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Finger Prince posted:That's not what people use those posts for in the previous threads though. So enforce sanctions on offenders who aren't posting in good faith, don't ban entire platforms of posts via a blanket statement. This isn't hard.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:05
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I have a model 3 in the garage and think that it’s useful to be able to share examples of lovely Tesla electric vehicle QC here, in the electric vehicle thread, even if it’s posted to the Nazi bird site. I relied on that sort of thing when we took delivery of the car as a checklist of stuff to watch out for and now just in case I missed something. Ours is great, but that doesn’t mean it’s unwise to know what you might be getting yourself into. Also making fun of tesla (or any manufacturer) for being bad at making cars is funny even if they are often decent cars that are fun to drive. Weird that people get so upset about it.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:12
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Loucks posted:I have a model 3 in the garage and think that it’s useful to be able to share examples of lovely Tesla electric vehicle QC here, in the electric vehicle thread, even if it’s posted to the Nazi bird site. I relied on that sort of thing when we took delivery of the car as a checklist of stuff to watch out for and now just in case I missed something. Ours is great, but that doesn’t mean it’s unwise to know what you might be getting yourself into. Great news! That's expressly encouraged in the rules! CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Hello and welcome to your new and OTA updated Electric Vehicle thread! Loucks posted:Also making fun of tesla (or any manufacturer) for being bad at making cars is funny even if they are often decent cars that are fun to drive. Weird that people get so upset about it. Not only are you correct about this, but so many people agree with you that there are multiple threads for this! No one is silencing you! For your convenience, here they are, as they were presented in the rules! CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Hello and welcome to your new and OTA updated Electric Vehicle thread! big crush on Chad OMG posted:My concern stems from the fact that people seemingly want to enforce rules for communities without engaging with them. Banning certain sites and post types because you don't personally like them without discussing it first is objectively bad. So PM a mod or IK about it, talk about cars, not the thread. It's transparent to everyone here that those opposed to the new rules are those that are upset they can't threadshit anymore. Nobody is going to get probed if they're posing in good faith.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:33
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RZA Encryption posted:You seem very concerned with the rules. Just post. The twitter rule is "don't post randos". I think the common interpretation of that is "don't post unsubstantiated claims from people that have no known credibility to be making them". If there's a tweet video of a spark ev vs a leaf drag race, absolutely post it. elviscat, lets do it Hell yeah, I'm ready to go, any time, any place, as long as I can get there with ChaDeMo charging and a 100 mile range from roughly the Seattle area. Also yeah BCOCOMG, I'd calm down and see how it plays out, I don't want to put words in CT or Elmnt80's mouth, but the rules are just to cut down on slapfighting, post what you want from whatever site you want, and if the mods/IK find it objectionable they'll ask you not to, it's not like this sub forum is known for heavy handed moderation, the stupid Elon Musk troll account isn't even thread banned ffs.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:33
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RZA Encryption posted:Great news! That's expressly encouraged in the rules! CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:
I don't have PMs and I don't intend to give Lowtax money. Also, telling people to take it to PMs is hiding conversations in the shadows and that is not conducive to creating community engagement. That has been a major problem on this site for years.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:36
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Fair, in that case you can have that open discussion in QCS: https://forums.somethingawful.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=188 Maybe it would solve a lot of issues if we specifically got clarity on this: quote:There's plenty of people who are dissemination information in bad faith out on the wider Internet so please avoid randos on Twitter. I read that as "don't post unsubstantiated claims from people that have no known credibility to be making them". You and others seem to read it as "never post anything on twitter, the domain name associated with the information taints the information, regardless of the provenance of the information" And I just cannot believe that interpretation is being made in good faith. Luckily, that's not my determination to make.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:44
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RZA Encryption posted:Fair, in that case you can have that open discussion in QCS: https://forums.somethingawful.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=188 I think everything could be solved by creating rules sourced from posters (assuming good faith) who post in this thread, not allowing one person to dictate what they feel is appropriate. Collaboration always leads to a better outcome.
