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corona familiar
Aug 13, 2021

https://youtu.be/UYYwZopfOwA

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Chillyrabbit
Oct 24, 2012

The only sword wielding rabbit on the internet



Ultra Carp

Cat rear end Trophy posted:

If you plan on doing any off road, I'd really consider spending the extra $900 for the e5 elite, but see the last line I wrote. Per the Specialized website there is a $500 difference in price.

Claris is a perfectly good entry level ROAD group but it has a couple of things going against it when it come to gravel riding. First, it is only 8 speed, and the gearing is really not set up for gravel. You have a 50/34 crank paired with an 11/34 cassette for a 1:1 low gear. The e5 Elite will give you a 46/30 paired with an 11/36 giving you a sub 1:1 ratio. And second, Claris just does not hold up in rough abusive conditions. That is just my opinion based on what I have seen. All of the bouncing around on gravel just vibrates every bit of your bike, and that means wear. The crankset is also kind of a brick and soft.

The non Shimano parts are also not really suited for intense off road. The tektro cable brakes are fine for on the street of easy trails, but there is now way I would trust them on something even mildly steep and technical. The modulation you get out of a hydraulic system is an absolute requirement for me. And Sunrace is just plain garbage. The cogs are never straight and they are just too soft. Any bit of grit will chew them apart.

Both bikes have the same frame, fork, wheels and cockpit. So if you do decide to go with the e5 Base and the parts wear out quick, you can get a GRX 400 level group and upgrade it yourself, probably for less than the $900 difference in the price of the two bikes.
Also I forgot to mention the $900 difference is in CAD so replacing claris with GRX 400 costs as much if not more just due to parts availability and shipping costs.

Shadowhand00 posted:

Hydraulic brakes will feel better overall. Mechanical disc brakes are funky and require a bit more fidgety setup. Additionally lowest level of grx will be much nicer than Claris. I think I had the same argument with a friend looking at the same bikes and after riding around the diverge e5 elite after building it up for him it would be no contest.

Damnit I've been convinced, when I mention gravel I do want to be clear I mean like fire roads, or hard packed dirt/rocks like these routes and not like the side of the mountain or like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zq72S36dJqw

I'll just have to shake the couch cushions a little bit and pay up for a bike instead of it being completely free.

charliebravo77
Jun 11, 2003

I'm a fat rear end cyclist so my calorie/carb needs may vary, but for any ride under 90 mins I will generally just bring plain water and an emergency Gu, SIS, Maurten or other gel/chew or two just in case I end up needing it, but won't generally use them. Over 90 mins I will put 60g of Tailwind into each 30oz bottle I bring and consume that as primary ride fuel. If it's a particularly long or tough ride I will bring a few gels/chews in addition to the 1-2 emergency gels.

Last longer ride I did was about 2.5 hours and I consumed about 100g of carbs from the Tailwind and then I think I had another 40g from a gel.

Total calorie burn according to Garmin was a hair under 1400 calories.

The Tailwind stuff has been kind of a game changer. I don't need to make a conscious effort to suck down a gel or eat chews or gummy bears or baguettes or whatever. Just hydrate as normal and the carbs come with it. Waaaay easier on the stomach than a bunch of Gu gels or whatever too.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

When I was going on a 2+ hour ride the first thing I'd do was ride to 7-11 buy and chug a standard 8oz red bull. That was usually enough carbs to keep me going. I might have eaten a cliff bar 30 min before heading out too. Always had plenty of energy. This was back when I was only 150 lbs

Red Bull has gluten in addition to sucrose which I think is the only widely available gluten source I'm aware of

I'd always have a backup Gu thing of course, but can't beat red bull for the convenience factor

Salt Fish
Sep 11, 2003

Cybernetic Crumb
Oh yeah to be clear I have plenty of energy. I don't sugar crash and I don't get hungry. But the ammonia smell is crazy, I seriously thought it was from inhaling car exhaust all ride or from some kind of leak in my apartment until I googled it last night.

The more I read about it I'm leaning towards its actually just fine. I really don't want to be chugging coke or sugared redbull or eating a loaf of bread 3x a week just to get my rides in. My main goal is long term fitness and not total power (I probably average like 120watts).

