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Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



I hope the twins show up in 6.0 fully Giraffe'd up without further explanation.

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Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



CharlieFoxtrot posted:

I'm sorry, his name is Fan Daniel, lmao

His full name is "Fan, Daniel, back at it again with the white robes." Please don't make fun of him

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Pharohman777 posted:

Why does Cid say 'that sounds familiar' if you choose the option 'G-warrior, engage!' in the sapphire weapon fight?
Is that line another gundam reference?

In Japanese it's "Tobe! (Take flight/soar) G-Warrior!" which is a reference to the first opening of Gundam.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dz3kjtQ0PUw

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Cleretic posted:

I still don't buy ANY of that about Amaurot being a utopia, but we're in a weird 'either way it works' situation on Elidibus possibly being a child. Either they are a utopia, in which case it's safe to trust a child there and their judgement is infallible... or they aren't a utopia, and are in fact a civilization so lovely or in such a bad position that they'd put a child in that role, which... also checks out, Lahabrea and Emet had to learn how to be terrible people from somewhere.

More's Utopia is about how such a place is completely impossible and that's exactly what our Amaurot represents. Hythlodaeus' name literally means "Speaks Nonsense," the River Anyder comes from anhydros meaning River of No Water, etc. It wasn't perfect because no perfect society can exist. :thejoke:

Also sacrificing a child in a The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas-esque manner to bring about a dark god sorta hammers that home, too. Azem abandoning their post makes a lot more sense now since seeing twelve other people vote for that would make any person want to get the gently caress outta Dodge.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Everything in 5.3 jibes pretty well with what we saw of Elid. He was naive, tried to strike deals with heroes and people who believed themselves to be heroes (Urianger, us, Thordan, the WoDs), was nearly single-minded in his actions, made attempts at reconciliation and he truly and honestly thought he was the hero. Elidibus also rescued Unukalhai from his fate on the 13th, which we now know is a direct parallel to his own life's circumstances.

He wasn't a particularly deep character but there were seeds of this form of him as early as Heavensward at least.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Cleretic posted:

Emet doesn't need to save me, I spent the entire first phase making a rope to pull my way back there anyway.

Tough titty, bruv. You got sassed back into existence by a certified Bad Bitch™.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Rand Brittain posted:

Looking back over the final scene with Elidibus, I don't think we're meant to assume he was an actual child because he still has an adult voice and manner of speech, because that would have been a very easy change to make to get that across. He's just small because there's not much of him left.

The voice and posturing didn't matter; read the context clues from the stones Hythlodaeus and Emet-Selch left behind. There's instances of the swearing Elid into his position, one chastising him for not going outside and playing after the rains and that in the metatextual FF stuff, Zodiark was purposefully kept as a child because the other gods feared it.

It is likely that they sacrificed a child who only wanted to protect everyone as their hero. That's how desperate they were.

Edit: not to mention that white robes and clothing are oftentimes associated with sacrifice

Vanderdeath fucked around with this message at 13:17 on Aug 24, 2020

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



thetoughestbean posted:

I don’t particularly believe in the Kidlidibus theory but I don’t exactly get why they had him be child sized after the fight

That was his actual size. Hell, during the fuzzy flashbacks shown of the Convocation (allegedly) from Elidibus' POV, they're way taller than him.

He also sounds way way younger in Japanese compared to the English VA.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



CharlieFoxtrot posted:

The Ragnarok...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJ4aa-q2GRg

(I would find the Big Whale acceptable as well)

Edit: what happened to the void ark, i literally remember none of the cutscenes in that series lol

I'm hoping Fandanny and his Telophoroi™ are summoning a Lunar Cry and also a Lunatic Pandora proxy, too.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Farg posted:

i dont get why people get like mad or offended when you lose a fight in the narrative. like, for me its just 'ah ok the games doing a thing, gotcha', but some people take it as a personal attack or some poo poo

It has some real "if I were a sun seeker cat I'd be a nunh" energy behind it

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Allag had clones and tons of 'em. The Amon we fight could literally just be a cloned body. Amon caused enough trouble that it would track that he'd be an Ascian of some sort though.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