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Jul 14, 2020 18:47
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I'd like to know which specific posts people found objectionable, if reasonable to ask. I already said I reported the post where they posted someone's profile picture, which was probated. But what other stuff is annoying?
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Jul 14, 2020 18:59
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:I think everything could be solved by creating rules sourced from posters (assuming good faith) who post in this thread, not allowing one person to dictate what they feel is appropriate. Collaboration always leads to a better outcome. Everything could be solved by you shutting the gently caress up. Just post about cars, Jesus Christ. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 14, 2020 19:58
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MomJeans420 posted:
Yep, fair game.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:22
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The problem with the discussion was that it was constantly derailed by non stop bickering about Musk's latest wisdom and/or "lmao tesla bad". More discussion about actual electric car stuff/new technologies would have fixed it. Please dont be part of the problem (I realize the irony of my statement here). Here's something to be actually mad about : Remember this?  Well it's now this.  Enjoy generic suv/crossover #45448972312. Now if I was to tie this in to tesla chat, I would argue that they at least would have the balls to try and engineer the first car depicted and produce it, even though you'd probably need around 5 years of them ironing the kinks out for it to be actually worth owning. Goddamn mercedes really dropped the ball there, I was full of hope.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:24
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In other news, nissan is doing some reveal event for the ariya today. Maybe it will be good! Or at least cheap!
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Jul 14, 2020 20:27
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LloydDobler posted:Everything could be solved by you shutting the gently caress up. Just post about cars, Jesus Christ. Because I'm a problem solver: 
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Jul 14, 2020 20:29
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Absorbs Smaller Goons posted:
I also understand it's based on the GLA like the EQC is not the GLC. The GLA is available with 4Motion so we'll get a transmission tunnel again. gwrtheyrn posted:In other news, nissan is doing some reveal event for the ariya today. Maybe it will be good! Or at least cheap! A car has no price.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:33
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Absorbs Smaller Goons posted:The problem with the discussion was that it was constantly derailed by non stop bickering about Musk's latest wisdom and/or "lmao tesla bad". More discussion about actual electric car stuff/new technologies would have fixed it. Please dont be part of the problem (I realize the irony of my statement here). The before picture looks just as generic, just "concept render smoothed". For every person that bemoans the bland generic design of many new EVs, there's a reason for it, and it's every person who crowed about "why does a hybrid/EV have to look like a goddamn alien space ship from the future, just make it look like a normal car.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:33
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gwrtheyrn posted:In other news, nissan is doing some reveal event for the ariya today. Maybe it will be good! Or at least cheap! Maybe they'll put in active thermal management, finally, I'm amused that Nissans EV offerings will be a choice between. A) large hatchback B) Slightly larger small crossover AWD option would be cool too.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:35
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I wish I could buy a 2 door EV bronco
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Jul 14, 2020 20:35
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On the “so close but probably shouldn’t” front: There was an e-tron out here for 59k and 0 apr, but it got snatched up and as of now there aren’t viable L2 chargers to get from northern Utah to california, which is my arbitrary benchmark for owning only EVs. Has anyone’s mileage threshold gone down since the pandemic started? I think I’m honestly cool at 250. We have a leaf, but one car being able to do 250 with charger support would be fine imo. Juuuuust maybe not 205. :/ Edit: RZA Encryption posted:I wish I could buy a 2 door EV bronco FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE, THIS. (Also, I’m looking up EV crate motors for that very same purpose. We are so close to it being viable!)