Pepe Arnold
Mar 9, 2024

Hadlock posted:

When I was going on a 2+ hour ride the first thing I'd do was ride to 7-11 buy and chug a standard 8oz red bull. That was usually enough carbs to keep me going. I might have eaten a cliff bar 30 min before heading out too. Always had plenty of energy. This was back when I was only 150 lbs

Red Bull has gluten in addition to sucrose which I think is the only widely available gluten source I'm aware of

I'd always have a backup Gu thing of course, but can't beat red bull for the convenience factor

I don’t think Red Bull has gluten. They say it’s gluten free. I’ve never heard of any of the major energy/non energy drinks or supplements containing any gluten.

Hutzpah
Nov 6, 2009
Fun Shoe
I imagine he means glucose.

Salt Fish
Sep 11, 2003

Cybernetic Crumb
38 grams of sugar yikes

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Hutzpah posted:

I imagine he means glucose.

Yeah, sorry

Salt Fish posted:

38 grams of sugar yikes



That's a 12oz can, not the 8oz quoted

Literally Lewis Hamilton
Feb 22, 2005



During a race I’ll neck down 120g an hour

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


When I was running I'd carry Gu's with me on longer runs and eat them on a specific schedule.

These days I just keep a handful of these in my bag and eat whenever I feel like it.

abraham linksys
Sep 6, 2010

:darksouls:
i went full dork mode and started ordering stuff from https://thefeed.com/, they were running a thing on strava where you'd get a "$60 yearly credit" (actually a $15 credit that reset every 3 months, so you have to order once every 3 months to get the full $60 worth)

i get clif bars, honey stingers, nuun tablets, a few gummies. the clif bars are constantly on sale for $1/each up to like 20 or something so it's a pretty good deal. though it does take self control to have a bunch of carbs just in a box in my kitchen, i do have to stop myself from eating the honey stingers as a snack because if you're not going to jump on a bike i'm pretty sure it's probably better nutritionally to eat literal candy. but that said if you are working out this stuff is usually in a good spot of "not too expensive, still basically regular food, will fuel you on the bike, won't make you go to the bathroom"

Freaquency
May 10, 2007

"Yes I can hear you, I don't have ear cancer!"

abraham linksys posted:

i went full dork mode and started ordering stuff from https://thefeed.com/, they were running a thing on strava where you'd get a "$60 yearly credit" (actually a $15 credit that reset every 3 months, so you have to order once every 3 months to get the full $60 worth)

i get clif bars, honey stingers, nuun tablets, a few gummies. the clif bars are constantly on sale for $1/each up to like 20 or something so it's a pretty good deal. though it does take self control to have a bunch of carbs just in a box in my kitchen, i do have to stop myself from eating the honey stingers as a snack because if you're not going to jump on a bike i'm pretty sure it's probably better nutritionally to eat literal candy

They hooked me with the same deal last year and I’ve stuck around because between biking and hiking we go through a lot of those sorts of things. I also keep a box of the Rip Van wafels around for snacking. They can’t be bad for you, they’re only 120 calories and have 6g of fiber!

dema
Aug 13, 2006

Felt good about this solo ride yesterday: https://www.strava.com/activities/11205866962

Very happy with my fueling and endurance. Time to start adding a bit more intensity to my training.

TobinHatesYou
Aug 14, 2007

wacky cycling inflatable
tube man

The Fool posted:

When I was running I'd carry Gu's with me on longer runs and eat them on a specific schedule.

These days I just keep a handful of these in my bag and eat whenever I feel like it.

I ain't taking protein on a ride unless it's like 12+ hours long.

For my road races I do 100g of table sugar and a Nuun tab in each 750mL bottle if the temperature range is 70-80F. If it's cooler than that the concentration goes up. If it's 85-90F, 70g per bottle. If it's 100F, like 50g per bottle. I always keep a Hammer flask with like 6 servings of Gu or maple syrup in case I eject a bottle or to supplement on the hot days.

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS
One bottle hummingbird food (figurative) to one bottle pure water.

corona familiar
Aug 13, 2021

when I was biking up twin peaks the other day my heart did feel like it was doing hummingbird stuff in there :newlol:

bicievino
Feb 5, 2015

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:

That was the worst part of riding long distance when I started, the amount of food you've got to shovel down goes beyond satisfying into unpleasant.

:wrong:
It remains incredibly satisfying.

Benson Cunningham
Dec 9, 2006

Chief of J.U.N.K.E.R. H.Q.
There's an alternative where you bike for a week, lose 10+ pounds, and then forever consume more food than you did before regardless of if you're biking or not.

amenenema
Feb 10, 2003

Chillyrabbit posted:

Damnit :tizzy: $900 isn't a breakpoint for me I think. I'm pricing it out in CAD so it's between $1699 vs $2599 and my wifes employer has a health spending account that pays for "wellness" which covers bikes just it's the difference between free bike vs paying for some of it.