I miss when Zenos was going full Luca Blight. Hopefully we'll get more of that Zenos in Endwalker.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



My WoL is going to run away and get gay married to F'lhaminn and Mother Miounne personally

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Garlemald was a near-failed republic that gave up its original political structure once Emet/Solus hooked them up with that sweet Magitek. I would argue that Garlemald's expansionism, brutal subjugation of "lesser" races and the fact that Varis outright says they're fighting for a master race tips the scales in favor of Garlemald being fascist.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Jetrauben posted:

I mean there's definitely political overlap. But importantly, for example, Garlemald has not been doing the most salient Nazi Thing of large-scale genocide as a primary policy - unless you're going to include cultural genocide, which is something most empires, and indeed most consolidating polities period, have done until relatively recently.

There aren't Garlean death camps, as far as we know. So while they've got a lot of overlap with fascism, they don't have the concrete historical legacy of crimes against humanity that made the Nazis uniquely vile.

You don't exclusively need death camps to be fascist (though I'd argue that the telophoroi towers should count, along with their genocidal handling of the beast tribes). I know it isn't a perfect list to go by by any means, but Garlemald hits nearly every single one of the Fourteen Points of Fascism set by Umberto Eco. Everything about Garlemald is meant to show that it is a continuation of a glorious legacy (Allag), they consider every other society around them (the ones that kept them in check for centuries) to now be lessers. Their first call of action was to go firebomb Dalmasca, Landis and Nabudis and to continue on from there, conquering simply for conquering's sake. They justified their actions by using the Burn as proof that the other races were destructive monsters that needed to be ground under the heel of Garlemald for their own good, etc., etc.

Time and time again Garlemald's shown itself to be a proving ground for absolute beasts that thrive off of dictatorial power and a desire to purge Aldenard and rest of the world of its undesirables.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Garlemald was having trouble, what a sad sad story
Needed a new leader to restore it to its former glory
Where oh where was he?
Where could that man be?
We looked around and then we found
an Ascian for you and me

And noooow iiiiit's Springtime for Solus and Garlemald

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



I wonder why that when conversations about awful crimes against humanity crop up, no one ever mentions Cylva. She was unfortunately pressed into a role she didn't want (much like Fordola) yet she was successful in killing roughly 80% of a planet's population via the Flood. The narrative and the characters all seem pretty cool with the fact that she's partially responsible for a lot of sorrow, but compared to Fordola and Yotsuyu, she barely catches any smoke from the fanbase.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



multijoe posted:

... has Zenos' mother ever been accounted for?

It was mentioned in a short story that she died relatively early in Zenos' life.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



TGLT posted:

Did they? As far as I know the only time the number 108 comes up is in the context of how long it's going to take. I don't think we know how many were sent out, only that it'll take 108 years. edit: Or maybe days. Whatever cycles means in an Amaurotine context. Actually probably days since that one ancient still remembered the event pretty well.

Hermes mentions that there's 108 Meteia total when he finally mentions that there's more than one Meteion.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



CJ posted:

We're going to fight some australian dragons.

I hope the first thing we see in Meracydia is a miqo'te yelling "Oi, gently caress off, ya dickhead."

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



hexwren posted:

you mean



In Japanese, the Gunbreaker's cartridges are straight up called Soils. It's probably the only FFU reference we're ever getting in this game.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



patch sucks because I refuse to say Ze-RO-mus instead of Zero-mus like I've been calling him for like 25 years now. You ain't gonna change me, Square-Enix :colbert:

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Cleretic posted:

What are you talking about, of course they're known in the west, they're the main focus of the worst episode of Cowboy Bebop

Maybe the worst episode but "Boogie Woogie Feng Shui" is the best episode name.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



14 does have some colorism that does creep into the product, like Y'shtola getting paler, Fourchenault originally being shown as darker than he appeared as in game and the fact that you see Lyse's dad who was nearly Raubahn's complexion yet Lyse and Yda looked, well, you know but all of this pales in light of the actual argument: everything Lyse does in Stormblood should've been done by M'naago.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Cleretic posted:

Y'shtola getting paler is greatly exaggerated by the playerbase; she's only gone up a shade or two, you genuinely wouldn't notice if people weren't telling you. And I know that, because Thancred's done the same thing in the opposite direction, and you don't know, because nobody makes a big deal about it.