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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I mean I'm perfectly okay with generic car look. I'd rather have something more generic car look than the pseudo-coupe profile suvs that are all the rage right now. I know those are done for aerodynamics and thus rated range, but I don't care since they have all the size of a suv but not the back-end space of one.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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RZA Encryption posted:I wish I could buy a 2 door EV bronco Me too. Even an ev with a range extender would be a ok.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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Elviscat posted:Maybe they'll put in active thermal management, finally, I'm amused that Nissans EV offerings will be a choice between. CCS would also be cool :P
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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I want an EV/PHEV minivan/large crossover that isn’t chrysler or model X $$$ so bad.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:38
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McStephenson posted:On the “so close but probably shouldn’t” front: My mileage threshold hasn't changed at all since it's around going to the airport which I do 1-2 dozen times a year to pick people up. 60 miles round trip all highway which I'd like to be able to do twice in a day in the winter without needing fast or L2 charge and ideally with some amount of battery degradation. Basically around 200+ rated is what I'm shopping for. If I was a regular road tripper, I'd want to be able to go 3 hours between stops, or about 210 miles of real range--probably not winter range since who road trips in the winter. For normal driving, I just need about 30 miles of real range in the winter to cover my commute. Basically everything does that.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:42
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gwrtheyrn posted:CCS would also be cool :P Yeah, but, consider this, CHAdeMO has a cooler name. Also, CHAdeMO 2.0! 400KW! I looked up if I could get from Seattle to LA, and I can! Only 19 charges for a total of 8.5 hours of charging!
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Jul 14, 2020 20:49
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McPhearson posted:When Smart first came to the US it was incredibly popular. People were putting deposits down a year before they came to market, and even then there was a 12-18 month wait to get one. Individual dealerships had their own reservation system as well; I know the Smart Center in Beverly Hills required a $2000 deposit just to be on the list of people called when a new one was available. Dealers were installing stuff like alarm systems on them in order to charge a $3k-$4k markup since they were supposed to be a "haggle-less" car, and even then they could barely keep them in stock. What really killed it was the 2008 recession that hit that same year they came out. Not a great year to launch a brand new, micro-car in the US. I don't think 2008 killed the smart car. It was a fashion accessory. They do well in Year 1. Beverly Hills is not a barometer for the overall car sales market. If it was the 2008 recession, how come sales didn't rebound with the broader car market?
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Jul 14, 2020 20:49
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LloydDobler posted:Everything could be solved by you shutting the gently caress up. Just post about cars, Jesus Christ. I would encourage you to read rule #1 in this thread. Be humble in your nature, don’t try to silence others with opinions different than your own.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:51
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Interestingly people were importing Smart cars before they were officially sold here. I even saw a Smart forFour on a California freeway once.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:53
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:That’s not what the rule is though. It’s you can’t post anything without “solid and sourced” evidence and these sites in particular are not allowed. What makes a site not allowed? There isn’t any criteria listed. Is it just the IKs discretion? I asked the previous thread for input and helped CI make the rules based off that. Your contribution to this discussion was to try to correct my spelling of ya'll and to say that actually the thread is fine and nothing is wrong. I disagree and yes quite frankly at the end of the day I'm the one that has to make the decision. Something awful is not a posting democracy and if you disagree with that, then you need to take it up in QCS. I want to see the EV thread actually having discussions about the positive and negative aspects of EVs without the poo poo slinging and useless trolling in either direction. I'll take the actions I feel help push it in that direction and picked an IK I trust to share that direction without favoring either side of the argument.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:57
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Charles posted:Interestingly people were importing Smart cars before they were officially sold here. I even saw a Smart forFour on a California freeway once. I respected the hell out of a guy who grey marketed a Brabus roadster. The other thing is that the original smart that became the forTwo had a god awful semiautomatic transmission that broke all the time and was extremely unpleasant, so the ownership experience was not great. An EV smart makes sense as driving a smart a long distance sucks, but the US is just not a microcar market fundamentally.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:57
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gwrtheyrn posted:CCS would also be cool :P You're in luck, it's getting all of that. It will have a liquid cooled battery and use CCS in North America. They said as such when they originally revealed it in... China? last year. 