I have hydraulic brakes on my kona dew so I know they're nice but wasn't sure if it's worth it for a road/gravel bike, for that much more plus grx gears but how noticeable are nicer gears from the Claris?

Any other bikes I should be considering in that price range? In USD the diverge vs elite is $1300-2000

At the top of that price range maybe something like

https://www.canyon.com/en-us/gravel-bikes/adventure/grizl/al/#sections-products

Or a bit cheaper

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/road-bikes/gravel-bikes/checkpoint/checkpoint-alr/checkpoint-alr-4/p/41513/

And also towards the bottom of the range

https://www.statebicycle.com/collections/off-road-bikes/products/6061-all-road-granite-grey-650b-700c

I'm in no way saying these are the best at any given price point, just throwing some good options out for perspective

Math You
Oct 27, 2010

So put your faith
in more than steel
Giant Revolt 1 clocks in at 2100 CAD with GRX (10 speed) and hydraulic brakes.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:

I switched from SPD clipless to Race Face Chester flat (pinned) pedals and I am happy with them.
I have plastic MTB pedals with gently caress-your-shins pins on my commuter and love them. No slip ever, easy to catch a slip on gravel/snow/ice, and you don't feel like there's a heatsink underfoot like with full-metal pedals. A+ would recommend.

amenenema
Feb 10, 2003

On the flat pedals topic - recommend me a set for a singlespeed runabout/bar bike - so ideally NOT with shin eating pins but still w decent grip if possible. Bonus points for color options.

I like the style of Deftraps, but pins...

Salt Fish
Sep 11, 2003

Cybernetic Crumb

amenenema posted:

On the flat pedals topic - recommend me a set for a singlespeed runabout/bar bike - so ideally NOT with shin eating pins but still w decent grip if possible. Bonus points for color options.

I like the style of Deftraps, but pins...

You should just root cause why you're bashing your shins into your pedals. Plus, I will tell you that after the first 20 times it stops hurting and you just find the blood later.

Clark Nova
Jul 18, 2004

I have some DMR v6 pedals with plastic pins, they work better than you'd expect and are priced appropriately for a bar bike


e: looks like Race Face Ride is like a Chester pedal but without the metal studs

Clark Nova fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Apr 19, 2024

Hot Diggity!
Apr 3, 2010

SKELITON_BRINGING_U_ON.GIF

Clark Nova posted:

I have some DMR v6 pedals with plastic pins, they work better than you'd expect and are priced appropriately for a bar bike


e: looks like Race Face Ride is like a Chester pedal but without the metal studs

Yeah Race Face Rides are flats I use. They're decently grippy.

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

amenenema posted:

On the flat pedals topic - recommend me a set for a singlespeed runabout/bar bike - so ideally NOT with shin eating pins but still w decent grip if possible. Bonus points for color options.

I like the style of Deftraps, but pins...

I went with the Raceface Chesters on my SBC All-Road, but yeah, you gotta watch those pins. The Raceface Ride are a good option, as was mentioned above.

On my single speed, I went with a set of Mission Impulse pedals. My LBS had them in the case with all the nicer MTB pedals, and I think I paid less than $15 for them. I wanted something with some grip, since I wear regular shoes or trail runners while riding that bike, and I was hoping I could get something with molded-in plastic pins instead of the Shinshredder 9000's most other pedals come with. Also, they had to be yellow, and boy oh boy are they yellow:

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




If I want a bike whose primary use would be cruising rail trails, what am I looking for? Some sort of road bike model?

Grumpwagon
May 6, 2007
I am a giant assfuck who needs to harden the fuck up.

Pretty much any kind of bike can go on rail trails. Depending on how much you want to spend, what body position you're comfortable in, and how much experience you have riding, anything from a basic hybrid bike up to a gravel bike would work great!

You could absolutely use a mountain bike or a road bike on rail trails as well, but I would consider them slightly worse than either of the above. Not so much that you'd need a different kind of bike if you had one of those already, but if you know your main riding will be on rail trails, I'd suggest one of the others first.

EDIT: If this is your first bike in a while, and you're just looking to cruise, a hybrid is often a good choice, because they're relatively cheap, and very versatile. Once you've been riding for a while, you'll know more about what you like and don't like about that style of bike, so you'll know what you want for next time.