Leaving aside sexism as a possible reason (because that's always a possible reason when we're talking about a male and female character being treated differently for the exact same thing), I think it's more pronounced with Y'shtola because her overall color palette changed; Y'shtola went from predominently white outfits with her skin as a darker break, to a predominantly darker outfit with her skin as a lighter break, and with all other factors being equal that's going to lead to you reading her skin as lighter. Thancred meanwhile has had his skin contrast against a white shirt or coat in every single outfit he's ever worn, so his contrast has never changed in that way.


Y'shtola also looks darker in 1.0 footage despite having the same model, because of 1.0's wildly different lighting; this is also true of Thancred, which I think we notice less because most of our experience of 1.0 cutscenes comes from scant Youtube uploads, and we're just watching Y'shtola's scenes more because she's the one that shares a scene with one of the big 'look into 1.0 story' hooks, with Travanchet. (The most viewed recording of that cutscene also has some REALLY wack color temperatures from the time of day.)

I understand all of this but it still sucks seeing the one actual brown-ish character that is a mainstay on the roster get paler, especially since the Scions are overwhelmingly fair skinned and light haired (and also mostly male right now). Overall, there's a dearth of darker skinned characters in this place that's supposed to take place on Fantasy Africa and that feels almost as weird as Yanxia being Second Japan. Brown characters getting paler is a big problem in a few Japanese franchises and it's disappointing seeing it happen yet again; that sticks in the cray of a bunch of people who just want a little representation.

I would also love to have more than two natural hairstyles in the game, too, but that's another conversation.

fake edit: this is not saying "ffxiv bad" or anything, I'd just like to see 'em do better

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Just to reiterate: Yes, I meant Aldenard as the Africa analogue, not Tural.


ZenMasterBullshit posted:

It doesn't accounting for the connection to Islebard that's still covered and africa doesn't have the iberian peninsula (Vyllbrand) sticking out on the southwestern flank of france.

It's exaggerated but it's meant to be similar to europe up to the eastern edges leading to Not-Russia where the empire formed in Not-Siberia in the far nothern parts of it. They didn't rearrange africa and then place a bunch of European flavored civilizations roughly where they'd be relative in a fake Europe, they just exaggerated europe on the map enough to call it something new.

I've always felt like Aldenard was supposed to be a flipped Africa and Vylbrand is the Madagascar while the Cieladaes are supposed to be like Seychelles and Mauritius.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



sweet geek swag posted:

And it's wring, because Aldenard is pretty clearly meant to be an analogue to the Iberian Peninsula in terms of its relative position, while it is not shaped like Africa at all.

Not to fully belabor this point but





They're obviously meant to evoke the same portions of geography which is all I was pointing out earlier.

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Lord_Magmar posted:

They collect any and all requested research materials, within reason. Remember that all of the Sharlayan Levequests are you doing Gleaner jobs canonically.

They're Sharlayans sponsored adventurers, so more educated than most and likely a bit pacifistic (but not entirely).

Exit: During Endwalker they were specifically being used by the Forum to gather all the required stuff for the evacuation plan, which meant the other Gleaner jobs got backlogged (levequests).

"Hey, Forum, how does Sharlayan acquire its collectables and knowledge via the gleaners?"

Gleaners:

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Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.



Failboattootoot posted:

Think Raubahn is kinda it, at least as far as major characters. Maybe M'naago and Conrad. There's probably several others in side stories I am forgetting. It generally does look really fuckin dire on that front from a western (well, American) perspective. Last I looked Japan's something like 5% black if that so probably doesn't seem that weird to a Japanese dev team.

My character is a Highlander that is supposed to be Ala Mhigan/Gyr Abanian and it's a shame to me that that's pretty much the only area of the world with a lot of brown-skinned people in the game. My character is supposed to be Black but there's so few options for it, hair-wise and facial features-wise. I would kill to simply have just a few more hair options that aren't straight.

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