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Jul 14, 2020 21:05
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Elmnt80 posted:I asked the previous thread for input and helped CI make the rules based off that. Your contribution to this discussion was to try to correct my spelling of ya'll and to say that actually the thread is fine and nothing is wrong. I disagree and yes quite frankly at the end of the day I'm the one that has to make the decision. Something awful is not a posting democracy and if you disagree with that, then you need to take it up in QCS. I want to see the EV thread actually having discussions about the positive and negative aspects of EVs without the poo poo slinging and useless trolling in either direction. I'll take the actions I feel help push it in that direction and picked an IK I trust to share that direction without favoring either side of the argument. Do you think that perhaps the lack of responses you received told you something about how posters felt about the thread? At any rate, deciding to blacklist certain sites willy nilly and create ambiguous rules in a vacuum is a very strange decision, especially in the post-Lowtax world where there should be more insight into how the mods and admins interact with the posters in their forums, not less. You can punt me off to QCS, but I was hoping to have some dialog and not just “because I said so” E: LloydDobler posted:Everything could be solved by you shutting the gently caress up. Just post about cars, Jesus Christ. Are these the posts that are allowed now? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 14, 2020 21:08
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:I respected the hell out of a guy who grey marketed a Brabus roadster. Yeah we had them for a while as rental cars in Seattle and they couldn't even get people to rent those I guess. Eventually they started renting GLAs and CLAs but pulled out last year or this year, all of the companies gone besides ZipCar by the beginning of this year.
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Jul 14, 2020 21:09
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:I respected the hell out of a guy who grey marketed a Brabus roadster. I have never experienced such a bad transmission as the forTwo. I cannot believe they brought that thing to market, or that people bought it.
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Jul 14, 2020 21:10
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:I think everything could be solved by creating rules sourced from posters (assuming good faith) who post in this thread, not allowing one person to dictate what they feel is appropriate. Collaboration always leads to a better outcome. We're on page two of a new thread and you've posted 3 pages of nitpicking complaints already.
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Jul 14, 2020 21:17
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BMW iX3 premiered - https://www.bmwblog.com/2020/07/14/bmw-ix3-first-electric-suv-2/ Will not be offered in the US quote:range of up to 459 kilometers in WLTP cycle or up to 520 kilometers in the NEDC test cycle  
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Jul 14, 2020 21:19
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That's a fairly large swing on the CO2 lifecycle balance including production being 30 to 60% lower than the diesel model. I wonder if the difference is based on power generation for the electricity used to charge it.
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Jul 14, 2020 21:23
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MomJeans420 posted:That's a fairly large swing on the CO2 lifecycle balance including production being 30 to 60% lower than the diesel model. I wonder if the difference is based on power generation for the electricity used to charge it. Yes, that's exactly it. I think it's basically 30% better on the German grid, 60% on a fully renewable.
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Jul 14, 2020 21:25
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i feel like that is the EV affluent Americans are clamoring for, but I guess it's not coming here due to a combination of Chinese production, cost, and probable low volumes destined to meet EU emissions/EV requirements?
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Jul 14, 2020 21:30
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I'm assuming they need to sell every one they make in the EU (at a loss if needed) so they can sell their high end / high margin cars and SUVs. Ola posted:Yes, that's exactly it. I think it's basically 30% better on the German grid, 60% on a fully renewable. Too bad the Germans shut down so much of their nuclear power, although I think their coal is finally dropping. I'd like to see exactly how detailed these projections get, I'd guess none of them are the point where they're considering the increased wear and tear on the road due to the weight of EVs, necessitating more frequent repairs. Maybe I'm wrong on that, but that seems like a rabbit hole with no end. *edit* Actually I was just thinking of Teslas with regards to weight, I don't know how something like a Volt compares to similarly sized cars. MomJeans420 fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Jul 14, 2020 |
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Jul 14, 2020 21:55
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:i feel like that is the EV affluent Americans are clamoring for, but I guess it's not coming here due to a combination of Chinese production, cost, and probable low volumes destined to meet EU emissions/EV requirements? I would cancel my Model Y order and just drive my X6 until I could get one of these if they came to the US. drat you BMW!
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Jul 14, 2020 22:02
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