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Shy and Shameless
Jul 15, 2015

Raised by birbs
All righty. Questions inbound both game and overall project related:

CLOAK GAMES
What's the goal of Cloak Games? Budding Heroes and expansions only? A larger game company rolling regional conventions and even Gen Con? No wrong answer; this is just to calibrate the kind of ideas to offer.

SINGLE/DOUBLE SIDED CARDS?
Are the cards single or double-sided? If they're single, feels like you could do double-sided for the encounters for sure since only one is used per session. PC cards would work easily, as well. The enemy cards are a bit trickier, as there are specific characters for each scenario.

Buuuut... if the backs were multiple prints of two or three low-level minions...


REVIEWERS
Upon checking for ya, it looks like the review folks I worked with are largely defunct (or folded into like... Dice Tower.) Bower's Game Corner is still going, and he does good work.

There may be opportunity with RPG videocasts here. Apologies as I don't know that group.


RPG SUPPLEMENT/STAND-ALONE GAME
This is a tricky spot, as your game is both. Which is it more, though? Where would it make sense to you to see it on a game store shelf? Whichever your answer, consider leaning into it hard while passingly mentioning the other. Along with where in the store it'll live, it'll also shape marketing verbiage for future expansions and such, too.

IN STORES OUTSIDE OF YOUR LOCAL AREA
You'll need to be carried by a distributor to be carried in stores outside your local area. The three big ones are:
Alliance, ACD, and GTS.

Happy to answer any questions and be a sounding board :3 Solid little game system you have here.



Edit was removing placeholder text.

Shy and Shameless fucked around with this message at 22:24 on Aug 15, 2020

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Shy and Shameless
Jul 15, 2015

Raised by birbs

Sentient Data posted:

What's the goal of Cloak Gaming?
The goal of Cloak Gaming is indeed a laser focus on Budding Heroes and ways that the game can expand.

Rock and roll! Running a game company is way fun, and I'm stoked for your adventure. :3

I've always thought it as selling fun. Like, actual measurable fun. Say a copy of BH gets played 10 times on average without expansions or anything. At ~20 minutes per game, that's 200 minutes. With (arbitrarily) 1000 copies sold, that's 200,000 minutes. Over 3000 hours of fun and enjoyment. THAT'S FRIGGIN' AWESOME :3

Totally get keeping things on the DL, too. Negotiations can be delicate at times.

Sentient Data posted:

Are the cards single or double-sided?
They're single-sided at the moment. [and playtested that they should be single-sided.]
I hear you. Usability is definitely a thing, and flavor on the other side is a fun option to have available in the future.

Sentient Data posted:

PG Supplement or Stand-Alone Game?
Great plans all. Story and raw component expansions both sound fun.

[quote="Sentient Data" post="507310191"]
I actually wrote a bit on my philosophy on the subject of skill points and leveling up which I could paste here if there's interest.
Oh hell yes if you're willing.

Sentient Data posted:

As far as where on the shelves it should live, I'd say next to the standard big boys. In a layout like Target where they have some RPG games and then a eurogame section, I'd say smack dab in the middle of those would be the perfect spot. I wouldn't really put it next to party games, nor the super-simple games - it's much more of a Ticket to Ride than a Monopoly.
I hear you. So alongside the likes of Munchkin, Smash Up!, and Boss Monster?

Sentient Data posted:

In Stores Outside Of Your Local Area
Right now I'm making a sell sheet to send out to small retailers.
Happy to help red-pen your sell sheet when you get that far, if you'd like.

Sentient Data posted:

Funding
Once they start to pick things up, I'll get a loan to put in an order for the low 5 digits of copies of the game, then from there I'll put the feelers out to large purchasers like Target and distributors.

I know ordering a huge amount after there's indie shop interest but before getting a yes from any of the really big boys sounds backwards, but I feel like I can get costs low enough that I could still cover paying it off if things go wrong, and it has the double benefit of showing a purchaser that I'm actually serious and while eliminating the need to rely on purchaser financing that would let them grab me by the balls.

If you have the means to fund and are confident in getting picked up quickly (so as to not have inventory waiting to be played), I see your line of thinking. Instead of having to wait to fulfill the order of many thousands, you're able to out the gate.

Do know that big box can be as far out as net 180 in their invoice terms.

Purchaser financing isn't really a thing in the hobby due to how niche the market is. It tends to be a pay-as-you-go industry for additional rounds of printing, building up to loans as the company secures better credit over time. (An old gag is, how do you make a small fortune in board games? Start with a large fortune.) Very occasionally, you'll see private equity enter the picture either for a well-established company (FFG to Asmodee), or a mini-based upstart.

Crowdfunding blindsided the industry back in 2011 with the effects still playing out even today. For example, before crowdfunding, a new game had a month or two to make its bones to stay on the shelf beyond the new release section in an indie shop. Due to the lowered barrier to entry and sheer press of quality content being made by designers both large and small, that's now down to roughly six weeks at most instead.

Sentient Data posted:

Manufacturing

Do you have a mass manufacturer lined up? If not here are a few:

Grand Prix Int'l
Ad Magic
Panda
Longpack
Delano <of note for being stateside, thereby cutting out the 60 day shipping time from China. Fluxx is printed at Delano as an example.

Be happy to discuss what to expect costwise even before getting a quote either here or through PM if you'd like.

Sentient Data posted:

Big Box distribution
Short of having contacts (which if you do, go friggin' HAM), your best bet on getting picked up at big box stores are trade shows.

New York Toy Fair
Chicago Toy and Game Fair
GAMA <indie space, good for meeting with distributors

Shy and Shameless
Jul 15, 2015

Raised by birbs
Rad on the manufacturer lined up and getting costing all figured out already, and same with the crowdfunding plan. That'll definitely get people's attention if they're getting it so quickly :3

A good source for crowdfunding stuff is Stonemaier games (Viticulture, Euphoria, and a bunch of other great hits). He breaks stuff down really well:
https://stonemaiergames.com/kickstarter/

SKILL POINTS
Thanks for sharin'! That's good stuff.

What you wrote rings true with a lot of RPG designers I know. Knowledge checks and locked doors are the two examples they use when conveying the same idea. If the game can't continue unless person N makes that knowledge or lockpick roll, why even roll the dice so long as said character is alive and able?

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