep 30, 2020 07:20
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Cleaning up some of my backlog... I watched Deca-dence up to episode 8 as it aired and then put it on the shelf. Finally got back to it now. Strange show. It wasn't bad; the first twist early on was great, and unlike a lot of anime DD has a definitive ending that was done well enough. Watching an episode made for a pleasant enough 23 minutes. And credit to the writers for killing off the mascot and actually keeping him dead. But otherwise Deca-Dence felt less than the sum of its parts and as best I can tell it disappeared from the consciousness about a week after the Summer 2020 season ended. I wonder why it didn't quite work. Maybe because the characters didn't seem to be much more than their archetypes. (Also, I guess threads don't get archived anymore?)
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Feb 12, 2023 20:55
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Agronox posted:Cleaning up some of my backlog... I watched Deca-dence up to episode 8 as it aired and then put it on the shelf. Finally got back to it now. Generally the big thing where it fell off for me was that the main character ended up being Kaburagi who just ended up not being as interesting a lead as Natsume. And the ending also kinda of felt like a cop out middle of the road ending especially given how big the stakes were
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Feb 12, 2023 21:31
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It was a wild first half of a show and a just fine second half and I think to stay in public consciousness you need both a good start (to get people hooked) and a good ending (so the people who got hooked keep talking about it).
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Feb 12, 2023 21:32
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Yeah Natsume being sidelined for a good portion of the second half was the part that irked me. We also had the weird prison bit and such that while plot important felt like side stories at the same time?
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Feb 12, 2023 21:34
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Agronox posted:I wonder why it didn't quite work. Maybe because the characters didn't seem to be much more than their archetypes. Like others have said, the show had a strong twist at the start, a nice high concept in its setting, and based on early interviews and episodes it felt like Kaburagi and Natsume were both co-leads. After the halfway point, Natsume mattered significantly less to the narrative, and the story played things more safe and by the numbers. While the status quo of the setting changed for the better by the ending, it was still a very similar exploitative system in place, albeit without the violence and death, rather than completely uprooting the exploitative systems in place and starting from scratch. Ultimately it was less "the show got bad" and more "the show had the potential to be an all time classic and instead settled on just being average in the end."
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Feb 12, 2023 22:33
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i think what made the first arc really compelling was the dramatic irony from making natsume the main character, it gave the show this feeling of righteous anger which was completely defused by shifting the perspective off of her in the second half. and then it ended up playing out very by-the-book. it's too bad since i legitimately thought i was watching the AotY for those first 5 episodes. don't think i've ever seen another show take advantage of the first time showing you the OP like it did.
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Feb 12, 2023 22:34
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It is a shame they never capitalized on that mid point reveal, cause I still love it a lot. Also I'll never forgive them for what they did to Pipe.
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Feb 12, 2023 22:41
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Julias posted:Ultimately it was less "the show got bad" and more "the show had the potential to be an all time classic and instead settled on just being average in the end." Firm opinion that these are the worst shows. Especially when it's more than just 'settled' and more like 'insisted'. Something that draws more than the usual investment and just burns it to the ground. I don't feel like Deca-Dence was quite one of those though. I think the prison bit and some other stuff caused a major back-end slog that kills the ending more than the ending ever actually being bad, just like Star Driver. Ranzear fucked around with this message at 00:01 on Feb 13, 2023 |
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Feb 12, 2023 23:58
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I wouldn't call show like the worst but shows that start great and seem like they'll be great but end up being just there are often the most disappointing things to watch ever
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Feb 13, 2023 00:02
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I'm thinking Deca-Dence felt more like ten episodes of setup and worldbuilding for a plot that starts around five episodes earlier and stalls out because of it, then has two episodes to actually resolve it. Pacing definitely killed more than not meeting expectations. Natsumi fell out of the way just for lack of time, meanwhile Kaburagi is in the prison for half the damned show. There weren't any majorly interesting or controversial concepts to swerve away from either, not to invoke my hateboner for Franxx, just a cool twist that kinda leads to an obvious resolution.
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Feb 13, 2023 00:15
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One of my big issues with Deca-Dence is the pacing of the twists. Or, well, twist. Singular. Most shows with a big reveal early on, like Attack on Titan or Gridman, have big reveals later, too. The show can be confidant in 'giving the game away' because there's much more game. Meanwhile, once Deca-Dence gives away that the world is a game, that's it. There's no more big surprises, no deeper secrets to the world, nothing to hit as hard as that opening twist, and that puts a shadow of "That's it?" over the whole show. What's more, despite supposedly being set in a cruel Attack on Titan style setting, nobody dies among the humans. Only cute mascot types die (some repeatedly), and that kind of death feels goofy more than anything. The claimed stakes and the actual action don't match, and therefore the tensions feels wrong. I admit, it didn't hook me like it did some people at the jump, so it falling apart wasn't as bad for me as for the people who were most excited for it, but it really did seem like it didn't commit to the bit. (And, of course, there were all the flaws that other people mentioned.)
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Feb 13, 2023 02:01
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