VVV this is very true, and I've ridden hundreds of miles of rail trail with a road bike, but if the rail trails near you are a bit sandier or less well taken care of, the thin tires can slide around sometimes. If you're a newer rider that can really sap your confidence. Again though, these are all very small differences. Any bike will be fine.

Grumpwagon fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Apr 19, 2024

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

I took my aluminum road bike up the fire road it Mt Tam (2200' vertical over 5-6 miles?) on 23c gatorskins which is like 5% grade the whole way and some exposed rock etc never had an issue

I would imagine a modern road bike on modern 28 or 32c would be very comfortable. Railroad grades are pretty sedate

I guess in some extreme situations railroad grades can get up to 8% but like 95% is 2.5% grade which is pretty dang flat unless you live in Texas or Kansas

Hadlock fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Apr 19, 2024

amenenema
Feb 10, 2003

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

If I want a bike whose primary use would be cruising rail trails, what am I looking for? Some sort of road bike model?

Paved or aggregate surface?

resident
Dec 22, 2005

WE WERE ALL UP IN THAT SHIT LIKE A MUTHAFUCKA. IT'S CLEANER THAN A BROKE DICK DOG.

Rail trails in Washington vary from buttery smooth crushed lime to back breaking mini-boulders that are barely rideable without a fat bike or suspension.

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

If I want a bike whose primary use would be cruising rail trails, what am I looking for? Some sort of road bike model?

To echo what everyone else is saying, it depends on the surfaces you'll be riding, and mountain bikes are not great for rail trails unless that's the kind of bike you already have--and even then, they're not great.

I started a few years back with a comfort hybrid (Giant Cypress), and it was more than adequate. It also allowed me to find out what kind of riding I liked to do, and that's what informed my next bike choices--a fitness hybrid, then a road bike, then a single speed, and most recently a gravel bike. When I go on the trails now, I'm usually on my road or gravel bike, but my single speed and even my current hybrid (Giant Escape) get some trail time.

Honestly, any bike can handle most rail trails. The only thing that makes mountain bikes less than great on them is that you'll be putting in extra power to push around all of those suspension components, and they're not going to make the ride any smoother because it's already smooth. If the trail is particularly dusty, like the Katy Trail over in Missouri, then you're also getting abrasive dust all over those components, and that's probably not great.

Of course, if you've got rough rail trails, then a mountain bike will be better than any other kind of bike, so there's that.

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




resident posted:

Rail trails in Washington vary from buttery smooth crushed lime to back breaking mini-boulders that are barely rideable without a fat bike or suspension.

Assuming you mean DC, then this is what I'm going for. I'm moving down there soon and while I would start out with the paved trails, eventually I would like to hit the canal pathway which I think is way more uneven

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Assuming you mean DC, then this is what I'm going for. I'm moving down there soon and while I would start out with the paved trails, eventually I would like to hit the canal pathway which I think is way more uneven

It’s about the other Washington.

Salt Fish
Sep 11, 2003

Cybernetic Crumb

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Assuming you mean DC, then this is what I'm going for. I'm moving down there soon and while I would start out with the paved trails, eventually I would like to hit the canal pathway which I think is way more uneven

Tow path is gravel, but mostly a very fine easy to ride hardpack. It has mud though and is dusty as hell in the summer. A 38c is plenty but fenders are so nice and options for a rack woild be good if you're camping.

Fifty Three
Oct 29, 2007

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

If I want a bike whose primary use would be cruising rail trails, what am I looking for? Some sort of road bike model?
I ride 99% on rail trails in western PA. I started on a Specialized Sirrus for a few years then upgraded to a Kona Libre and have been 1000% happier. Take that as you will.

Math You
Oct 27, 2010

So put your faith
in more than steel

Clark Nova posted:

I have some DMR v6 pedals with plastic pins, they work better than you'd expect and are priced appropriately for a bar bike


e: looks like Race Face Ride is like a Chester pedal but without the metal studs

I have Rides on my commuter and "upgraded" to Chesters for my gravel bike. Gotta say it's not a huge difference. Can definitely vouch for the Rides.

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 6 hours!

Fifty Three posted:

I ride 99% on rail trails in western PA. I started on a Specialized Sirrus for a few years then upgraded to a Kona Libre and have been 1000% happier. Take that as you will.

Also where I ride and I see people on triathlon bikes on them all the time.

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Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS
Another option is to get pedals that use metal pins but put the less‐sharp cap heads up.

OneUp does this from the factory with their small composite pedals.

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